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no but actually since we are talking about the waterfall scene in s1 of TNM while yes it does feel like a random and over the top way of objectifying their lead (yay) i really do love the symbolism of it. waterfalls are loud and overpowering and i think it's a great way to show his inner turmoil. primal vibes, man wrestling with (his own/human) nature and fate etc. plus yeah the whole make me clean/guilt thing which i think has a direct echo in the shower Jonathan takes after killing Corky AND the shower Teddy takes in s2 episode 6 as he prepares to betray his father and seek repentance away from criminal life. i think also these are characters in search of truth/redemption/purity who want to wash away the façades they've been forced to wear and seek rebirth away from violence BUT the mask (and the violence) is necessary to accomplish the redemptive task life has thrown their way...tragic, really. shower scene or the summit of sexy angsting
Okay so, I've been wanting to write about this for a while now, I always see people talking about how much they love series Loki because that's where he's most comfortable with himself— and I agree, I love him too and I think it's great that he learned to accept more some aspects of himself and got more comfortable with showing vulnerability to others as well as allowing himself to make meaningful connections with the people around him
BUT
Saying that Avengers Loki is not the real Loki just tells me you don't really understand Loki as a character at all
I'm part of the few people who don't entirely buy into the headcanon that Loki was brutally tortured by Thanos in the 1 year gap between Thor and Avengers, I think he did went to very bad places but it doesn't make sense to me that Thanos would break physically and mentally the man he was sending to lead an army on a different planet to get him an infinity stone, I believe he had to fight for his life after his fall and Thanos probably submitted him to a very rigorous training like he did with his daughters (yes, one could argue that that was tortue but let's be fr, it's on a whole different level)
Anyway, my point is: Loki didn't attack Earth against his will, he was angry and hurt, feeling betrayed by his family and dealing with an identity crisis, he was livid, he went through hell after his fall and now he had a chance to cause some trouble for Thor and Odin and he was going to take it
I don't believe Loki really cared about Thanos' philosophy and the whole "freedom is a lie" thing, he was parroting what Thanos told him to cause some dramatic effect but I don't believe, not even for a second that he gave two fucks about it, again, he wanted to make trouble and to cause damage, he wanted to hurt Thor and Odin bc he felt hurt, he didn't care that innocent people were going to die, he didn't even think about them, he just wanted to channel his anger and to piss off his family, and ykw?
That's the real Loki
Because Loki is not some perfect little angel who was forced to do bad things against his will in order to survive, Loki is a vengeful God, a being of chaos, a master of magic and sometimes... an asshole
Sorry, he's not the little baby we all like to pretend he is sometimes, yes there's lots of pain and shame and sadness inside his heart but that doesn't erase the fact that there's some ugly parts in his personality, that's what makes him so complex in my opinion, he's not necessarily evil but he's also not necessarily an innocent baby either, he said it himself:
Believe it or not, that applies to him too!
Avengers' Loki shows us the "ugly" parts of himself—parts many would prefer to ignore. But sorry to break it to you: that was the real Loki too.
Some might argue that the whole "God of Mischief" persona was merely a facade to hide his vulnerable, weak self, but I disagree. I believe Loki did use his title to build walls around himself and keep others at a distance to some extent. However, things aren’t just black and white—Loki is the God of Mischief, whether people like it or not and that means he thrives in chaos sometimes
I mean, he even tells Mobius, "Sometimes our emotions get the better of us," when talking about the New York attack. I know some people don't like that scene because it contradicts their headcanon of Loki being tortured and forced to go to Earth, but personally, I love it.
I never liked the idea of Loki having so little agency in Avengers. And yes, I know the Mind Stone was influencing him, but that’s the key—it was influencing, not controlling
I think what I’m trying to say is this: some people don’t truly understand who Loki is. They’ve created a version of him in their minds and reject anything that contradicts it. Refusing to acknowledge the darkness within him only proves that you don’t fully appreciate him.
You can love series Loki and say that it's the more mentally healthy version of the character, but please don’t claim that Avengers Loki is his worst version—or that it’s not the real him.
