#rammstein lore

Hi!

Emil's mom's name is Yvonne Reinke, and Yvonne and Paul weren't married, so Emil has his mom's last name.

Similar to Till's (except the first) and Richard's: their kids also have their mom's last name (where Richard's oldest is a special case as her mom was married Till and changed her last name to his, then kept the name after they divorced and later got together with Richard)

(older ask, only now got to it, sorry anon 🌺)

Big part of 'Rammstein lore' is what happened at recording their 3rd album 'Mutter' and the fall-out of it which lasted for years afterwards.

Everything was difficult for the coorperation in the band at the time, even the videoshoot of the video to the single Mutter was not done the way the six-men democracy wanted, and as Schneider mentions in this 'making of' (that was shot afterwards, like the making of's to all the older Rammstein videos), he sometimes doesn't even like hearing the song anymore

The interviews at the release of Mutter don't even show it that much, but especially in later years several bandmembers have commented on it, this is only one example. It seems that in the end everyone agree that Richard's obsessive (and partly cocaine fueled) obsession with his own importance trying to take over the band was very difficult to handle, and in years after the others fought back to have their fair share of creative input again, at some occassions even dismising Richard's input by default.

During Rammstein Mutter era (and fall-out) there were many interviews with the bandmembers, and the Rammstein in Amerika documentary also looks back on that era. Newer fans who find these 20-25 year old interviews now for the first time, may think this is the way Rammstein is, but the last 5, maybe even 6 or 7, years have shown a new Rammstein chemistry on stage and behind the scenes, more relaxed and open to eachother's input, the way they had intended it 30 years ago when they started.

Unfortunately nowadays the bandmates don't give many interviews anymore (and the attitude towards the band by german media has not helped either), so we have far less insight in how their relationship is now... but if what we see on stage in recent years is anything to rely on, i think we can hope that the fall out from the Mutter era is finally in the past.

I'm on a dive in GDR music past again, and stumbled on this one

Did anyone ever see this one? Feeling B and Paul are mentioned in the cast as well, although i assume only in a small part.

Bookquote from 'Wir wollen immer Artig sein..' (published 2013, by Ronald Galenza and Heinz Havemeister), page 676-677, first two photos are from the book.

An undeniable part of the past GDR music scene is the fact that some people in the scene were unofficial informers (IM) for the GDR Stasi (Staatssicherheit, GDR state security). Two who very much surprised their bandmates and others, because of their very outspoken anarchist music with 'Die Firma' were Tatjana Besson and Frank 'Trötsch' Tröger.

IIn the book 'Wir wollen immer Artig sein..' André Greiner Pol from the band Freygang has a notable nuanced take on the situation, which i thought was interesting. André had known Tatjana since 1979, she was manager of Freygang for a while, and later, after 'Die Wende' happened and 'Die Firma' ceased to exist, Tatjana joined Freygang. André had his own encounters with the Stasi as well, of which he talked in his own book 'Peitsche Osten Liebe'

(Original text, english translation below)

Wie gehst du mit der Stasi-Geschichte von der Firma um?

André: Das war so: Tatjana und Trötsch hatten sich geoutet. Die hatten das irgendwann rausgehauen nd waren zum Musikmagazin 'Messitsch' gegangen und ließen das dann drucken. Ich wußte nichts. Ich bin aber so wie immer an die Sachen frank und frei rangegangen, solange mir keinener auf den Sack fing und mich bedrängte. Was sollte ich machen, sollte ich mit jedem Typen, mit dem ich Musik mache, vorher ein Kadergespräch führen? Genau das hasse ich doch, so ein Kadergespräch, deswegen mache ich sowas nicht.

Hattest du aber instinktiv nichts bemerkt?

