Like you can like the show and Hannigram if you wanna. But the show and the books are completely separate universes... Not to mention, if we have to consider one of the two as canon, it's the books. It's the foundation, the spine of it all, where every Hannibal and the other related characters are rooted in.

And people saying "they made him straight 🤢". No. Hannibal wasn't made straight in the books, because he already was. And if he wasn't, Thomas Harris never let us know, and only showed him having a romantic/sexual interest in women throughout the tetralogy.

Hannibal was made gay in the show, when he originally wasn't, and his character was twisted to make it a toxic yaoi yandere fanfiction/tv show. His personality, his attitude towards characters like Will —who, in the books, he absolutely hates and does not fall in love with—, his decisions regarding murders —NBC Hannibal kills more freely and often, when he's mildly upset or finds someone to be standing in his way, whereas book Hannibal is more measured, has different methods, be it manipulation, murder, and others, that don't always involve murder—...

And don't get me started on how he treats women. Book and movie Hannibal, we know, respect women. Book Hannibal punished a man for smacking his aunt's rear and for insulting her with his words, too. He punished Paul Krendler for the things he'd done to Clarice, the harassment and making her job hell, preventing her from achieving progress and all. And damn, even if he hurt a woman —we only ever know he swallowed a nurse's tongue, but she lived—, he never killed her AND she wasn't a minor.

NBC Hannibal? As far as I recall, he killed Abigail Hobbs —who was, at the time, around 17-18, so technically still a minor, still "vulnerable"—. He's killed many other women, I know. But couldn't there have been another way? Because book Hannibal knew ways of removing stones from his shoes without having to kill anyone just like that, as a first option.

Yes, in the book Hannibal "tries to brainwash Clarice", you'll say. He didn't. He misinterprets love because the most intense, true and devoted love he's felt was decades ago, with Mischa, and she died. He thinks his love for Clarice must be like the love he felt for Mischa, he values her integrity, her "worthiest place", thus misunderstanding his own feelings as he has never really processed this and thinking he wants to bring Mischa back through Clarice... But then he has sex with her, they become lovers... He can tell the difference now.

And even if he had brainwashed her, let's indulge the excuse for a moment... How is that worse than what Hannibal from NBC does to his Will?

Hannibal knew of his encephalitis, hid the diagnosis from him, brought out the worst of him, framed him for his murders, killed someone Will loved —perhaps not truly, perhaps just the ideas he projected onto Abigail, but the fact remains—, among many other wrongs... Manipulated Will, expressed his feelings in the worst ways possible... He hurt Will. A lot.

I'm not saying Will didn't hurt him, but we're talking about what Hannibal does to his lovers in the book and the show. If you compare it, he never harmed Clarice. Thomas Harris specifically states that the drugs she took were for therapeutic purposes only, and that they no longer have a part in their lives since years ago, in the epilogue. Whereas with Hannigram, the manipulation is constant, from both sides, the harm, everything.

In the book, he is all protective over Clarice, though he knows and respects that she is more than capable of taking care of herself. In the show, it's almost as if toying with Will's mind in a destructive way amuses or even arouses him, whereas in the book, Hannibal can't seem to stand the thought of harming Clarice neither physically nor psychologically. Talk about big differences.

Again, back to my first point. Hannigram shippers hating on Clarice, wanting to get her off the books... You do realize that, without her or without Clannibal, your little ship wouldn't have material to be born from? True, Bryan Fuller could have made something up, with enough effort and creativity... But if he could come up with a whole show by his ideas alone, why are most of Will's and Hannibal's dialogues, be it with each other or about each other, just a copy paste of Hannibal and Clarice's own, if only a little modified or adapted?

How come you hate Clannibal, when your own little ship and your precious murder husband quotes about love, about the daily stab of hunger, about seeing everyday forever and remembering this time, are just adaptations of Clannibal moments? It isn't Clarice that needs to be replaced or erased. Because you might think that even if there was no Clarice in the books, Will could have become Hannibal's lover, you are terribly wrong.

Will and Hannibal hated each other. Will's morals and mind in the books are not like the Will's from the show. This Will actually is horrified by Hannibal's crimes, completely against them, and hates Hannibal. Same goes with Hannibal, who hates Will for catching him among other things, from taking his freedom from him.

Hell, Hannibal sent a fucking serial killer —Francis Dolarhyde— not after Will alone, but after his goddamned family —which he actually loves in the book—. His step-son and his wife. Thanks to what Hannibal does, he is terribly disfigured. He becomes an alcoholic, his life goes to hell... How is that going to become love, as you claim, when he has destroyed his life completely? Hannibal is controlled and composed, yes, but he still feels quite as much as anyone else, if not more. His hatred for Will Graham leads to this.

You can't hate Clarice Starling, finally, as a character or person regardless of your ship. She is an intelligent, strong, stubborn and resourceful woman who rose from the lowest she stood, from the loss of her father, from being sent away from her mother and siblings, from the trauma of the lambs, from the orphanage and poverty of her childhood... All to become what she truly believed in. A law enforcer who could actually do some good. Whose ideals and goals mattered more than greed or self advance.

Nowadays we criticize women written by men so damn much, because they're so plain, always the seductress or the damsel in distress, like a Madonna-whore complex. Yet when you are facing a strong, complex but coherent female lead, you can't seem to like her, be it for your preferences regarding characters or regarding ships...

It's rather interesting. Why is hating Hannigram homophobic, but hating Clarice Starling isn't misogyny? She is a strong woman making her way in a male-dominated field, in times were sexism and racism —which are still present— were, dare I say, even worse.

