I've had time to properly absorb the weight of all that happens at the end of chapter 4, and obviously I do feel for both kris and susie. that is The Point of the scenes being from their perspectives; after everything they just went through and all the worry they had for toriel's safety (for the second time in 24 hours!), the scene they come home to is maybe the most uncomfortable slap in the face possible. it sticks out to me that the last thing susie talks about before the dark fountain is sealed is her wanting tomorrow to be the same as yesterday and for everything to always be able to go back to how it was, and that's what greets them - a blatant, obnoxious sign that things are changing. even though the scene has a lighthearted side, its overall tone adds to the downcast feeling the chapter ends on.

having said that, as someone who has spent the past 9 and a half years being normal about sans and toriel, I'm still very very happy that this is a canon scene we got 💜

the fandom may be largely not considering their perspectives in the slightest (or worse, only viewing their perspectives from the most bad faith angles possible), but I for one love this for them!! as other very good posts have pointed out, toriel has been sorely in need of someone who's there for her - an awful lot of people in town saw the divorce play out and have something to say about it, the holiday family are closer to asgore than toriel, kris is her child and stuck in the middle of their parents' issues, and while she's friends with alphys, them being coworkers and alphys being kris' teacher likely puts a distance of sorts between them. but sans is new in town, someone she immediately connects with, who has no pre-existing opinions about her family and has seen firsthand what toriel has to put up with from asgore. in every universe, sans is exactly the kind of person toriel needs in her life.

there's less to work with from sans' perspective given how little we know about him, and I'm not all-in on sans being from deltarune just yet (more specifically I do love the theory, I'm just giving myself room to not be too disappointed if it doesn't happen), but the new version of it's raining somewhere else being named 'the place where it rained' emotionally destroys me forever. either way it drives home just how happy toriel makes sans in both worlds and I love that so so much :']

to be clear I'm not saying they did nothing wrong, their choices negatively impacted kris and susie and they were objectively disruptive and inconsiderate after kris went to bed. but I like that they're being messy and flawed, because it means this isn't just "my faves are getting closer in the background yippee" but that their relationship is potentially an actual part of the story, and that's how you get The Good Stuff!! we wouldn't have had meaningful character moments like noelle finally standing up to queen if queen hadn't tried to control noelle and just listened to her from the start, or susie comforting ralsei with her bloodied hand if he'd told her and kris every detail of the full prophecy the moment he met them and never kept any secrets. if all the hints towards a flower shop dark world turn out to be true then it's pretty clear the story is building things up to make those future character moments hit, and considering we still don't know what happened with the dreemurr divorce at this point, chapter 5 seems like a perfect opportunity to dive into all of that.

plus, as sweet as susie's bond with toriel is, I honestly think susie seeing this side of toriel needed to happen. a lot of the fandom's complaints about toriel right now boil down to her not being the "perfect mother" they thought she was, and what bothers me about that is toriel was never meant to be that kind of character. toby has said that she's not the classic video game protagonist's mother who sees you off on your journey and you can come home and visit any time, and nothing changes and she never has any substantial character of her own. in undertale she literally handholds frisk through the tutorial, she becomes the first boss in her attempt to protect them when every other human left her care, and once they leave she won't let them come back or even call her phone because she can't face seeing them knowing they'll leave again and likely be killed. she's more than just the mother figure of the game, she's her own person with likes and dislikes, hobbies and flaws, and a past and trauma she can't overcome until the best ending.

we've only seen the tip of the iceberg of her history in deltarune, but that same principle holds true: she isn't the perfect parent you return to after each day's adventure, who gives you butterscotch pancakes every morning and never has any real part in the story because that isn't the intent behind her character. she mentioned her loneliness back in chapter 1, kris has secrets and problems they aren't letting her in on, asgore is being relentlessly inconsiderate of her boundaries, and for all susie's praise of toriel being a good mother, I think that house of cards was going to fall eventually. my hope is that, like her blowing up at ralsei ultimately bringing them closer, susie being able to see toriel as the imperfect adult she is but one who does genuinely care might help them build a stronger bond in the end too.

