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Re: Armand carving an 'A' on Louis's chest, a writing decision that baffled even Assad, Jacob, and Sam in their Vulture interview
Idk how many times people need to hear this, but although to some people this may seem insignificant (since Louis's vampire body will most likely heal the wound in no time), this incident doesn't exist in a vacuum. It is one among a series of quite insidious decisions made on the writers part throughout Armand's S2-3 story arc. Please check out this link, read to the end.
Snequanimity listed all the outrageously racist insults/imagery/actions IWTV writers have subjected Armand (also Fareed in the TVL finale and honestly Muslims and South Asians in general) to from s1-3.
Also read:
Another related post about the finale.
And in case you still think all of this was unintentional on the writers' part:
*an almost Pulitzer. In 2006 he was a Finalist in Drama, but that year the Pulitzer Prize Board declined to select a winner out of the three finalists, marking the first time since 1997 that no winner was selected for the Pulitzer Prize for Drama (lol)
i had to come back to put together a few things i keep thinking about:
they already associated armand with islam via him praying as fake rashid
they conflated armand with assad, a british bangladeshi muslim (as far as i know), by referring to him as a french bengali in the show when that had nothing to do with what we previously knew about the character
armand is assisted in torturing louis by fareed, presumably supposed to be muslim
louis is beheaded and armand is using livestreaming - reminiscent of videos used of hostages beheaded by terrorist groups in west asia
armand is wearing a metal bangle reminiscent of the one sikhs wear
armand is wearing a vaguely military-looking shirt even though this is very unlike his normal taste
all this is saying to me that theyre just jumbling together anything that says to them brown person terrorist muslim torturer insane fanatic
then theres the big boss song
lyrics about armand perpetrating executions (never mind he got taught that in rome - if hes doing eugenics they are in fact catholic tinged eugenics) and stating its his decision alone who dies (ignoring the involvement of white characters)
big SS on the cd cover blatantly associating him with nazis
daniel calls him dr mengele - a nazi who tortured ppl by experimenting on them
armand and fareed desecrate a kosher space by spilling human blood in the butchers shop
so its not exactly a coherent framing but i think its still a framing
then theres the fact that his csa history, after being the subject of mockery, is now brought up seriously, at long last, in this context! what is that telling us? especially since so much focus has been given to lestat over an abuse story they made up from whole cloth.
but lestat was abused by a woman. armand, we are constantly told, was a catamite. hes a twink bottom. he was a limp, passive ragdoll for sale. his daddy groomed him into a little bitch. hes emasculated, a beige pillow, his sexual performance is so-so, hes desperate and needy, hes a pussy and a betaboi. in short, hes too gay, not lestats ideal of a masculine bisexual man. like this is some kind of corruption of character, being the receptive partner in anal sex
what the fuck are they doing here. hes a nazi, and also a brown terrorist, and also a 'passive' homosexual. what the actual fuck are they doing. they chose his indian background for him and have done nothing with it except racism.
anyway im off again. as soon as the conversations started being more about 'how dare armand be cruel to louis' instead of 'how dare the writers do this to the characters and the viewers' it felt like we slipped off the track you know?
this show, once, seemed like it wanted to be conscious of race and sexuality and the intersections of different identities and now look at what its doing. jesus fucking christ. its antiblackness and islamophobia, anti asian and queerphobic and homophobic sentiment all rolled together, like it was designed to pit different segments of the audience against each other. a known far right tactic against the left! the only question is whether anyone drove this deliberately or whether they fell into it through prejudice and ignorance of their own blind spots. one thing is clearly deliberate though - they knew in the past theyd told us armand perpetrated the trial out of fear and insecurity, and people still hated him. in tvl they told us he wasnt just willing but having a good time. they made the brown abuse survivor a happy, gleeful torturer of black people.
