Beauty standards are a disease. I saw this TikTok of a girl who got chemical burns on her armpits from some kind of waxing trend and the doctor said it would go away faster if she didn’t shave. She apparently continued shaving over A CHEMICAL BURN because… why? Because she was so disgusted by her own body hair that she would rather suffer for longer? Because other people would shame her for it? A guy would never feel like he has to do that. She was like 15 as well. Young girls should never feel like being pretty is more important than being healthy. Not to mention shaving over that could definitely introduce infection and deepen the wound. In my opinion, shaving itself isn’t necessarily bad, but it becomes bad when a girl feels like she needs to do it, even prioritizing it over her health. I just wish this didn’t happen.
I know a lot of people yell, “but it’s their choice!!” Idk how to tell you this but this is not a choice. This is a societal problem only pushed onto girls.
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I felt like just coming in here to talk about deltarune a little bit and I just wanna say...
I miss chapter 1 and 2, I miss the feeling that those two chapters gave me. Maybe it's for nostalgic reasons, or maybe it's something else, but... At the very least those chapters had something to say and at the very least were consistent, everything else after that just felt completely different to how I thought deltarune was supposed to be...
Chapter 3 was the weakest chapter due to it being a complete nothing burger of a chapter, with the only thing that saved it was Tenna even though he's kinda just Spamton but worse. Chapter 4 was okay somewhat, it was actually at the very least getting all serious... And then chapter 5 came along, and it became so underwhelming, with the gameplay and the weird route being the only good things about the chapter.
And let me tell you, the lore has become so unpredictable for the sake of being unique even though it's not always the best case in terms of writing a piece of media. And it sucks ass.
Like... God forbid we care about the story and it's characters and theorize what's gonna happen next with them, only for it to all turn out completely fucking pointless in the end.
And they're not even fucking consistent with it, it doesn't even stick to it's landing because it gets resolved in the most shallowest fucking ways known to man.
King's whole abusive behaviour and his actual interesting goals and personality and being Toby's first ever evil character? Nah, he's actually a big softie and he knew Lancer would just bounce around all fine even though that doesn't change the fact that he was gonna throw his son off the fucking roof anyways but whatever who tf cares!
Queen's mind control and kidnapping because of her own goals and motives? Nah, she didn't know about The Roaring and is just a memelord girldad and bananas!
The whole mystery shrouding around Mike? Sike, you get three characters that cosplay as him for a joke about people theorizing shit way too much and a secret dialogue with Tenna even though most people probably gave him to Mettaton anyways and don't know this!
Tenna dying that actually raises the stakes and makes the Knight be this actual dangerous threat? Nah, you can revive him and the Knight is beatable even though that diminishes any actual threatening behaviour that they've had!
The whole talk about how kindness is not a solution to solve every problem and how sometimes the best possible answer is to fight them? Nah, fuck that let's heal Flowery because we want to beat him in a different way!
There's more to it than that, but I'm too tired to do more... Like I won't even be suprised if the Knight turned out to be Papyrus or something. Or something even more unpredictable that will make no lick of sense for deltarune whatsoever.
Idk what else to say... So TLDR; Chapters 1 and 2 > chapters 3, 4 and 5. And that opinion's never gonna change for me.
i wanted to know ur opinion on the recent undertale drama (if ur aware of it) with toby fox not translating/making dubs for the game except Japanese + in general the world tour of the undertale orchestra pretty much ignoring latin america.
mostly cuz people r using the excuse of “he cant learn every language” when its like…. hes a multi-millionaire like i can assure people it wont even scratch 1% of his wealth.
+ i saw the argument of fan translations being available (hypocritical af that toby supports those js so he doesn’t need to pay people) which js seems to ignore console players/people who dont have a computer.
I know of the controversy, and I've spoken about it in bits and pieces on both my blogs. I don't like it.
Spanish is one of the most widely spoken languages globally, to not want to have a Spanish dub for your game is something that could only be attributed to general bigotry and racism. I'm not sure why people are expecting HIM to learn the language specifically, as opposed to just hiring translators, so I also feel like that's just an excuse being made to take away from the problem at hand.
It's wonderful that there's a community of people who are doing the work for free as add-ons to the main game, but if it's not apart of the main source material then that's nothing to write home about.
Also at what point are we going to discuss Toby Fox's obsession with Japanese culture is a flavor of orientalism we shouldn't just keep endorsing because the characters are silly? Every other character is "white person weeb" and we've ventured so far into the satire and commentary of it all that we forgot to actually be genuine. It's another piece of media that perpetuates the concept of only white and Japanese people being able to exist in anime and anime-adjacent media, with the occasional Black character for tokenism. With that context in mind, it's a pretty shitty decision he made.
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It's an interesting dynamic of us having literal control of Kris's body but being ignorant of the world, helpless outside of their body and not desiring them as a vessel vs Kris being a puppet but clearly needing us for mysterious reasons, being able to resist our control by literally throwing us out or performing dialogue options differently, further topped by us not knowing Kris on a deeper level and them not knowing what we even are. It's way more complex than "oh you're kris's puppeteer and are torturing them" , especially since the term cage doesn't imply helplessness but also ties their existence to us nonetheless.
Since I see possibly some of the worst character assassinations on Ralsei within fandom spaces from multiple angles, I'm going to break down some of the most key aspects of his character and challenge assumptions that many of you have formed about this character in your head. This is mainly going to deal with key motives for Ralsei rather than general characterization.
There will be citations involved, because I'm that frustrated. I will be using the Deltarune text dump for citations, and will give a lead in line for each scene I am talking about. A link will be provided to the specific line.
Ready?
Let's start with possibly one of the biggest things that you NEED to understand about this character and his motives.
RALSEI DOES NOT WANT THE PROPHECY TO OCCUR
Or at least, he doesn't want the Final Tragedy to occur.
I see this take a lot where people insist that Ralsei is the person in the group who is subservient to the prophecy. He wants it to occur, because who is he to fight fate? When... uh... that could not be further from the truth. In fact, this is explicitly spelled out by Ralsei MULTIPLE TIMES.
Let's start with the final prophecy breakdown.
"I thought if I said something different..."
In this scene, Ralsei is fully breaking down. He spells out that he was trying to break the prophecy from the beginning while using kindness as his method. It is only when he is seeing that he failed completely that he begins to break down and says "Our fate is already decided."
This is not something that he wants. This is not something that he desires. In fact, this is explicitly spelled out yet again.
"I want to believe... it can change! That there isn't just one ending!"
He wishes to change the prophecy. He wants with every fiber of his being that the prophecy can change, even when the prophecy is staring him in the face.
But isn't this just him gaining hope from Susie's infectious hope?
NO.
Ralsei, SINCE THE BEGINNING, has been attempting to break the prophecy. In fact, he attempts to get You in on it as well. Let's go all the way back to Chapter 1, which is largely neglected when discussing Ralsei.
"Kris, once we pass through this door..."
I want you to really pay attention to what is being said here. Ralsei is telegraphing that he believes your choices DO matter, even though he KNOWS there is only one ending foretold exactly by the prophecy. He claims that how you treat people makes all the difference, AKA his plan of "if we were just kind enough...". He even goes the extra mile to say that you won't find the end result favorable if you don't, alluding to the prophecy's actual ending.
This means that Ralsei has been attempting to break the prophecy since Ch1, since before he befriended Susie, and he likely hatched this plan before he even met Kris or Susie. After all, he tells you pretty quickly at the dummy...
