Let me sleep, please

Credits: @foxes-in-love

Oh you have no idea the rant you've just unlocked - I'd apologise but I'm far too excited about this :DD

I think that they would make an absolutely fantastic pairing, either romantically or otherwise. Not just chemistry wise , but I think that it could be a surprisingly healthy and helpful relationship for the both of them!!

But to put it the long way:

1a. I like my narrative parallels - Atonement

Egbert’s motivation for adventuring is that he is looking for atonement, and by the end of the campaign he has achieved that. Liliana, well, lets just say that she has done a lot of things that she needs to make up for

At least in my interpretation of her, I feel like a post-cannon Liliana has realised that what she spent her life doing was wrong because it got a lot of folks hurt. Egbert’s guilt comes from the fact that he hurt people trying to do the wrong thing, whilst hers would be more that she hurt people because she didn’t care what happened to them if they were in her way

They both do achieve that atonement in the campaign. Egbert is allowed to re-join the order because of his hand in restoring gold dragons, and Liliana is very explicitly forgiven by the entirety of Geth thanks to They in Prism Escape

I feel like whatever kind of relationship they would end up building would be built on that mutual need to be forgiven by others, and to forgive themselves 

1b. Other interesting similarities and opposites:

Not that it means a lot in a DnD world, but they have both had people who want to kill them specifically! Lils in general thanks to the various evils she liked to do (see the guards in Frenemy at the Gate), and prior to LoD it seems like Egbert had a kill on sight policy when in the citadel’s grounds. So… fun bonding experience for all? 

Egbert uses self-depricating humour as a coping mechanism a lot, which isn’t really surprising given the jokes other people make about him. The example that comes to mind is about the clones, telling Liliana  “well maybe if you’d gotten to know me a bit better first you’d have realised what a bad idea that was” in using him as the blueprint. She on the other hand bigs herself up (which I think is putting up a front, but that’s maybe more of a headcannon) to cope, re. I refuse to believe “I’ve never had to work for anything in my life” is true coming from the woman who spent 2 centuries translating a book. I think Egbert would struggle deciphering her humour at first (the “haha, yeah, very drol” from when he tried to eat one of every canape, I forget which episode, speaks to me in a very neurotypical way, I promise) but he would get there, maybe end up having an easier time understanding it in the end from specifically studying it

They both are/have experienced loneliness. Egbert says that he was a lonely child who spent a lot of time exploring under Mistmire, he had his entire support network dismantled when he was thrown out of the order, and you know, the guild’s treatment of him at times can’t have helped that. Headcannons again here a bit, but Liliana never mentioned anybody else. She’s collaborated with various people, but between evil bases it doesn’t seem to be the same folks. When she moves into Necropolis as far as we know she moves in solo (barring the Otherberts, but I’ll get to them in a mo) and, well, hundreds of years is a long time to be alone

2. Why they would be good for each other:

Egbert is the kindest person in the guild, no question about it. Corazon’s attitude a lot of the time, plus what he doomed his old crew to only to procrastinate saving them, Dob’s refusal to think through the consequences of his actions and what I’m calling his only child syndrome (Yes, he has Suzette. But she raised him more than grew up besides him so it still counts), Merilwen’s “no second chances” see the moonbeaming the surrendering Otherberts, and Prudence is Prudence. The worst thing Egbert ever did was done out of compassion, to help the last golden dragon despite all the indoctrination the order had put him through.

(We’re going to ignore the whole “repeatedly bashing an old man in the back with a mace until he turned into a seal” because he at least didn’t leave him to fend for himself, and he did end up preferring life as a seal) 

Something tells me that Liliana would need somebody like that, somebody who would check in and make sure she was alright, not because she’s helping them save the world, but because she is frightened and he is not

I just know that they would help each other to heal, make them both a lot better

Egbert would show her that it is possible to redeem yourself even after doing terrible things, and Lils would teach him how to stand up for himself when he needs to 

3a. The relationship starting:

I think it would take a fair amount of work to get a proper friendship going between them, despite how well it would work out in the end

Out of the whole guild, Egbert definitely dealt with the most at Liliana’s hands. He was the only one of them with permanent (or at least very long-term) consequences as a result of Spell Check since he lost his kidney. Then he was kidnapped by her, which is traumatic in and of itself, not to mention that he was found in the tower suspended in a tank with a bunch of wires attached, clearly being experimented on. And, you know, the minor fact of being made on numerous occasions to murder large groups of people that look exactly like him? And that could be considered his children? Poor guy needs a hug...