How come you can't stand a woman who actually earns her place, who doesn't bend down to corruption, who sticks to her values and her oath to serve justice?

And, for those who might not like Hannigram, but don't like Clannibal either because "it does wrong to Clarice's character"... Can you blame her for falling in love? For wanting better things in life? She finds the system as doomed, flawed from within, and if she can't change it... It doesn't make her become a criminal herself. It doesn't make her a killer or a complete opposite of what the idealistic heroine is. It simply frees her, opens her mind to the possibility of, for once, looking out for herself, pursuing something she wants, not obligated to duties anymore. For once, she allows herself to be selfish, to grant herself some happiness...

I don't think you can hate Clarice just because. I don't think she deserves it. She is a well written character, human, and not completely white, not completely black. She's a scale of gray, and I love that. She's not completely "good" or "ideal" because absolutely no human is. That's precisely the beauty of it all. She is so close to that, but still human.

And you can't hate Clannibal when you adore Hannigram, because Hannigram is a gay-fied, toxified version of Clannibal.

Will Graham in the show is far more like Clarice Starling than he is to the Will Graham from the books which he is supposedly based on...

So, like I said, it is irrational to hate Clannibal, as it is the source of the romance Fuller gave "Will" and Hannibal in the show. A house without a strong foundation falls apart, and Hannigram's foundation is Clannibal. You think about this...

Yes. I know I'm dragging you down with me here, but yes, please watch it!

It is like the pandoras box. It just never stops. You think you know a lot about DW, and then you find that you haven't even scratched the surface! Canon doesn't make sense bc it has had so many different writers who all love to directly contradict each other, and it's all as true or false as you make it!

It has some of the best and worst writing imaginable, and no one can agree on what's what (except for the most recent two seasons. I think everyone can agree that these were - for the most part - horrible). There are entire books and stories for characters you've never heard of! A character is seen once in an episode, and then you wonder why everyone likes them so much, and then you find out that they've an entire audio series dedicated to them!

>u make a completely unnecessary reply stating u DONT like the ship. cool. nobody gaf.

>u then go on 2 imply that queer relationships make u uncomfortable

cool, nice job homophobe. there’s literally no way u can explain “being more comfortable w straight ships” w/out it sounding homophobic. which u r.

How little comprehension people put on topics and words these days... It's about *my* preferences and what I'm comfortable with.

And homophobia, my, my, my... That word makes me uncomfortable. *Phobia* is *fear*, *terror*, or in your context —mistakenly assumed as hate— some form of hate. I don't hate those ships, I don't hate gay people and whatever y'all do is between you and God, not me.

I just commented on a post I saw from someone I've talked to before and made a different comment altogether.

If I mentioned I don't like LGBT ships it's because the OP said it was sad that I didn't even like book/movie hannigram. They prompted it by mentioning a ship that is very much gay, as you may understand. I literally merely explained. I never criticized or judged anyone for liking them.

It's my personal preference, and nothing else. I force no one to agree, hell I don't even ask folks to agree.

I'm not offended by other people's preferences (if they are into the same sex or like gay couples, your business, not mine).

However, the fact that you are offended by my preferences and makes you feel a need to call me a homophobe (better word would be hater, as I previously explained) would lead me to believe that the intolerant person here is you.

Like I said, I don't care if other people like gay ships or are gay/lesbian/have another preference. It's your business, I don't judge or force you to change.

I respect your preference. But my preferences must also be respected, in order for me to respect other people's.

If I'm uncomfortable with gay stuff, so what? I'm not harming anyone or judging anyone for their tastes. I know gay/queer people who don't like straight ships, or makes them uncomfortable, but there's nothing wrong with it.

It doesn't matter if your preference is for gay/lesbian stuff or for straight stuff. The thing here is, you are calling me a homophobe, a hater, just because I am sticking to what makes me comfortable.

What if I call a gay person something similar for not liking straight stuff? Makes me a jerk, right? It's the same thing. If someone isn't comfortable with LGBT stuff, they'll seek what they are comfortable with. If someone isn't comfortable with straight stuff, they'll seek what they are comfortable with.

I say this in the most respectful and polite way possible. I don't mean to be rude. But I certainly won't just stand by and let you 'attack' me for my preferences. I don't attack people because of their preferences, so I should not be attacked because of mine either. Respect goes both ways.

This is mostly about book/movie Hannibal but I do see Mads' Hannibal doing this as well.

So, we know Hannibal Lecter is a cannibal and also a connoisseur of everything... Except the NBC version. That one doesn't know about not killing women and still succeeding in his little schemes 💔.

Anyway, my point is... Hannibal is a cannibal, a cannibal who knows about the cuisine of literally any damn country, ethnicity, town or culture you can think of.

Imagine if, I don't know, someone he and Clarice knew was Mexican. Maybe a friend. Maybe it's one of their neighbors in Buenos Aires. Who knows?

I feel like that neighbor, if given the circumstances, would invite them over OR send them some pozole (if you know what pozole is you know where this is going to). Clarice would probably like it, I think, but I may be biased.

And Hannibal would enjoy it as well, if not while a little bit more... Distracted. He would probably take his sweet time analyzing the flavor, seasoning and even the meat to guess, more or less, where that neighbor is from. Because, trust me, every state and every town has a different pozole and he would somehow know them all.

And maybe he is inspired and, when feasible, he brings a free range rude guest to his kitchen. And makes pozole.

Silence of The Lambs + Hannibal + CBS Clarice textposts! Made by me<3