"Though FIGHTing is unnecessary in this world..."
He has had this planned for a WHILE.
Yes, Susie's infectious hope gives Ralsei the support he needs to keep believing, but she is not the sole person breaking a prophecy. Remove the dichotomy from your head of Susie being the rebel and Ralsei being the rule follower. It's not quite that simple.
But doesn't Ralsei stress how the three of them are heroes and how the Roaring needs to be avoided?
Yes, but I think people get far too hung up on this fact when... it is in fact very pertinent for everyone's continued survival that the world does not literally end.
"When the LIGHT is subsumed by SHADOW"
Understand that Ralsei does not want the prophecy broken just to break it. He wants it to end because the prophecy's outcome is unbelievably cruel. Replacing it with a worse cruelty is not something he wants.
But doesn't he worry that if the prophecy is broken, it can only lead to something worse?
"If there was something else, what would it be...?"
THIS IS WEIRD ROUTE EXCLUSIVE DIALOGUE.
These lines alone cannot be taken alone as his entire thought process on the prophecy. You have to take them in conjunction with the fact that he is visibly and constantly attempting to break the prophecy. You have to acknowledge that this is Weird Route Exclusive.
I would be doing this a disservice to not note that Ralsei expresses similar apprehensions when going off the path in one of the minigames in Chapter 3.
"I feel kind of... glad we're going back"
And yet, he chooses to fight for a different ending regardless. Since ch1, he has been doing this. In ch4, he stresses that he wanted to believe that it could change.
So what gives?
Well for one, Ralsei chose to break the prophecy using kindness as his method. Honestly, breaking from the analysis just a bit, I find it immensely satisfying that he looked in the face of a cruel prophecy and said that he would break it by trying to be its antithesis: Kind.
So what purpose would Mind Breaking people, destroying friendships, killing countless Darkners, and putting someone in a coma serve for someone like Ralsei?
Sure, the prophecy is broken, but everyone else would be so horrendously broken afterwards that it wouldn't even be worth it. Ralsei doesn't want the prophecy broken for the sake of it! He wants it broken, because he saw SOME cruelty in it, and didn't want that for people who he hadn't even met yet! He DELIBERATELY CHOSE to be kind.
It's the same reasoning for why he recounts the long and short of the prophecy at the beginning, and why he yells when the Roaring almost begins. Sure, it COULD be a detour to spawn a Titan this very moment, but that would... very likely kill everyone. Lightners being stuck in an endless night is not a good alternative to whatever the prophecy says.
He wants a GOOD ENDING for everyone and those he loves.
I don't want to ignore his fears here, but I also think that people are overblowing them and using them to absorb the rest of his character.
He has shown that he wants to break the prophecy, but he has simultaneously shown a fear of what is off the path
"I just didn't know... what was over there."
And quite frankly, I think that's natural. Remember, the prophecy ends with
ONLY THEN, WILL THE WORLDS BE SAVED
The worlds WILL be saved at the end of the prophecy, even if the Final Tragedy occurs. It is an entirely natural fear to say "Hey, what happens if we DO prevent the Final Tragedy, and that somehow causes the worlds to not be saved?"
And, this is all that Ralsei has ever known. What would a world be like where he doesn't know what lies ahead?
But Ralsei chooses to try to break the prophecy anyway. This is indisputable ever since Chapter 1 at the Grand Doors. He may have fears about doing so, but he has made the conscious decision to do it scared.
You cannot use his fears to discard all of his other actions. Do not do that.
So, in conclusion for this segment, while Ralsei may have fears about what would exist in the prophecy's place, he has made the conscious decision to try to fight the prophecy ever since the beginning of Chapter 1.
---
RALSEI'S DISCARDING COMPLEX
Oh boy.
Some of you may have believed that something was missing from that last segment, and if you did, then please pay attention to this one.
At the beginning of Chapter 3, we get a very lengthy scene between Susie and Ralsei where Ralsei seems to be priming Susie to "forget about him and make some real friends".
Many... MANY people think this is him priming her for the Final Tragedy to simply Occur.
Not only have we discussed in length that Ralsei is not on team-prophecy, but this doesn't make any sense if he IS talking about the prophecy.
We know since the beginning of Chapter 1 that Ralsei has been trying to break the prophecy through kindness. However, we learn in Chapter 3 that Ralsei honestly thinks that he SHOULD be left behind.
"So... if you ever feel like we're not enough..."
The Final Tragedy is also something that Susie says this about:
"And obviously YOU wouldn't let it happen."
Correct, Susie, considering he has been trying his damndest to break it even before you saw it.
If the Final Tragedy only required one ambiguous sacrifice, or if the prophecy targeted Ralsei specifically (or something like Castle Town being sealed), Ralsei would have next to no issues with that occurring.
...Which means that him planning to break the prophecy since Chapter 1 no longer makes sense.
So this cannot be him talking about the prophecy.
And this is an aspect of Ralsei's character that so... SO many people miss in favor of making his only issue the prophecy.
Ralsei's entire spiel here is because he is a DARKNER.
"Then, selfishly, I... started feeling sad, too."
This entire scene is not about the prophecy. It's not about fate. It is about the difference between the Light and Dark World, and the limitations of Darkners when the lights turn on.
Darkners cannot exist in the Light World as themselves. Ralsei cannot be friends with Susie in real life. Ralsei cannot go with them. Ralsei cannot be there to buy Susie Ice Cream at the festival.
This is an entirely independent issue from the prophecy, and is central to Ralsei's identity plot. Please stop conflating them.
Even if Ralsei managed to break the entire prophecy, and his friends managed to walk free and happy, he still couldn't go with them.
Ralsei cannot be Ralsei except for in a Dark Fountain. Otherwise, he's just an object. He is tied to a closet in a high school.
Even if the prophecy is broken, Kris and Susie will grow up one day. They'll leave Highschool. Heck, either of them might go to college. To stay friends with Ralsei and any other Darkner (HE SPECIFICALLY BRINGS UP LANCER TOO) is to be tied down in a remote town.
"We can't do it all. So... if you ever feel like we're not enough..."
"Just forget about us and make some real friends, okay?"
He is priming them to forget about him, because he knows that he is nothing more than an object. He's trying to downplay his own feelings and his own existence so that when they get bored of him, they don't feel bad about it.
Because he is an object. Because he is something impermanent. Because he is doomed to be left alone in a closet when he is finally discarded.
And this is spelled out again with what he says to Tenna.
"Mr. Tenna... I... understand how you feel..."
Ralsei thinks that Darkners shouldn't make Lightners worry about them. He believes that it is a blessing to be able to bring life to Lightner's lives for a bit, but it's only natural for that time to come to an end.
I constantly see all of Ralsei's talk about identity and being forgotten as tied to the prophecy in some way, but I will stress this again, even IF the prophecy was entirely removed from this game and was never a thing, Ralsei would still be doomed to being forgotten due to his nature as a Darkner.
Think about that.
This trend of him slowly trying to give himself permission to feel certain ways is caused by this impermanence of his existence.
"But recently... I'm starting to feel like... Like I'm developing my own opinions."
"Should a... Darkner... be feeling like this?"
He's unsure if he even should be developing his own preferences.
"It's nice that Ralsei is Ralsei"
"No one's... no one's ever said that to me before..."
"I just wonder what... being "Ralsei-like" even is...?"
He struggles to even begin to think of what that might look like.
None of this matters, even if the prophecy is broken.