But Egbert doesn’t hold grudges. From being kicked out of his order, he knows what it is like to have your past actions held against you, so he always seems to forgive instantly. I’d argue that this is frequently to his own detriment, never questioning how his friends mock him, and never getting apologies. I might be forgetting something here, but the only time I can think of with anybody apologising for poking fun would be Merilwen when she was recruiting Rowan, but he heard neither the insult or the apology, so that doesn’t really count. That’s a whole tangent that’s not relevant, but what I’m getting at is that if he was capable of holding any sort of bitterness, he would have left the guild a long time ago

Liliana on the other hand? She’s been spending a hell of a lot of time and resources trying to murder five specific idiots for years because they flooded her laboratory with magic sandwiches.  Which I think qualifies as grudge holding

All of which is to say, I don’t think Egbert would hold the past against her (unlike everybody else), and maybe given time, she could learn a thing or two about forgiving others from him

Despite this, it would probably still take some time for them to connect, but that’s not from Egbert holding any reservations, more like Liliana and her lovely self esteem problems. Once they saw that Corazon was okay, in an everybody-lives AU, I think he’d be first to her side, first to try and reconcile, first to achieve that, the first to understand her motivations and the one stopping the rest of them from murdering her

“The worst thing I ever did was for a good reason, every other thing we’ve done that ended with my friends and I being run out of a town had good intentions behind it, so tell me why you did that so we can help you”. Not in so many words, but that kind of thing?

3b. The Dyamic

I think that they would have a really fun dynamic as friends (or otherwise) post cannon. It's very much a sunshine and moonlight type vibe, with Egbert being Egbert and Liliana a ball of angst given mortal form, but I think he would bring her out of her shell and she'd teach him to take less shit

I've now got the mental image that I'm very tempted to write of the guild and Lils post quest cleaning up the mansion, she works herself into somewhat of a mental breakdown when Egbert finds her. She's all "I'm a terrible person I don't deserve any of this kindness" and he's like "Yes you do. You made mistakes but you're a person" then "What do you mean, I tried to have you murdered??? I stole your kidney???" "Yeah, you gave it back!" "Only because the world was about to end!" "Okay, everyone needs pushing a different amount to get there" "Wha- I literally made you murder clones of yourself? Many times?" "Yeah, who hasn't wanted to punch themselves in the face at times!" "...." "Back to washing up? I'll steam up the whole room if I try, so you wash and I'll dry?" "... okay"

Do I think the guild are a bit dickish about him making friends with her immediately again? Of course they are! Of course they don't trust his judgement! But they get proven wrong and that's all that matters (And maybe threatened a little bit into being nicer - she chucked them out of a balloon once, I think she can still intimidate the guild a lot <3)

Also, Egbert's the only one who can take Liliana's teasing/jabs at the start and I think that's wonderful. She probably takes a long while before being comfortable being sappy or sincere with anybody, so having one of the guild who doesn't get tetchy when she jabs at them means a lot to her and goes a long way in opening her up

And Liliana is a scholar - I think she would actually be interested in La Vache Mauve once she realises that she is real and not a figment of Egbert's loneliness and that would mean the damn world to him

4. The Otherberts:

Liliana created the otherberts, so she actually understands what Egbert is like as a dragonborn (to an extent at least) - aka she would finally be someone who wouldn't carry on with the invasive dragonborn anatomy questions

