loved the very specific fuckery with "gendered" terms this chapter
reminder that gendered terms should be fucked with as often as possible and aren't cages you need to lock yourself or anyone else in

Janaina Medeiros

izzy's playlists!

blake kathryn
NASA
Sade Olutola
YOU ARE THE REASON
todays bird
I'd rather be in outer space 🛸

tannertan36
EXPECTATIONS
One Nice Bug Per Day
2025 on Tumblr: Trends That Defined the Year

Kiana Khansmith

if i look back, i am lost

❣ Chile in a Photography ❣

titsay

Origami Around
cherry valley forever
Stranger Things
Sweet Seals For You, Always
seen from Japan

seen from South Korea
seen from Germany
seen from United States
seen from Canada
seen from United States
seen from Brazil
seen from United States

seen from United Kingdom
seen from Türkiye

seen from Germany

seen from Slovenia
seen from United States
seen from United States

seen from Belgium

seen from T1

seen from United States

seen from United States
seen from Finland
seen from Poland
@bored-trans-creature
loved the very specific fuckery with "gendered" terms this chapter
reminder that gendered terms should be fucked with as often as possible and aren't cages you need to lock yourself or anyone else in

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Ralpunzel part 4: “You can always rely on a friendly me… to make you free!”
I like the theory that Kris's original Soul was Patience.
What if their eyes reflect their Soul?
Which vessel would your soul inhabit?
1
2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
10
11
12
Spin the wheel. That's who's trying to kill you.
Spin the wheel again. That’s who’s trying to protect you.
(If you have zero idea about a name you got, spin until you see someone you recognize.)
Are you safe?
Absolutely not. I'm dead. 100% dead.
I might stay alive, but it'll be a really close thing.
I'll take some hits, for certain, but I should be okay in the end.
A few attacks might get through, but nothing concerning.
The attacker might be able to get in one lucky hit. If that.
I am the opposite of worried. I'm 100% safe.
…Look. I've tried picturing this. But I honestly don't know how to answer.
(I've run this poll twice before, expanding it significantly for the second run. With about a year passed since that second run, I thought it was time to add another couple hundred names to the list and have another go.)