Because to him, he is an object, and one day, all of this will not matter. No matter how much he yearns for it, it cannot be his. (Hopefully one day, that will change).
"I realized... being friends is... a responsibility"
"A responsibility... I can't... fully complete"
In conclusion for this section,
Ralsei's identity struggle is intertwined with the fact that he is a Darkner, an object, and impermanent. He tries to pull away from his friends to make this fact easier on them. He tries to downplay his own emotional growth by reminding himself that he is nothing more than an illusion who should be happy that he is forgotten about.
This occurs regardless of whether or not the prophecy is broken or not. Even if he entirely shattered it, his fate would still be the same.
---
RALSEI SUSPICION CLAIMS
This is going to be my general lightning round segment for countering people who think that Ralsei is somehow scheming in some way or being actively malicious to characters, you included.
This one will dip into the metanarrative, because I see a lot of mischaracterization coming from the player-positive side of the fanbase. Come on yall, you're not making it easier to defend your case.
"Ralsei knows of Kris' betrayal, and will join the betrayal group with them."
No. Negative. I'm going to use this quote a lot in this section, because it is constantly ignored during Ralsei theorizing and I'm going to pull my hair out.
"About the "rules" of the world. About the prophecy."
The TWO THINGS that Ralsei knows about are
The rules of the world and how it functions
What the prophecy says will happen
I have seen a tendency to use these two aspects to think that Ralsei is all-knowing. However, we can see at multiple points in the game that this isn't true. The Titan being summoned in Chapter 4 threw him so off that he had to improvise on the fly to use the soul to seal it.
"Kris... you can seal fountains, can't you?"
These two things actually leave a lot of ambiguity. Sure, Ralsei can give verbose tutorials, enough to where he actively can say action commands and understands what you are seeing.
"Press [Z] when the white rectangle's in the blue box!"
This does NOT however mean that he knows literally everything that is happening. In fact, it would be out of character for Ralsei to know about what Kris is doing and NOT snap. Remember, Ralsei saw the Knight summon a Titan. It's well known the Knight is creating fountains.
"The KNIGHT that pulls the Fountains from the Earth."
"THE KNIGHT WHICH MAKES FROM BLACKENED KNIFE."
And what have we seen Ralsei do, explicitly, when someone is about to create a fountain and bring the Roaring?
"Stop!"
Ralsei, after an entire chapter of fading into the background while the Lightners are with their real friends, yells at all of the Lightners around, in spite of his Darkner status, to tell them to cut that out right now.
He interrupts them. He asks them what in the world they're all doing. He's EXASPERATED and TERRIFIED.
And we see this AGAIN when the Knight is about to do the exact same thing.
"DON'T MAKE ANOTHER FOUNTAIN!!!"
The game would have to do a hell of a lot of setup in the opposite direction for me to believe for a SECOND that Ralsei is fully gearing up to betray the party. In fact, if he was working with Kris and the Knight, then why on earth is he dealing full damage during the Knight Fight?
Even further, why does he say this when you win?
"Somehow, I thought we... had won... for a moment..."
He hoped for the briefest of moments that the prophecy had been averted early, and yet it remains the same.
These are not the words of someone who is an ally to Kris and the Knight. I reject the analysis that he is a fellow traitor wholeheartedly.
Also let's not ignore the fact of how much he has bonded with Susie. I feel like people assume that Ralsei is besties with Kris for some reason when he has been bonding with Susie for the entire narrative. That could be an analysis of its own, but I need to really not overextend this more than I have. Susie and Ralsei enjoyers, I'm so sorry for your erasure.
"But what if part of the prophecy says that Kris will betray everyone?"
Sure. We can make up random prophecy panels that we never saw all day. The prophecy also says that Ralsei is going to stab Susie 27 times in the chest, so now I can justify that he's evil!
Do you see how this sounds stupid?
The game hasn't done the setup required to prove that Ralsei knows about Kris' betrayal yet, and in fact has gone FAR in the opposite direction.
One of the points of the prophecy is that it is frustratingly vague. That's why Tenna can still live even if he was cleaved red by blade. It doesn't say literally everything that will occur. It just gives key events in vague terms. As of now, making up prophecy panels when we went through the entire chapter with them seems like cheap writing, and I would be disappointed if the game went that direction to pull a fast one.
The only panel we confirmed haven't seen is the Final Tragedy, which, quite frankly, a betrayal doesn't warrant this kind of reaction from Ralsei.
"Ralsei is purposefully sending you away to scheme with Kris about something nebulous".
This one makes me mad, because it's the most uncharitable interpretation of events, and is the most popular.
Deltarune fans largely consider the lack of information as malice. Consistently, when the fandom has a lack of information about a character, the worst is always assumed. Look at the fanon interpretation of Gaster. Look at the fanon interpretation of FRIEND. These are two characters we know very little about, and yet they are pretty universally blamed for everything (And I'll die on the hill that Gaster is our #1 supporter and on "break the prophecy" gang stfu).
This is no different from Ralsei.
Because we don't get to see something, people think that he must be doing something nefarious with Kris.
The only suspicious send-away is in Chapter 4, and we know why it was suspicious. Maybe Chapter 3. Yes, I will defend and die on this hill.
In both Chapters 1 and 2, Kris and Ralsei were not doing anything important. They were waiting for Susie to do something. Most importantly, the party was split.
You are not useful watching them stand around. In fact, both times, Susie is doing something incredibly dangerous. In Chapter 1, Susie is staging a jailbreak. This is something you'd probably want the soul present for. The soul protects the Fun Gang, remember? In fact, you can see the soul zoom in from off screen when Susie engages with Lancer. This is a known ability the soul has at this point, and is VERY useful when the party is split.
In Chapter 2, from Kris and Ralsei's POV, Susie is once again staging another jailbreak to get Noelle to Berdly on the roof. Of course, we know that it ended up being a date staged by Queen, but Ralsei doesn't know that! The party is once again split, and Ralsei uses your ability to go to someone else to aid Susie. This ends in you third wheeling, but again, Ralsei didn't know that.
In Chapter 3, things start getting a bit murkier. Was it really necessary for Ralsei to send you away? Like bro just walk into the room. But also, the other two moments end with them clearly in conversation. Kris and Ralsei aren't in conversation during this one, so this one is entirely net-neutral. One of Kris' dialogue options is that they were Talking. Personally, I enjoy this scene for the sole purpose that if you hang around, Ralsei seems genuinely taken aback that you are deciding to hang around with him. "Let's just chill, man" indeed lmao. I can't get a read on this one. It's like he wants to send you away to watch the more interesting thing that's happening instead of hanging out with him.
In Chapter 4, it's the most blatant. Dude runs off before your screen is even dark. He's running ahead to check on the prophecy. We know. Ironically, I believe this to be the most suspicious any of these moments are, and it was already answered what the hell he was doing.
And, again, I feel like absence of information is being treated as infallible proof that Ralsei is scheming about the Evil Soul with Kris. Because you don't know something, the gaps are filled in with the worst case scenario.
2/4 scenarios, sending you away was the correct choice. 1/4, Ralsei is having an identity crisis and I have no clue what's going through his head. 1/4 scenarios he's having an aneurysm that the prophecy is still alive and it has nothing to do with us.
And, if you don't believe me about the whole splitting the party thing being important?
Remember when you get separated from Susie during the Sound of Justice?
Kris recognizes that the party is split, and that they cannot find her in the dark. So, they shut their eyes, and guess what happens?