They're both the only ones who seem to see the otherberts as people?  Liliana made them, and even if she does treat them a bit eh by sending them to wars constantly and the like, that's her general personality.Egbert is obviously compassionate for them. The others? Again, Merilwen and the moonbeam of the retreating ones, Dob and Bonsely (I'm still mad about the disrespect there tbh) etc

It’s a really silly thing to latch onto, but in Season Finale, the Otherbert reading the shipping log to Lils as she trances for her first night in Necropolis on Sea is really important to me <3 

In terms of Portal Combat specifically? I keep forgetting they were in that fight, I'm not going to lie (the ending distracted me, okay? Haha)

But they were really helpful (or at least attempted to be for the ones that kept missing) which I do love because the whole campaign they were somewhat incompetent in the "well maybe if you'd got to know me a bit better first" only for them then to be really important in crowd control in the final encounter so that the action economy doesn't hinder the group is brilliant

But they disappear (As does every other NPC) once Liliana stands up to kill Merilwen. And I know that this was to not crowd the scene - the moment was one for the characters to shine and a good one at that, I wouldn’t have it any other way, but it does make me wonder what they all were doing when that happened

Personal headcannon? I think the Dob shouted everybody away to safety once he realised what Liliana was doing (going for the kill). Why Dob specifically? ... Suzette angst, that’s actually the only reason, I needed her to be elsewhere during that scene for AWMST. But to try and retroactively justify it, Corazon realised but was busy jumping in front of Merilwen and the others were probably distracted

But the Otherberts? I like to imagine that since Liliana is changed by her adventure, she tells them her plan and tells them to flee and start a new life by themselves, without her name to drag them down, because yay for redemption!

(Either that or you know... they are paladins... if Merilwen hadn't had reincarnation prepared and Egbert also forgot he was a paladin.... they would have had revivify.... But that depends on how you want to interpret her final stand)

And yeah, I think they'd be good for each other, too!!!

1a. I'm also fond of narrative parallels - Atonement:

I think you've got their characters down from the get-go. Egbert is very desperate for a sort of approval and I think Liliana is too even though she acts like she's above it. (For example, when Egbert tells her that his seal does not care for her, she sarcastically replies "I'm so hurt." in I believe the same tone she does when she says she's never had to work a day in her life. Which to me speaks to her feeling like a caged animal and lashing out at anything that draws near to reach her sensitive underbelly so to speak.) While Egbert tends to wear his heart (and his yearning for approval) on his sleeve, Liliana prefers to keep it locked away.

And for their relationship as you describe it, I can see Egbert as the kind of person who always tells her he forgives her even though she tries to argue she doesn't deserve it, (even though she's desperate for it), and it then being a big milestone for her when he says he forgives her and she just says thank you instead of ranting as to why he's wrong to forgive her.

1b. Additions to your compare and contrast:

- Yeahhhh, also even though the kill on sight order was lifted for Egbert, Dryesdale still hates his guts and specifically told him that if Egbert ever returns that he, Dryesdale, will kill him. So they've both definitely still got people mad at them. And they could probably have some interesting bonding conversations about that with their desires to be wanted and approved of.

- YES! Okay, okay, yes, I think about this a lot. I agree and I think Egbert's self-deprecating humor also has to do with how he was essentially raised. I know the only peek into pre-Oxventute life for Egbert that we have for him is that one bonus episode of the podcast ("Paladin Adventures" for anyone curious) and him saying that he was a very lonely child that wandered the catacombs but based on that I can't imagine he was a very popular or well-liked child (Sorry Egbert) and I think he was actually put-down a lot and looked down upon, especially when he didn't take to his Paladin duties as easily as the others. And so I think he sort of adapted the reception he knew he was going to get as a defense mechanism, like why keep building yourself if you know you're going to get knocked down but being mopey all the time is just going to make people uncomfortable. Then when the Oxventurers never challenged those ingrained beliefs, he just kept doing what he was doing, which just digs himself into a deeper hole.