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Free to watch • No registration required • HD streaming
do you live in seattle (the american city)?
yes
no
please reblog to get this poll out of my bubble, i want reach
so ive been meaning to do this poll for a while because my hypothesis is that seattle is the most Tumblr city, likely in the entire world. tumblr has a huge american majority userbase obviously, but just for comparison going forward, only 0.22% of the american population lives in seattle. as of this reblog, this poll is showing 4% of respondents are seattleites. given, this isnt scientific at all, because my blog just has a lot of seattle connections and seattle followers, but it's still an impressive bias
But if an Ape hoarded 1 trillion bananas, monkeys would join up under him as best freinds, until a krokodile krew would inevitably slide in and steal the bananas, leading to a series of chases and advantures where various permutations of monkeys and/or apes in dynamic pairs, must chase down the krooks and get the bananas back. As we see in nature.
“Terf is a slur used to silence us” dang bitch I wish it worked shut the fuck up
This shit is like a reverse reclimation. You know you fuckers used to carry that shit with pride, right? Like it was made to clerify you as not the same as actual feminists, but I remember a time TERFs saw the term as a badge of pride, until it really, REALLY became clear that making a nitche for yourself in a progressive movement as conservative and bigoted didn't actually make you special, it made you the enemy.
Red Soul Dess idea
This JUST occured to me, and could be nothing, but in examining the Dess Red Soul theory while replaying the game, I can't help but overthink everything. It is an aobsrvable trend that flavor text changes in tone chapter by chapter. It's like chapter 1 is trying to trick players into thinking they are Kris, until they break out, and then as the chapters go on, the flavor text gains more and more personality and distance from kris. Compare the examining mirror lines, from "It's only you" in chapter 1, all the way to chapter 5, where the flavor text narration asks who the person in the mirror even is. My addition/observation to this is... What if, instead of the proposed years of Kris+Dess alliance until we take control of the soul... Dess was *silent*. Kris had a new soul, but not a new personality/voice? It served to keep them alive but there simply was no Dess? It would add to Kris avoiding Noelle and self-isolating, not because it's Dess controlling Kris, but Kris guilty because she is gone and they blame themselves, and it's entirely them choosing it. What if Dess's voice coming back is part of this processes, even key to Dess's revival? If our leveling up, our getting stronger, is somehow repairing Dess's soul, giving her life and restoring her voice, with the goal of returning her soul into her body stored somewhere else, like in the shelter? This could open up new permutations of knight theories, like the knight being similar to a messed-up duskner, but for a human corpse that craved being a deer monster, not just a dead monster revived by someone who did not know them, like the old man statue. The extra tagedy here, then, is that perhaps just as we cannot hear Kris, they cannot hear Dess's narration to us, so they don't know how the plan is progressing, if at all; She is coming to life to us but cannot talk to Kris? I dunno. This idea provides me an important amount of motive for Carol and Kris to not only have the red soul around, with us in control, but to let us explore dark worlds and get stronger. That's been missing in a LOT of theories and the overal analysis of the narrative; why, is this allowed to happen? Why are we being presented obstacles to clear if our opposition is the ones setting up the obstacles? If our guidance is bringing Dess's soul back to life that gives me a better sense of motive for just about everything. But as the person who introduced me to this idea, maybe even came up with it, what do you think, @shattered-cage ?
Interesting interpretation. I'd have to sit on it more, since it's radically different to where my head is currently at with the SOUL thing, but I don’t see anything to contradict this; totally plausible. The only thing holding me back is I’m a total subtext slut and Kris being completely “in the dark” about dess feels… a little less interesting and agentic? it feels more like 'things happening' as opposed to the conflict of “oh shit she’s gone” and “oh shit she’s coming back”. plus the weird route in general… but yeah tbh you actually do a great job of presenting this in a way that is narratively compelling.
not because it's Dess controlling Kris, but Kris guilty because she is gone and they blame themselves,
Thing is, I'd imagine these two would see Dess as 'gone' either way, but not even having her voice in Kris's mind would make her 'more gone,' so that's fair. Personally, I feel like having concrete proof of a shred of Dess being there, but locked in Kris's mind with no real way of removing her or letting others talk to/be assured of her existence feels... scarier, and a little more compelling, perhaps. But again that may just be because I've given it significantly more thought than the alternative
Why are we being presented obstacles to clear if our opposition is the ones setting up the obstacles?
That's the question to be asking. It's the same principle behind why I'm so staunchly convinced the Weird Route is a trap. However, if we take that as a given, i.e. once that trap has been laid and the Knight is thrust back into the 'main route'... then yeah, there needs to be SOMETHING driving this 'open fountain, close fountain' process. You mention in the other post the Knight knowing in Chapter Four their fountain wouldn't bring about the Roaring, and this idea of reforging and strengthening Dess within Kris does provide an explanation there.
What if Dess's voice coming back is part of this processes, even key to Dess's revival? If our leveling up, our getting stronger, is somehow repairing Dess's soul, giving her life and restoring her voice, with the goal of returning her soul into her body stored somewhere else, like in the shelter? This could open up new permutations of knight theories, like the knight being similar to a messed-up duskner, but for a human corpse that craved being a deer monster, not just a dead monster revived by someone who did not know them, like the old man statue.