Over and over again, your soul zooms in from the side to protect Susie. Like a beacon in the dark to her exact location. You last long enough for Kris to find their way to her. The soul being used in case the party is split is a SKILL that Ralsei SHOWED KRIS HOW TO USE IN CHAPTER 1 (the only required close your eyes section).
The closing eyes segments are THE MOST suspicious part about this character, but is utterly blown out of proportion compared to all other behaviors we have seen from him in the game.
"Ralsei doesn't say things and hides things from his friends."
I will turn you into a caesar salad.
"I know so many things I, don't know. When to say them."
READ THIS ENTIRE STRETCH OF DIALOGUE AND COME BACK HERE.
This is an IDENTIFIABLE character flaw that Ralsei has. However, people use it to somehow prove in a roundabout way that Ralsei is evil, wants to hide something from his friends for some asinine reason, or is a liar in general.
No, it's literally because he got loaded with all of the information of how the world works and what their fates are, that he doesn't know how to say them. Ralsei's lies are consistently ones of omission.
When was he supposed to tell Susie that Darkners patterned after a memory of a loved one only appear under specific darknesses? When was he supposed to say the exact mechanics of how to start the Roaring? When was he supposed to drop the bomb of the final tragedy? When is he supposed to tell everyone about the soul?
Some of these, he could have said earlier, but he doesn't know how to say it in a way that doesn't scare people. Like yeah man, go ahead and lore drop on the end of the world while you're just getting to know these people. Ralsei is already managing trying to break a prophecy through kindness while also struggling with new emotions that he doesn't know if he should be able to feel. On top of all of that, he has been saddled with so much terrifying information, and feels that if anyone should be saddled with that information, it should be him.
This is a character flaw, but it is not out of malice.
What would you do if you suddenly were overloaded with all of the intricate mechanics of your world? Ralsei had an answer, and it was the MANUAL. We can see how well info-dumping goes for him. REMEMBER THIS THROWAWAY LINE? FIRST INDICATOR THAT HE STRUGGLES WITH PORTRAYING THIS IN A DIGESTIBLE MANNER.
(You tried to read the manual, but it was so dense it made your head spin...)
Yes, it's hurting him AND his friends when he keeps hiding things from them. That's why Susie lifts him to his feet. Heck, she even gives him that little bit of extra solace by letting him hide the prophecy for just a bit longer.
"That Last Prophecy thing... I don't need to see it."
But, she tells him that he's not doing the rest of this alone. Susie, unlike most of the fanbase, can accept the explanation that Ralsei gave her while in tears. He's overwhelmed. There's something that terrifies him. She respects his opinion on that, even if she erroneously runs ahead to try to find the Old Man and sees the Last Prophecy.
Ralsei needs to learn how to let his friends shoulder the burden with him. You can see that begin to happen when he talks about Susie's infectious hope at the prophecy. His want to protect his friends comes from a good place, but it's hurting them and himself far more than simply telling them would.
He is learning to work through that, just as he is learning how to have his own wants and desires. He's learning, and the fact that people do not give him enough leeway to do so is genuinely disheartening.
In fact, I've seen people take it so far as to say that Ralsei had to do SOMETHING to learn all of this information, and that makes it bad somehow.
"I didn't ask to know, but I do."
He directly refutes this. End discussion.
"Ralsei hates you the Player."
Man. I think yall just want every character to hate you for no discernible reason. Toby "I hope you can be friends with everyone someday" Fox did not make this game for yall to assign hatred from characters where none exists. Not rehashing this here.
Here's the post I already made on this.
"What if Ralsei is just lying?"
Yeah bro. Sure. Let's just assume that everything we've been shown for four chapters is all just a setup for one, awful plot twist. Remember that Deltarune is a NARRATIVE with limited time. If the characters that we have seen are entirely fake, then that's bad writing. DO NOT GO FOR "TWISTS" RATHER THAN "CONSISTENT WRITING".
At multiple points, Ralsei is in TEARS trying to explain himself and why he is the way that he is. He's NOT in the mental state to spin lies. What are we even doing if you cannot trust explicit characterization?
---
In conclusion,
As of the current ch3+4 characterization of Ralsei, he has explicitly been stated to be trying to break the prophecy since Chapter 1. He may have fears of what it'll look like if he DOES manage to break it. However, his aim for breaking the prophecy is to bring about a better outcome. Allowing the Roaring to happen or Weird Route to occur would obviously be against that.
Ralsei's identity issues stem from the fact that he is a Darkner. He is an object. He is an illusion. He is impermanent. He cannot continue being friends. He cannot continue being himself. One day, his friends will not be able to go to a storage closet in the High School and will move on, and he is trying to convince himself that he's content with that.
Many theories about Ralsei being malicious or acting in subterfuge are taking the worst case interpretation of events. You have to actively ignore other key moments of Ralsei's dialogue.
This post will likely be added to as time goes on, since I am going to start using it in Ralsei discussions due to constantly retreading the same ground. I hope that it, at the very least, calls forward dialogue that people might have missed or challenges some beliefs on Ralsei.
Surprisingly, that's a pretty good analysis! You've independently arrived at many of the same conclusions I've had since Chapter 2! Most people who try to analyze Ralsei suck dick at doing it, but you've painted a relatively accurate depiction of who he is. He's a a scared, lonely young man, tormented by forces beyond his comprehension and control, who believes himself fundamentally powerless, and yet he still *has* to try to stop the cruel fate he knows is coming. He can't just let it happen, no matter how hopeless it seems, no matter how much he wishes he could just accept that there was no hope, because in his heart, he's a hero.
There are only two, maybe three things I'll knock you for.
1. I do think that Ralsei's identity issues and the Torment of the Prophecy are interlinked. They are separate issues, but the throughline between them is the idea that there are some terrible things which will happen, and which simply can't be changed, so you should just accept them. In the case of his nature as a Darkner, no one else seems to be as overcome with grief at not being real, or as convinced that their lives have no value. Everyone else seems to be doing pretty much fine. Like Seam says, while Lightners give you your purpose, you find ways to pass the time, or you go crazy. Ralsei has denied himself any method of passing the time, because he believes to be anything *but* a servant, a plaything, is to overstep his boundaries. "Selfish," even for wanting someone else to be happy, because objects don't have wants. It's not even like he thinks other Darkners are worthless fake people. He puts in a lot of effort to respect them and accommodate them. It's something he's internalized mostly about himself.
In the case of the Prophecy, as I'll get to in a moment, as much as he fears it, he can't bring himself to take drastic action, because of the potential for worse outcomes. As much as he doesn't want it to be true, and tries to defy it with platitudes, his hopes are weak, and he does not expect anything really to come from them. There's a lot of "we were supposed to do this" and a lot of "everything will happen exactly as the Prophecy has foretold." Essentially, it reads to me like he's trying to ease his own pain if nothing comes from it. He wishes he could just slide into a comfortable numbness, an acceptance that he did all he could and hope is lost. It's something I can also read into in his terrible pep talk to Tenna. This was coming no matter what. It's not your fault. Take pride in playing your part well and let the end wash over you. Because of this throughline, it's a prediction that I have, though not really backed up by any evidence, that both Ralsei's complete knowledge of the Prophecy, and worldview of Darkners (but himself in particular) not counting as people and deserving the right to want or need things come from the same source. It just seems to make sense thematically.