the sequence where the muses judge lestat as an unworthy failure would've hit so much harder if the show had adapted magnus, marius and gabriella's white supremacy from the tvl novel. and i think muse-magnus and muse-gabriella should've been the only characters to consistently refer to louis as "a pimp" or "the pimp". imagine if the show had textually addressed magnus' white supremacy and his fixation on finding a "superior" heir as one of the reasons for his specific victim pool (you could even connect him being an alchemist to him having proto-race science style beliefs- 1794 is 2 years before the idea of "cranioscopy" the precursor to phrenology was invented in england in 1796, magnus turns lestat during one of the periods where the idea of trying to scientifically codify and "prove" racism is really starting to take off). and imagine if instead of muse-louis, muse-magnus had spoken this line- "hops the "ss abandoned" in new orleans. gives the gift to a pimp who lives to make him miserable" contrasted with s1 footage of louis looking darling and sweet and not at all like the way he's being harshly stereotyped. (in this hypothetical alternate version of tvl that actually cares about race and blackness, muse-gabriella saying "kills the daughter. saves the pimp" would've worked too, given gabrielle's canon supremacist views, desire to lord over her victims like a goddess in africa, and her contempt for every lover lestat's ever had).
like ofc a white supremacist like magnus would be indignant and repulsed that lestat gave the gift to louis and claudia- literally shared his blood with his black husband and adopted daughter, metaphorical vampiric miscegenation in addition to the literal miscegenation of loustat's relationship that was x2 illegal under the jim crow regime and louisiana's "crimes against nature" laws. there could've been a longer horror scene in magnus' tower where magnus waxes creepily poetic about lestat's physical attributes and his gallic heritage and how that shows ~he's more finely made than other men~ while touching his body or his face in a gross way and lestat's half out of it with blood loss (then later, when marius admiringly and matter-of-factly talks about this when lestat meets him, the show smoothly affirms marius' racism that the s2ep4 museum scene already hinted at and shows how powerful either marius or akasha are that they could pluck this fixation from magnus' mind across the continent).
and lestat, knowing this about magnus, would represent him this way in his mind, knowing his maker would've been more than displeased that his blood was passed on to black vampires- and it could connect with lestat having a deeper reckoning about the way he treated louis and claudia, the fact that he was complicit in their lynching- when lestat was onstage in s2ep7, he said "i'm cursed with my maker's temper". my maker's temper, not "my father's temper" this time, when he's onstage spouting lines villainizing his black family, framing claudia as an inherently defective "cripple" (white supremacy and ableism go hand-in-hand!!) and acting as the star witness in a show trial that's meant to manufacture consent for louis and claudia's murder.
also remember magnus and armand knew each other- armand called magnus "my predecessor" in s2, meaning magnus was the leader of the parisian children of darkness chapter before he left the cult at some point and then armand took over, and at some point between magnus' departure and lestat's arrival in paris in 1789 magnus began actively pursuing a "perfect specimen" as his heir- and given enforcing the great laws by disproportionately targeting black people seems to be a paris coven specialty (maybe it's bc magnus was too powerful to fight directly or bc armand didn't wanna bother with it as long as magnus left him alone and was suitably discreet with his killings, but there's no indication armand tried to put magnus down for being a rogue vampire hunting in his territory) it's interesting to think about how that could have roots in magnus' tenure as the parisian coven leader or in the vampire laws in general- it's a major "freeze frame and squint" moment in s2 and given the massive change in the writers room i don't know if the show would even follow up on this idea anymore, but in the plaque in the coven's lair listing all the vampire laws in s2ep3, there's a law about not giving the gift to black people.
like. you can see how engaging with race and racism already makes the text richer and the characters and their motives more layered- and the tvl writers team consistently falls short of that. instead of examining the racialized context of black men being perceived as inherently sexually predatory for why racist characters would reduce louis down to pimp and pimp only as his core trait, the show just plays into that kind of racism- the writers are clearly fixated on "pimp" as something eternal and inherent about louis (notice they don't do this with lestat being a john, sex tourist or the angel investor for louis' biggest and most successful brothel in s1) so multiple characters just call louis a pimp left and right without considering whether it fits those characters' voices. like off the top of my head i can think of at least 10 different words lestat would use to refer to louis instead of "pimp"- but magnus insistently calling louis "a pimp" would make sense if his racism had been adapted, bc then it's clear it's a specific reflection of a character's personal politics. i miss the characters feeling like unique individuals with unique voices and worldviews instead of coming off like an assortment of mouthpieces for rolin's voice and worldview.
