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Random question that I thought of while trying to sleep. What do you think the Rogues' ages were when they either started being costumed criminals or started being a team?
This is all pre-Flashpoint, because post-Flashpoint is particularly a mess from an ageing and continuity perspective.
Axel was 16, and Owen was 19. This information came from creators in interviews.
Roy got his prisma-goggles when he was 21 and he probably didn't become the Rainbow Raider immediately, but he probably wasn't significantly older than that.
Evan is particularly challenging because he was seemingly de-aged during his history. Originally, I'd say he was kinda old, probably somewhere in his 30s when he became the Mirror Master. By the Johns era, he was probably in his early twenties when he started.
I want to say that Al Desmond was ~25 when he became a costumed criminal. He was stated to be "over 30" during the Bronze Age, though in those days there wasn't really a compressed timeline like we have now so who knows how much time had passed in-universe. He was also probably older than the other (or most other) Silver Age Rogues because he likely had significant education by the time he became Mr Element.
The others are a bit harder to figure, IMO. Mick had a job with the circus before he became Heat Wave, and was clearly an adult when he debuted. He was also stated to be 40 during Johns' run, so I think it's pretty likely he's one of the older Rogues. And Len of course looked ancient by then, though he'd had a lot of hard living so he wasn't necessarily that old. Digger was balding before he became Captain Boomerang, although some men start balding pretty early so it also doesn't necessarily mean much. But I tend to think of these guys as the oldest core Rogues, even if it's kinda based on vibes more than anything. I'll say ~25 for them too.
Mark is probably on the older side of the Rogues as well, as he was showing his age in the Johns era and had a well-established burglary record and stints in prison by the time he became the Weather Wizard. Maybe 23-24 when he started?
Sam was such an enigma that I really don't know what to think. He did look kinda craggy sometimes, and he also had a well-established burglary record and stints in prison before becoming the Mirror Master. He was also someone the other Rogues naturally looked to and accepted as leadership material, so he might have been a bit older than all the core Rogues. That's my feeling, at any rate, so maybe 26 or over.
Len called Hartley "kid" at an unspecified point, and Hartley said he was "thirty-plus" around the time it was mentioned that Mick had turned 40. Mind you, "thirty-plus" could be a coy way of saying "39" (it's technically correct!), so I wouldn't necessarily think Hartley was significantly younger than Mick. We know that Hartley was kicked out of several colleges before he became the Pied Piper, so he was probably a young adult when he debuted.
(And one thing to be kept in mind is that some people call others "kid" to condescend to them, so it could be an indicator of age or it might just be another Rogue being a jerk to his peer)
James was probably one of the younger Rogues when he debuted, likely starting in his late teens or very early twenties. I'll split the difference and say about 20.
Lisa already had a career as a headlining skater in an ice show by the time she became the Golden Glider, so I'd guess she was somewhere past 19, probably in her early 20s.
One hill I'll die on is that Roscoe was very young when he first became the Top. He was arrested only twice before becoming a supervillain even though we know he wasn't a very skilled thief, and he had something of a babyface when he had the idea to become the Top. It probably took a while for him to teach himself to spin and invent his tech, so maybe he was ~22 when he debuted?
being too warm during the day: well, this sucks, but this temperature makes sense because the sun is up, and the sun is making me warm. i am unhappy but logically i can deal with it for now.
being too warm at night: what if i kill everybody.
The quiet horror Barry feels upon realizing Eobard had full access to him, no matter where he is or what he's doing, this entire time, he just *chose* not to act on his threats, and the second wave of terror when he realizes it's just a *yet*
You tag it. And Barry's tug of familiarity, knowing there's more and knowing he can't remember it, that he didn't live it in this version of himself but how much worse were the other times, how much more brutal, how often did Eobard go through on those threats? The not knowing is worse than if Eobard would just do it and get it over with, after a certain point.
Yeah, I think Barry would be able to deal with it a lot better than the not knowing. Sure, finding out what horrible scheme Eobard whipped up is terrifying in itself, but it's the unknown that REALLY gets Barry. He could come from anywhere, to any point in time in Barry's life and Barry can't predict him. It's impossible to guess what Eobard might do any given moment. I mean, just look at the Post New 52 Rebirth comics, where Barry is on the verge of a complete breakdown due to his fear of Eo killing everyone if/whenever he wanted.
