#nonbinary discrimination

reminder that i-suggest-transfeminism isn’t a safe person

becsusd. a lot of this just straight up isnt true. “they reclaimed it as a badge of honor and so i can use this slur against tuem. and actually the people calling them theyfabs are morally righteous because the theyfabs tmes are pretending to be oppressed which needs correction. aka itsbyour fault that people are calling you a theyfab, stupid theyfab”

smh its too early for ts

(Link to the post for your blocklist needs)

Actually though what. What the fuck. How is acknowledging transmascs face discrimination and oppression "harming all transmasc, transfem, and cis people around you." (Way to exclude nonbinary people, by the way.) Genuinely to include CIS PEOPLE in "people harmed by transmascs speaking out about their oppression" is some DISGUSTING victim blaming DARVO type shit.

"you are a blight on feminism" ah, hah.. and. The people insisting perisex afab transmascs don't experience misogyny (despite being born women and absolutely experiencing misogyny during the part of their lives where they have lived as women) aren't harmful to feminism? Insisting that someone's oppression under patriarchy can be invalidated and 'didn't happen' or 'doesn't count' the second they switch to he/him pronouns.. that's not harmful to feminism? really? The people completely ignoring intersex people in these conversations, who often invalidate transmascs AND afab transfems (especially intersex, though not exclusively), showing a clear bias towards people born/treated as women.. Those people aren't harmful to feminsm? Got it. Clearly the hypocrisy went WAYYY over your head.

"your words are much akin to that of a white high schooler boy complaining about how men are so mistreated and undervalued by women. many of your talking points overlap with those of rightwing beliefs, those who would have you dead. stop playing the oppression olympics, nobody is playing with you."

Oh, really? We're gonna talk about whose talking points are more comparable to right-wing beliefs, huh? Because.. A lot of this rhetoric about "transandrobros" is NEAR-IDENTICAL to the rhetoric TERFs spread. People like you say the EXACT SAME THINGS TERFs say about us. You believe all trans men are inherently evil and should leave or die, ah, hm, I wonder, is the right-wing, perhaps, also trying to frame certain minorities of the population as inherently evil and deserving of death and/or banishment? wow i wonder. I wonder if you guys have that in common perhaps. It's not like the people calling anyone they disagree with "hitlerites" and saying shit like "bomb that kills all of (insert minority here)" might have something in common with facists. Nah. It's the people telling you to stop saying "bomb that kills-" type shit that are the REAL facists, huh?

Also fucking hilarious "'stop playing oppression olympics, nobody is playing with you" when it's. Literally the people talking down to trans men like this that ARE playing oppression olympics by literally invalidating transmasc people's oppression and using transfems as their major example of people who "'are more oppressed/have it the worst/you have privilege over, etc." I think it's clear who's REALLY playing oppression olympics here.

(Link to their account for your blocklist needs)

Actually though that's what this fucking is. "I didn't experience this so the people who say they did must be saying it for attention or they just hate women."

Like, I dunno. I can't speak to transfems' experience, but at least for me, and I know for many other trans people, a lot of us don't relate to this narrative that we were "always (the gender we transitioned to.)" Before I fully realized and before I came out of the closet, I was basically just a very gender-non-comforming woman, and I don't want to erase that part of my life where I lived as a woman. Being a gender-non-conforming woman, I did experience discrimination. I will always remember the weird looks I got for being a woman with short hair, especially during the times I shaved my head. I will always remember how people saw me differently.

And, like most women, I will always remember the times I've had to deal with creeps and predators. The times I've had to be a bit paranoid and make sure I wasn't being followed or stared at by random men, the times when men I thought I could trust ended up wanting to be with me when I was a child and they were an adult.

I am not going to erase those experiences by saying I was always a man, because I wasn't. I did live as a woman for a time of my life, and while that time is over, I don't think that should invalidate what I've previously been through. I still don't pass. I still get referred to as "ma'am" most of the time I'm out in public. So even though I no longer see myself as a woman, unfortunately, society still does.