This is where you’ve sold me the most. Not only is this interesting and adheres to my own suspicions about what’s going on with the SOUL: even if this explanation wasn’t necessarily “true”, such logic could easily be leveraged against Kris as emotional manipulation to earn and secure their compliance, which I think is important since, from body language and behavior and vibes (not to mention the ending of chapter 4), it’s very clear Kris feels they have no choice but to cooperate, both out of personal obligation and external insistence (mostly Carol but whoever else is in the Shelter, too I'd imagine) and would clearly much fucking prefer not lying to their bestie Susie. Anyway whether the manipulation is just Carol or whoever is directing this conspiracy from within the bunker, say, just as an example, the “brains” of the operation, a scientific mind (hmmmmmmm no one comes to mind… ah right alphys that settles it)
Anyway gasterslop aside: Dess-denial would align thematically with Deltarune's escapism theme. Much like how Susie will have to accept the reality that the dark worlds are NOT reality, Carol will have to accept that nothing is bringing back her daughter. An intense effort on her and Kris's part to try to anyway--out of grief and guilt respectively--would be very tragic and on-brand in this regard.
I can see this idea of Kris's bodily power and perhaps synchronization with the SOUL “revitalizing” Dess's consciousness since the Dess-flavored descriptions don’t really come into play until the later chapters. However, the main caveat here is that I'm not sure how we the Player 'play' into this. Still feels like the timeline (i.e. Gaster summons us and mid-sentence we return to Kris) suggests there’s a new (recent) entity controlling the soul, which is somewhat supported by Noelle and company thinking 'Kris is quieter than usual.' If Dess wasn't controlling Kris, and we weren't controlling Kris, what would that look like in terms of the immediate lead-up to Deltarune Chapter One? Kris was already in cahoots with Carol and ostensibly the Knight, perhaps even making Dark Fountain(s), so what's the deal with Gaster suddenly feeling the need to bring in an outside entity as a body-and-mind buffer between Kris and Dess?
Worth noting: the line or two at the end of the Vessel creation is not Gaster. Does this imply that it is Dess? Is it a dream?--maybe but that's less interestjng… honestly I'm sort of baffled by the text and tone shift, which clearly indicates it is no longer Gaster speaking. I guess it has to be Dess…?
Lastly this bit about an “amputation of the mind” could connect to the Dess hand trauma stuff we keep running into. Could explain why Dess says “i'll never play again” and also messes up the piano in ch4. however, this brings into question why Kris can still play guitar in ch3 if dess is the one allowing them to do so; is Dess simply 'back' enough by that point to carry us through the minigame? Could this just be a literal red herring? The USB mic at the computer in Chapter Five Asriel used for webchatting with Dess is clearly from Rock Band, and the Tenna minigame is adjacent to that. Tenna mentioning Dess and the song being Desspilled as shit and the Player/SOUL playing 'Guitar' specifically sure as shit makes it seem like Dess's skill is carrying us through, but it could just be that Kris is cracked at Guitar Hero lmao
(1/3) So I feel the need to clerify a little here.
In case my message got muddled by the confusing way I go off on tangents and then forget my original point XD I absolutely agree we are not Dess. The player is a new entity, brought in by Gaster, to take control of the soul, and puppet Kris as a result. I was suggesting that unlike the proposed "Kris and Dess had a good relationship until Dess was unexpectedly wiped and replaced with us", my own proposal is basically "Kris was largely in control of themselves, acting 'normal' enough to avoid notice, until chapter 1 begins and for the first time, is puppeted by another consiousness in the Soul. Dess *is* in there but has been waking up due to the progression of our efforts/level, appearing as flavor text narrator" Let's augment this post with, as I've thought about it since, two possabilities that make enough sense to be. Let's call them A and B. Leadup to both senarios: Kris is a human, Dess is a human. Both raised in hometown, both weird and rebellious, and as neighbors and the adopted children of adults who are freinds, become fast friends themselves. Obviously Dess and Asriel had their own relationship (which might not have been romantic both sides, IDK if love letters in a drawer mean they were explicitly dating or that Dess returned or even knew about his feelings, but that's not the subject matter here) and Noelle... was there. Fanon likes to interpet it that Kris and Noelle *were* close as kids, and they only iced them out post-events, but TBH noelle not remembering Kris *ever* complimenting her in their lives, combined with her inability to determine if her and Kris are friends, to me doesn't read "we were loving friends until DA ACCIDENT" it tells me things weren't simple. Kris is a little weirdo and even if *they* were fond of Noelle in their own way, I'm not sure Noelle ever took all that pranking as friendship. As she says, they were the neighbor. Even her dad calls them, the weird kid next door. IM GOING ON A TANGENT AGAIN In both senarios, Dess and Kris, alongside an unknown amount of people, at the very least Catti, participated in a demon summoning, during which Catti lost her nerve and fled, which if it's the event that set things off... good call. This is not GARENTEED to be the un-Dessening but it's the best assumtion we got. A demon summoning, maybe the presence of FRIEND or Gaster or Dark Papyrus, whatever it was... the point is, the unkown incidident which may or may not involve the creation of a dark world, the first known apperance of the knight or another such entity that has these abilities (I take stock in Ralsei the living prophecy's confusion at the notion that the Knight is not a new presence. Ralsei knows puzzle solutions and gags by heart before they encounter them, there's a good chance in my mind the source of the black shard that day, and the Knight we know now, might not be the exact same entity.) All of this to say what we KNOW is shakey and what we ASSUME might not be right but anyway... on to the senarios. IDK if it's Tumblr as a whole or just my PC but I can't type as long of posts as other people? it glitches out. Senario A in a reblog.