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i might make a longer post about this later looking at the entirety of iwtvl through woodard's historical analysis but for now here are some excerpts from "delectable negro" that are relevant wrt the nonblack tvl writers, particularly rolin and hannah at the helm as white showrunner/head writer, directly referencing and pulling on this imagery in louis' onscreen brutalization. the torture of louis' rotting body in a literal butcher shop and louis coerced to apologize for his sins in s3ep7, the derogatory lines about louis and lemuel's femininity in s3ep2 and s3ep6, and louis' amputated leg in the flash-forward in s3ep1 are esp relevant. rolin has already given a post-s3ep7 interview where he's teeheeing with the also-white interviewer about the fact that louis is now physically disabled (they had a quippy "someone's missing an eye" "someone's missing a foot" exchange about the flash-forward) and that he has been branded on his chest.
and rolin and hannah don't have the range to pull on this history and this kind of violence for shock value- and it was intended primarily for shock value instead of any kind of racial commentary bc rolin said they went for the choice to have louis tortured like that in s3ep7 bc horror fans considered this show "horror-lite". the brutalization and branding of a decapitated black body and torture of two black characters was used as a way for the white showrunner to try to show off his hardcore horror chops to people who didn't think s1-s2 (which rolin calls "cuddly"- the seasons with the literal race riot, domestic violence and lynching) was extreme enough.
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- it's either canon (e.g. mel/jayce arcane, arthur/guinevere bbcmerlin) or entirely plausible (e.g. prism or coupé/robert dispatch)
- fanbase overwhelmingly pairs nb man off with another nb man and disengages from the Black woman character, shunting her into a background wise & sassy caretaker role (for which there is a name) or leaving her out of fanworks entirely
- fans who do this ^ claim it is an expression of love and admiration for the Black woman character, actually, bc the nb man (who may be her canonical partner) "can't handle all that" (he may be perfectly competent and engaged; she may be totally low maintenance; it has no bearing), she's just too wonderful (too much) and out of his league (lacking in flaws and interiority and fan appeal)
have we all observed this and can we see the multiple dimensions in which it is racist ☝️ i'm not bringing it up to make any beautiful fujos feel bad abt shipping this or that, just to ask for some consideration of what ppl are saying abt Black women when they make their excuses to each other. like you can just not make the excuses. yk?
remember how louis playing out the story of season two felt? it was exhilarating like it was a gothic james baldwin novel seriously… reticent vampire of the ninth arrondissement just know you are everything to me
Uhhhh art dump.. I drew ticcijeff bc ppl kept asking me to draw them so I did, anything for the people :)
I don’t actually like how Jeff looks in the bottom pic, I might redraw it ^^
Do I post my creepypasta tiktoks on here aswell?? I haven’t used tumblr in ages idk how this platform rlly works anymore.. do ppl watch videos on here..? Prolly not /ref
Hi, it's us. The fans and viewers ofAnne Rice, The Vampire Chronicles and AMC Immortal Universe.
We wanted to have a talk with you that’s been long overdue. And I think it's best to address this as Louis would. With hard words and soft words.
Soft words. The AMC Immortal Universe is a massive dream come true for a lot of us. The fans who have read Anne Rice books since the 80s and the fans who grew up watching the 1990s and 2000s IWTV and QOTD movies. And then there's the new fans who came on board from other spaces like the Hannibal fandom who found a new gothic fiction home when we felt like we lost ours in 2015.
The initial reaction to the revival of what was IWTV was I'm sure mixed, what with Louis being reimagined as a Creole man and Armand being a brown man. Not to mention all the sexy gay vampire themes that were going on that I'm sure not everyone was on board with. But you stuck to your guns and you made a whole new universe with confidence and surety that this is what was meant to be. And you were right. We're so glad that you decided to take the show in the direction that you did and for a lot of us, this is what is cemented as The Vampire Chronicles.
Other things that have never failed to amaze us are the perfect casting choices for every character, the magic that Daniel Hart's music brings to the story, and the costume and make up team that always brings passion to the fashion. The aesthetics of this series is truly something to behold. We truly love this series with all of our hearts. IWTV was such an explosive array of wonder since its pilot and it has been a wonder to all of us since then.
Hard words. We have witnessed the noticeable drop in writing quality in the new season The Vampire Lestat and that is not our only concern. We have also noticed a major pacing issue past episode 2, flanderization of characters, the meta commentary ad nauseam, and most notably the consistently antiblack writing for characters of color.
