I think my biggest issue with fabriz as a concept is the fact that not only do people do the classic "this character is aro but it's ok if while shipping him I call the relationship a qpr!" And just make the relationship the SAME as with any allo character and have no consideration of Riz's canon uncomfortableness and fear towards the idea of romance, but also the motivation of "but they have so much chemistry!! What if I just want the to be soft and grow old together?" Because... That's such a big tell on how you see things.
It's a big tell on you not getting what Baron said to Riz. Why is it that you can only envision the "growing old together", maintaining closeness and companionship as the years go by, only by having them be paired up? By having it be exclusive, it be them two as a monogamous relationship where they live and sleep together and kiss every day?
Why is it that you look upon the character who's biggest fear was "your friends will all pair up and leave you alone because the romantic relationships are worth more than your friendship and you will be forgotten because you don't want to parttake in this. You are most unlike your parents in a happy union", and say "he can only grow old with one of his best friends and be happy if they're in an exclusive, monogamous, amatonormative romantic relationship "qpr"?
Alright, Iβm gonna be entirely honest here in that I initially had OP blocked because I get kind of tired of seeing posts like this in the Riz tag, and I might re-block them after, but as an Aroace person AND a Fabriz βshipperβ (feels strong but thereβs not really another word for it) I actually have some words to say about this because Iβm kinda tired of the slander.
Firstly, to elaborate on my being aroace (which I figured out BECAUSE of relating to Riz, in fact); I know with absolute certainty that I donβt feel any romantic or sexual attraction whatsoever. I never really have, and I canβt predict the future but I doubt I ever will. However I am still very happily in a romantic relationship with my partner, who is also aroace, and doesnβt really feel attraction either! And weβre best friends, honestly before being partners most of the time, but weβre also very in love, and thatβs as much of a perfectly valid way to be aroace as any other!
I personally happen to find it very interesting to explore the dynamic between Riz and Fabian primarily in the way that I relate to within my own relationship, because I simply feel like itβs fun! And honestly, I really like that there are so many ways to interpret their dynamic, be it more romantic, or as some form of platonic life partners, or as being abnormal about each other in a completely regular dude-friends way! (Because one of the most important parts of their dynamic, or one of my favorites at least, is honestly that neither are capable of being normal about the other, in whatever way you feel like interpreting it.) Being aro and being ace are very much spectrums, and theyβre not always directly linked, and not everyone seems to really accept that, but itβs true, and itβs not a bad thing to relate to an aro and/or ace character in a way that lies somewhere on these spectrums that happens to be less popular or not as widely understood.
Honestly, 99% of the other people in the Fabriz tag ALSO lie somewhere on the aro and/or ace spectrums, and ALSO use these characters as a way to explore or otherwise relate to their own identities, because there are literally infinite ways to be aro and/or ace! And thatβs a beautiful thing! At the very least that Iβve seen, there are very few people in the Fabriz tags that actually erase Rizβs identity. Rather, almost everyone Iβve seen simply relate to it in a different way, and make posts and art and writing about how they relate to it, which is completely their prerogative! Are there people out there who do erase his identity? For sure! But they are the vast minority, as far as Iβve seen.
Nobody is under any obligation to like any specific interpretations of the characters or dynamic, but just because you (royal βyouβ, not just OP) donβt like it, or donβt relate to the character in the same way, doesnβt automatically make it Morally Evil and Automatically A Horrible Thing To Engage With. You donβt have to engage with it if you donβt want, thatβs why the block and mute buttons exist. But it just feels rude and, frankly? Very invalidating and hurtful to say that the way you relate to a character is the ONLY correct way to relate to said character, and everyone else is stupid or wrong.
Idk, it just feels like it would be way easier and simpler to just block and move on if youβre not about it than get mad about it. Thatβs just me though.
I mean I will add a comment because this will stay as a response to my post whether I want it to or not and I feel like clarifying some stuff
(For anyone reading this, if you want the real meat of my point you can go straight to point 3 in the numbered list)
Firstly, I get that you're responding to me about something bigger than my post, you said it yourself, you're tired of this style of take (don't know since when you would've had me blocked specifically because I've been in this fandom for like. A week. And hadn't made much comment on fabriz yet, and know even less why you'd unblock me then to see this post, but you do you my guy), but therefore, you kinda missed the point I'm making
I never said "never ship fabriz ever in any capacity" or that some people don't explore interesting dynamics or their own selves through it. That has nothing to do with me if I'm a different flavour of aroace, I get that. And I get that you may feel particularly pissed and defensive because of your own life experiences the way I and others feel defensive in another direction
What I'm raising a point against, and again, I said "MY problem with fabriz", as in MY personal opinion, is the way that a sizeable number of people I've come across in the little time I've spent here, like to do one of the following three things, going up in importance:
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1) Argue that Riz is not aro. That his entire arc about not forming a romantic bond and fearing the fact that he'll be left behind by his friends because of it is entirely an ace centric experience because Brennan didn't say "he's aro" in the sevens clip. If you don't get my problems with this then you might as well stop reading here or search "Riz" in my blog for more elaboration.