(2/3) Senario A: Something REALLY bad happened, which turned two humans, each with a soul, to one human and one human soul, and they don't match. Kris takes (or is given, IDK) Dess's red soul into themselves to live, and while they continue to live and have agency, for all intents and purposes, Kris is just Kris and Dess is just dead. Carol, with her extensive reaserch into humans and souls, is frustrated that Dess's spirit does not persist in her soul, but alone or through working with Gaster/Knight/Time Traveling Togore (the third one is always a joke to say, I don't know what it could be as a fact) she determines that, through the power of dark worlds, sealing fountains, SOMETHING that levels the party up in between chapters, Dess's soul can be 'repaired' or something, and her fledgeling life can be restored. Kris, who feels guilty and does not give a damn about themselves, endevors to do this, basicaly signing up to be body snatched by Dess should she revive this way, proceeds to open up multiple darks worlds, have adventures in them, ect. They experiment with various methods, and bad guys, and sealing fountains... nothing works. Enter Gaster, in communication with them or not, who has through his manipulations of the timeline and knowledge of Undertale, has realized the missing piece; Frisk, isn't the one in control when they mess with the underground. It's not Determination that finally resolves the Undertale time loops... it's a foreign entity. Gaster knows about players, about how they turn the world into games proper, and get shit done. So he invents the Survey program, uses the goner-maker to prime the player for the experince as Kris, even sets us up to prepare for one, planned ending by telling us our choices don't matter, and then his Deltarune, not to be mistake with the Delta Rune, can begin. With us in control, a scary new feeling for Kris, progress is made. Suzie gets dragged along this time, not just Kris, and Ralsei is waiting for them... the Prophecy calls for "The Cage, with Human Soul and Parts" as in, Kris who is containing A human soul and a decaying body, not thier original soul, and a cage for US not acting on their own account. This reflects Kris's surprise and distrust of us, but bregrudingly the plan is going underway and, provided it's not the little possibility I worried about for edgyness, the worst part for them is that it's WORKING. In a few day's time Dess's mind is waking up, seeing the world, expressing herself, when they in years couldn't bring this about. No wonder they hate us so much. Senario B, is similar in nature to Senario A, including that Kris has Dess's red soul. Duh. But in this one, it's a bit crueler. Dess's body is still on some level functional, maybe it's the knight, maybe it's just sealed away somewhere, who knows. And Kris's original, Cyan soul? It's still out there too! But they aren't allowed to have it. Kris and Dess are combined by force, by FRIEND or whatever was summoned, to carry out some kind of will or task, with Dess's body and Kris's soul as the leveredge. Maybe just one of the two but I find it more compelling if it's both. Whatever tasks they are doing, they do as a pair. Dess controlling Kris, Kris allowing her control and providing the willpower to open Dark Fountains. But, and here's perhaps the twist... Gaster is NOT working with anyone else here. Gaster has his own twisted little wants, and he's decided Dess is in the way, so he summons his own pawn; a player. He uses the survey program not to summon a player to further whatever goal Kris and Dess are doing, but to do his own thing, to follow his prophecy, and even if Kris, Dess, Carol, and who else knows is on this team hate it... they can't afford to lose the Soul. They HAVE to keep things up, have to keep chugging along, in the hopes that Dess can overpower the player, or perhaps they are looking for ways to stop Gaster and drive the player out? This one I'm less confident on, but it occured to me, so I'm gonna say it.
(3/3) God this is messy, I wish I was allowed to type as much as I wanted like everyone else seems to be able to do T.T Anywho This just to say these are just ideas as I see might fill the holes, not trying to completely upend your theory as it stands. I personally really vibe with the notion we are waking Dess up in the soul, as a fun inversion of Undertale's "chara wakes up as we do bad things", where Dess wakes up as we solve problems and help people. It's only the wierd route where instead of Dess awakening, it's us projecting a dangerous influence on Noelle, and for all we know it's Gaster or someone else using our hands on the Soul to taint it further, if we use our choices to let this coruption in. I see the Weird Route as an exploitation of Genocide/Bored players, the people who don't bother with the story as is, who hunt for secrets and see everything just because they can. I like how you call it 'Gaster's trap' because that's 100% what it feels like. Gaster knows what players are like, and called us over for a reason. He may well have wanted this kind of player all along, and accepts any timelines where we don't do wierd route as acceptable chaff as long as weird route happens at least once. As for Sword Route, I'm curious if it pans out (The idea that starting, but aborting the weird route to get the Purecrystal and make the Twistedsword is it's own route, in the end) as pro or anti Gaster, but TBH I'm not sold it's a true 3rd Route yet. It's certainly a creepy item, a trance blade for Kris, but there's nothing that sells me on the idea it's a proper route like weird route is, with it's own plot and happenings, and may instead just be a change on character reaction if you make it. Not to add MORE questions to all this, but what's your thought on this proposed 3rd route?
Red Soul Dess idea
This JUST occured to me, and could be nothing, but in examining the Dess Red Soul theory while replaying the game, I can't help but overthink everything. It is an aobsrvable trend that flavor text changes in tone chapter by chapter. It's like chapter 1 is trying to trick players into thinking they are Kris, until they break out, and then as the chapters go on, the flavor text gains more and more personality and distance from kris. Compare the examining mirror lines, from "It's only you" in chapter 1, all the way to chapter 5, where the flavor text narration asks who the person in the mirror even is. My addition/observation to this is... What if, instead of the proposed years of Kris+Dess alliance until we take control of the soul... Dess was *silent*. Kris had a new soul, but not a new personality/voice? It served to keep them alive but there simply was no Dess? It would add to Kris avoiding Noelle and self-isolating, not because it's Dess controlling Kris, but Kris guilty because she is gone and they blame themselves, and it's entirely them choosing it. What if Dess's voice coming back is part of this processes, even key to Dess's revival? If our leveling up, our getting stronger, is somehow repairing Dess's soul, giving her life and restoring her voice, with the goal of returning her soul into her body stored somewhere else, like in the shelter? This could open up new permutations of knight theories, like the knight being similar to a messed-up duskner, but for a human corpse that craved being a deer monster, not just a dead monster revived by someone who did not know them, like the old man statue. The extra tagedy here, then, is that perhaps just as we cannot hear Kris, they cannot hear Dess's narration to us, so they don't know how the plan is progressing, if at all; She is coming to life to us but cannot talk to Kris? I dunno. This idea provides me an important amount of motive for Carol and Kris to not only have the red soul around, with us in control, but to let us explore dark worlds and get stronger. That's been missing in a LOT of theories and the overal analysis of the narrative; why, is this allowed to happen? Why are we being presented obstacles to clear if our opposition is the ones setting up the obstacles? If our guidance is bringing Dess's soul back to life that gives me a better sense of motive for just about everything. But as the person who introduced me to this idea, maybe even came up with it, what do you think, @shattered-cage ?