Meanwhile Liliana hasn't had recurring and reliable interactions with others to shape her outside view of herself like he has so she has to be her biggest cheerleader and when there's no one around to contest that then she's free to think whatever she wants of herself, including that she's the best ever.

I do agree that Egbert would struggle deciphering her humor, especially because I think he struggles with sarcasm and metaphor (See: his response to someone saying that something is under the opponent's nose is "What I'm getting is that there's something inside your face.") which I think Liliana uses a lot. (Also the episode is Exhibition Impossible Part 1 and if I understand correctly I think the "very droll" is very like neurotypical being uncomfortable by something someone weird (typically neurodivergent) did and are trying to pass it off as like an acceptable social exchange because it was just a charming little joke and then Egbert's response of repeating it is him trying to fit back in, once again desperate for approval) But I think once he deciphers her humor, he'd have a lot of fun trying to pull laughter out of her. (And I have a soft spot for the idea that he's like the only one able to do that)

- Ohhhhh, they are soooooo lonely. That's one of their defining traits to me. And yes!!! Like his even if he had a family outside of the order, Egbert's entire life was on Mistimire and he has no idea what's out there but he has no choice but to do that and go it alone because he's been severed from any support he previously had when they kick him out!!! And, yeah, The Oxventurers love of ribbing doesn't help but also I think he like immediately puts up with it because 1) it's similar to what he's used to and 2) these are the only people thay are giving him a chance so what's a little bit of ribbing if it means he'll have people (mostly) on his side?

And yeah, Liliana definitely seems like the type thay finds people entirely expendable (a far cry from Egbert who immediately ingratiates himself with like most NPCs, especially old women and those werebears in High Moon) so she's not keeping people around on tenure or anything like that. Also I feel like I should point out that Bismuth is very much on Necropolis-On-Sea when Liliana takes over (maybe bonding with the Otherberts like she did Egbert) so even though Liliana probably sees her as just a dispensable servant that she doesn't have to treat with respect, Bismuth *is* there with her. (Even though she escapes to tell the group about the dragon eggs and then returns) But given Liliana does not see these people as equals, it's no doubt that she would feel very alone.

2. Why they'd be good together:

- THANK YOU! This is what I've been *sayinggggg!* Egbert is genuinely so sweet and caring and kind and you can see it in the way he talks to so many NPCs and literally in the way Johnny plays the Otherberts at the pub with how they choose to make a point of one advising Corazón to slow down on the pipe because those things are really bad for you and how they thank the barmen for Carry-Oaky night (even though it was *their* invention) and compliment the course as they leave. Like if you push aside the bomb explosions and devil-may-care attitude people tend to just see Egbert as, you get a massive sweetheart, you just have to loook. (Also an addition to the Suzette part, Suzette definitely raised Dob as if he was the most important thing in the world (which to be fair to her, she is to him) because she couldn't afford to lose him so that, paired with the fact his caregiver was a child herself dealing with the grief of losing her parents and couldn't have had enough knowledge and maturity to take raise anyone, let him get away with a *loooootttttt* of stuff and he never really learned that there are consequences for his actions (frankly, I still think he hasn't learned)) Then Merilwen is also a True Neutral, like Ellen is very clear about this and its a moral alignment she really sticks to (which kudos to Ellen), and True Neutrals are not going to go out of their way to be kind like Egbert does. Then, yeah, the worst things Egbert has done was accidentally kill people (that he is very sorry for) and probably property damage on a quest to right the wrong of his order because they were quite literally abusing an animal and ruining its quality of life. And he was right and the dragon went free in the end so really if they listened to him in the first place they wouldn't have to had to deal with all this.

- (Actually, we're not. Because the "bashing an old man in the back with a mace until he turns into a seal" was I think a Corazón/Andy line and he loves to make everything worse than it actually is and also I think Mike said after "like a love tap". And furthermore! Like you mentioned, Victor *literally* says he's happier as a seal because he can eat, sleep, and yell whenever he wants and he didn't have to die for his home to become a museum like he wanted it to. (And for folks curious we learn this in like Orbpocolypse episode 1)

- You're totally right, and I can see Egbert sort of becoming her guiding light out of the fear and into getting better what with his calm friendly persona that makes him easy to talk to and golden scales that probably reflect the sun beautifully

- They would!!!

