Honour

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Some quotes from Honour themselves. (In regular text below the cut. I chose to put them in smaller text here so it didn't get super long)

"The mods aren't going to do anything about the racism in the site...I'm so sick to my stomach about this."

"We have forced minorities to be okay with seeing and saying slurs. Gay people *have* to be okay with other gay people saying the F word. Trans people *have* to be okay with other trans people saying the T word. Black people *have* to be okay with other black people saying the N word. People are so eager to say slurs that they strip the meaning away and then it's just a special word that only I can say.

I am not okay when I see, in any context, the M word. It makes me ridiculously sick to my stomach. It makes me unable to eat. It makes me unable to speak. It can't be stripped into a nothingburger word for me specifically because most the time I see it, it's used like this. It's used by people erasing my past, taking my label for themselves. I see it more as a name and pronoun and stupid made up Tumblr identity than I see it used on a dog. It's erasure.

But because of the therians that specifically think their identity is more important than generations of racial abuse brainwashing other white therians into thinking this word is okay to say, I am the only one to tell anyone this word shouldnt be said. I am the person left in the front lines to educate people that a word that makes me literally sick to see is a word they shouldnt be saying. And 99% of the time they act like this."

This is my call to action.

The mods of the website and app cited the individual involved "not identifying as human bodied" as the reason they should be allowed to say the slur. We find this ridiculous. At the end of the day, a users identity on a website should not be encouraged to be used in a way which takes away from people who are negatively affected by it.

It is strange to me that the moderators are just okay with "don't identify as being a some being in a human body" as a reason for this behavior to continue. Because, like. What's the difference between this and someone using a different racial slur because the "identify as that race".

"they identify in a way they are not and therefore this slur is actually on limits to them"

It's unprofessional. And I think we need to say this. Especially those of us who are in the alterhuman and therian communities.

Anyone. Anyone is either is or is not directly influenced by the usage of this slur, I ask that you lend your voice. I ask for the sake of people who are affected by the slur, for my own sake and for Honour's, let us have one moment where the voices of people saying this is not your word to say overpower the voices of those who want to steal it.

If you have the ability to email them, even if you don't know what to say, please message me. I will provide you with the mods emails. I will even provide you with speaking points if they are needed. I beg everyone to spread this message specifically around.

Honour said that they are always left in front educating people. Can we, please, band together to form an educative and safety circle around them.

I truly believe it we can do this, it will be the first small win which inevitably leads to our victory. But it starts with this.

Yes, it's ridiculous. Because it is a forum pet game. But that's why it might just work. They don't have the resources NOT to listen to all of our voices. And getting someone to listen to us would be more empowerment than we've ever had before.

Please spread this. Spread this to anyone. Spread it in your discord servers if you can, spread it in Tumblr communities. Reblog it. (Maybe don't put it on twt bc that's where people will flame you) , but I beg that you spread this post anywhere you can so that we can get enough people to make a change.

Thank you for you help

Imo this honour person just needs to get offline. Like seriously. Im sorry but a word affecting you to such a degree is not reason enough to try and force an entire community not to say it. That is a personal problem.

Like idk maybe you should consider that its a good thing actually that the word is no being used in a derogatory way and that most people dont feel threatened when referred to as such. That most people associate it with dogs and not even in a derogatory way. The same cant entirely be said for "faggot" and "tranny" as they still refer to humans who are gay and trans respectively, but people of those groups being able to say them and refer to themselves as those things and giving them better connotations is a GOOD thing. And i say this as a queer extransmasc (was trans for a couple years, just happened to not actually be me). The n-word however IS still largely considered a slur when used by anyone other than african/african americans. Bringing them up is such a false equivalence argument.

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This is super super important and a topic that is significant to me personally.

Mutt is a slur. When you use mutt in reference to human-bodied beings (even yourself) it perpetuates the idea that it's okay to call people that slur. It hurts beings within the community and humans outside of the community. Please do not perpetuate the dehumanization of people of color.