André: Ich hatte mit Trötsch später gesprochen. Der erzählte mir die Story, wie es war. Er wollte nicht arbeiten gehen, wollte Musik machrn, und dann hatten sie ihn Ende der Siebziger wegen 'Assi' eingeknastet. Acht Monate bekam er. Er war in Rummelsburg und die Herren kamen und sagten, du kommst raus, wenn du mitmachst. So hatte mir Trötsch das plausibel erklärt. Er wollte im Knast nicht von irgendwelchen Berufsverbrechern in den Arsch gefickt werden. So entschied er sich für das kleinere Übel.

Er hätte doch spätestens in der Mitte der achtziger Jahre aussteigen können?

André: Sie hatten ihn, so denke ich mir, immer unter Spannung gehalten. Er sagte mir, daß er auch viel machen konnte, daß er über die Leute, die er anscheißen sollte, zum Teil falsche oder verharmloste Sachen erzählte. Kann ja durchaus möglich sein.

Wart ihr nicht enttäuscht? Wenn man bedenkt, ihr hattet über Jahre zusammen Musik gemacht und du hattest der Firma Auftrittsmöglichkeiten besorgt. Da entstand doch persönliche Nähe.

André: Jeder reagierte verschieden. Ich versuchte sofort eine Analyse. Ich stellte mir die Frage, warum kommt gerade jetzt in dieser Szene was hoch? Ich versuchte, Tatjana und Trötsch vor dem Mob zu beschützen. Ich habe überhaupt kein Problem, daß die das gemacht haben. Ich versuchte sie zu beschützen, nicht weil ich das gut fand, was die gemacht hatten, sondern weil sie deswegen fertiggemacht werden sollten. Das wollte ich nicht. Ich weiß, Tatjana war mit vierzehn in der Schule eine richtige rote Socke *1). Das kam durch ihren Vater, der war Oberstleutnant bei der Staatssicherheit. Er war also ein ziemlich hohes Tier und Chef vom BFC (Berliner Fußball Club) Dynamo. Mit vierzehn Jahrsn war sie FDJ *2)-Sekretärin und Klassenbeste. Da kamen die Kollegen von ihrem Vater und sagten ihr, du bist Kader. Als ich sie 1979 kennenlernte, war sie eine richtig rote Käthe *3). Sie ist mit vierzehn reingerutscht, was willst du da machen. Sie ist jahrelang damit rundgelaufen. Du bekommst den Auftrag von denen, daß du nichts sagen darfst. Mensch, ich war bei der Army, da gab's doch auch solche Politoffiziere.

Überwiegen also die persönlichen gemeinsamen Erlebnisse?

André: Ich kann's vielleicht so übersetzen: Daß ich stolz darauf war, daß die persönlichen Erlebnisse mit Tatjana und Trötsch stärker waren als die Stasi. Tatjana war in einer Scheißlage, weil sie das vom Typ her am Anfang vielleicht geil fand, weil sie überzeugt war. Trötsch hatte es gemacht, weil er aus dem Knast rauswollte, um einfach Musik zu machen. Er wollte auch kein Arbeitsplatzbindung und so einen Scheißdreck, wo sie ihn ständig überprüfen.

How do you deal with the company's Stasi story?

André: It was like this: Tatjana and Trötsch had come out. They put it out at some point and went to the music magazine 'Messitsch' and had it printed. I didn't know anything. But as always, I approached things openly and freely, as long as no one got in my way and harassed me. What should I do, should I have a team discussion with every guy I play music with beforehand? That's exactly what I hate, a discussion like that, that's why I don't do something like that.

But didn't you instinctively notice anything?

André: I spoke to Trötsch later. He told me the story as it was. He didn't want to go to work, he wanted to make music, and then they put him in prison for 'Antisocial' in the late '70s. He got eight months. He was in Rummelsburg and the men came and said you'll get out if you join in. This is how Trötsch explained it to me in a plausible way. He didn't want to get fucked in the ass by some career criminals in prison. So he decided on the lesser evil.

Surely he could have at least left in the mid-1980s?

André: I think they always kept him under pressure. He told me that he could also do a lot, that he sometimes said false or trivialized things about the people he was supposed to be shitting on. It could certainly be possible.

Weren't you disappointed? Considering you had been making music together for years and you had gotten 'Die Firma' gigs. You were close personally.