Interesting interpretation. I'd have to sit on it more, since it's radically different to where my head is currently at with the SOUL thing, but I don’t see anything to contradict this; totally plausible. The only thing holding me back is I’m a total subtext slut and Kris being completely “in the dark” about dess feels… a little less interesting and agentic? it feels more like 'things happening' as opposed to the conflict of “oh shit she’s gone” and “oh shit she’s coming back”. plus the weird route in general… but yeah tbh you actually do a great job of presenting this in a way that is narratively compelling.
not because it's Dess controlling Kris, but Kris guilty because she is gone and they blame themselves,
Thing is, I'd imagine these two would see Dess as 'gone' either way, but not even having her voice in Kris's mind would make her 'more gone,' so that's fair. Personally, I feel like having concrete proof of a shred of Dess being there, but locked in Kris's mind with no real way of removing her or letting others talk to/be assured of her existence feels... scarier, and a little more compelling, perhaps. But again that may just be because I've given it significantly more thought than the alternative
Why are we being presented obstacles to clear if our opposition is the ones setting up the obstacles?
That's the question to be asking. It's the same principle behind why I'm so staunchly convinced the Weird Route is a trap. However, if we take that as a given, i.e. once that trap has been laid and the Knight is thrust back into the 'main route'... then yeah, there needs to be SOMETHING driving this 'open fountain, close fountain' process. You mention in the other post the Knight knowing in Chapter Four their fountain wouldn't bring about the Roaring, and this idea of reforging and strengthening Dess within Kris does provide an explanation there.
What if Dess's voice coming back is part of this processes, even key to Dess's revival? If our leveling up, our getting stronger, is somehow repairing Dess's soul, giving her life and restoring her voice, with the goal of returning her soul into her body stored somewhere else, like in the shelter? This could open up new permutations of knight theories, like the knight being similar to a messed-up duskner, but for a human corpse that craved being a deer monster, not just a dead monster revived by someone who did not know them, like the old man statue.
This is where you’ve sold me the most. Not only is this interesting and adheres to my own suspicions about what’s going on with the SOUL: even if this explanation wasn’t necessarily “true”, such logic could easily be leveraged against Kris as emotional manipulation to earn and secure their compliance, which I think is important since, from body language and behavior and vibes (not to mention the ending of chapter 4), it’s very clear Kris feels they have no choice but to cooperate, both out of personal obligation and external insistence (mostly Carol but whoever else is in the Shelter, too I'd imagine) and would clearly much fucking prefer not lying to their bestie Susie. Anyway whether the manipulation is just Carol or whoever is directing this conspiracy from within the bunker, say, just as an example, the “brains” of the operation, a scientific mind (hmmmmmmm no one comes to mind… ah right alphys that settles it)
Anyway gasterslop aside: Dess-denial would align thematically with Deltarune's escapism theme. Much like how Susie will have to accept the reality that the dark worlds are NOT reality, Carol will have to accept that nothing is bringing back her daughter. An intense effort on her and Kris's part to try to anyway--out of grief and guilt respectively--would be very tragic and on-brand in this regard.
I can see this idea of Kris's bodily power and perhaps synchronization with the SOUL “revitalizing” Dess's consciousness since the Dess-flavored descriptions don’t really come into play until the later chapters. However, the main caveat here is that I'm not sure how we the Player 'play' into this. Still feels like the timeline (i.e. Gaster summons us and mid-sentence we return to Kris) suggests there’s a new (recent) entity controlling the soul, which is somewhat supported by Noelle and company thinking 'Kris is quieter than usual.' If Dess wasn't controlling Kris, and we weren't controlling Kris, what would that look like in terms of the immediate lead-up to Deltarune Chapter One? Kris was already in cahoots with Carol and ostensibly the Knight, perhaps even making Dark Fountain(s), so what's the deal with Gaster suddenly feeling the need to bring in an outside entity as a body-and-mind buffer between Kris and Dess?
Worth noting: the line or two at the end of the Vessel creation is not Gaster. Does this imply that it is Dess? Is it a dream?--maybe but that's less interestjng… honestly I'm sort of baffled by the text and tone shift, which clearly indicates it is no longer Gaster speaking. I guess it has to be Dess…?
Lastly this bit about an “amputation of the mind” could connect to the Dess hand trauma stuff we keep running into. Could explain why Dess says “i'll never play again” and also messes up the piano in ch4. however, this brings into question why Kris can still play guitar in ch3 if dess is the one allowing them to do so; is Dess simply 'back' enough by that point to carry us through the minigame? Could this just be a literal red herring? The USB mic at the computer in Chapter Five Asriel used for webchatting with Dess is clearly from Rock Band, and the Tenna minigame is adjacent to that. Tenna mentioning Dess and the song being Desspilled as shit and the Player/SOUL playing 'Guitar' specifically sure as shit makes it seem like Dess's skill is carrying us through, but it could just be that Kris is cracked at Guitar Hero lmao
(1/3) So I feel the need to clerify a little here.