The use of this slur may not be a common problem where you come from, but there are many places and contexts where it is still a big problem, and people coming across your posts may not recognize that.

Image ID: 3 screenshots of a conversation between the users Honour and PsychWolf.

Image 1:

Honour: "one of your pronouns, (mutt) is a racial slur and those of us the term is used against feel very negatively about human bodied individuals using the term for things like names, identities, and pronouns. The problem is that even if you can reclaim it (which I always assume the benefit of the doubt and assume a person is able to use the slur they choose to make their pronoun), it furthers the belief that the term is okay to use. White people think "mutt" is an okay pronoun because they saw someone else use it with no disclaimer that it is a reclaimitory slur, if that makes sense. Sorry to be a bother, I went to your profile because your pride flag thing seemed interesting and I was curious, but as someone who is viscerally uncomfortable with the word, I felt the need to let you know instead of digging further into your profile"

PsychWolf: "I specifically use said set of pronouns as it connects to the mix of what my labels are - being alterhuman, therian/otherkin, and the sub sets of xenogenders I am (fauna, pup, etc). For a shorter explanation that doesn't get into deeper more personal chunks of my identity - I do not view myself as human or human bodied ( also please do not refer to me as such) . The closest is more specs of it throught my perception like sand in sugar or salt. I originally was introduced to using them do to the large mix of species that were related to said identifies and the fact it didn't belong to one singular breed. These are common in these spaces"

Image 2:

Honor: "While your reasoning may make sense to you, there are a multitude of other terms that can mean mixedbred dog, and ignoring the request of someone who is genuinely affected by this use of a word which is, no matter what you believe, a recognize racial slur, is wrong. I did not call you a human, but you do need to understand the fact of the situation. You may not be human and I am not here to tell you otherwise. But mutt, when used on someone with the /body/ of a human, is a racist SLUR. You are choosing to label yourself with a slur and trying to excuse it in the face of someone the slur is against."

PsychWolf: "The line about not referring to me as human was added to include the point - not a human body. The top message was explaining the meaning behind using them - as in alterhuman and therian spaces it is commonly used for a long list of reasons"

Honour: "I didn't see a reason listed that trumps the fact that you are using a racial slur and encouraging others to use it as well in reference to you while continuing to have to clarification anywhere that the word is a racial slur"

Honour: "you are sporting a slur against me in a gif. asking people to refer to you as a slur against me, a racial slur. The word does not only have history in meaning mixed breed or unknown breed animals,"

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PsychWolf: "It isn't used in the therian and alterhuman communities because they " like the term" it is used do to the existence of mixed breed animals, and for a larger chunk of the community that do not have singular species identity because of the issues they faced because of said identities. As multiple groups spent years harassing them which lead to it spreading and other issues that I don't have the current spoons to go into."

Honour: "you haven't answered any of the questions, you are just deflecting. I am a therian, I know that the therian community has the ability to coin new terms. I know that there are terms that are not related in any way shape or form for people who have multiple, complex, confusing, mixed breed, and other similar relating theriotypes. there are options that are not slurs. people like yourself who choose to continue to use the term are, in fact, using it because they "like the term", because if you had any genuine care for anyone in any minority besides your own, you wouldn't use a racial slur as a fucking pronoun. being harassed for being a therian is not equal to being harassed for being a racial minority and you know that. again, I ask: Why, in any position or universe, should it be okay to use a word that you now know is a slur, to encourage others to say a word that you now know is a slur, when someone who is directly affected by the use of the slur is telling you intently that they are hurt by it? How is that appropriate?"

I am otherkin & my species is canine (including mutts)

I enjoy being referred to as a mutt (and other canine terms)

But I do not understand why is bad if two different words? What word can be used instead of?

Mutt is not a slur in the context of canine? Like the word fag when talk about bundle of sticks?