As for personal opinion here (and I'm not attacking anyone, I don't like to shit on things not for me on their own comments or posts, this was a post just for me expressing a larger frustration and for those that feel similarly to enjoy), I don't particularly like fics where Riz's whole deal of not only not feeling and not entirely getting romantic attraction or romantic gestures is completely erased for a conventional more "generic" character approach to romance, as well as his fear or being left behind by his friends BECAUSE he sees that they'll value their romances over his friendship, which does happen! In the real world! (More about this in point 3). Especially because he's the character with whom I've most clearly seen this fear explored, with such honesty, it feels straight up wrong to remove that aspect of him. Again, PERSONAL OPINION, if you wanna make 'em kiss with tongue I'm not gonna stop you
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2) Making QPRs an excuse to do just a normal allo relationship / erasing Riz's whole deal with not wanting a committed relationship aside from friendship. Again, strongly related to the prior point. This is a bigger fandom as a THING issue, I carry this prick on my back from fandoms past, but with Riz it feels especially egregious BECAUSE of his whole thing with Baron. And I don't mean making Baron up, I mean the whole scene in the forest of the nightmare king, explicitly he fears his friendship will not be enough and is scared by being most unlike his parents in a happy allo relationship. Erasing that fact or making a QPR with no difference to a socially accepted romantic deal (Again, not saying everyone who writes QPRs does this or generalizing on what QPRs can be, I'm commenting on this specific case with this specific character when written by specific people), it bums me out. If you prefer to omit or change some aspects of his character to suit your exploration, feel free, I'm not the aro police, but I'm also free to say I don't particularly like it
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And finally THE point of the post I feel you missed:
3) I've seen some people say "So what if I ship them? Am I guilty for wanting them to grow old together?" And it's this sentiment that rubbed me the wrong way specifically. It rubbed me the wrong way because of what it implies and as with so many of my aro posts, I make it about a particular case with particular characters in a particular fandom, but the message goes beyond that case, this comment in a vacuum seems fine, but my point is to comment on why it sounds particularly odd and tending towards harmful here AS WELL AS what the deeper message of that comment implies in the bigger picture level for aro people.
Let's go back to Baron. They tell Riz that his friends will move on without him because romance is valued in a greater way that friendship is. That they'll grow up, meet their one romantic partner and move on from their friends, and that he- as most unlike his parents who grew together in an allo relationship where they dated, got married, and did all the nuclear family stuff -will essentially die alone. That he struggled to make friends for nothing because they will abandon him because he cannot and doesn't want to be their romantic partner, and without a real one of his own aside from Baron, he'll be left with nobody.
When saying "I just like shipping them because I want them to grow old together, is that so bad?" It implies that the only way for them, or any pair or even group for that matter, to grow old together is if they commit each other to a romantic relationship or something akin to it. Something that Riz in canon specifically struggles with and fears to be the reality, it's a pretty big part of his arc to ignore, and more potently, it's a pretty important part of his arc for non-partnering aros
Riz is, at the end of the day, a fictional character, you can write him however the fuck you want, hell, they could make a senior year season and completely change him to be the most romance obsessed guy in existence, because he's not a real person. But real people who see themselves in this specific important struggle of Riz are real and do exist, and the fact is that as far as I can tell, Riz is the most beautiful and sincere exploration of this particular aro struggle I've ever seen in the canon material of anything, and for many others it's the same. I'm talking about Riz, yes, but the important part is that I'm talking about the people who relate to him in this aspect of his character writing and what messaging these kinds of comments give off, in the bigger picture sense, not only about however you wish to write Riz
And my point is, with what the arc says, with the fear being that those who don't fit within the mold of the romantic partnering society expects will be left to the wayside, will end up sad and abandoned by those dearest to them, and with the triumph over it being that friendship CAN be just as important, that your allo friends CAN value you just as they value their romantic inclination, that tou CAN grow old together with your friends without needing to force yourself into a romantic mold you don't fill, that you don't need to pretend you have a partner to be normal or liked, how is it tactful to then turn around and say "they can't grow old together if they're not in a relationship. Therefore I want them to be in a relationship"? How is it cohesive with the fics where they clearly move on from all the other bad kids as a couple, leaving friendship behind for the romantic partnering life?
And more importantly, with a character whose big arc focus is this exact discussion (in favour of "you don't need a relationship you don't want to be happy, your friends can value you as you are, you don't have to end up alone"), what message does it send to those who feel seen by it to tell them "yeah, we watched that same piece of media, but what I want to focus on is the fact that as I see it, the only way these characters will remain close is by partnering up in a way different from friendship, exclusive and monogamous"?
Not all aros are the same, clearly, I know that. I'm talking from a particular aro perspective and what fandom tells us covertly with certain comments, it's my POV, I am not you. I'm glad that you are deeply in love with someone if that makes you happy, you don't have to feel attacked by my perspective I'm just saying we should considering those of us who are non partnering as important too, and watch what we say, because people can imply really hurtful stuff when talking about silly little characters. That's what media analysis is all about
Speaking clearly, I don't consider the take of "this aro character whose whole arc provides a stellar coding of non-partnering canonically, dealing with the fear that friendship is undervalued in favour to romance should in the end just partner up with one (1) of his friends to live with forever and will eventually move on from the rest as they move on from him" to be the aro-positive revolutionary take of the century
In our society, friendship is the type of relationship where people go "they're JUST friends" and romance is "MORE THAN friendship". I don't think flipping a character arc that challenges that amatonormative view to conform to amatonormativity and have friendship play second-fiddle to romance again is all that productive
And again, not to attack you, I get that some aros like to partner up, and plenty like to explore themselves as partnering through character writing, go nuts, I'm not gonna stop you. I'm just expressing a personal frustration that goes beyond fabriz, beyond Riz, for those that feel similarly, and maybe this post wasn't to your liking and that's ok