The AMC Immortal Universe has never been shy about issues of race and racism since day one given that Louis had been cast as a Creole man with Jacob Anderson and Armand as a French-Bengali man with Assad Zamman. Seasons 1-2 masterfully handled these themes in not only New Orleans, but also Romania and Paris. In fact, it was one of if not the central thing in IWTV that was praised among fans and critics alike when it aired. The incredible details to historical facts, rich cultural aesthetics, multilingual mastery, and confronting the brutal truths of America and Europe's history of slavery and racism were what we could consistently and confidently hold pride in when we recommended this show to others. But after this new season, we are unsure if we still hold that pride within us.
In the first two seasons you had core Black writers in the room who were Ben Philippe, David B Harris, and A. Zell Williams who brought their experience and expertise into the scripts. As did director Keith Powell. Their absence and the absence of any Black writers in the writing room this season has reflected in the show’s overall quality, especially in the characters. To say that you have handled it poorly is an understatement.
There were 4 new Black characters introduced to the show yet they have had no character development and were more or less used for plot device and decorative stereotypes. The scammer. The crack whore. The eye candy boyfriend. What will you do with the Queen, we wonder. We also couldn’t help but notice that you hired a South Asian writer this season and yet she has contributed virtually nothing to Armand’s development this season. In fact, the brown characters in this show constantly seem to be the bad guys doing bad things to Black people. Claudia’s monologue in the seance scene was riddled in racist and misogynistic connotations including casually throwing around the word “slave” and “nappy headed” and claiming that she hated Louis more than her literal rapist and murderers. Nevermind the fact that she said Lestat was her “blood” and she liked him better, which contradicted all of S2 Claudia’s development as a Black female character. Louis had lost practically all of his character growth from the first two seasons that he was reduced to a “pimp” and a failure of a “good Negro” who bends to others around him. Even before the gory torture scene, the fandom was literally asking “Why do the writers hate Louis?”. And we most certainly did not miss the off brand "bucket of Louisiana fried chicken" joke in episode 4. Nor the highly uncomfortable absolutely tone deaf excuse filled After Dark for episode 7. This is more than just character assassination. It’s character undoing and erasure.
And as a bonus, it’s not just your writers, but your own production designer, Andres Cubillan, who is making statements like this about the actors of color in interviews:
When we see these things happening so frequently and repeatedly, we seriously need ask ourselves, what kind of people are running this show and what are they allowing in the production environment that makes them believe that this is possibly acceptable. What exactly are you subjecting your actors of color to?
The antiblackness is so prominently highlighted in the season that even non-Black viewers and fans are feeling increasingly uncomfortable from the implicit and explicit bias. Some have deemed it a resentment of the black writers and their work. Others have completely tuned out and have ran back to their stack of Anne Rice novels.
The thing is there is a fundamental difference between non-Black writers who think they understand racial issues and Black writers who do understand racial issues down to their bones. But even with the best intentions of a group of non-Black writers and production crew, it isn’t enough.
It's also concerning to us, the fans and viewers, that the production and marketing team is going to Reddit of all places for fan input when it is well known that moderators there are known to silence and remove any Black and LGBTQ voices when it does not follow their agenda. It was absolutely jarring to us when we heard executive producer Mark Johnson say that the audience has no sympathy for Armand and that fans didn't like IWTV S1-2. Neither are true. “Make IWTV Great Again”? Please, no. There's a reason a lot of us are on Tumblr instead of the massive echo chamber that is Reddit.
Here’s what Tumblr thinks:
There’s only so much that a 10 photo limit of a Tumblr post can show you, but here’s a few more:
If you care to see more of such valid criticism, all you have to do is search #tvlcritical or #thevampirelestat.
You or others might say "Well if you don't like it, then don't watch it", which of course is always a choice, but that is not what we choose to do. We choose to hold you accountable for your writing choices this season and to not enable them. Which is also why our answer to Ryan Kattner's PR stunt on Instagram before the airing of episode 6 is a resounding "NO". We won't be wowed with glamourized trauma porn and we won't bend to pity filled soap boxes.
It isn't enough to hire stellar actors of color who will undoubtedly do a stellar job on screen every single time. When you made a choice to cast them, you had the responsibility to make sure that they were represented fairly. In a world of pro-capitalism where racism and antiblackness runs the consumer's world stage, we really rather this show not be part of that equation. You’ve lost the wonder that this show used to have and replaced it with something else. We want that wonder back.