There are people who say they've "always known," and I don't want to invalidate that. I'm glad you were able to recognize and discover that part of yourself before I did, but that does not make either of us any less valid for how we talk about our experiences. I despise the fact that people like me are treated as invalid, lying for attention, or just "hating women/trans women" for the way we talk about our pre-transition selves. That's fucking weird and transphobic.

This one is less serious, but it proves to me that their previous post was not at all made in good faith.

I'm not kidding. I genuinely couldn't find any gender-neutral LGBTQ+ groups, they were ALL categorized by gender in this way and it really made me feel grossed out and unwelcome as someone on the nonbinary spectrum because like. Great. I'm either "man-lite" or "woman-lite" in this scenario. I have to choose between joining the "gay men's" community or the "gay women's community" instead of just. y'know, the fucking lgbt community as a whole? And before anyone says anything about "oh well maybe it's just dating-" no. No it isn't. I did not filter for dating groups only or any of that shit. I genuinely only saw gay men or gay women centered groups. Some of those included dating, yes, but the majority of them did not.

It's just. Genuinely frustrating. On so many levels. I really wish the LGBTQ community as a whole would stop treating nonbinary people as some "other" that can fit into whatever category- like? Does anyone else get that feeling? That it's not just, being inclusive to nonbinary people, but that the majority of the time it feels like "men, women, and if you're neither of those, whatever, you're welcome as long as you're close enough to the gender I prefer."

I saw this on my feed and. Yeah. Gross. Regardless of what their "theory" is it's disgusting to platform the idea that 1. certain trans people are predisposed to be predators, and 2. that certain sexualities are predisposed to be predators. BUT..

Considering they tag this with "transmasc.." It looks like this was a typo, and they meant which gender they identify as. So. Hooray.. more propoganda against transmascs, now insisting that because we're men, as one person in the comments said.. we're more likely to be sex offenders. Fucking disgusting stereotyping bigotry.

So I went to their profile and uh, this is what I was greeted with.

Because of them self-identifying as Ragebait I was inclined to just silently block and forget they exist, but considering my account has helped other people know who to block, I'm still making this post 1. to rant about this bullshit being platformed, ragebait or not, and 2. so people who wanna block the ragebaiting troll know who to block. And, again, because of that, I'm just gonna link their profile instead of any individual post.

(link to their account.)

This fucking cruel and unnecessary comment towards someone happy they realized they were trans, (but simply didn't use the word dysphoria, they never implied they didn't have dysphoria, they just said gender euphoria helped them realize.) UGHHHH I'm incoherent on this one because this is just. I don't wanna say harassment but this is literally attacking some random boy for identifying in a way you don't like. Yet another example of where transandrophobic rhetoric leads... Fucking awful.

This is yet another reason I didn't wanna brush it off as a troll and ignore this because, they are attacking random people for their trans identities, troll or not, it's hard to ignore when they're inserting themselves into other people's posts to spread their bigotry like this.

This one is also particularly disgusting. It benefits NO-ONE to regress and refer to our trans identities as a DISORDER. It's part of who we are. Would you classify women identifying as butch or tomboys as a disorder? Would you classify femboys/feminine men as being disordered? No! So why would you do it to trans people?

Regardless it's also just gross to pull the take far-right conservatives LOVE to pull with "you're not a man/woman just because you say you are." As if you're not "actually trans" or "trans enough" and don't deserve to be referred to with the right name and pronouns until you medically transition enough to pass or to be as close as possible to a cis person of the gender you identify as. THAT is fucking disgusting.

What's worse, using that childish mocking form of typing to acknowledge intersex people (as if they're also inherently ''transtrenders'' or as invalid as they consider nonbinary people to be.) It's so gross to say "are you intersex?" as if you don't believe intersex people are real until you meet one. Like, it's true some people use intersex people as a 'gotcha,' but I have a feeling they're not upset with that for the reasons they should be. They're not upset at intersex people being used, they're upset they 'got got' by the 'gotcha' intersex people were used for.

