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BH: the dynamic cert- the dynamics changes when you get fans, right? when people are expecting... something out of ya!

L: asshole fans... yeah! [chuckling in room] (laughing) that would change the dynamic! no, I-I mean–

BH: when there's an audience, though?

L: – you get what I'm saying! you want fans who like what you like–

BH: sure! sure.

L: – you want the fans to be you–!

F: but who's got bad fa- but who's- I mean, I'll just be contrarian, like, who's got bad fans? I mean, nobody–

L: I can't say- I can't say their names.

F: (chuckles) I mean, there's not a band in the world that has, like. you know, there's no such thing as a bad- I mean, what's a bad fan?

L: well, this is- I mean, I would just - without actually getting mean about other artists - um, I think there is this idea that we've talked about, which is people who are loved- are-who- sorry, who are liked by everybody but loved by no-one, you know. who- who just–

F: oh, those are very peculiar bands. you mean like... you mean like The Pointer Sisters? or. (laughs)

L: I mean The Pointer Sisters-(!) no, I didn't- I wasn't thinking of them. but–

F: I'm like, you know, they had like, a million hits on the radio–

[talking on top of each other]

L: – yeah, yeah, yeah. somebody who's, like –

F: – I don't think anybody's like, "oh my god, I gotta see- like, I love The Poin-" or Heart–

L: – right! right–

F: – I mean, Heart in the '90s–

L: – but often things that are sort of massively successful have that quality. I mean, they often do have a core following of obsessive people, who... really like them! but then, I would say, you know. there's a thing you have a sense about, which is.. that.. there's stuff that is- is just.. kind of.. tolerated (laughing) by everybody in a way, like.

F: (stammering quietly)

BH: unoffensive.

L: unoffensive!

F: [rustling] (discreetly, laughing) unplug- unplug the microphones, say who you're thinking about. [laughter] I'm just, I'm so-

["Minimum Wage" soundbed fades in. voice-over]

at this point in the conversation, the members of They Might Be Giants discussed bands that are liked by everyone, but loved by no-one. the contents of this discussion are now forever lost, to history.

[soundbed fades out]

L: probably should wrap.. that up. [JF chuckles]

F: but I wanna gossip more!