We need you to do better and we are demanding that you do better in the next season. If you get a next season. Because to us, this is not a joke. Clean up your act and hire more writers who can represent these characters or we're pulling out.
This is the open letter to the IWTV writer’s room and production team I’ve been working on. You’re free to RB and share to other platforms including Twitter and Reddit where the writers are more likely to see it.
You are also free to use it for the emails to the AMC marketing team and NAACP in this call to action here:
💬 107 🔁 88 ❤️ 134 · EDIT - reposted because I had reblogged the wrong version previously with the other concerned fan still tagged. The re
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edit: there is something wrong with the captcha of the contact form. I have linked another site that "Contact Us" will open into an email contact form. I'll also put this link below.
Any TV show deserves criticism; it's how writers grow and improve, but TVL deserves real fucking criticism for a lot of things. It can be really easy, however, to dip into hate mail - which will not be treated seriously by the company or show runners - so here are some tips on how to write a critical review that will be taken seriously. I recommend, even if you enjoyed this season and the finale, you write your own critical review - it doesn't need to match the examples I list below.
An email address will need to be provided for the form, so if you have/have had an AMC account, be sure to use that one. I also am unsure if there is a character limit, so try to keep the review concise and 2000 words or less.
Your goal is constructive criticism
I know, this feels like playing nice, or giving them flowers they may not deserve, but the people receiving the review will not know you participated in good faith unless you show your work. This is basic communication 101; you need to communicate that you see TVL as a work of art, and show that you did engage with the material with intent to understand. Lie, if you have to, but pure vitriol will not be taken seriously.
Before you start writing the review, identify:
1 or 2 CREATIVE decisions you liked. This could be actors, costume, set design, original content, dialogue, music, ect. These are things that make the work artistic. Map them out, and treat them seriously: for example, I really liked that the gift to walk in sunlight is a skill that can be taught, and doesn't come from age.
1 or 2 ADAPTIVE decisions you liked. This could be how they condensed something satisfyingly, an ambitious change that you think was compelling, character choices that surprised you, ambiguous details that have you thinking, or things you thought were interesting and were disappointed they did not explore more. Adaption is an art, so let them know how the art impacted you. For example: I really liked the choice to have Magnus be depicted in a music video first, and return as an aggressive and haunting muse. I think it was extremely effective, and I would have liked to see more music-video style narration.
1-2 points of strong criticism. It is easy to dogpile on a whole bunch of flaws, especially when you are irritated, upset, disappointed, or disgusted. Take a deep breath, and make sure your criticisms are substantial. I think everyone who reads this post should make one of these points reference the offensive and poorly framed racialized dialogue, and the striking and hurtful orientation of Louis as a character punished by the narrative.
The conclusion should include actions you wish to see taken to prove the creative team has considered and respected our critique. One or two requests are enough, and I will share my example at the end.
Once you have clearly identified your points, you can move onto the next step
Organize your points
Part of what makes a successful critical review is how it summarizes and analyzes a text's strengths and weaknesses, which means you won't just be writing bullet points. In academia, this would be an introduction and paragraphs based around topics abc, but we don't have to do that. These will be organized into "sections," but that's more to prevent rambling than to grade you. I'll include examples of what I would say, but don't be afraid to use your own voice and just use my words as inspiration.
I'll give you guys 3 methods you can choose between:
Concerned Viewer
If strong criticism scares you, this is a good option.
Start with a short introduction using casual language: "Hi, I am a fan of AMC's Immortal Universe, and I wanted to reach out to share some concerns I had watching the latest season of 'The Vampire Lestat.'"
Next, mention one of your negative points, and follow up with a positive point: "When watching the adaption, I was struck by the realization that ___. This disappointed me so much, because the story and themes could have added so much more to the world and characters, but I don't feel ___. I was happy that some elements made it through, such as ____. I would have loved more moments like this."
The next section should be this, but reversed. Start with a positive point, end with a negative point: "____ really stood out in their performances this season. ___ and ____ stuck with me for days after I watched. I was, however, distracted from complete enjoyment because of _____."