However, in both the case of his nature as a Darkner and the Prophecy, all this stuff about how there's nothing he can do is just a coping mechanism. Something he tells himself when he's hurting to deny his own feelings, bury his pain so it'll be easier to keep going forward, because he's scared, and sad, and tired, and if he can't keep going despite it all, if he breaks, then how can he protect the people he cares about?
It's something he consistently tries to advise others, because due to his total lack of life experience, he doesn't have any idea what else he can say to comfort them. He just suggests what he himself does. He tells Kris that Spamton was just a corrupted program, and that at least he's their ally now, so they should just accept it. He tells Susie that he shouldn't have feelings and isn't real, so she should just forget him and make some real friends. He tells Tenna that it's not his fault he's being thrown away and that it happens to everyone, so he should just be happy he got the chance to make people smile and accept his death, because trying to fight it will just make everyone sad.
None of this is actually what he believes in his heart. When push actually comes to shove, when there's something he wants, someone he cares about, something to fight for, he fights on anyway. Because that's just the kind of person he is. He's a hero, and for as much as it hurts, he'll never stop trying to help people, trying to save people, trying to make a better future for everyone.
2. As I mentioned briefly above, I believe is that Ralsei is hoping that he can defy the cruel ending of the Prophecy, without actually having to break from it. His acts of defiance are, for the most part, impotent. Nothing is meaningfully changed about the major beats of the story by being nice to people. Yes, it feels better, but either way, the enemies are out of the way and the heroes can proceed. There's no reason the Prophecy should care about the fine details as long as the stuff that matters is in place.
If Ralsei were willing, he could attempt to entirely derail the Prophecy. Go to Card Kingdom early and stage a revolution against Spades King. But even though that is not itself a violent or destructive act, it still means the Prophecy *cannot* simply keep going as intended. Which means that there's no promise something really bad won't happen. He does not want the Prophecy to happen, but he stays pretty neatly within the lines of what it says will happen, because not knowing what's going to happen is *terrifying,* especially when he's been told that there is no salvation for the world outside the Prophecy. So he hopes that if he just says something different, and acts as kind as he can to everyone all the time, things will just magically work out. It's naive, and sad, but it's all he's had to go on for so long. Susie was the first person he ever met who could see the Prophecy, know the horrible fates declared immovable, and simply say "no." Not to squirm and try and find some workaround, to just refuse. To laugh, and insist that they just wouldn't let it happen, even if only for his sake. It was thanks to her that they managed to overcome a Titan, something that should have been their demise.
Thusly, I predict that going forward, Ralsei will be a lot more brazen in his attempts to break the Prophecy. His hope is renewed, and for the first time, he's starting to think that maybe, just maybe, the Prophecy isn't a necessary evil, isn't something they have to go along with as much as possible, something they can only defy in small ways that don't ultimately change the big picture. For the first time he's starting to think that maybe, it can be completely subverted, and that even if something bad happens, they'll manage to survive.
3. This one is more of a minor point which I don't have all that much to say about, but I do think it's not impossible that Ralsei knows Kris is working with the Knight. It does seem to line up with how cloying he is toward them, and how much he emphasizes their choice and that "don't worry, we can do anything!" How much he tries to hype them up and insist that whatever they want to do is actually great. It could be he's hoping that if he can only show them they don't need to side with the Knight, that they have friends who care about them and will stick by them, and that maybe they can achieve their goals (likely to help Noelle and make her happy again after all her trauma) without ending the world, that they might just defect permanently to the good guys' side. Again, there's not much evidence to support this other than it seeming to make sense, so I don't have too much stock in it.
Please let me know if these points make sense and whether or not you agree! I've spent a long time working on my interpretation of Ralsei and ideas of what's next for him. Once again, very good job on this analysis!
I agree in some aspects but largely disagree in others. I'm glad you liked the analysis overall! However, I'm going to have to delve into the prophecy a bit here to talk about why I think Ralsei's method is actually working. Dealing with things like the prophecy is absolutely 100% speculation due to the fact that we only know what it can't be.
I have gone extensively on the main post into why I do not believe in point #1. While you can make a throughline, I believe it to be superficial. Him burying his pain is rooted in the fact that, of everyone, he is the disposable one.
"And if anyone's going to hurt..."
I simply do not see acceptance in anything that Ralsei is doing in regards to the prophecy, even though he accepts that he will be abandoned one day. He loves Kris and Susie. He is thinking about their future when he talks about being abandoned, because there will be nothing to abandon if either of them are hurt.
This is not something that he has decided "must happen".
I do believe that his hope massively falters in the Church, and I think that it's entirely reasonable for that to occur considering he's staring his own failure in the face.
"I... I want to... I want to believe again."
Again. He DID believe it could change. There was not acceptance, only fear when he's staring down the blue glass.
You have largely reiterated many examples of him downplaying Darkners in general. Spamton, in his pursuit of freedom, nearly killed the Fun Gang and went out of control in order to go beyond his purpose as a Darkner. For Ralsei, that's a terrifying prospect. Also, I think Spamton talking about needing the soul to reach HEAVEN is massive foreshadowing for Ralsei's character, but that's neither here nor there.
Everything you've said on the Darkner side of things, I agree with.
It's the prophecy part I don't.
Because, what most of this reads to me is, why isn't he doing enough?
Many examples of him "Not really actually trying to break the prophecy" seem like downplaying the fact that he DID try to be kind in order to stop it. In a prophecy which has an ending written in cruelty, that is the most radical thing you can try to do against it, especially because he likely doesn't know how each point in the prophecy would transpire.
You say that his actions against the prophecy mean very little, but I believe the exact opposite.
Everyone believes we are going for a clean breakage of the prophecy. We will defy that final panel with the resolve to change fate. However, I don't think people are really paying attention to the Old Man's dialogue.
"Though... I do like goin' the wrong way."
You get better ideas that way, do you? In fact, if you go the wrong way in game and start breaking Ralsei's mantra of kindness, things start changing. Darkners aren't recruited to Castle Town, making it just a little bit emptier. Berdly loses his arm in the Light World. Tenna dies. Jackenstein dies. Your point is that ultimately, these don't change ENOUGH.
I jus' think, those words shine a bit too bright."
You all are stuck on the path so blue, that it's all you can see.
However, with Ralsei's actions against the prophecy, we're working between the lines, with what the prophecy doesn't say. His actions do not seem like they're doing anything to him, because he cannot see the other routes like we can. And yet, he earnestly believed that being kind could make a difference.
And it does.
Berdly keeps his arm. Tenna lives and gets to be with a new Lightner instead of being thrown away. Jackenstein is saved and lifted up.
With Susie's reaction against the Final Prophecy and how Ralsei fights against it since the beginning, it's fairly safe to say that it leaves little room for interpretation. Susie is visibly broken when she sees it, after all. It would have to be something that she would see and INSTANTLY recognize as horrifying. However, the old man is suggesting that going between the lines is our greatest strength.
...or being there when ink washes over all the pages with the white pen of hope.
Regardless, I'm straying too far from Ralsei.
Your point #2 was also largely mentioned in the post. Ralsei wants an ending, but he doesn't want one that ends in further tragedy than the one that already exists. The worlds already WILL be saved in the prophecy as long as the tragedy occurs, but he wants to break the tragedy. Going stupid crazy is NOT GOING TO WORK.
Because, as we've seen, there's a really easy way of breaking the prophecy. Do you wanna know how the prophecy has broken ingame already, when something goes so terribly off course?
THEN THE WORLD
WAS COVERED
IN DARKNESS.
