My gender is like a phoenix

You're holding an actual child to higher standards than you hold yourself, but it's the child that should be removed from public and community spaces. For your comfort.

Even though they no longer are causing harm to others and are able to actually undo some of their previous harm by living, some folks reacted as though this ending was somehow morally suspect. Morally bankrupt, even.

And I think it might be because so many of us were raised on a very specific kind of kids media trope:

They all fall to their deaths.

Disney loves chucking their bad guys off cliffs. And it makes sense- in a moral framework where villains *must* be punished (regardless of whether their death will actually prevent further harm or not), but killing of any kind is morally bad for the hero, the narrative must find a way to kill the villain without the protagonists doing a murder.

It's a moral assumption that a person can *deserve* to die, that it is cosmically just for them to die, that them dying is evidence that the story itself is morally good and correct. Scar *deserves* to die, but it would be bad for Simba to kill him. So....cliff.

Steven Universe, whatever else it's faults, took at step back and said "but if killing people is bad, then people dying is bad", and instead of dropping White Diamond off a cliff, asked "what would actual *restorative*, not punitive, justice look like? What would actual reparations mean here? If the goal is to heal, not just to punish, how do we handle those who have done harm?" And then did that.

Which I think is interesting, and that there was pushback against it is interesting.

I'd also like to point out that the idea that you can prevent a wholesale genocide by like, killing the RIGHT individual, is a rather...simplistic understanding of what causes genocide.

Frollo, to use him as the example, is a priest (in the book), and a judge (in the Disney movie.) He's not just a bad guy. He's an extention of the Catholic Church/The State (depending on which version you want to lean on here.) His power to do harm comes from his position within those institutions and the power of those institutions themselves. The persecution of the Roma people within France isn't because there was a bad guy, but because of those systems of power being used to kill the people that the church and the government wanted dead. Frollo getting dropped off a building wouldn't stop the persecution of the Roma in any world that isn't, maybe, a Disney film.

In the real world, it's very easy to hold up Hitler as the boogeyman. But if Hitler had died, but the war machine of Third Reich Germany hadn't lost the Battle of Berlin/the War as a whole, the Holocaust wouldn't have magically stopped just because 1 guy died.

Look. I'm not saying that there's never been a situation in the world where killing 1 guy wasn't the objectively best option in a high stakes, immediately dangerous situation. The world is full of Trolley problems and self defense situations and nuance and context.

But this post is about Restorative vs Punitive Justice *systems*, and about how many people, in general, start and end their analysis of Justice with "did the bad guy get killed?"

I would even argue that this mentality, where as long as you are sure in your heart that it will SAVE LIVES, killing people is just and good and shouldn't be questioned because some people are just bad- that mentality? Forms the core of Police killings in our culture. Justifies shooting first and asking questions never. Because once you decide that someone has done harm, they need to die for there to be Justice?

Many Disney villain deaths ARE specifically by falling ( Gaston and Frollo are the most obvious examples, but theres more- Snow Whites Queen, Ratigan from the Great Mouse Detective, etc), or falling with a twist (Gothel from Tangled and Clayton from Tarzan come to mind). But sometimes it's a little more abstract- still a death that leaves the hero blameless, but not specifically a fall (Hades, Dr. Falcifer) Technically, it's not falling that kills them, but it fulfills the same trope.

2.

Scar absolutely fits category 2. He very dramatically falls off a cliff, in a parallel to Mufasa, and THEN gets eaten by hyenas. The fall is absolutely part of it.

I support Jews.

I support Israel existing. I do not require Israel to meet some perfect level of existence I don't put onto any other democratic state. I'm from the USA. My own country is shitting the bed really regularly. I still support its existence. Nuance!

"I support Jews but not Zionists" is Nazi talk.

I have been reading/watching information about Nazis for 30 years, and I know "Those are BAD Jews, but these are GOOD Jews" is Nazi talk. That's literally how they started using the centuries-long antisemitism to fully poison the German people. "Oh, we won't go after the GOOD Jews who have assimilated and served in the Great War." (Guess what they fucking did. Otto Frank was a fourth-generation German secular Jew who served in WWI.)

Antizionism is antisemitism because I have literally never seen a so-called antizionist do sweet fuck all to make Jews feel welcome in the diaspora.

In the abstract? Sure. If someone is unhappy with their own habits and wants support changing them, they should be able to get that support.

But that’s often not how this plays out socially.

Often, nobody actually asks, “Are you okay with how much you’re using this?” It becomes “I don’t like how much you’re using this, so it’s a Problem, and if you say you’re okay with it, that just means you’re in Denial.”

At that point, the person’s own distress and agency have disappeared from the conversation. The observer’s discomfort has been laundered into a diagnosis.