Barry has to take everything Eobard says as a legitimate threat because Barry can't prove he's bluffing (to be fair, some of Eo's talk really is just to scare Barry but Barry has no way of knowing that) and Eobard 100% exploits that.
Eobard isn't an idiot. His actions aren't random and petty, they're very effective tactics for his long-term goal. Everything he does, he does for a very specific reason. It may not seem like it at first, but he's an excellent study of the human psyche, in that he knows exactly what to do to tweak, break and mold Barry into what he wants. Every little thing he does to Barry would eventually culminate into Barry being extremely lonely, isolated, unloved--just like Eobard. That's what he wants. He wants him to feel his pain. He wants Barry to come to him, he wants to be the only one who understands Barry and vice versa. And to do that, he has to keep chiseling away at Barry until that's a possibility. And he won't ever stop.
I love you guys and you are correct and this is very dramatic, but I want to point out that when Barry is hallucinating Eobard going around and doing bad things to people, it is not because of something Eobard did, it's because Barry is a dumbass and went Lightning Rod on Eobard and brought him back to life after tenderly caressing his corpse.
AND THEN Eobard died AGAIN, and Barry was so upset with Iris for having killed him THAT HE BROKE UP WITH HER, and his speed force connection to her got damaged and her hair grayed out a little bit because Barry wasn't entirely keeping her young anymore.
(All panels from Running Scared by Joshua Williamson)
This man is not normal about Eobard either, it is very much a thing where no one is normal ever lmao.
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Flash Vol. 2 #205 (February 2004): "Ignition, Part Five: Secrets" [behind the scenes - pays for the Wests' meal; Wally realizes he was chatting with Cold]
Flash Vol. 2 #206 (March 2004): "Ignition, Part Six: Up to Speed"
Superman/Batman #3 (December 2003): "The World's Finest Part Three: Running Wild"
Avengers/JLA #4 (January 2004): "The Brave and the Bold" [**may not be canon**]
Flash Vol. 2 #207 (April 2004): "Rush Hour!"
Flash Vol. 2 #210 (July 2004): "Reconnected"
Flash Vol. 2 #212 (September 2004): "Mirror Mirror on the Wall"
Flash Vol. 2 #213 (October 2004): "Slow Motion"
Flash Vol. 2 #214 (November 2004): "The Secret of Barry Allen, Part One"
Flash Vol. 2 #216 (January 2005): "The Secret of Barry Allen Part Three: Spinning"
Identity Crisis #6 (January 2005): "Chapter Six: Husbands and Wives" [Appearance same as Flash Vol. 2 #216]
Identity Crisis #6 (January 2005): "Husbands and Wives" [as a corpse; the Rogues are informed of his death]
Flash Vol. 2 #216 (January 2005): "The Secret of Barry Allen, Part Three: Spinning" [the Rogues are informed of his death; scene identical to Identity Crisis #6]
Flash Vol. 2 #217 (February 2005): "Post-Crisis" [as a corpse]
Flash Vol. 2 #220 (May 2005): "Rogue War Chapter 1" [as a corpse]
Flash Vol. 2 #221 (June 2005): "Rogue War Chapter 2" [as a corpse]
Flash Vol. 2 #222 (July 2005): "Rogue War Chapter 3" [as a corpse]
Flash Vol. 2 #223 (August 2005): "Rogue War Chapter 4" [as a corpse]
Flash Vol. 2 #225 (October 2005): "Rogue War Conclusion" [buried]
Blackest Night #8 (May 2010): "Blackest Night" [returns to life]
Brightest Day #0 (June 2010): "Carpe Diem"
Red Robin #15 (October 2010): "The Hit List, Part Three: Secret Identity Crisis"
Red Robin #16 (November 2010): "The Hit List, Part Four: The Best-Laid Plans"
Flash Vol. 3 #1 (June 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues"
Flash Vol. 3 #2 (July 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues"
Flash Vol. 3 #3 (August 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues, Part Three"
Flash Vol. 3 #4 (September 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues, Part Four"
Flash Vol. 3 #5 (November 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues, Part Four"
Flash Vol. 3 #6 (early January 2011): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues, Part Six"
Brightest Day #7 (October 2010): "The Secret Of Life"
Flash Vol. 3 #7 (late January 2011): "What Goes Around, Comes Around"
Brightest Day #18 (late March 2011): "Easy Come Easy Go"
Brightest Day #23 (early June 2011): "Rise and Fall"
Brightest Day #24 (late June 2011): "Brightest Day"
Red Robin #26 (October 2011): "What Goes Around..."