Which, like, 1. I feel like even being a binary trans person on HRT you should know that hormones can alter your genitals, which, under your definition of "third sex" i think makes it pretty obvious that there are different forms of genitals than perisex cis ones. 2. You're clearly very ignorant and uneducated on intersex people and their experiences, it's weird and gross to demand information about their genitals to "prove" a "third sex" exists (when sex can actually be pretty fluid in a similar way gender identities can be fluid, though this person clearly doesn't wanna acknowledge that with their "two genders" bullshit.)

But most importantly, being corrected on calling intersex people deformed (as if they are an illness or mutation that shouldn't exist) and your response is just "'rude but I'll change the wording" really shows how fucking heartless they are and how little they give a shit about how they affect other people. Which, no shit I guess but oh well.

So, these two posts is another reason I wanted to talk about this point of view because it is very strange.. I understand having frustrations with how the non-trans side of the queer community treats trans people. When trans people are easily sidelined or thrown under the bus politically, because we're seen as "harder to defend" than gay people. When cis people often ignore trans people and don't always listen to us when we're forced to argue why our identities are valid. Or even just.. other ways I've talked about more here. Lesbians in the community that are so obsessed with this "non-men loving non-men" thing that they completely disregard most trans people, trans women with penises as "not women enough," or transmasc people who still have vaginas as "not women enough" because they identify as masc and use he/him pronouns. It's frustrating, it really is.

But the solution is not to dissolve and separate ourselves from a community. The solution shouldn't be for us to separate ourselves, and therefore have less of a community to rely on in the first place, splitting ourselves up and just giving in to 'divide and conquer..' (And. Not to mention accusing the trans community of "letting in a bunch of predators" which is. very obvious why that's bigoted and gross.)

I just. I dunno, this one affected me a bit, because with all this "boys vs girls" shit people pull, attacking transmascs in the name of "defending transfems," I can get how this feels, y'know? It can be frustrating to feel like you don't have a community anymore because your community is so set on pitting people against each other that nobody stands in solidarity or unity anymore.. It does feel like the LGBTQ+ community as a whole is less connected than ever. It does feel like there's more infighting lately. Even IRL, the only LGBT group I know of that I could look into was full of toxic people.. Even when I lie about my micro-label specific identity and just call myself nonbinary I still get called a slur. It does hurt.

(Link to the post for your blocklist needs)

yeah gonna repost that one post I've talked about before because. yes people do literally compare transmascs to hitler. Also, it wouldn't be a problem if they truly were "calling out a small but very real and dangerous group of reactionary facist trans men" because guess what's included in that statement? A SMALL GROUP OF THESE SPECIFIC TRANS MEN. Y'know what these people always fucking say? "All trans men are like this." "This proves trans men are as bad as cis men/men are the evil bad gender." If they were criticizing a subsection of people who happen to be transmascs, that'd be fine. That's what I do when I criticize the small subsection of people who happen to be transfems pulling this "transmascs vs transfems" bullshit. The problem is, these people DO equate their actions to ALL trans men. And, again, I will repeat, the rhetoric these people spread about transmascs is VERY comparable and very close to the same things REAL TERFs and nazis say about transmascs.

Anyway moving on because it's very clear and easy to see how this post is stupid.

(Link to the post for your blocklist needs)

Once again it's the assholes talking about transmascs this way that use slurs like this. Okay. 1. Trans men are not suddenly "not real men" for still identifying as lesbians post-transition. Gender is complicated as fuck, and there are many people out there who have more than enough valid reasons to identify as lesbians despite being "just men" in your eyes. Transmascs who get minimal medical transitioning, (no bottom surgery and/or no top surgery) AKA.. still having the same bodies lesbians who date cis women would be attracted to, just going by he/him pronouns. And, y'know, genderfluid, multigender, and other gender identities that include being men AND other genders. I shouldn't need to go on, this argument has been done to death and if idiots like this don't get it by now they never will- 2. "you say trans men historically belong in women's spaces but that's only in porn actually" is DISGUSTINGLY ignorant. It ignores the very real history of transmasc people who have identified as lesbians likely before you were even fucking born. You're following the same logic as transphobes here, "i'm only hearing about it/seeing it accepted recently so it must be some new woke garbage." Not to mention it REALLY shows your true colors that you only think about transmascs in the context of porn. Makes me consider what your kinks must be since that's yet another example of you not viewing transmascs as people.