Maybe I'm being annoying but it just hurts every time I see posts trashing him and saying that he's the worst Loki ever, to me that's one of the most fascinating depictions of him precisely because we see how malicious, cunning and calculating he can be, he has so much range and I genuinely feel sorry for all the people who can't appreciate that
Okay so, I've been wanting to write about this for a while now, I always see people talking about how much they love series Loki because that's where he's most comfortable with himself— and I agree, I love him too and I think it's great that he learned to accept more some aspects of himself and got more comfortable with showing vulnerability to others as well as allowing himself to make meaningful connections with the people around him
BUT
Saying that Avengers Loki is not the real Loki just tells me you don't really understand Loki as a character at all
I'm part of the few people who don't entirely buy into the headcanon that Loki was brutally tortured by Thanos in the 1 year gap between Thor and Avengers, I think he did went to very bad places but it doesn't make sense to me that Thanos would break physically and mentally the man he was sending to lead an army on a different planet to get him an infinity stone, I believe he had to fight for his life after his fall and Thanos probably submitted him to a very rigorous training like he did with his daughters (yes, one could argue that that was tortue but let's be fr, it's on a whole different level)
Anyway, my point is: Loki didn't attack Earth against his will, he was angry and hurt, feeling betrayed by his family and dealing with an identity crisis, he was livid, he went through hell after his fall and now he had a chance to cause some trouble for Thor and Odin and he was going to take it
I don't believe Loki really cared about Thanos' philosophy and the whole "freedom is a lie" thing, he was parroting what Thanos told him to cause some dramatic effect but I don't believe, not even for a second that he gave two fucks about it, again, he wanted to make trouble and to cause damage, he wanted to hurt Thor and Odin bc he felt hurt, he didn't care that innocent people were going to die, he didn't even think about them, he just wanted to channel his anger and to piss off his family, and ykw?
That's the real Loki
Because Loki is not some perfect little angel who was forced to do bad things against his will in order to survive, Loki is a vengeful God, a being of chaos, a master of magic and sometimes... an asshole
Sorry, he's not the little baby we all like to pretend he is sometimes, yes there's lots of pain and shame and sadness inside his heart but that doesn't erase the fact that there's some ugly parts in his personality, that's what makes him so complex in my opinion, he's not necessarily evil but he's also not necessarily an innocent baby either, he said it himself:
Believe it or not, that applies to him too!
Avengers' Loki shows us the "ugly" parts of himself—parts many would prefer to ignore. But sorry to break it to you: that was the real Loki too.
Some might argue that the whole "God of Mischief" persona was merely a facade to hide his vulnerable, weak self, but I disagree. I believe Loki did use his title to build walls around himself and keep others at a distance to some extent. However, things aren’t just black and white—Loki is the God of Mischief, whether people like it or not and that means he thrives in chaos sometimes
I mean, he even tells Mobius, "Sometimes our emotions get the better of us," when talking about the New York attack. I know some people don't like that scene because it contradicts their headcanon of Loki being tortured and forced to go to Earth, but personally, I love it.
I never liked the idea of Loki having so little agency in Avengers. And yes, I know the Mind Stone was influencing him, but that’s the key—it was influencing, not controlling
I think what I’m trying to say is this: some people don’t truly understand who Loki is. They’ve created a version of him in their minds and reject anything that contradicts it. Refusing to acknowledge the darkness within him only proves that you don’t fully appreciate him.
You can love series Loki and say that it's the more mentally healthy version of the character, but please don’t claim that Avengers Loki is his worst version—or that it’s not the real him.
Maybe I'm being annoying but it just hurts every time I see posts trashing him and saying that he's the worst Loki ever, to me that's one of the most fascinating depictions of him precisely because we see how malicious, cunning and calculating he can be, he has so much range and I genuinely feel sorry for all the people who can't appreciate that
Okay so, I've been wanting to write about this for a while now, I always see people talking about how much they love series Loki because that's where he's most comfortable with himself— and I agree, I love him too and I think it's great that he learned to accept more some aspects of himself and got more comfortable with showing vulnerability to others as well as allowing himself to make meaningful connections with the people around him
BUT
Saying that Avengers Loki is not the real Loki just tells me you don't really understand Loki as a character at all
I'm part of the few people who don't entirely buy into the headcanon that Loki was brutally tortured by Thanos in the 1 year gap between Thor and Avengers, I think he did went to very bad places but it doesn't make sense to me that Thanos would break physically and mentally the man he was sending to lead an army on a different planet to get him an infinity stone, I believe he had to fight for his life after his fall and Thanos probably submitted him to a very rigorous training like he did with his daughters (yes, one could argue that that was tortue but let's be fr, it's on a whole different level)
Anyway, my point is: Loki didn't attack Earth against his will, he was angry and hurt, feeling betrayed by his family and dealing with an identity crisis, he was livid, he went through hell after his fall and now he had a chance to cause some trouble for Thor and Odin and he was going to take it
I don't believe Loki really cared about Thanos' philosophy and the whole "freedom is a lie" thing, he was parroting what Thanos told him to cause some dramatic effect but I don't believe, not even for a second that he gave two fucks about it, again, he wanted to make trouble and to cause damage, he wanted to hurt Thor and Odin bc he felt hurt, he didn't care that innocent people were going to die, he didn't even think about them, he just wanted to channel his anger and to piss off his family, and ykw?