When you die, when you give up before the story has seen its fruition, that's it. The worlds are not saved should you choose to abandon them.
Sure, he could try to derail many things, but how does he know that his actions will not make things worse? It's the Weird Route line that I brought up.
But the fact of the matter is that despite all of these requirements, he is still trying. Sure, it might not seem like enough, but considering the thin line that he is treading here, I think he's doing a spectacular job.
I do not have anything to say about Point #3. I have already expressed my points against it, and believe the plot needs to do a lot of work to convince me that it would not just be a cheap plot twist.
I appreciate the counter-analysis, but I respectfully am unable to reconcile that Ralsei would accept the prophecy. Even when he is seeing it with his own eyes, he's in despair and begins to hope again. There is no part of him that's in acceptance.
so funny when people on twitter talk about tumblr and 1) assume we're dead, 2) out themselves as people who need to see porn on their social media feed. turns out the porn ban was literally the best possible way to filter out the braindead gooners and leave only the Real Poasters behind, in a sort of purifying reverse-rapture. also there's still porn on tumblr you just have to open up your dash in public
Sure that's the actual definition of it,but whenever it's actually used in practice, it's for some bullshit about "ughhh you're misinterpreting my favorite character" "how dare you hate a plot point" or some other dumb fictional drama, that's likely what the original tweeter was talking about, either that or people complaining that lack of interest in books or "deep" Media is an actual problem lol
I have seen. A consistent theme lately with people stating that Ralsei's actions in chapter 5 towards Kris and us are entirely justifiable, because he cannot possibly know who is doing what in our dynamic. I still have jumbled thoughts on that, but it got me thinking.
And I think this led me to seeing a pattern here which leads me to believe that this game is actually about to do possession theory with its whole chest but in the way where "You are evil for existing and Kris is your hapless victim."
Even though this sucks actual ass.
This is going to be an incoherent ramble that is far too invested in something that upsets me, so only click read more if you want to deal with incessant whining.
It all started with this fucking screenshot.
I use this screenshot a lot. It's verifiable proof of Ralsei acknowledging our existence and KNOWING our skillset. This is later corroborated by him saying that he knows the rules of the world. He is fully aware of who exerts control and who is at the wheel.
In fact, during a scene with Spawn where the escape route is physically behind Kris, Ralsei yells the following
* KRIS!!! RUN LEFT, NOW!!!
Ralsei has talked about battle commands in his tutorials. He has talked about the UI outright. He has mentioned our ability to SAVE. We knew this. This is not new information. What irks me is that Ralsei's nods otherwise are always... strange.
Everything good that you do is always... mentioned as Kris. Ralsei addresses Kris. If he wanted to keep us a secret, this would make sense for him to do (even if that's horseshit at this point). But then there's... moments... where Ralsei inexplicably knows who is talking. If you're mean in ch5 with the tea thing, then he switches to talking about Kris instead.
* If you... if Kris makes the tea for me by hand...
But whenever you're nice, whenever you do something or try to be kind, it's always Kris who you are seen as! Every good deed is them, while every bad deed suddenly awakens a sixth sense that "Oh it's that pesky little soul!"
This isn't fucking new to Undertale and Deltarune and I'm so mad I'm seeing echoes of it happening again with no hint of irony seen in the actual plot.
Let's go review Undertale.
When you complete True Pacifist, suddenly, everything that you did is seen as things Frisk did. Frisk was always the one doing the actions. Why would you think any different? Every mention of YOUR friends, every instance of second person, is now suddenly replaced with Frisk's name. "Despite everything, it's still you" is replaced with "Still just you, Frisk." Every single personal moment that you experienced with this game has now been replaced, but you were never Frisk. What right do you have to be upset?
Then you decide to kill everything and everyone.
And suddenly... like magic... the game turns its eyes to you. It looks through you. Sans calls you an anomaly. Chara addresses you with "You" only when the world is destroyed. It's your fault. It's all your fault. It couldn't be anyone else's fault, because you were the one who pressed the stupid little button.
So... why is it only ever you... why are you only ever acknowledged... when you do wrong?
Just as you chose to hit the fight button every single time you kill a monster, you choose to spare monsters and choose which options are most likely to end the fight non-violently. You learn about these people and try earnestly to be friend them. You begin to open your heart up and care, and the game welcomes you in to do this before-
It was all Frisk. It was all Kris.
"I hope you can be friends with everyone someday." Isn't that what you said, Toby? Then why does your writing never act like it?
Let's go back to Deltarune.
You can make every conscious choice to love. You can select every kind option to the best of your ability. You can try to watch these people grow and help them find out who they are. They never really address you in a way that you'd hope, but you can still see them flourish. You begin to change the ending. You try everything in your might to help your friends while the very person that you are caged in attempts to subvert you. But you never raise your weapon against those who accept mercy. You choose Ralsei's path of kindness to try to find a better outcome.
...and... what is the end result of that?
Pink, your BODY… it's… its own person, too.
Don't you think your body deserves a say, too!?
People have tried to twist this into Ralsei not truly understanding our dynamic. And yet, he has a sixth sense for Kris being the good piano player. Maybe that's the point. Maybe he only knows our rules, that we control, but if he knows our rules... then why not our limitations?
Oh wait, he knows where we're limited too. He is able to walk us over a carpet of spikes because we can't get over the stupid little hitbox.
So, after all of that, the undying faith is still in Kris. Kris gets outright exonerated by Ralsei for making fountains, unquestioned even the slightest. People also try to claim that Ralsei thinks it's us doing it, but he prefaced the conversation with Kris' piano playing. He knows.
Every good deed... is seen as Kris. Every misstep they take isn't actually a misstep worth a character daring to question at this point.
So then what happens when you make the conscious choice to tear it all to pieces?
Weird Route.
Welcome back, sixth sense. I missed you.
The game suddenly starts acknowledging you again. It isn't Kris' voice anymore giving the commands. It isn't Kris' voice that Noelle hears anymore. The game makes a clear distinction between Kris calling out their friends' name and you calling out Noelle's name. There's a whole scene in the hospital to rub Noelle's understanding in your face. But, this can all be excused considering that Noelle notices something wrong with Kris in a normal route too. She'd know!
Then we get to Ralsei.
Who instantly knows Weird Route is happening. There's no possibility in his mind that Kris could be doing these things suddenly, because in chapter 5, he's elated to see that they're okay! All of those deeds are suddenly no longer Kris', they're ours!
EDIT: And you can claim that this is because "Oh Kris would never do the evil things" Hey I'm not the one stabbing fountains into the ground, and half of the "bad options" you can say aren't stifled by Kris. Kris spends a whole two chapters making sure you're not mean to Ralsei, but you can say "Good, keep smiling" perfectly fine? The double-standard for what is Kris and what is us is INSANE and I'm tired of acting like they don't have their own demons. I get why Noelle, characterization wise, would detect Kris. I get why Ralsei, the person who knows the rules, would detect Kris. However, everything in this narrative was put in by a writer, and it has put in ZERO effort other than one singular Gaster line during the Knight battle to tell you even a simple 'good job'. It's not that I cannot see how characters got here, it's that I don't think the narrative sees why that's a PROBLEM.
And then I started thinking about one piece of the puzzle that never quite fit for me.
The Twisted Sword.
We know next to nothing about it, only that it offers a trance down. This has made it perplexing to me, because many have insisted that it will be claimed in the Weird Route (or an aborted Weird Route) to... subjugate Kris? Subjugate Noelle more? Loosen our connection with Kris so that we can body hop?