Chronology Uncertain
It is uncertain where these stories fit into his chronology.
Batman #645 (November 2005): "Show Me Yesterday, For I Can't Find Today" [Flashback - during Jason Todd's stint as Robin]
Flash Vol. 2 #224 (September 2005): "Rogue War Chapter 5" [Flashback - Digger sent to the future and meets Meloni Thawne]
Secret Origins Vol. 2 #41 (June 1989): "A Rogue by Any Other Name"
Superman Secret Files and Origins 2004 (August 2004): "Suicide Watch"
DC Retro-Active: The Flash: 1980s (Oct 2011): "The Path Of True Love"
JLA 80-Page Giant #1 (1998): "The Secret Society of Super-Villains"
JLA 80-Page Giant #2 (1999): "With Friends Like These..."
DC Comics Presents: The Flash (October 2004): "The Fastest Man--Dead!"
Flash Vol. 1 #110 (December 1959-January 1960): "The Challenge of the Weather Wizard" [Flashback – Mark finds Clyde dead, uses his research to build a weather wand]
Flash Vol. 1 #110 (December 1959-January 1960): "The Challenge of the Weather Wizard"
Superman: The Man of Steel Annual #4 (1995): "Hero"
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Flash Vol. 1 #113 (June-July 1960): "Danger in the Air" [Flashback - childhood and young adulthood]
Secret Origins Vol. 2 #41 (June 1989): "A Rogue by Any Other Name" [Flashback – childhood and young adulthood, but retcons in a new real name, Giovanni Giuseppe]
Flash Vol. 1 #113 (June-July 1960): "Danger in the Air"
Aquaman: Time and Tide #1 (December 1993): "Time & Tide Part 1: Flashback"
Flash Vol. 1 #121 (June 1961): "The Trickster Strikes Back"
Flash Vol. 1 #129 (June 1962): "Double Danger on Earth"
Flash Vol. 1 #130 (August 1962): "Who Doomed the Flash?"
Flash Vol. 1 #142 (February 1964): "Perilous Pursuit of the Trickster"
Flash Vol. 1 #152 (May 1965): "The Trickster's Toy Thefts"
Legends of the DC Universe #15 (April 1999): "Dark Matters"
Legends of the DC Universe #16 (May 1999): "Dark Matters Part Two"
Legends of the DC Universe #17 (June 1999): "Dark Matters Part Three"
Flash Vol. 1 #177 (March 1968): "The Swell-Headed Super-Hero"
Flash Vol. 2 #190 (November 2002): "Rat Race" [Flashback - Hartley attempting to open up to the Rogues]
Flash Vol. 2 #218 (March 2005): "Rogue Profile: Heat Wave" [Flashback - Len and Mick squabble while the Rogues socialize]
Flash Vol. 1 #209 (September 1971): "Beyond the Speed of Life"
Flash Vol. 1 #228 (July-August 1974): "The Day I Saved the Life of the Flash"
Flash Vol. 1 #239 (February 1976): "The Tailor-Made Crimes of Central City"
Flash Vol. 1 #242 (June 1976): "The Charge of the Electric Gang"
Flash Vol. 1 #243 (August 1976): "If I Can't Rob Central City, Nobody Can"
Flash Vol. 1 #244 (September 1976): "The Last Day of June Is the Last Day of Central City"
Secret Society of Super-Villains #8 (July-August 1977): "Let the Villain Fit the Crime"
Secret Society of Super-Villains #9 (September 1977): "Turnabout Is Unfair Play"
Secret Society of Super-Villains #10 (October 1977): "Triumph and Treachery"
Flash Vol. 1 #254 (October 1977): "To Believe or Not to Believe"
Flash Vol. 1 #256 (December 1977): "Prisoner of the Past"
Justice League of America Vol. 1 #154 (May 1978): "I'll Kill You In Your Dreams!"