André: Everyone reacted differently. I immediately tried an analysis. I asked myself the question, why is something coming up right now in this scene? I tried to protect Tatjana and Trötsch from the mob. I don't have a problem at all with them doing that. I tried to protect them, not because I liked what they did, but because they were going to be trashed for it. I didn't want that. I know Tatjana was a real red sock *1) at school when she was fourteen. This came from her father, who was a lieutenant colonel in the state security department. So he was a pretty big shot and the boss of the BFC (Berlin Football Club) Dynamo. At the age of fourteen she was FDJ *2) secretary and top of her class. Then her father's colleagues came and told her, you're on the team. When I met her in 1979, she was a real red Kathy *3). She slid in at fourteen, what are you going to do? She walked around with it for years. They tell you not to say anything. Man, I was in the army and there were political officers like that too.

So the shared personal experiences outweigh things?

André: I can perhaps say it like this: that I was proud that the personal experiences with Tatjana and Trötsch were stronger than the Stasi. Tatjana was in a shitty situation because characterwise she might have thought it cool at the beginning, because she was convinced. Trötsch did it because he wanted to get out of prison and simply make music. He also didn't want to be tied to a job and all that bullshit where they're constantly checking up on him.

--

*1) Rote Socke = in this context slang for a very left wing (politically) inclined person

*2) FDJ = 'Freie Deutsche Jugend' the official youth wing of the GDR and the socialist party there

*3) Rote Käthe = again implying a very socialistic woman, originally sobriquet of Katharina Rentmeister

--

😄

Not sure what month Lilly was born but it could've been that, or she came early if it was "medical emergency" + 9/11 tension and fear + internal drama. At the end, it was too much of everything.

This is just another example of their strong characters and fierce loyalty both to work and each other. They've had really bad issues, crazy schedule, just overload of everything during Mutter era, but somehow they've acknowledged that what they have, what they create, has value and as hard as it may be, it's worth it.

Older ask about that time that Paul missed a few shows (and being replaced by Daron Malakian) due to a 'family emergency', and yes i agree that a combination of thinga and very possibly Lily being born might be the reason.

Well, i looked it up 😊 and i'm going with Rammwiki on this

"The band heard about the Metrobeat competition, to which a tape of demos had to be sent in. They recorded four songs, one of them being an early and English version of Weißes Fleisch, called White Flesh back then,[5] and sent in the tape under the name Tempelprayers.[6] They ended up performing four songs at the contest festival and immediately won the competition. The prize was a week in a professional recording studio."

The note [5] refers to Flake's book 'Heute hat die Welt Geburtstag' page 193, where Flake mentions the songs that existed before he joined the band (which was after the contest):

"Vier Lieder gab es schon, bevor ich in die Band kam. Das waren 'Rammstein', 'Der Seemann' und 'Weißes Fleisch', das damals noch auf English war, und 'White Flesh' hieß, wobei ich 'White Flash' verstand und dachte, es würde um den Atomschlag gehen. Dann gab es noch den 'Tiefer Gelegten', ein Lied, das so hieß, weil die Gitarristen für dieses Lied ihre tiefe E-Saite auf D gestimmt hatten, und somit einen Ton tiefer spielten, als es normalerweise mit den Gitarren möglich war."

translated

"There were four songs before I joined the band. They were 'Rammstein', 'Der Seemann' and 'Weißes Fleisch', which was still in English at the time and was called 'White Flesh', which i understood as 'White Flash' and thought it was about a nuclear blast. Then there was 'Tiefer Gelegenten', a song that was called that way because the guitarists for this song tuned their low E string to D and thus played a tone lower, than was normally possible with the guitars."

and more from Rammwiki on the demo with those four songs, which was recorded somewhere between the end of 1993 and february 1994

"It is unknown if they also actually performed at the Metrobeat Contest, but it's possible that they sent in the demo tape, which resulted in them winning a chance to play there, as well as winning them a recording session in a studio at the same time."