- Yesssss, you've put it perfectly. And I can see Egbert calling her Lils (and Lili) and it really growing on her (maybe only letting him call her that, though, because he put in all the effort to help her bring her walls down)

3a. The relationship starting:

- Nod, nod

- Exactlyyyyy. Also, to hold onto those last examples for a minute, Egbert *does* routinely call the Otherberts his sons and they routinely call him papa/The Jarfather so it feels clear to me that they feel the urge for like a parent child relationship but the majority of the Otherberts are loyal to Liliana and told to kill him so he often has to stand aside or help people kill his own children (which I think Corazón enjoys) and that's definitely going to take its toll on anyone. And we definitely know it takes its toll on him because he is genuinely remorseful when they die and is on record of saying staring at all of the corpses/skeletons of copies of him is weird (only for Dob to immediately make the original Bonesly and make Egbert have to deal with that). So yes, he needs so many hugs and I think it's going to take a little bit for him to reconcile with all that. But maybe the presence of the Portal Combat Otherberts (who I know we will get to) could help with that being the ones he can actually have a parent child relationship with.

- I think you've perfectly hit the nail on the head here, I don't think I can really add anything. Other than that I think they do apologize (prompted by Egbert) for not believing him when they learn they were captured by people for a party where the rich people eat the poor people for which is something he is recurringly concerned about, but other than that they don't really ever apologize to him. And also that last sentence in that bullet point is really good to hear imo because I think it a lot myself.

- Exactly (again)

- Aw, that's very sweet (:* I agree

- Awwww, I think you're absolutely correct and I think it would mean a lot to Liliana

- 🥹🥹🥹 that's very sweet (Egbert *is* such a sweetie afterall)

3b. The Dynamic:

- Yesssss!!! I think they are like the sun and moon to each other (Liliana maaaaybe could even get them matching jewelry for it as a very vulnerable attempt at a gift and Egbert lovesssss it (and cries about it because he's canonically a crier) (Also I think since I started this I should probably share some potential ideas for that otherwise but I'll leave that for the end here) And I can really see Liliana telling people to shut up so Egbert can speak and curtly pointing out that Egbert was still talking when they interrupt him and I think he really appreciates it.

- Oh my gourddddd, that's so adorable and sweeeeeeeettt! Absolutely no pressure but if you wrote it, I'd definitely read it.

- ^^^^ this, this, this is very right. I think Corazón (and maybe Prudence) especially would throw a fit about it.

- Awwww, and when she *is* ready to try being sappy/sincere I think he'll meet her at her level about it while also being open to it with open arms. Like he won't use the moment to tease her back like perhaps some of the other Oxventurers would do.

- Yes!! Ohhhhh, I love La Vache Mauve (and her relationship with Egbert) and I think she and Liliana and Egbert could have a lot of interesting discussions about godhood and nature and responsibilities and things like that.

4. The Otherberts:

- Very, very true

- Trueeeee. Egbert especially with how he pretty much instantly sees them as his sons. (Also yeahhhhh, I'm also still mad about the disrespect that is Bonesly. Like imagine if you were cloned and your friend decided to use/defile a skull and spine of one of those clones as a literal puppet/weapon. Like, to me at least, it really speaks to Dob having like no respect for Egbert but that's a tangent for another time)

- No, no, it's not silly, it's a really cute moment (:*

- Don't worry I think about them a lot. Two Otherberts were guarding Merilwen while she concentrated on a fire wind wall thing and the other three were being ordered around by Prudence when she told them to shoot their arrows. They didn't really stand out in the episode but they mean a lot to me.

- Yeahhhh

- Oh, that's interesting. I mean Dob does send Message to Suzette to run, which she does, so maybe everyone else followed her? Especially seeing as they'd know she's got a good head on her shoulders *and* would be the person Dob would want to warn if things go south and like if you see that kind of person running then you're probably gonna wanna start running, too.