I do not want to dismiss I just do not understand and need someone explain simpler

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>In these screenshots user {Honour} informs user {Psychwolf} that they are using a racial slur as a pronoun {mutt} and should not be regardless of their nonhuman identity because it is a slur which they do not have the power to reclaim and also it should not be normalised as an {ok} word even if they do_

>User {Honour} is someone personally affected by said slur_

>{Psychwolf} counter argues that they are allowed to use that slur because it represents their species identity and is common in therian spaces because of its relationship to mixed breed animals_

>They also attempt to deflect responsibility for their microaggression by acting like a worse or equivalent issue is {Honour} potentially indicating that {Psychwolf} is human or human bodied which {Honour} is not even doing_

>{Honour} restates the facts of their position as well as pointing out that multiple alternative terms exist including within said communities they also ask {Psychwolf} to explain why they think using a slur as a pronoun is appropriate to which {Psychwolf} has no response but to insist it's fine because they aren't human and identify as not being human-bodied either_

I'm not really understanding. If they use "mutt" for themselves to mean a mixed breed dog because they're a dog therian/alterhuman... I don't really see the problem? I'm not really sure if it's an english thing, but are slurs illegal to use or something? I thought that slurs were used like insults? Like, it's the same as insults but sometimes have racial or homophobic connotations or something?

Is it illegal to use slurs? Is it not the same as insulting someone? (obv that's bad too but... not that serious)

"if they are using the words for themselves, it's fine, isn't it?"

I don't know. If a straight person chooses to sit in their room by themselves and say the F slur, is it fine? People have different definitions of when it is, or if it is ever at all, okay to say a slur that doesn't apply to them.

The difference is that this isn't "for themself", it's not a private manner that only they are involved in. It is them giving any person that wants to refer to them the option to say a word that they have no right to give people to use.

"as long as it doesn't have a racist connotation, it's fine right?"

Racial slurs are often used without racist connotations. When people in music say the N word, or someone calls their friend, "my nigga", they are often not referring to race specifically, and more often than that, not purposely being racist, however, a non black person repeating these, even with the same intention, is wrong. It's not their word to say. It's not appropriate, and it becomes ill intended because it is nearly impossible to say slurs you cannot reclaim and it be well intended.

"because they are a dog therian... I don't see the problem"

The problem is that use of the term mutt is contributing to erasure of the oppression mixed race individuals face. A guy saying tranny to refer to his transmission (while still often frowned upon), does not take away from trans individuals anymore because everyone knows that tranny is a slur. It is incredibly rare to find someone who knows that mutt is a slur, you've said this yourself. Using mutt as a name or pronouns and in an identity term you coin continues to push the narrative that theres nothing wrong with this word. Because there are so few of us, the voices of people who use the word despite it not beinng against them drastically overpower the voices of us begging to not see slurs against us thrown around like identity markers. That is why you don't hear people saying they are uncomfortable with the slur being ripped from us. Because other voices are drowning them out.

"Maybe they didn't know mutt was a slur"

This is what I assumed, and this is why I did not come at them harshly or negatively, but with intent to teach, please note that instead of apologizing, they literally claimed "harassment toward therians" as a reason they should continually get to use a word that is not a slur towards them. They /now/ know mutt is a slur and they continue to use it. They do not care about the oppression of racial minorities, they only care about their own oppression.

"if they are using the pronoun for themself, whats the problem"

My history is being ripped from me as I am forced to watch people who do not face the discrimination I face use a slur against me for aesthetic purposes. I am tired of seeing the word mutt on Tumblr every day because I am also a part of this community. Racial minorities should be allowed to exist in their communities without being forced to see people downplay the seriousness of their slurs every day.

Don't use either of these platforms if you value yourself and your safety.

Orbit is open about using AI and doubles down no matter what if you point out how risky using AI for an app like this is.

Indigo on the other hand, made an eager post about the app they're developing, saying that they can look at your data and will very much delete your account if they find out you're an endo or find endo material in your account.

Remember that there are going to be people looking to take advantage of the fact there's very little for systems right now. Do your due diligence and make sure to do extensive research before using any platform claiming to be for systems, even if by a system.