All inconclusive. And then Weird Route decided that it was going to send two kids into a lake without a Shadow Crystal. Aborted Weird Route still technically exists, but I'm unconvinced of the idea so far that it's going to do something.
Neither here nor there, but I'd like to talk about the Twisted Sword in relation not to the ThornRing, but the PureCrystal.
Seam says that the PureCrystal will create something that we will like, something that will be very very interesting. The only item so far that we have seen this thing used with... IS the ThornRing. The only way to get it so far is an aborted Weird Route, but the ThornRing reads to me as getting a lategame item early that you aren't supposed to have. So I'm not quite sure that there's no way we can't obtain this via another method.
Originally, I always thought the Twisted Sword was an option that would be smashing this item representing freedom over your knee to fuel your own devices.
But if the Twisted Sword is the intended path, I fear what it will mean by Trance Down. The Pure Crystal is various dreams of different types of freedom pushed together. What would a sword, wieldable by Kris, that gives trance down, actually do?
They need us. Kris needs us for whatever plan they have. They can freely remove us and put us back in to take control. They can deny our options. They have the final call in so many situations, and yet I fear the game is going to act like that isn't the case.
The good ol "Your choices don't matter, but theirs do" that everyone has been touting around.
I fear the Twisted Sword is literally just there to relinquish control, and to become a god damned battery, and the game will act like this is a good thing. UTDR has always acted like it is a good thing that you are forgotten. Let Frisk be happy. Let Frisk live their life. If you disagree with what Kris is doing, you just don't understand it yet. All of this trying? All of this caring? It means nothing, because you're other. You're too beyond them. What is that about Darkners being loved even though they're on a different level of existence? That doesn't apply to you. Why? Because that's the only story that Toby Fox knows how to tell.
So then what was the point? Why were you here at all? Were you here just to help everyone else flourish, only to be forgotten because... that's what you're supposed to do?
What... makes you any different than Ralsei's mindset in chapter 3 then?
Is it suddenly okay if it's us just because we have a 9-5 to go back to in real life?
If Toby was TRYING to do a nuanced metanarrative, then as far as we have seen UP TO CHAPTER 5, he has failed. The fact that people can't even agree on what Pink meant and use it to support whatever theory resonates with them the best is BAFFLING to me. I'm not even concerned about being right about Pink anymore. I'm concerned about the fact that Ralsei gave some of the biggest slap in the face dialogue in the game, and I'm supposed to not act like I just got punched in the jaw!
If Toby's metanarrative is just Undertale But We Poke You For Taking Up Space, then it's not a good one! You cannot imply intent for harm on our side when we didn't choose this, we didn't ask to be put in Kris, we don't do any of the shitty things that they do on their own, and IF WE EVER QUIT, THE WORLD ENDS.
I fear that one of the final resolutions of this game will be it trying to convince you that your cage takes up too much space in Kris' room.
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suprised at the dark interpretations of the stop line,when it likely meant that kris is saying stop very seriously instead of a more lighthearted “stawwwp noelle hahaha” that they did in the past,considering when it’s specifically said, i won’t be shocked if it turns out noelle liked to mess with kris too.
Okay so, when I finished chapter 5 I had a sort of general feeling of dissapointment, and to some extend I still do now. But there was also this air of familiarity about it, like, "I was disapointed like this before"
and for the love of me I couldnt figure out why that was. Until today that is.
You see, this used to happen all the time in the SU fandom. We would wait months for an episode or two, theorize ourselves to hell and back, and when they came out, they were casual, slice of life episodes. No lore reveals just general mundane shenanigans (sound familiar?)
so naturally, we all got dissapointed and angry because we all expected something more.
Thing is, when you watch the episodes now, they work perfectly fine as a break between all the huge lore reveals and end of season bullcrap.
I remember a phrase feom one of the fans "We dont need a break, we just got one!"
And I feel thats exactly whats happening here. (besides certain plot points that were just dissapointing like asgore not being in the conspiracy)
Because we wait so long, ch5 felt more like filler than anything of substance. Weird part is though, Toby is usualy pretty good at splicing important lore bits with filler stuff, I have no idea why he decided this was a good idea with release times worse than SU.
SU has the excuse that, while the people making the episodes completed them on time, the showrunners would release them in really weird segments.
But no one is releasing these for Toby. Who knows. Main point is, when 6 and 7 come out and we play it as a whole set it will all make sense.
hopefuly.
This point has been brought up a few times, and people keep going "Oh Toby explicitly said this is a fun lighthearted adventure before the storm!"
That's great. However, you can absolutely do fluff while not dumbing down the characters during it, still progressing the plot, and building on our current knowledge.
It's called Chapter 3.
Chapter 3. The Fun Adventure. The adventure clinging to that theme of nostalgia and refusing to let go of the good ol times. Here's one last fun adventure reminiscent of all the other ones you've been on!
The Knight appears. The overarching tone in ch4 does not let off of the throttle. We are led to believe with the Final Prophecy's reveal that things will never be the same From Now On.
NOW LET'S TALK ABOUT SOME JARONA!
And Deltarune, ultimately, is a game. It is a brief narrative which will only last for a little bit in its overarching story. Filler is cool and all, but as stated previously, you need to continue advancing the plot. Why make that filler completely impervious to previous information that happens in the plot? Why not color the Suselle festival moment with the fact that Susie is wary of the Final Prophecy and she has to reconcile with the fact that she's playing into its designs? Why have characters suddenly ignore outright bullying towards each other? Why have characters ignore things which could very well lead to the Final Prophecy occurring (like opening fountains).
It's not that this chapter is fluff, it's that this chapter is meaningless fluff. I think it's actually so fucking fine to expect the game to start answering questions at some point, because now our only option to handle the laundry list of very pertinent questions is for ch6 and 7 to be obscenely long. The pacing has been shot in the head now for a chapter that doesn't really add anything and makes it seem like every character just FORGOT about what happened in Chapter 4.
They fought a Titan together. They saw the end together. What are we DOING letting Ralsei get goomba stomped into the ground?
And quite frankly, people are leaning way too hard into "I trust the process for ch6 and 7". Chapter releases are already controversial as shit. Deltarune has already shown its cracks with mechanics vanishing or being dropped, massive quality disparities, and sometimes feeling like cliffhanger bait is essential at the end of the chapter to keep drumming up hype.
I am judging what we have now. I am judging based on how well I think the game can answer the questions it itself has posited in a way that is satisfying while also not obliterating the millions of other questions.
Like here. Under the cut. These are all of the things that I believe have become so utterly pertinent that the story can't get away with not answering now. Ask ended here.
All you need to know is that I am absolutely not calling this fluff chapter a good thing no matter how much Toby said he was going to do it.
Ralsei's identity plot and how his journey as a Darkner will resolve. He has no way of going to the Light World that has been expanded on (closest thing is Spamton NEO wanting our soul to do that very thing).
Castle Town's ultimate fate, which is the same thing as the Ralsei thing. How long are all of these people going to be able to visit a small town highschool supply closet? This was exactly Ralsei's fear and is a big question mark.
The Final Prophecy and how to subvert or break it. The Pure Crystal is our only lead, which isn't even actually a lead, just an assumption. We still do not even know what it says, and the entire plot of the game is about there potentially being more than one ending. This has not really been explored yet in the main route
The entire meta. You have been caged and your will has been stifled this entire time. You haven't had time to build your own personal dynamics with the Fun Gang like every other character, meaning that your reveal could feel very short-lived. This makes me worry that it will lead to "You are here to join forces in the final hour to Win The Game for Everyone Else's happiness but Never Yours". The meta has only been brushed with the finest comb
Susie finding out about the entire betrayal and the resulting aftermath.