That's the real Loki
Because Loki is not some perfect little angel who was forced to do bad things against his will in order to survive, Loki is a vengeful God, a being of chaos, a master of magic and sometimes... an asshole
Sorry, he's not the little baby we all like to pretend he is sometimes, yes there's lots of pain and shame and sadness inside his heart but that doesn't erase the fact that there's some ugly parts in his personality, that's what makes him so complex in my opinion, he's not necessarily evil but he's also not necessarily an innocent baby either, he said it himself:
Believe it or not, that applies to him too!
Avengers' Loki shows us the "ugly" parts of himself—parts many would prefer to ignore. But sorry to break it to you: that was the real Loki too.
Some might argue that the whole "God of Mischief" persona was merely a facade to hide his vulnerable, weak self, but I disagree. I believe Loki did use his title to build walls around himself and keep others at a distance to some extent. However, things aren’t just black and white—Loki is the God of Mischief, whether people like it or not and that means he thrives in chaos sometimes
I mean, he even tells Mobius, "Sometimes our emotions get the better of us," when talking about the New York attack. I know some people don't like that scene because it contradicts their headcanon of Loki being tortured and forced to go to Earth, but personally, I love it.
I never liked the idea of Loki having so little agency in Avengers. And yes, I know the Mind Stone was influencing him, but that’s the key—it was influencing, not controlling
I think what I’m trying to say is this: some people don’t truly understand who Loki is. They’ve created a version of him in their minds and reject anything that contradicts it. Refusing to acknowledge the darkness within him only proves that you don’t fully appreciate him.
You can love series Loki and say that it's the more mentally healthy version of the character, but please don’t claim that Avengers Loki is his worst version—or that it’s not the real him.
Maybe I'm being annoying but it just hurts every time I see posts trashing him and saying that he's the worst Loki ever, to me that's one of the most fascinating depictions of him precisely because we see how malicious, cunning and calculating he can be, he has so much range and I genuinely feel sorry for all the people who can't appreciate that
Anya is live and ready to show you everything. Watch her strip, dance, and perform exclusive shows just for you. Interact in real-time and make your fantasies come true.
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So I made some gifs from some scenes in the first Avengers movie that no one ever talks about. I think most people have completely missed it because I've never actually seen anyone comment on it.
This:
Clint Barton actually hits Loki!
CLINT. HIT. LOKI.
That bullet hits—and then ricochets, and then Loki reacts like this:
He immediately retaliates, and if Clint hadn't ducked out of the way because he's incredibly good at that, he would have been obliterated head-on!
And as we all remember, Clint then gets back up after everyone else has been knocked down, and this moment happens here:
And this? This is when Clint realizes that Loki is far stronger than he was expecting—it's a great bit of acting on Renner's part, because you can see him realize 'holy crap, this guy is something else entirely'. Canonically, Hawkeye is the strongest of all the agents without any 'extras' and he's always been able to handle himself and this is the first time he's been up against something like this.
You can see his expression go from "ow, that hurts" to "wait...what the fuck?" and it's just so damn brilliant.
I always had the thought that Loki was getting irritated because he's aimed at the guy more than twice and not only did Clint dodge, but he got back up to keep fighting! Loki's literally thinking, You keep getting back up! Stop it!
...and I have always been certain that this was the moment he saw something in him.
This is why he said, "You have heart."
I genuinely think Loki was planning on killing him up until that point, but when he saw that this human had such a drive and passion to fight, he knew that this was the right person to protect him. I would like to remind people that Loki was actually still severely incapacitated, it just didn't seem that way because he was still stronger compared to humans.
Then in the scene that occurs right before the deleted scene (which explains so much more) we have this:
Look at how Loki looks at him, almost as though he's measuring just how adept he is and how smart he is. This is when Clint is explaining how he chose the location because they need the three levels of lead-lined flooring to keep S.H.I.E.L.D. from finding the cube. This is Loki realizing he chose the right person because right after this we hear him see, "I see why Fury chose you to guard it," acknowledging just how smart and adaptive he is.
And then there's an entire scene between the two of them that was cut from the final draft.
Which never. Should have been. DELETED.
Take this for instance:
You see all of those people? You see all of that massive set up??
NONE OF THAT WAS LOKI.
Everything that you see in the planning throughout the rest of the Avengers movie that seemed to be Loki was all Clint Barton outsmarting and outwitting S.H.I.E.L.D. He was the one who even came up with the plan for Loki to purposely get himself captured!!