- Oh, that's a sweet thought for Liliana. I always imagined them kind of standing on the outskirts, maybe still sort of hanging onto their posts so to speak, just watching and having no idea what to do because, despite everything, they've like literally just been born (literally let out of their tubes for the first time for the fight) and have no experience with situations like what was unfolding in front of them. (Maaaaybe approaching Egbert after the dust has really settled, but what's probably more likely is that he approached them)

- (😭😭😭 (I know we rag on Egbert for not reviving Corazón but also I think, narratively, Merilwen resurrecting him as a Tortle fits better, especially with their bickering which is more 1v1 compared to Corazón's dynamic with Egbert which sometimes just feels like Corazón bullying him))

"Opposite sides of the same coin" is a very good way to put it. I think they're so intertwined with each other that it can be hard to talk about one without bringing up the other. They really fascinate me and I'm glad you think a friendship between them would do them both a world of healing cuz I think so, too <3

Also under a quick read more, here's some sort of like Liliana and Egbert as a relationship (romantic or queerplatonic, take your pick, delete according to your belief, y'know (but for my ease I'm just gonna type "romantic") like headcanons because I started this and I feel like I should at least try to offer some of the possibility:

Therefore I posit: having a missing person declared dead in the Shire requires the consent of their next of kin. Whoever Bilbo’s next of kin was at the time of the Hobbit (possibly Otho? I’m not sure) had him declared dead at the first opportunity but Frodo refused to ever do it.

Frodo had anxious hobbit bureaucrats knocking on his door every couple of years like ‘Mr Baggins… blease… it’s been 10 years… he was eleventy-one… can we fill out his death certificate yet’ and Frodo was like ‘absolutely not’.

A cat named ■ ■ ■

Chapters: 1/1 Fandom: Oxventure (Web Series) Rating: Teen And Up Audiences Warnings: No Archive Warnings Apply Relationships: Cressida Blackwater/Morven Hellwain Characters: Morven Hellwain, Cressida Blackwater Additional Tags: Dialogue Heavy, Asexual Morven Hellwain, Angst, Hurt No Comfort Summary:

Great dialogue can come from radical emotional honesty. But in most real conversations, people

dodge questions

answer indirectly

lie (badly)

change the subject

crack jokes to avoid serious answers

lie (convincingly)

say half of what they mean

tell the truth but get so anxious/angry/defensive others now think they're lying

If your dialogue feels unnatural, it might be because everyone is saying exactly what they think, or articulating their thoughts too well. Try letting characters hide things instead.

people don’t always speak in full sentences,

slang can change depending on age range, demographic, etc. &

Merilwen (who is 102) would've been born in 1924. She would've been there for the prohibition, and the great depression, and WW2, and the fall of the Berlin wall, and the beginning of the information super-highway and just, like, doesn't that boggle the mind?

Corazón (who is 30) would've been born in 1996, which is pretty normal.

Prudence and Dob (who are both 28) would've both been born in 1998, which feels kinda young but still pretty normal.

And last but certainly not least, Egbert (who is 24) would've been born in

Drumroll please 🥁🥁🥁

2002!

Egbert, in a modern AU, would be a 2002 baby!! 2002!!

Can the computer create something? At first glance it seems obvious that it can. Animated computer graphics, with their fluid transitions and whiplash perspectives, look strikingly new. And if one watches the machine doing animation work, there seem to be lengthy periods when the computer is acting “on its own.”

But if one observes these processes in more detail, it becomes clear that creation is not occurring within the machine. First of all, computer graphics are not unique. Computers have yet to generate anything that cannot be done by hand—and usually already has been done. Second, the apparent ability of the computer to “act on its own” is the outcome of thousands of hours of patient human effort to refine its instructions. The computer can manipulate a shape for us if we have already informed it what a shape is, what the rules for shape manipulation are, what this specific shape is, and so forth.