In case my message got muddled by the confusing way I go off on tangents and then forget my original point XD I absolutely agree we are not Dess. The player is a new entity, brought in by Gaster, to take control of the soul, and puppet Kris as a result. I was suggesting that unlike the proposed "Kris and Dess had a good relationship until Dess was unexpectedly wiped and replaced with us", my own proposal is basically "Kris was largely in control of themselves, acting 'normal' enough to avoid notice, until chapter 1 begins and for the first time, is puppeted by another consiousness in the Soul. Dess *is* in there but has been waking up due to the progression of our efforts/level, appearing as flavor text narrator" Let's augment this post with, as I've thought about it since, two possabilities that make enough sense to be. Let's call them A and B. Leadup to both senarios: Kris is a human, Dess is a human. Both raised in hometown, both weird and rebellious, and as neighbors and the adopted children of adults who are freinds, become fast friends themselves. Obviously Dess and Asriel had their own relationship (which might not have been romantic both sides, IDK if love letters in a drawer mean they were explicitly dating or that Dess returned or even knew about his feelings, but that's not the subject matter here) and Noelle... was there. Fanon likes to interpet it that Kris and Noelle *were* close as kids, and they only iced them out post-events, but TBH noelle not remembering Kris *ever* complimenting her in their lives, combined with her inability to determine if her and Kris are friends, to me doesn't read "we were loving friends until DA ACCIDENT" it tells me things weren't simple. Kris is a little weirdo and even if *they* were fond of Noelle in their own way, I'm not sure Noelle ever took all that pranking as friendship. As she says, they were the neighbor. Even her dad calls them, the weird kid next door. IM GOING ON A TANGENT AGAIN In both senarios, Dess and Kris, alongside an unknown amount of people, at the very least Catti, participated in a demon summoning, during which Catti lost her nerve and fled, which if it's the event that set things off... good call. This is not GARENTEED to be the un-Dessening but it's the best assumtion we got. A demon summoning, maybe the presence of FRIEND or Gaster or Dark Papyrus, whatever it was... the point is, the unkown incidident which may or may not involve the creation of a dark world, the first known apperance of the knight or another such entity that has these abilities (I take stock in Ralsei the living prophecy's confusion at the notion that the Knight is not a new presence. Ralsei knows puzzle solutions and gags by heart before they encounter them, there's a good chance in my mind the source of the black shard that day, and the Knight we know now, might not be the exact same entity.) All of this to say what we KNOW is shakey and what we ASSUME might not be right but anyway... on to the senarios. IDK if it's Tumblr as a whole or just my PC but I can't type as long of posts as other people? it glitches out. Senario A in a reblog.
(2/3) Senario A: Something REALLY bad happened, which turned two humans, each with a soul, to one human and one human soul, and they don't match. Kris takes (or is given, IDK) Dess's red soul into themselves to live, and while they continue to live and have agency, for all intents and purposes, Kris is just Kris and Dess is just dead. Carol, with her extensive reaserch into humans and souls, is frustrated that Dess's spirit does not persist in her soul, but alone or through working with Gaster/Knight/Time Traveling Togore (the third one is always a joke to say, I don't know what it could be as a fact) she determines that, through the power of dark worlds, sealing fountains, SOMETHING that levels the party up in between chapters, Dess's soul can be 'repaired' or something, and her fledgeling life can be restored. Kris, who feels guilty and does not give a damn about themselves, endevors to do this, basicaly signing up to be body snatched by Dess should she revive this way, proceeds to open up multiple darks worlds, have adventures in them, ect. They experiment with various methods, and bad guys, and sealing fountains... nothing works. Enter Gaster, in communication with them or not, who has through his manipulations of the timeline and knowledge of Undertale, has realized the missing piece; Frisk, isn't the one in control when they mess with the underground. It's not Determination that finally resolves the Undertale time loops... it's a foreign entity. Gaster knows about players, about how they turn the world into games proper, and get shit done. So he invents the Survey program, uses the goner-maker to prime the player for the experince as Kris, even sets us up to prepare for one, planned ending by telling us our choices don't matter, and then his Deltarune, not to be mistake with the Delta Rune, can begin. With us in control, a scary new feeling for Kris, progress is made. Suzie gets dragged along this time, not just Kris, and Ralsei is waiting for them... the Prophecy calls for "The Cage, with Human Soul and Parts" as in, Kris who is containing A human soul and a decaying body, not thier original soul, and a cage for US not acting on their own account. This reflects Kris's surprise and distrust of us, but bregrudingly the plan is going underway and, provided it's not the little possibility I worried about for edgyness, the worst part for them is that it's WORKING. In a few day's time Dess's mind is waking up, seeing the world, expressing herself, when they in years couldn't bring this about. No wonder they hate us so much. Senario B, is similar in nature to Senario A, including that Kris has Dess's red soul. Duh. But in this one, it's a bit crueler. Dess's body is still on some level functional, maybe it's the knight, maybe it's just sealed away somewhere, who knows. And Kris's original, Cyan soul? It's still out there too! But they aren't allowed to have it. Kris and Dess are combined by force, by FRIEND or whatever was summoned, to carry out some kind of will or task, with Dess's body and Kris's soul as the leveredge. Maybe just one of the two but I find it more compelling if it's both. Whatever tasks they are doing, they do as a pair. Dess controlling Kris, Kris allowing her control and providing the willpower to open Dark Fountains. But, and here's perhaps the twist... Gaster is NOT working with anyone else here. Gaster has his own twisted little wants, and he's decided Dess is in the way, so he summons his own pawn; a player. He uses the survey program not to summon a player to further whatever goal Kris and Dess are doing, but to do his own thing, to follow his prophecy, and even if Kris, Dess, Carol, and who else knows is on this team hate it... they can't afford to lose the Soul. They HAVE to keep things up, have to keep chugging along, in the hopes that Dess can overpower the player, or perhaps they are looking for ways to stop Gaster and drive the player out? This one I'm less confident on, but it occured to me, so I'm gonna say it.