Now let's talk about this scene here:
"I want to know everything you can tell me about this team of his. I would...test their' mettle."
Like...HELLO??? This tells us right here that Clint was the one who gave up all the information and told Loki everything about all of the Avengers! We can glean from the fact that we saw Clint in the first Thor movie (with Coulson) that he has been fully aware of the Avengers way before anyone else knew about it.
He had the most information besides Coulson. Which means that Loki went into his "capture" already knowing all about Clint and Nat's relationship, which also allows us to deduce that he also knew that Natasha was playing him from the beginning! He knew she would figure it out, so he was stalling for time—and that was it!
Then we have this:
Clint: "If you're set on making yourself known...could be useful."
Loki: "Tell me what you need."
This is the dialogue that takes place here, and it explains so much. The way they originally cut the movie, it jumps from the scene with Selvig to the dialogue at the tail end of this deleted scene—which now, if you rewatch the movie, you will see is a glaringly obvious cut.
But this entire deleted scene sets up the rest. of the freaking. MOVIE.
This deleted scene shows us that Hawkeye was the mastermind behind not only taking down the helicarrier with only a few arrows, but also the one who planned the entire attack...just to get Loki back out after he triggered the Hulk.
Fury (over comms): "It's Barton. He took out our systems. He's headed for the detention level!"
ALL. CLINT'S. PLAN.
I am of the mind why they cut this scene was solely to put the blame on Loki, because if they had kept this scene in it would have become painfully obvious that Loki wouldn't have made it as far on his own and only made it so far because of Clint.
Canonically, a year has passed since our young, heartbroken Loki fell from Asgard; during this time, his family believed him dead, which means that wherever he went, he either shielded himself from the eyes of Heimdall (we know that he is capable of that, and we could also believe that he was ashamed enough that he would hide from his family); or, alternatively, he accidentally stumbled upon Thanos's forces that were already in hiding in The Sanctuary.
For the record, I am quite bitter about how we didn't get to learn what happened to him exactly throughout that year, not even from the series that was written about him.
Did he accidentally fall into darkness and danger, and started climbing up the hierarchy with tricks, so he could finally break free?
Or did he, the edgy dark prince deliberately search for the forces of Thanos so he could piss off his family once more? He is exactly petty like that (tho I find this version less believable, based on the first Thor movie; I think Loki is a lot more clever than trying genocide ONCE AGAIN to get his family's attention after how his first attempt has failed. But who knows?)
We won't ever know the answer! Tho there are a few things that are clear:
1. Loki was tortured. He was in an awful physical condition. His back hurt – which is terrifying, considering that he is a god, and even when the Hulk smashed him into the ground, he could stand up and walk just fine within an hour -, and I love the theory that he is showing the symptoms of heat exhaustion.
2. He was terrified. He was threatened by The Other with further torture to do his job perfectly. He masked with cruelty and arrogance, but it was shown, several times, that he felt awful, or even afraid.
3. He was canonically under mind control; and we couldn't learn everything about how that works, but we do know that under the spell of the spear, the person kept their own personality traits and also, they were perfectly aware of what they were doing; they just *wanted* to do what their masters told them to.
So in brief, he arrives on the Earth. He kills without a second thought. He is planning to conquer a whole planet, and he is willing to kill civilians over it. He is also dramatic, and as loud as he can just be. He is a great contrast to how we got to know him in the first movie. He is still a clever little bitch, always a step ahead of everyone else and pretty smug about it, but he is a lot more desperate. More angry than hurt.
But I like to think that wether he met his allies by an unfortunate accident or by a choice, he really wasn't up to their game anymore. If Loki didn't want to be dragged into Asgard in chains, he wouldn't have been. He is the greatest sorcerer in Asgard! He could have get away easily.
So I believe that he failed on purpose, and the failure had to be believable so noone would run to recruit him. Therefore, I really like to think that he planned out his 'failure' in a way he could make sure he would get into a safer place. What if he heard that Thanos was searching for the Tesseract, which was on the Earth, and therefore Loki convinced them to be the one sent down to steal it? In exchange of an army against the Earth to "conquer it"? Who wouldn't have believed him, the prince without a throne, that he wanted to rule and would do anything for that? And he not only ensured that his allies' suspicion towards him would lower, but also that he would meet Thor. Because Thor *had* to come to save his precious Midgard with his precious mortal. Odin would send him against Loki's army to be self-rightous about violence. And that's how Loki planned to escape the torture.