Every single app for systems going dark at the exact same time except for octocon is incredibly suspicious. Add in the fact they’re all (with the exception of lighthouse) practically begging people to use octocon? And the fact all the developers have been in touch? (Again except lighthouse) And the fact that in the simply plural discord server any attempt to point this out or criticize the octocon developer (atlas) is immediately deleted and met with passive aggression and being told to not talk about it? None of that is normal. That’s not normal for two separate entities that have supposedly not been in contact with each other more than minimally, and that’s not normal for two separate entities not in some form of cahoots.

One ecosystem having a total monopoly over the entire plural community, regardless of what your stance is on syscourse (particularly the endo discourse) is dangerous. Nothing good can come of it. Sorry (not really) but I would genuinely rather eat the caca out of someone’s butt than go back to using octocon especially since now I feel like I’m being forced to use it.

Atlas stated on his blog that he and the sp developer are not in any cahoots, but how do you know he’s telling the truth? He allowed a known pedophile into his server with minors in it, protected the pedophile and harbored him. He pushed the situation under the rug until the community pushed back, demanding answers and retaliation. Even now, he continues to downplay his decisions. How do you know someone who protected a predator is telling the truth? What, because Atlas said so, his word is suddenly absolute truth? The same person who denies the anti endo origins of the app? If it initially had anti endo origins, and truly did change his mind, then the correct thing to do and the honest thing to do would be to own up to it. To publicly express the shift when it fucking happened. Not wait until there was backlash. Not deny it and wipe all evidence of the past, claim it never happened, and essentially gaslight an entire community of trauma survivors.

Personally I don’t care it was originally an anti endo ecosystem. I don’t give a damn about 97% of syscourse. I have my opinions for certain topics but I don’t care about them enough to make an issue out of it. I don’t care it was anti endo, I care he’s lying about it. I care he’s gaslighting an entire community. I care he’s backpedaling because being anti endo got him backlash. I care because he refuses to admit the truth. Nobody would care if it was originally anti endo but his opinion shifted or the goal of the app shifted. But everybody does care because you’re lying about it.

Considering that, the harboring a pedo situation (and downplaying that too even after being exposed), and the contradiction between what he states and what’s actually in his (shady and vague) terms of service/privacy policy, can you really trust that he’s telling the truth?

Personally, I wouldn’t trust Atlas with even your favorite color, never mind your entire system data.

A question for the plural community:

If a new plural-focused app like Concordia were created, what features would you want to see?

What works well in current tools like Simply Plural or Octocon? What features feel missing or could be improved?

The goal of The Concordia Project is to build something shaped by the community, so hearing what people actually want from a plural app is incredibly valuable! Sharing this post helps a lot!

- Option to use HTML / CSS for your profile

- A planner/Organizer with a calender

- If public, the ability to hide information and change who can see what is a must

- Alter Web/Headmate map. Essentially, the ability to see which members are connected in what way (people are recommending a relationships feature, similar to this, but ideally, visual

- If public, some form of "Read me" that isn't the system profile that can show up at the top of the alter list of the system so chooses (to ensure people don't have to add a member just as a read me

- This thing that Ampersand has would be really cool

DO NOT USE OCTOCON. I repeat, do no use Octocon. Octocon is not a safe alternative, and your account could be banned at any moment without notice for simply using their platform in a way they don't agree with. They are aggressively sysmedicalist and have (alledgedly) protected predatory behavior towards minors.

Lighthouse has also been discontinued, unfortunately, so this is no longer a viable replacement.

With Ampersand going on hiatus, I wouldn't rely on that platform to keep your data stored. Its official blog has been abruptly deleted, so who's to say the app won't abruptly go down too? Granted, it's at least still up for the time being, so it might not be a terrible alternative. Only time will tell where that's going.

The Concordia Project is very promising, but as far as we're aware, there is not currently a usable app available. PluralKit and Tupperbox can also be used for these purposes, and private Discord servers can also be used to log information.

Pronouns.cc is a very good alternative, we think. It can be a little clunky to use for larger systems, but it can at least help with keeping track of basic information.