3. "you're either a butch with internalized homophobia or a binary man bragging about getting laid by women." JESUS FUCKING CHRIST. This IS transphobia. This IS falling under the "lost lesbians" narrative TERFs use against trans men. It's also disgusting to imply they're "butches with internalized homophobia" when?? your problem with them is that they identify as lesbians and not straight men??? You sound like the homophobic asshole here with a LOT of internalized shit. I could say more but it's easy to see why this is horribly bigoted so I'm gonna move on.

(Link to the post for your blocklist needs)

Again, INCREDIBLY ironic you accuse transmascs of being terfs while admitting you LITERALLY "accidentally" like posts by terfs because you clearly do have certain beliefs in common with them.

"if you're a lesbian and hate trans women you're a fake lesbian. you need to go to a mental hospital and you're delusional for wanting to date an afab trans person." JESUS. I can't. I can't repeat myself but that's my instinctual response, what a piece of shit! This is literally the SAME THING homophobes and transphobes say about us. That we're "delusional and belong in mental hospitals" for believing we are the gender we say we are. That we're gross and mentally ill for being attracted to the gender you'd prefer we didn't like.

I mean, seriously, this is fucking VILE. Yes, lesbians should not exclude trans women from their dating pool because they're trans, but guess what! that fucking includes trans men too. If you have a genital preference, you can be open about that without being transphobic. But to tell people they're "fake lesbians" for dating the gender you think they shouldn't.. is weird. You are literally policing and invalidating other queer people's identities because you think it's "not queer enough" or "too close to being straight." I just find this argument so weird too because like???

Okay so. 1. "trans top propoganda killing trans bottoms" doesn't even imply only trans men. So way to imply that if you're trans you have to be a bottom. 2. "st4t where the guy is the top + a man without a penis is worth nobody's time" ok so people without penises shouldn't top. Got it. So trans women should be tops because they have penises, then? When topping is usually associated with (and you, mentioning penises, seem to associate it with) men? Riiight.. It's the "transandrobros" that are misogynistic, transmisogynistic, and transphobic. Not you, right? Suuure... 3. "st4t where the guy is the top is not something that happens irl or something anyone wants" how much are you willing to bet this person has never talked to any st4t couples IRL and is severely chronically online?

4. "go on any space made for women, and ask them if they'd prefer a real penis or a fake one inside them." Sounds like you've never talked to lesbians who like straps. Which is very common, actually.

5. "People of all genders and sexualities can come together and agree a man without a penis/with a fake one is worth nobody's time." Ok cool so - you admit this isn't about topping, this is about you shaming trans people's bodies for being fake. - great to know you think intersex people and/or people with any sort of genital deformities around their penis aren't "man enough" and are "fake and not worth anybody's time." Definitely not intersexist rhetoric. - Definitely not completely fucking disgusting that you've revealed you view people's worth based on how fuckable their genitals are to you. I'm sure trans women with deformities or failed bottom surgery are gonna view you as an ally and definitely not see you for the transphobic piece of shit you are. - Also incredibly disturbing how, even when including trans people and mentioning trans women, you still associate "people with penises topping" with men. "a man without a penis is worth nobody's time." interesting, so what do you think about women with penises then? - And also obviously exorsexist to have gender = genitals in this conversation.

Just generally: These posts REEK of treating your own personal sexual preferences as justification for your bigotry, and believing that must be a universal opinion.

But we're not done. I haven't gotten to the harassment yet.

The original post's crop is so terrible, I see 0 evidence the person in question "realized they're funny when it's someone on his side making them" because no?? His initial reaction was "you're both horrible." One of the people apologized, so he accepted the apology. What part of this is defending or finding rape jokes funny exactly? Because the original post didn't show the person defending the joke or laughing at it. Just accepting the apology. In fact, it seems like the person who's actually being criticized for joking about rape here was cropped out, if you look at the top comment in the screenshot.

“Well if I’m not allowed to travel being allowed to leave my own country then I am being held here.”