The only thing I doubt that would be true is that Loki would really want a throne, he'd really want to conquer and rule. He keeps telling us he doesn't want it; he never ever mentions craving power for doing justice, or changing the world to his liking. He only keeps repeating that he is a prince, his birthright is to be a king, and he deserves it. And I think that's the only way he gets to say that he wants to belong somewhere, he wants to live and he wants to be worthy and he wants to be finally equal to Thor, by holding onto his title. He is "the prince of Asgard and the rightful king of Jötunheim." That must mean he has a purpose. A future. He is a whole person outside of being Thor's little brother. His life has changed and he is terrified that he no longer belongs anywhere, so he only has his title left and he is clinging onto it with arrogance never seen before.
That being said, there are several bits of dialouge in the movie that are worthy of pondering about a bit. Firstly, I want to state that I believe that Loki mostly says exactly what he means. He likes to speak in a way that you'd want to find further meaning to it, and also, he often sounds sarcastic; these modify the impression of his speech, but don't modify the meaning. I think this is a defense mechanism that was developed because people in his close environment wasn't good at hearing him out; so he just lets them assume whatever they want from his words. Less work for him, so the focus can be shifted elsewhere. Loki's strange, because he mostly lies with his actions, not his words.
Our first example will be the following, the single most iconic line of his (for a reason):
Fury: "This doesn't have to get any messier."
Loki: "Of course it does. I've come too far for anything else. I am Loki of Asgard, and I am burdened with glorious purpose."
This dialogue beautifully sums up his character in the whole lenght of this movie. It always gave me chills, of course partly because of the amazing delivery by the actors, but partly because it has made me feel like there's a lot going on in Loki's mind at this moment. "I need it to get messy if I've come this far", he says. Obviously, he literally has come far, as he used the Tesseract for travelling, which is a cool detail. The metaphor is clear as well, as he has got so far from his old life, from Asgard, from his family, from his old self. He has also endured god knows how much torture. I could interject here my own theory again: He endured it all, and now he's got here and the exact point is to make things even "messier." Is it because of the obvious reference to his plan of leading an army against the Earth, causing violence and destruction? Or does he rather mean to draw the attention of Asgard and Thor on himself via the chaos he creates, and escape Thanos's forces this way? (We will never know.)
And the legendary glorious purpose part! He is burdened with it, he always has been, since Odin took him in with the intention of using him as a tool for democracy. Loki is burdened with this purpose, with his family, his royalty, his ancestors, and he never really had a free choice in his life. He got to The Sanctuary just to be used as another tool and serve another genocidal leader.
"Freedom is life's great lie. Once you accept that, in your heart...you will know peace" – Loki said, and I believe he meant it. He has nowhere to run, no way to start a new life and find his own freedom. The most tragical part of Loki's story is that even when he finally rebeled, when he got angry and tried to break out, he really just continued being the pawn he always has been. When he went against the will of Asgard and attacked the Earth, he did what was already written for him. He inherited the genocide, the rivalry, the fate of a monster and a king, and eventually, this all lead him back to Asgard, where everything started.
The only way he could have broken free would have been if he layed low, stayed put and tried to heal. And that would have been impossible with all the millenia-long pent up anger and despair he held, and without any positive examples or loved ones to support him. Loki tried to break free, but even that decision was shaped and controlled by the will of Odin; it was, somehow, the exact path that had been carved out for him since the asgardian royal family took him in. Loki fulfilled the prejudice of him being a monster when he could no longer pretend to be the lesser brother.
"The bright lure of freedom diminishes your life's joy in a mad scramble for power. For identity." He says in Stuttgart to the crowd. Other than it sounding like imperialist (and xenophobe??) crap, trying to insult the whole human population on Earth, it's also the same kind of projection of emotions Loki uses every time. Loki wanted to break free, and for freedom he needed power, and he needed to finally be himself (spoiler: he is not succeeding yet). And while fighting for these two things, he had lost everything that he valued in his life and brought him joy. He sees this as inevitable – one either stays controlled by someone else, or destroys their life while trying to break free. It's a bit strange how he views himself so much above humans (and different lifeforms as well), but he equals his own suffering to theirs. He arbitrarily hurts and kills people he understands or even empathizes with. Is it because he is terrified and desparate? Or because he views it as his right (and even duty) as a king? Or was he simply a soldier too long, carrying responsibility and guilt, that some more suffering and death doesn't seem to count anymore? Either way, his actions, words and thoughts are all contradictory. I like to think that even he doesn't understand everything he does and says.