I think I always knew that if soriel ever inched closer to being canon there'd be discourse about it, and toriel slander is unfortunately nothing new. people are just being annoying about it currently and it sucks when I genuinely love what's being built up here!!

so chapter 3 is a billion percent my favorite chapter. idk how many times i've playing it at this point.

and the ending still fucks me up every time. as soon as you get through tv world and go back to the green room and "glowing snow" starts playing the tears start flowing. because everything is still there. his silly golden statues that were so funny at the start of the chapter, now they stand alone in the darkness and the cold. they no longer feel celebratory or self-indulgent. just. sad. and lonely. the green room that he is too tall to fit in, where he has to shrink down, the space he built for everyone but himself to enjoy.

and you get to the save point in the green room and it says this. this, dawg. be for real. i cry every damn time. all the joy and whimsy from earlier, the facade of having fun playing cowboys and rock stars with your friends, it crumbles. turns to stone.

and then. AND THEN. THE LAST FUCKING THING BEFORE HIS BOSS FIGHT. is the last little legend of tenna you play. a recreation of the dreemurr family home. fuckin' a. the last thing you see before you have to go fight him, because he's had it. he's past his limit.

tenna.

AND THEN HAHAHAHHAAHHA. AND THEN WE HE ACTUALLY FINALLY DOES START THE FIGHT HAHA. HE FRAMES IT AS A PHYSICAL CHALLENGE. STILL PLAYING. FUUUUUUUUUUCK.

hate that his health bar just says "enemy." horrible. awful. it's so intentional. it's so painfully intentional that at the end of the fight he's just the big bad you have to defeat to finish the chapter. objectified. the tv. the final boss.

i think very very often about how none of tenna's endings are quite... ideal. at least not of the ones we see right now. i think we'll likely have to wait and see what future chapters have in store exactly for a couple of these but at current, even if castletown is a place where he might be able to get offered more community and friends he is still living with an immense amount of guilt and i Cannot imagine he feels normal about knowing that his employees are all here knowing they had left him during his time of immense need (including and Especially so his closest friends!). he has a very very long way to go i think until he can be at peace with himself + everyone.

wanted to pull this one because of the point about mental illness YUPPPP ive talked about it a couple times in my posts that people either a) ignore mental illness as a disability altogether or b) straight up villainize people with it or who are (checks my notes) displaying symptoms of severe distress in ways people find uncomfortable. i don't like to get too into the weeds on this sort of thing but theres a very odd correlation with certain types of tenna characterization that read as though theres a very obvious bias towards him being visibly mentally ill and thus is violent and aggressive and should be punished for this <- when we don't actually see these traits reflected by him beyond his big breakdown.

THIS EXACTLY ! this is also kind of related to what i mentioned about the first set of tags here but genuinely he gets like full on abandoned by everybody. even if they thought it was the right choice at the time (for whatever reason), tenna has been Shown again and again and again that he has been severely traumatized by Specifically abandonment and well. it just keeps on happening to him! he keeps getting left behind by the people around him when he becomes too much, when he starts to break. he's afraid that if he breaks that he will be thrown away, and he's literally proven right. its like. Horrifying to think about.

and then. yea. using his insecurities against him. its one of the things i think about very very often with the newsletter scene and im really curious to see how that situation evolves when the chapter comes out. Like i see so many people jump to say that battat is defending his fellow workers when we.... literally see him berate the other two at multiple points. i dont think his statement at all was said as a defense, it seemed pretty pointed to me that it was him lashing out because he wasn't chosen as the favorite mike in that moment or that he doesn't feel appreciated enough when hes small mike (even though it is. Again. A self appointed position. nobody asked him to do this)

and the final couple points is something that comes up a lot in discussions around him. he gets put under such a weird spotlight compared to every other character. im not entirely sure the reasons and im sure theres a mix of underlying reasons why but he (and queen as you mention!) really does get put under a microscope and dissected far more than a lot of other characters ive seen

lastly i thought these two brought some really interesting thematic stuff up. his facade !!! his wonderful beautiful facade !!! it might be working too well....

the hays code thing is also super interesting. God it makes me sick thinking that he associates it with punishment. it would make a lot of sense.

edit: also adding these tags by @/pubbee that i got while drafting this post