The identity of the Knight and why the Knight became that way
The newly confirmed and introduced "something is under the town" plothread
Why are Plantners suddenly relevant and distinct now unless the only reason this was done was to make sure Flowery stays dead?
Noelle's plotline with her being left out of everything and needing to confront likely her own past and to be more involved
Rudy is actively fucking dying and the resulting fallout
What even was Kris' plan? What are they trying to do? Why do they need us? Why why why why?
What the fuck is going on with Gaster? Seriously!
I loathe these two and would be fine if they never appeared again, but what's with our two resident potential critters (FRIEND and ERAM)
What is your ultimate fate?
What is the Angel? Why does it need to be banished?
What is the tail of hell? What are roots? What is the ring of heavens call?
Why is there sacrifice with Undyne?
THE ENTIRE ROARING IS GOING TO HAPPEN AMIDST ALL OF THIS AND HIJACK THE PLOT
What's in the Shelter? What's at the bottom of the lake?
And before people go in the comments and say "Oh star obviously some of these are being set up", the point is not if some of them can be hit. The point is if you can answer all of these questions THAT THE NARRATIVE POSITED in a way that is SATISFYING, WELL-PACED, and DOES NOT overshadow the other aspects!
THAT is where I am concerned. Not IF these questions can be answered, but HOW will it be executed.
SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK🗣️🗣️ idk why we need a break when deltarune has always been a lighthearted game,even chapter 4,the chapter everyone touts as this ultra serious chapter has a YTP miniboss alongside jokes from gerson and the npcs,and like you said deltarune can do fluff and serious, chapter 2+3 already did this,what I'm most concerned about is Kris betrayal,I can't stress how utterly devastating this will be to a girl used to getting hurt and a guy who knew they were behaving suspiciously but choose to give them the benefit of doubt,not even mentioning Noelle and the situation with her father+her reaction to learning the Truth about everything, unless they're really, like REALLY long,how would you handle all of that in 2 chapters
Reading your list,I forgot half of the mysteries you mentioned which made my fear even worse,to add on to it, what's the deal with CAROL,like seriously.
How the game will able to handle the huge Kris betrayal, possession and noelle finding the truth conflict alongside the relationship between Noelle+Kris/her parents while also answering other questions regarding carol,the knight,dess,ralsei identity..etc etc is genuinely concerning,we really don't have that much time left,as much as I would like to be optimistic cus this is the guy who wrote Undertale of all things,I don't really think the game will stick the landing unfortunately :/
i'm on unpaid medical leave rn due to severe pain in both wrists -- definitely icing them after typing this 💀 -- and as a wheelchair user who now can't even do a job from home since most require typing, i'm kind of screwed. i'm stuck with very little $$ for food, bills, etc.
so if you ever want to support me pls consider giving me a little ko-fi to get through this rough patch!! i can give audio essays/bunny pics!
I got less than rent in disability aid for July from my ODSP worker not updating my file on time, despite me telling her in early June... so I can't even fully pay rent and I have no money for food/bunny supplies/etc. & turns out I have a fracture in my right wrist that might need surgery
Reblogs/$$ heavily appreciated 😭 (kofi link above)
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honestly, chapter 5 threw me for a loop bc everything felt so...ooc? especially for susie and i was a little sad how we barely got any soul and kris interaction.
then i thought about it, and okay forgive me for yapping a bit here delete this if you'd like LMAO but i wanna trust toby in how the other two chapters are going to go. perhaps im going insane trying to rationalize what the hell i just played. anyway:
i think susie is falling deeper in the escapism. what she saw in the prophecy that she shattered scared her so badly that she doesnt want to face the possible reality of losing the Dark Worlds. assuming that's what she saw
this is the one good thing that brought her friends, connections, noelle, and gave her the feeling that she's someone important. and ik the fun gang's trying to prevent the roaring, they HAVE to seal every other fountain, but when flowery starts telling her off about how its unfair to seal HIS DW and keep ours, susie couldnt really give a proper comeback.
this could be what is causing her not to think so rationally. she's ignoring kris' feelings, bc girl wdym you walked with them, telling them the dark worlds are YOUR THING, then invite noelle straight after. has them third wheeling her date with noelle, and the beach scene.
she has had so much fun within the dark worlds, sees how much pressure noelle is under, and wants her to feel the same joy she does during their adventures. susie considers Castle Town her Home (and is willingly sleeping in the school's closet btw), shes so far deep in this.
noelle has pushed kris to the side for susie, and susie has done the same to them for noelle. and ralsei only exists in the dark world, asriel is away, dess is gone, everyone in town prefers asriel over kris.
HEAR ME OUTTTT what IF toby is setting the scene for a possible reconciliation between kris and the player. after feeling so isolated and alone....perhaps we will get a scene where kris will recognize that its just them and us. WE are the only possible connection they have left, and hopefully something will come out of that.
we cant just be a tool for kris to use, we have to be a friend that interacts with everyone. i dont want this to be like undertale.
does this make sense??? i hope it does LMAO
IM GOING INSANE TRYING TO THINK ABOUT WHAT THE ENDING SCENE MEANS, SUSIE'S CHARACTER IN THIS CHAPTER, AND WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN IN CHAPTER 6 AND 7 i wanna trust toby to hopefully pull everything together satisfyingly in the end, oughhh
anyway thanks for reading my theory slop, i love ur ao3 fics!!!
This is nice, but unfortunately I have to disagree. Let me stop you at go real quick because the Final Tragedy CANNOT be "The Dark Worlds are sealed". If it is, Toby fumbled.
Ralsei says over and over again that his fate as a Darkner is to be left behind and forgotten. This is something he accepts and also imposes on other Darkners when they begin to worry about being left behind. He is setting up Kris and Susie to forget about him one day, but he is CONSTANTLY attempting to break the prophecy. All the way back in Chapter 1, Ralsei was suggesting for you to break the prophecy at the Grand Doors. This is before he has gone through any character development about personhood.
Susie says that obviously Ralsei wouldn't let the tragedy happen in ch4 despite knowing how he is about being left behind. Ralsei chose to break the prophecy while simultaneously knowing he's fucked because he's a Darkner and WILL be forgotten about. That's just how objects work, and he un-persons himself constantly because of that. What? Do you think Kris and Susie can stay in a small town forever instead of going off to live their lives? Do you think they can keep visiting a storage closet? Ralsei doesn't, and he believes that it would be bad if he even lied about that. Even IF the Final Tragedy were prevented, that wouldn't change.
So the Final Tragedy ISN'T the fountain sealing. It CANNOT be without bungling chapter 1.
Ralsei simply would not have been trying to break the prophecy. He would sooner drive the metaphorical sword through himself than DARE to jeopardize his friends' world being saved.
I honestly believe that your Kris scene could instead happen with Susie. Love finds its way to the girl could have multiple meanings. If she DOES get the soul, it would likely be at the most dire of moments where the Roaring has started and she feels alone. But there's still one more friend that's still with her, one that she hasn't properly met but knows damn well.
The legend explicitly states that there needs to be a balance between light and dark and pretty much all character development and relationships happen in the dark world, sealing it forever will kinda condrict the lore and the overall message that escapism is fine with limits
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