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Red Soul Dess idea
This JUST occured to me, and could be nothing, but in examining the Dess Red Soul theory while replaying the game, I can't help but overthink everything. It is an aobsrvable trend that flavor text changes in tone chapter by chapter. It's like chapter 1 is trying to trick players into thinking they are Kris, until they break out, and then as the chapters go on, the flavor text gains more and more personality and distance from kris. Compare the examining mirror lines, from "It's only you" in chapter 1, all the way to chapter 5, where the flavor text narration asks who the person in the mirror even is. My addition/observation to this is... What if, instead of the proposed years of Kris+Dess alliance until we take control of the soul... Dess was *silent*. Kris had a new soul, but not a new personality/voice? It served to keep them alive but there simply was no Dess? It would add to Kris avoiding Noelle and self-isolating, not because it's Dess controlling Kris, but Kris guilty because she is gone and they blame themselves, and it's entirely them choosing it. What if Dess's voice coming back is part of this processes, even key to Dess's revival? If our leveling up, our getting stronger, is somehow repairing Dess's soul, giving her life and restoring her voice, with the goal of returning her soul into her body stored somewhere else, like in the shelter? This could open up new permutations of knight theories, like the knight being similar to a messed-up duskner, but for a human corpse that craved being a deer monster, not just a dead monster revived by someone who did not know them, like the old man statue. The extra tagedy here, then, is that perhaps just as we cannot hear Kris, they cannot hear Dess's narration to us, so they don't know how the plan is progressing, if at all; She is coming to life to us but cannot talk to Kris? I dunno. This idea provides me an important amount of motive for Carol and Kris to not only have the red soul around, with us in control, but to let us explore dark worlds and get stronger. That's been missing in a LOT of theories and the overal analysis of the narrative; why, is this allowed to happen? Why are we being presented obstacles to clear if our opposition is the ones setting up the obstacles? If our guidance is bringing Dess's soul back to life that gives me a better sense of motive for just about everything. But as the person who introduced me to this idea, maybe even came up with it, what do you think, @shattered-cage ?
Interesting interpretation. I'd have to sit on it more, since it's radically different to where my head is currently at with the SOUL thing, but I don’t see anything to contradict this; totally plausible. The only thing holding me back is I’m a total subtext slut and Kris being completely “in the dark” about dess feels… a little less interesting and agentic? it feels more like 'things happening' as opposed to the conflict of “oh shit she’s gone” and “oh shit she’s coming back”. plus the weird route in general… but yeah tbh you actually do a great job of presenting this in a way that is narratively compelling.
not because it's Dess controlling Kris, but Kris guilty because she is gone and they blame themselves,
Thing is, I'd imagine these two would see Dess as 'gone' either way, but not even having her voice in Kris's mind would make her 'more gone,' so that's fair. Personally, I feel like having concrete proof of a shred of Dess being there, but locked in Kris's mind with no real way of removing her or letting others talk to/be assured of her existence feels... scarier, and a little more compelling, perhaps. But again that may just be because I've given it significantly more thought than the alternative
Why are we being presented obstacles to clear if our opposition is the ones setting up the obstacles?
That's the question to be asking. It's the same principle behind why I'm so staunchly convinced the Weird Route is a trap. However, if we take that as a given, i.e. once that trap has been laid and the Knight is thrust back into the 'main route'... then yeah, there needs to be SOMETHING driving this 'open fountain, close fountain' process. You mention in the other post the Knight knowing in Chapter Four their fountain wouldn't bring about the Roaring, and this idea of reforging and strengthening Dess within Kris does provide an explanation there.
What if Dess's voice coming back is part of this processes, even key to Dess's revival? If our leveling up, our getting stronger, is somehow repairing Dess's soul, giving her life and restoring her voice, with the goal of returning her soul into her body stored somewhere else, like in the shelter? This could open up new permutations of knight theories, like the knight being similar to a messed-up duskner, but for a human corpse that craved being a deer monster, not just a dead monster revived by someone who did not know them, like the old man statue.
This is where you’ve sold me the most. Not only is this interesting and adheres to my own suspicions about what’s going on with the SOUL: even if this explanation wasn’t necessarily “true”, such logic could easily be leveraged against Kris as emotional manipulation to earn and secure their compliance, which I think is important since, from body language and behavior and vibes (not to mention the ending of chapter 4), it’s very clear Kris feels they have no choice but to cooperate, both out of personal obligation and external insistence (mostly Carol but whoever else is in the Shelter, too I'd imagine) and would clearly much fucking prefer not lying to their bestie Susie. Anyway whether the manipulation is just Carol or whoever is directing this conspiracy from within the bunker, say, just as an example, the “brains” of the operation, a scientific mind (hmmmmmmm no one comes to mind… ah right alphys that settles it)
Anyway gasterslop aside: Dess-denial would align thematically with Deltarune's escapism theme. Much like how Susie will have to accept the reality that the dark worlds are NOT reality, Carol will have to accept that nothing is bringing back her daughter. An intense effort on her and Kris's part to try to anyway--out of grief and guilt respectively--would be very tragic and on-brand in this regard.
I can see this idea of Kris's bodily power and perhaps synchronization with the SOUL “revitalizing” Dess's consciousness since the Dess-flavored descriptions don’t really come into play until the later chapters. However, the main caveat here is that I'm not sure how we the Player 'play' into this. Still feels like the timeline (i.e. Gaster summons us and mid-sentence we return to Kris) suggests there’s a new (recent) entity controlling the soul, which is somewhat supported by Noelle and company thinking 'Kris is quieter than usual.' If Dess wasn't controlling Kris, and we weren't controlling Kris, what would that look like in terms of the immediate lead-up to Deltarune Chapter One? Kris was already in cahoots with Carol and ostensibly the Knight, perhaps even making Dark Fountain(s), so what's the deal with Gaster suddenly feeling the need to bring in an outside entity as a body-and-mind buffer between Kris and Dess?
Worth noting: the line or two at the end of the Vessel creation is not Gaster. Does this imply that it is Dess? Is it a dream?--maybe but that's less interestjng… honestly I'm sort of baffled by the text and tone shift, which clearly indicates it is no longer Gaster speaking. I guess it has to be Dess…?
Lastly this bit about an “amputation of the mind” could connect to the Dess hand trauma stuff we keep running into. Could explain why Dess says “i'll never play again” and also messes up the piano in ch4. however, this brings into question why Kris can still play guitar in ch3 if dess is the one allowing them to do so; is Dess simply 'back' enough by that point to carry us through the minigame? Could this just be a literal red herring? The USB mic at the computer in Chapter Five Asriel used for webchatting with Dess is clearly from Rock Band, and the Tenna minigame is adjacent to that. Tenna mentioning Dess and the song being Desspilled as shit and the Player/SOUL playing 'Guitar' specifically sure as shit makes it seem like Dess's skill is carrying us through, but it could just be that Kris is cracked at Guitar Hero lmao