Then there's the whole reunition with Thor. The fact that Loki looks genuienly afraid when he recognizes Thor's thunder, and Thor takes him forcefully and then let him fall on top of that rock. The way he shows no concern when Loki can't get up easily, asks no questions about the well being of his brother he thought dead. Thor is chosing blissful ignorance and blames his brother for everything, just so he could avoid thinking about what happened to Loki. The worst of all is that Thor is concerned and does want to get his brother back, but with this kind of ignorance, his wishes become self-centered, and Loki feels more attacked by his attention than loved. And Loki leans away from every touch and you can see the disbelief in his eyes when Thor asks him to come home with him. Such a nice dream, such an ignorant and naive thing from Thor to say that it makes Loki laugh.
Thor: "I thought you dead."
Loki: "Did you mourn?
It sounds mocking and was intended to be hurtful, but it's still a good point. Did anyone really miss Loki, or were they better off without him? Because the way Thor acts now doesn't seem like anything has changed with his mourning. Loki certainly doesn't hsve time to process all of this.
Loki: "I remember you tossing me into an abyss! I, who was, and should be, king!"
Thor: "So you take the world I love as a recompense for your imagined slights?"
We all know that Loki wasn't tossed into the abyss; Thor knows it as well [and it makes him look comically flabbergasted]. Did Loki get caught up in his anger a bit too much? Is it the influence of the Sceptre? I have no idea, I just wanted to include this cool detail.
Loki: "This is a child at prayer! Pathetic! You lie and kill in the service of liars and killers. You pretend to be separate, to have your own code, something that makes up for the horrors. But they are part of you. And they will never go away."
These lines are exceptional, because it was very obvious that Loki wasn't only talking about Natasha, he was also talking about himself. His reflection shows in the glass, and he speaks more passionately than anywhere else in this movie. First of all, this means that Loki does despise (morally!) both Odin's and Thanos's forces for the violence they have comitted. Loki also knows well enough that he is guilty, and there is no absolution for him. He understands that even though he may had different reasons behind his actions, even though he justifies his own decisions, he is guilty, and it's horrifying how well he knows that it can break a person; that's why he says this to Natasha.
But also it's awfully interesting how his mind works here! It's mostly not empathy he uses to figure out Natasha's feelings; it's analysis and projecting. It's a perfect example for what we witness him doing from movie to movie. Here, he studies Natasha and her past, he asks her questions to test the waters, and after analyzing the situation, he finds a similar feeling in himself, and then he projects it onto the other person. This approach both allows him to make precise calculations [for the purpose of trickery], and it is also a pitfall that leads him into failure, for example in the next moment when it turns out that Natasha learns about his plan. Loki miscalculated, because his starting point was that Natasha must had been feeling what he did; he assumed that Natasha was as sensitive as he was. But what could have broken Loki did barely hurt her; it was a misstep, a tipically Loki-like one to take.
Thor: "Look at this! Look around you! You think this madness will end with your rule?"
Loki: "It's too late. It's too late to stop it."
Thor: "No. We can, together."
Loki: "Sentiment…"
I also really like this part around the end, because even if Loki tricks Thor and stabs him ruthlessly (which gets kinda hilarious when we later learn that's a brother-thing between these two), Loki still hasn't said anything untrue. He is not lying with words, he just puts on an act, and that's how he is always so convincing. Plus I really like the line "it's too late to stop it". Was there even a point where this all should have been stopped, since the happenings of the Thor(2011) movie? Did Loki even plan to come this far with the Chitauri? Or did he actually believe that it's possible for him to conquer the Earth and become its ruler?
I am still not sure about the eye colour changing thing, I've seen a bunch of evidence and read counter arguments. But what's sure is that Loki is crying in this scene. ("Sentiment" he says mockingly, but is it his or Thor's? And is he crying because of helplessness, or anger?) When Erik Selvig was under mind control, he wanted to build the bridge with the Tesseract. There was his own scientific curiousity and his whole personality to back him up, but what he craved to do was being controlled by Loki. Here, the brothers were fighting and Loki has gotten some punches with Thor's power. Did the blunt head trauma distract the mind control for a second? If it did, was stabbing Thor Loki's decision made fully by his own will? I like to imagine yes, and I also like to imagine that getting beaten by the Hulk was the thing that permanently liberated Loki from mind control.