Black Lightning Vol. 1 #10 (July-August 1978): "The Other Black Lightning"
Flash Vol. 1 #285 (May 1980): "If, At First, You Don't Succeed"
World's Finest Comics Vol. 1 #280 (June 1982): "General Scarr's Army of Crime"
Flash Vol. 2 #215 (December 2004): "The Secret of Barry Allen Part 2" [Flashback - Roscoe brainwashed by Zatanna and brainwashes the Rogues]
Flash Vol. 2 #190 (November 2002): "Rat Race" [Flashback - childhood and young adulthood]
Flash Vol. 1 #307 (March 1982): "Prey for the Piper" [Flashback - childhood and young adulthood]
Secret Origins Vol. 2 #41 (June 1989): "A Rogue by Any Other Name" [Flashback – childhood and young adulthood; it emphasized his surgeries for the first time]
Flash Vol. 1 #106/2 (April-May 1959): "The Pied Piper of Peril"
Justice League of America Vol. 1 #14 (September 1962): "The Menace of the 'Atom' Bomb"
Impulse #84 (May 2002) "In The Line Of Fire" [retells and expands upon the final page of Flash Vol. 2 #183]
Flash Vol. 2 #184 (May 2002): "Crossfire, Part One: Run Program"
Flash Vol. 2 #185 (June 2002): "Crossfire, Part Two: Hide and Seek"
Flash Vol. 2 #186 (July 2002): "Crossfire, Part Three: The Thinking Man"
Flash Vol. 2 #187 (August 2002): "Crossfire, Part Four: Run-Down"
Flash Vol. 2 #188 (September 2002): "Crossfire, Conclusion: Metal and Flesh"
Flash Vol. 2 #195 (April 2003): "Off-Balance"
Superman/Batman #3 (December 2003): "The World's Finest, Part Three: Running Wild"
Flash Vol. 2 #201 (October 2003): "Ignition, Part One: Driven" [behind the scenes - robbed the police payroll and grabbed a girl's butt before escaping]
Flash Vol. 2 #207 (April 2004): "Rush Hour!"
Flash Vol. 2 #210 (July 2004): "Reconnected"
Flash Vol. 2 #212 (September 2004): "Mirror Mirror on the Wall"
Flash Vol. 2 #213 (October 2004): "Slow Motion"
Identity Crisis #2 (September 2004): "Chapter Two: House of Lies"
Identity Crisis #4 (November 2004): "Chapter Four: Who Benefits"
Flash Vol. 2 #214 (November 2004): "The Secret of Barry Allen, Part One"
Flash: Rebirth #6 (April 2010): "Fastest Man Alive"
Blackest Night #1 (September 2009): "Blackest Night"
Blackest Night: The Flash #1 (February 2010): "Blackest Night: The Flash"
Blackest Night: The Flash #2 (March 2010): "Blackest Night: The Flash, Chapter Two"
Blackest Night: The Flash #3 (April 2010): "Blackest Night: The Flash"
DCU Halloween Special '09 #1/9 (December 2009): "Mirror Games"
Flash Secret Files and Origins 2010 #1/1 (May 2010): "Running to the Past"
Flash Vol. 3 #1 (June 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues"
Flash Vol. 3 #2 (July 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues"
Flash Vol. 3 #4 (September 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues, Part Four"
Flash Vol. 3 #5 (November 2010): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues, Part Four"
Flash Vol. 3 #6 (early January 2011): "Case One: The Dastardly Death of the Rogues, Part Six"
Flash Vol. 3 #7 (late January 2011): "What Goes Around, Comes Around"
Chronology Uncertain
It is uncertain where/if this story fits into his chronology, as it’s an anachronism. He is present in the story but is not known to have interacted with the Rogues at that point.
DC Retro-Active: The Flash: 1980s (Oct 2011): "The Path Of True Love"
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