-- I will address the conclusion under a different header --
End with: "I would love to continue to watching The Immortal Universe franchise, however I do not feel comfortable returning to the franchise unless these criticisms are taken seriously. Thank you."
Analyst
This is a good structure if you have very precise critiques that extend beyond surface-level impact that you want to convey.
Start with a strong overview of your impressions of the season. Briefly address one good point and one bad point. You will return to these later: "Dear writers and producers of 'The Vampire Lestat,' as I have tuned into this season weekly, I found myself increasingly dismayed at ____ which damaged my enjoyment of ____ and I wanted to convey my impressions to all concerned parties, to avoid a repetition of this experience."
First section should include your weakest points. You're leading them into the criticism. It is good, also, to describe what story-telling elements you were paying attention to: "I was most excited to see the portrayal of ___ to explore the themes of ___. I was, however, distracted by ___, and found my attention torn between enjoyment and confusion."
Next section should hit your most appreciated moments, but why the flaw you chose made this feel lacking, despite your appreciation: "I was most impressed by ____ which landed with me in ways I didn't expect [fill in details]. However, the ____ were not only distracting, they completely circumvented my deep appreciation for ____ [fill in with details].
-- I will address the conclusion under a different header --
End with: "I am disappointed in the result of this project, despite how interested I was in the story being told. Unless these points are seriously addressed, please do not consider me to be a returning viewer."
Offended Viewer
If you cannot find it in yourself to be polite or logical, you are not a problem. There are ways to structure your argument to convey that emotion without having to "play nice." This will be if you can't seriously commit to the positives from above, but you should still mark things you COULD have enjoyed if the other things didn't ruin your experience.
Start with a direct address (don't name names - yet.), and then give a summary of your issues: "For those at AMC who take criticism for 'The Vampire Lestat,' I have some things that need to be said. ___ and ___ were flaws of the project that ruined my enjoyment, and taxed by emotional and intellectual well-being because I tried so hard to give this adaption a fair chance."
Next section, start with the creative/adaptive things you were looking forward to, and then transition into the moments/episode when you realized that they disappointed you. If you can name the scene, do so. Precision will get you everywhere.
Next section is when you really beat the drum. Name head writers of the episode that pissed you off, detail 2 or 3 moments that you cannot in-good-conscience accept as art, and then provide the summary of what the show seemed to tell you while depicting these things. Tell them what the story impressed on you, because a message delivered ignorantly is still as painful as a message delivered intentionally. Make sure they KNOW what you took from the story.
-- I will address the conclusion under a different header --
End with your earnest disappointment and frustration, and what guided you to this show in the first place: "I expected to enjoy this season. I wanted to respect the changes and experimental approach. I wanted to see ___ and ___, but I did not enjoy it, and my opinion of the project is forever changed because of it."
Conclusion and Action
I put this under its own header because any activist will tell you that you get the most reward out of being united, and if our demands are the same, or are similar, we are more likely to see the results we want. Giving them actions to prove they have listened will also tell the audience if it's worth it to tune into the next season.
You can shift this to be in your own words, with your own criticism. You can even choose different actions. This is just my example, to help you see exactly what I mean.
I do not expect to find myself returning to 'The Vampire Lestat,' unless I have proof that the criticisms I outlined here have been heard and understood.
First, because of the failure of the narrative framework to build a substantial critique of racism -- that included racially offensive dialogue and insults directed at Black characters -- I will not return to The Immortal Universe unless two or more Black writers are hired to share their voices in the creative space. I do not trust the creative team to further address the topic of anti-blackness without them. Second, I request a public and published acknowledgment of the creative missteps, and the insult they have given, so that I have evidence that the creative team is interested in audience feedback.
I know some people are probably not interested in returning and I get you, but I encourage you to lie anyway. Executives speak in numbers, much to my absolute disdain, so if they know they could do something to get you BACK, they will have more incentive to actually do it.
So lie: lie for the fans who want to return, for the actors who want to return, for AMC to treat us seriously, and because it's fun to give a little lie to people who won't be harmed for it. Does AMC really deserve our total truth?
You can screenshot this post, share it on other social media platforms, discord groups, group chats, whatever you need. You can do it without crediting me. Just get the word out there, so AMC's creative team is aware of the impact of their massive fumble of the season.
This isn't about personal taste, it's about solidarity and refusing to accept anti-black writing without calling it out.