I will ask, one last time, that could it really be a mistake, a failure, that Loki was stopped so quickly and brought back to Asgard? I don't want to talk down on what the Avengers had achieved, but The Chitauri only destroyed a small bit of New York. The number of deaths could probably be compared to what Thor caused on a regular basis when the two brothers were warriors together. Also, Loki didn't try to escape for a long time, staying in the Stark tower while the heroes were fighting – maybe he was simply overconfident, craving the celebration and flowers that Stark mentioned, but it still wasn't very "casting illusions and manipulating from the shadows" of Loki. It's not a behaviour he'd shown anywhere else. The grandiose wish for people to celebrate him, yes ("Your saviour is here!"), but not the reckless display of dominance and power that could make him a perfect target. Even when he killed Laufey with his own hands, that was a part of a big, complicated scheme. After being defeated, Loki seemed more annoyed than bitter, especially as we see him in Endgame. I feel like he was exactly where he wanted to be, and he just looked satisfied with the destruction and chaos he caused. See, some kids punch walls, and some ally with dark forces to conquer a planet. I would have loved to see movie!Loki outside of this era of his life, dealing with such emotions as anger, because I bet he wasn't very good at that.
Jokes aside, the Avengers movie, where we see Loki in his most violent, mad and self-righteous state rises many questions. What has Loki gone through in the last year? How much free will he had, and what were his real plans? What are all the thoughts behind his words, what's just a jab and what's a real analysis from him? I think I could continue with my theories, and I could probably stop at every single bit of dialogue to overthink it, but for the purpose of analysing the movie and Loki's decisions in it overall, I am finished for now. My point is that we know hardly enough about Loki in this era, and even though he is not lying with words, he is rather unreliable when it comes to displaying his own thoughts and motivations. *Probably this kind of mysteriousness and power play is what makes 2012's Loki so hot. Anyways, I am somehow glad for the opportunity for headcanons and the plotholes for fanfictions to fill.*
Sometimes when I read certain fandom discussions I wanna remind everyone that:
Clint Barton kills people for a living. Maybe Natasha doesn't (because it's unclear, maybe she was more of a bodyguard/looking for secret information kind of an agent, at least from what was stated in CA:TWS)(we do know that she also would kill if it was required tho)), but he ABSOLUTELY does, he is always equipped with a bow or a sword, and is not shown to have any exceptional spy skills, unlike Natasha, what do you think S.H.I.E.L.D keeps him for? He also decided to kill people for five years straight after the loss of his family.
Thor ENJOYS killing his enemies and is VERY proud of his kill count. Throughout the entire MCU.
Wanda Maximoff has been involved in different forms of mind control/mind manipulation AND mass murder in AoU and WV, even prior to her "villain" arc in MoM (I'm not even talking about her VOLUNTEERING to work on H.Y.D.R.A tho).
So every time I hear that Loki is a villain who needs to redeem himself over and over again or when I hear things like "MCU Zemo is such an unforgivable villain" (If you said it about the comic book version, I would totally agree, just to clarify it here), or something about how far gone Hela is I'm usually looking at certain avengers and asking myself what exactly separates Thor from Hela, Zemo from Wanda or Clint, or Loki from, for example, Natasha.
Because I'm not sure the avengers have ever had moral ground to stand on, outside of some exceptions like Steve&Sam&Bruce.
Loki doesn't want the throne it is mentioned 2 times in the movies that he only wants to be an equal. The throne isn't something he nesaseraly wants. it's more what the throne represents: respect, unconditional love, and means he is worth something
We can't take everything loki says in averagers seriesly it's confirmed by Tom that he was under the mind stones affects and tortured by Thanos but you know when he's not under a spell when he's bearing his heart to thor in the first movie he's hurting and in pain and bearing what he genuinely wants and he might have said it again in another movie
He confessed in the show aswell-do you want the throne- no but I was born to be - and when he had sylvie witch (WHY GOD NO EW) he straight up admits to her he wants her safe over a throne he wanted an equal that is all he wants
He doesn't want the throne but he was raised for it it's all he knows how to want if he can't have an equal the next best thing is a throne to be king means your important people respect you something he didn't have he wanted the throne to prove people wrong that he is worthy that he is worth something to his father that he is loved
1050yrs of wanting to prove he is worthy of his father that he is just as good as thor of being in another's shadow of being treated as different as an outcast with the only true unconditional love and understanding from his mother
He doesn't want a throne he wants to be worth something to be someone's equal
How many times must it be thrown in your face how many times must he say it and have the show and movies literally throw it at you for yall to get it
I'm becoming increasingly disappointed with my generation and media literacy
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Genderfluid. This is canon, and anyone who disagrees is a homophobe in my book.
He's bisexual. Also, canon.
Loki prefers knives specifically because as a kid, it was fun to hide them up his sleeve.
I think after Loki fell in the void, he actually spent more than a year with Thanos. He says in the Avengers that time worked differently in the void.
Speaking of Thanos, it's pretty accepted within the fandom that Loki was tortured and mind controlled, but I also think that his memory, specially was also altered. In the Avengers, after he's confronted by Thor, he tells him that he remembers 'living in the shade of your (Thor's) greatness' and he says that Thor pushes him off the bridge, when he actually jumped.