(1/3) So I feel the need to clerify a little here.
In case my message got muddled by the confusing way I go off on tangents and then forget my original point XD I absolutely agree we are not Dess. The player is a new entity, brought in by Gaster, to take control of the soul, and puppet Kris as a result. I was suggesting that unlike the proposed "Kris and Dess had a good relationship until Dess was unexpectedly wiped and replaced with us", my own proposal is basically "Kris was largely in control of themselves, acting 'normal' enough to avoid notice, until chapter 1 begins and for the first time, is puppeted by another consiousness in the Soul. Dess *is* in there but has been waking up due to the progression of our efforts/level, appearing as flavor text narrator" Let's augment this post with, as I've thought about it since, two possabilities that make enough sense to be. Let's call them A and B. Leadup to both senarios: Kris is a human, Dess is a human. Both raised in hometown, both weird and rebellious, and as neighbors and the adopted children of adults who are freinds, become fast friends themselves. Obviously Dess and Asriel had their own relationship (which might not have been romantic both sides, IDK if love letters in a drawer mean they were explicitly dating or that Dess returned or even knew about his feelings, but that's not the subject matter here) and Noelle... was there. Fanon likes to interpet it that Kris and Noelle *were* close as kids, and they only iced them out post-events, but TBH noelle not remembering Kris *ever* complimenting her in their lives, combined with her inability to determine if her and Kris are friends, to me doesn't read "we were loving friends until DA ACCIDENT" it tells me things weren't simple. Kris is a little weirdo and even if *they* were fond of Noelle in their own way, I'm not sure Noelle ever took all that pranking as friendship. As she says, they were the neighbor. Even her dad calls them, the weird kid next door. IM GOING ON A TANGENT AGAIN In both senarios, Dess and Kris, alongside an unknown amount of people, at the very least Catti, participated in a demon summoning, during which Catti lost her nerve and fled, which if it's the event that set things off... good call. This is not GARENTEED to be the un-Dessening but it's the best assumtion we got. A demon summoning, maybe the presence of FRIEND or Gaster or Dark Papyrus, whatever it was... the point is, the unkown incidident which may or may not involve the creation of a dark world, the first known apperance of the knight or another such entity that has these abilities (I take stock in Ralsei the living prophecy's confusion at the notion that the Knight is not a new presence. Ralsei knows puzzle solutions and gags by heart before they encounter them, there's a good chance in my mind the source of the black shard that day, and the Knight we know now, might not be the exact same entity.) All of this to say what we KNOW is shakey and what we ASSUME might not be right but anyway... on to the senarios. IDK if it's Tumblr as a whole or just my PC but I can't type as long of posts as other people? it glitches out. Senario A in a reblog.
tldr: gerson is absolutely the main boss of chapter 4. list of reasons why: he is introduced soon after you get to the dark world by him chasing you through the dark, he spends most of the chapter interrupting the fun gang's progress, distracting them, or otherwise wasting their time, he has a "lair" in the dark world, all the denizens of the dark world appear to listen to him, he randomly appears wherever the fun gang is specifically to comment on their progress. he is not evil, but a deltarune main boss is not required to be; the bosses gradually get less antagonistic chapter to chapter anyway. the knight passed through his lair, then blocked the way forward, and he simply let them. the only boss-ism gerson doesn't do is fight you at the end of the chapter, and that's explained in his character: he refuses to follow fate. he makes his own path. of all bosses to just not actually fight you, gerson's the one who would do it.
every chapter in deltarune has a main boss directly representative of the core theme of the dark world: gerson, an interpreter of the prophecy and father of the priest, fits that bill perfectly for a chapter themed around a church and the prophecy.
chapter 4's boss and secret boss are the same person and this is a hill i will die on.
more on this here: https://www.tumblr.com/inkblotsonmyhands/820263753742434304/deltarune-chapters-1-4-analysis-below-no?source=share
I think this post would benefit from some clarification on nomenclature; some generally accepted terminology is Ruler, Chapter Boss, and Secret Boss. The Old Man is generally accepted as the Ruler of Dark Sanctuary, this isn't a new take. He is also the Secret Boss of chapter 4, as seen by his granting of a special item (Justiceaxe) as well as a Shadow Crystal, after an optional encounter.
What he is *not*, however, is the Chapter Boss (the final encounter of the chapter) or the Ruler of 2nd Sanctuary (which has no ruler) and while I think it's up for debate because of its connections to Dark Sanctuary, I wouldn't consider him the Ruler of 3rd Sanctuary either, despite appearing in it.
In truth, Chapter 4 is a big outlier in terms of the Deltarune Formula. Not only are there three separate dark worlds, but also the typical Ruler structure is not there. While the Old Man is the closest thing to one, not all the enemies know or listen to him; only the ones he recruits. The Darkners are in this inverse relationship, with the set seen in 2nd Sanctuary unable to thrive in the darkness of the first, and vice versa, with the inhabitants making up details about their 'ancestors' which are proven wrong as you progress. The secret boss only "fights" one of you, and only as a survival gauntlet, with no ACTing or draining of his HP. The chapter boss isn't a ruler, it's a force we knew about but assumed would be in the final chapter, not here. The chapter serves to confuse the player and shatter their confidence in predicting the game, so we feel as petur bed and nervous as the cast.
You seem hung up on a narrow understanding of the word 'boss' and find the idea that Gerson is akin to characters like Tenna and Queen to be a new notion you are bringing up, when... The outlier Ruler is King. King is the only ruler who has not considered themselves aligned with at least one lightner, and while yes Gerson doesn't turn and attack the party due to a misunderstanding or personal anxiety, he *is* a secret boss fight? Like how split of hairs are you looking for, and why is your perception that this isn't... Obvious information?
So uhhhh
I never remembered seeing this on the second board of chapter 3... Huh.
Obsessed with Kris looking at the camera and doing a mario peace sign when confronted with the fact they flirt with everyone. Gotta win...
I didn't even replay the chat to see the result of the other choice. Kris 100% flirts to win and is proud of it, I knew with certainty it was the only real choice. If Kris isn't aroace, if they have feelings for anyone, it sure as hell isn't the doll thier dad put on a trash can to serve as a mascot for the store, once. (I love you Pink but Kris does not. They don't give two shits about you lol)
i have chocolate milk :) in my cup
fucking awsome

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i have chocolate milk :) in my cup
My UTDR Tomodachi Life highlights so far (finally added them to my exclusively Ace Attorney/BG3 Island)
Added KFC obviously, gave them different clothes because a lot of the in game clothing is so cute.
Toriel, Sans, and Papyrus! I’m so obsessed with Toriel’s little sunflower dress 🥺🥺
Hm. Yeah.
Noelle it’s been five minutes are you serious 😭😭😭
Are you kidding me
This sentence is what you put on a trap to spesifically catch me. I've never seen a sentence so compactly hit so many of my interests in 17 words/Acronyms. Also those Miis look GREAT. Susie in particular is impressive to me, as is Sans. I suck with the draw tools.