You can try using Pinterest? You can name boards after headmates and save images to the board that they enjoy or associate with themselves. You can even find flags on there, and you can make subboards for things like clothes they enjoy. We don't personally find this intuitive for our own needs, but maybe someone else will?

I've also heard of systems using excel or other spreadsheets to keep track of system information, which might be more accessible for larger collectives.

Additionally, keep important information noted down in a physical journal. I understand this is not very accessible for larger systems, but this may unfortunately be the only way to ensure that your system information is 100% secure from being suddenly deleted. Information I would consider crucial is name, pronouns, identity labels, roles (if applicable), and formation date (this may be different for other systems, and that's okay! Write down whatever you feel is crucial). For RAMCOA survivors, noting down programming/triggers is extremely important too. For those who don't find manually writing everything accessible, you can print out the pages after typing them out. You can even try to print screenshots of currently existing profiles, if that's something that will save you time.

Seeing as some systems are not in a safe environment to keep a physical journal of these things, I would highly suggest using Ellipsus instead. For those of you exclusively on a phone, you can even try to get creative with world building/character logging apps. I just wouldn't suggest Google Docs, Google in general is not a very trustworthy company.

the most common thing everyone knows: they’re sysmed as FUCK. they got a lot of backlash for it and changed the BOT’S stance on this, but the dev team themselves have not changed.

let me say it again:

sysmeds. do. not. protect. the. cdd. system. community.

they don’t. sysmed ideology hurts and shames ALL systems. you cannot win with a sysmed. they have a wall for a brain and nothing you say will make them understand.

cdd systems are not safe from sysmeds, no matter how pick-me you want to be with them.

2: they literally allow fucking pedophiles to use their services (which i’ll get to how fucked that is from another point) and talk in their discord server.

source (with screenshots)

honestly that whole blog (octocon-beware) is a reason to not use the app.

even IF they have now banned that pedo, they publicly stated that they would not do anything about it to begin with, and that’s fucking disgusting. they do not deserve any grace for banning them after they said that. it does not make it go away. they endorsed pedo behaviour and do not have the right to get away with it if they FINALLY banned them.

don’t fucking fall for it.

3: their TOS states they can terminate your account for any reason they want. if it disagrees with their stances (aka sysmed and pedo-loving) they’ll smash you with the ban hammer.

they can see ALL your data. while i seriously doubt they comb through every account, i would NOT be surprised if they have a little trigger cue that gives your account an alert on their end if you use words like “endogenic” or “mixed origins”.

anyways, they literally admit to banning people they don’t agree with IN THIS TOS CLAUSE. why else would they write it like that? they “exercise” the clause. if they hadn’t done it before, there would be no reason for them to say it like this.

they could say “we exercise this clause by terminating the accounts of people who break the “prohibited uses” clause” or some shit. they PURPOSELY say that it’s things they are “staunchly against” because that covers their being staunchly against anything other than traumagenic systems.

and because you signed up for octocon without reading the tos, and you got banned for “being what they’re staunchly against”, you can’t complain because you literally agreed to it by creating an account and accepting the tos

this is why you read the fucking tos

no matter how long it is

read the fine print

anyways, octocon-hating, fully traumagenic canis corps out

do with this what you will

TLDR; A pedophile that has admitted to abusing a minor is in the Octocon servers, and the creator of the bot and the moderator team for the servers have stated they will not do anything about it. The Octocon servers allow minors and have minors active in the server.

If you are in a server that uses and has ever recommended a member go to either of the Octocon servers, I ask that you please notify the mod team so that they are aware there is a predator in the servers they are recommending their members to.

A second post with evidence of the discussion with the moderators as well as the pedophile admitting to abusing a minor is linked at the bottom of this post.

More details about the situation below. Content warning for a slightly more in depth discussion of pedophilia.

The creator of Octocon and the moderators of the Octocon discord servers were made aware of a pedophile that sexually abused and traumatized a 14 year old when he was 18 years old. The evidence submitted into a private ticket with the moderators was the pedophile admitting to doing so in a private message with a user that I will keep anonymous.