I think back in Asgard, everyone relates Loki to a snake because he used to transform into one so often, since Thor likes them.
Frigga taught him how to fight, and you could clearly see that his fighting style is much more different than Thor or the warriors three.
A lot of people like to headcanon that Sif and the warriors three used to bully Loki, but I think it was more subtle than that. I think they probably excluded him or at least tried to make him feel excluded. I don't agree that they outright said anything to him- and definitely not in front of Thor. That's still his younger brother, and that's still the prince.
He has a huge aversion to heat, since he's a Frost Giant.
Both him and Thor loved to study languages when they were children
Gets offended when people refer to his female form as 'Lady Loki'. He's always Loki, guys.
Inherited his love for mischief from Frigga, who is just as worse, but a lot more quiet about it.
Is very, very picky about his habits. The bed has to be warm. The desk has to be clear by the end of the night. He has to take a bath before going to sleep. He's autistic like that.
Owns patterned socks.
Loves sweets- especially chocolates.
He knew that Thanos would either kill him or Thor and chose to sacrifice himself in Infinity War.
Discovers black nail polish on Earth and wears it forever.
He'd love books- but specifically books about very, very niche topics
Is responsible for most of the unexplained crazy things that happened on Earth. DB Cooper? He lost a bet. Rasputin? Yeah, Thor dared him to drug a random priest, and now the Romanovs are dead. Oops. The Ten Plagues of Egypt? He was...what's the word? Bored.
Loves musicals and the theatre in general.
Writes occasionally.
He has a favorite dagger, but no one knows which one it is.
He's very extroverted when he's drunk
His favorite memories are in Asgard, at the feasts when people would sing or dance.
When he was first learning magic, his favorite guinea pig was Thor. literally. He'd turn Thor into a guinea pig.
Notes-
Hiiiii
Can you tell he's my wife? Cause he's my wife.
Alright, let's get into it! I didn't think this would go on as long as it did, but apparently, I have thoughts about the matter. Shocking, I know.
1. I have a lot of feelings about Loki and Thanos, and a large part of it is inspired by a fic titled 'The kindness of strangers', on ao3. Feel free to check that out.
2. I think Tom Hiddleston and Rene Russo (the actress who plays Frigga) have also decided that Loki fights like Frigga, so it's almost canon
3. Thor has Allspeak in the comics, and he also knows how to 'speak Groot' so I assume that Loki also has that knowledge.
4. Someone pointed out that in Ragnarök, Loki is wearing patterned socks when they come down to Earth, and that is... really in character, for some reason.
5. In the Loki TV show, Loki says that they don't have candy on Asgard, just nuts and grapes, so it would make sense that he's addicted to chocolates.
6. Also, in the TV show, he gets drunk on the train and immediately starts to entertain everyone by singing and dancing and I imagine that something like that would happen often on Asgard, in victorious feasts, or just in general.
Well, that's all! Everything seems to be kicking my ass lately, but we persevere. As always, I hope you enjoyed and thank you for reading.
With Love,
Ophelia.
“The Tesseract or your brother’s head. I assume you have a preference?”
Have….have we ever considered the fact how utterly disturbing it is that Thanos a) waves Thor in front of Loki because he knows that Loki would kill the universe to save him, and B) HE RECOGNIZED THOR AS LOKI’S BROTHER ON THE SPOT?
I don’t think that Thanos, Thor, and Loki had a little sit down before the battle started and talked about familial relationships.
This line, usually thought of in passing, means these things:
Thanos knows how important Thor is to Loki, which means Thanos and Loki have talked about this beforehand.
Thanos knows what Thor looks like which means Thanos has seen Thor from Loki’s head before
Thanos knows that Loki has the Tesseract. He could have chosen ANY PERSON on the ship to convince Loki to give up the Tesseract, but instead, he picked Thor out of the group and CHOSE to use Thor against Loki on PURPOSE.
Thanos didn’t demand the Tesseract from Loki first, he WANTED to play with him and he WANTED to torture Loki and he WANTED to see Loki mouth “please” and he WANTED to see Loki’s desperation and he WANTED to see Loki break again, and he WANTED Loki to think Thor getting tortured was his fault, not Thanos’
Thanos knows Loki on an intimate level that we do not fully understand.
Thanos probably knows Loki better than his family does
And Thanos, more than likely, killed him in the way that he knew Loki was terrified of
Something about the fact that Thanos had no idea loki wasn’t asgardian but immediately recognised Thor as his brother & knew he was the best way to manipulate him. Like… how does their working relationship even get to that point?
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