#john hate

The three guarantees that you have stepped into destieheller shit:

Hates John

Dean is bi

“You didn’t even see them since ‘day one,’ actually. Because that was never on the show.” - Mary manipulated and lied to John for their whole relationship pre-HLV. That’s why the REVEAL that she was an assassin was a BIG DEAL... because John DIDN’T KNOW... because she had been LYING, and that’s a CANON part of the show. Oh, and if we’re only allowed to call something canon if we actually see it, then guess what isn’t canon? That’s right! Your guys’ whole argument about Sherlolly being canon is based on an assumption that something happened between them off-screen between the ily and the montage. So apparently, you’re allowed to totally make up shit and call it canon, but when we discuss something that we KNOW FOR SURE happened off-screen, it’s not canon because we didn’t see it?

“He more than likely fucked another woman off-screen.” Oh, so we can’t talk about Mary canonically being a liar, but you get to make totally baseless assumptions about what John does off-screen in order to support your biases? What the actual fuck, talk about double standards?!? What happened to “It didn’t happen on the show! You tjlcers just make shit up!” 

“When you say you forgive someone and you’re staying married, you stick with it.” When did John ever go back on his word? He told her from the get-go that he was still angry she tried to kill his best friend - which is totally fucking understandable. Unlike her, he actually made an effort to fix things between them. It was your darling angel MARY who chose to continue keeping secrets. MARY was the cause of their marriage problems in S4, not John. JOHN was the one who reminded her that couples are supposed to talk things out. JOHN was the one who chased her down with Sherlock’s help after she fled.  

“though asshole John did abandon Mary for months during her pregnancy.” How do you know? iT dIdN’t HaPpEn On ScReEn!! Oh - you know because of the “months of silence" line? You used dialogue to fill in the timeline gaps?! Oh, are you suddenly familiar with the concept? And btw, we still have no idea what happened in those months. We don’t know if that line meant John had moved out, or if they just hadn’t talked about it yet. But sure, go ahead and call him a jerk because of your headcanon. Also, are we forgetting who actually, canonically DID abandon her family in S4, including a newborn infant? Yeah, it was Mary. I don’t see you throwing a fit about her ditching her responsibilities (though we all know how much you’d shit on John if he’d been the one to run away). But no, go ahead and call him an asshole for “abandoning” Mary. Yeah, what a jerk, how dare he spend some time alone after finding out his wife has been lying to him since they met, has killed god knows how many people, and tried to murder his best friend in cold blood. 

And yeah, John definitely isn’t innocent himself. He texted another woman and felt immensely guilty afterwards (unlike the zero remorse we saw from Mary when her past was revealed). And yes, he has anger/ violence issues. Unlike you, I’m not going to make excuses for him just because I like John. John isn’t perfect. But he doesn’t deserve to fucking die or be called “trash.”

Because if he’s “trash,” then guess who else is trash? Mary.

Both of them are very flawed and have made bad decisions during their marriage. You don’t get to call one of them trash while upholding the other as a saint. If you’re forgetting, Mary is a LIAR, a paid KILLER, tried to MURDER Sherlock TWICE, and fucking ABANDONED her infant to go kill and play secret agent. But here you are acting as if none of that happened, and Mary is just some poor, faultless victim here. 

If a literal assassin deserves nuance when analyzing her immoral actions, why doesn’t John deserve it too? I’ll tell you why. It’s because Mary is your fave and can therefore do no wrong. John is... John, and you’ll use any excuse to hate him because you’re so blinded by your biases you don’t know how to look at anything objectively.

Hi Nonny! *hugs*

I did receive the first half of this ask, but after a lot of thought, I’ve decided to not post it, given that it seems you genuinely feel like you are worried you worded the ask in a terribly awful way, and I myself know that you were posting out of annoyance with S4, so rather than stir up a pot I’ve no energy to deal with, I going to reword your ask below and answer it here.

Everyone else, essentially, the Nonny is wondering why, in their ask that precedes this one, authors choose to make John an asshole like he was in S4, or goes back to Mary, or is homophobic, rather than the John we know and love, the loyal hero he is and the man who loves Sherlock. For that I answer: 

Nonny, I honestly do feel your sentiments on it, because characterization is super important for me to really get into a fanfic, and because I don’t read John that way at all either. To me, it feels like some people hate John, which makes no sense to me at all, because how one can be a Johnlocker and hate John?*shrugs* THAT SAID, there are people who do like that reading of his character and therefore there’s going to always be space for it, but no one is forcing me to read those stories at all, so I don’t *shrugs*. It has been frustrating when I get far into them and then John’s character does a complete 180 to this John, but it’s rare.

Writers are allowed to write whatever and however they want, so really I can’t condemn them at all. I mean I read all the characters differently than other people do, and some people agree with me while others don’t, and that’s okay. Basically, the rule has always been “Don’t Like, Don’t Read” and leave it at that, and it’s what I do whenever I read a fic I’m not getting into. I have read plenty of fic where I “nope” out of it in the middle, Mark it as Read, and move on. 

More likely than not, I usually rec fics in MY personal lists (anything also tagged with “to read” means I haven’t read them yet) have John and Sherlock relatively in-character to my liking, anyway, LOL, so do feel free to check out my fic rec lists here :)

Anyway, long-short of it, the authors are writing these stories, for free, because they love the characters in the way they do, and they have their own ways of interpreting them. Writers do the stories for themselves, and if people like it, all the more bonus! I respect fan fic authors greatly, even the ones I don’t like the stories of, because writing is not easy, and you can’t please everyone but, c’est la vie. 

All you need to know about destiehellers and how they ‘watch’ the show.

THEIR opinion is the only one that matters. Canon? What is canon?

THEY are the only ones that use ‘team free will’

WE are wrong to like John Winchester

Ok... what? 

First of all barriss, absolutely no one is telling you that you’re not allowed to enjoy Molly’s character or praise her for being good friend and godmother - this person is only saying you don’t need to unnecessarily bash other characters while you’re doing it. But of course, you sherlollians won’t miss a chance to twist johnlockers’ words to make them look sexist - it is your favorite hobby after all. You just assumed that because that person was a johnlocker, they MUST be a misogynist out to disregard Molly, because you ... ah, how do I phrase it... because your “hate is THAT engraved in you” and “being objective is too much to ask from some of ya’ll.” 

Second, the person is calling out your hypocrisy of praising one character and then right away hating on another - completely unnecessarily, may i add. The post wasn't even about John. It was totally possible for you to praise Molly here without shitting on John. But your response to this callout was to... lecture them about character hate? Right, because it’s okay for you to piss on John in every other breath but god forbid a johnlocker utter a peep about any female character. (Plus, this person didn’t even say anything bad about any of the women. You literally just pretended that they did, like wtf?) 

Third, if Sherlock and John are both such assholes, why do you ship them with the women you supposedly love so much? If they’re so awful, don’t you want better for Molly and Mary?... Hm?... *crickets chirping* 

Here you’ll see Sherlollians doing everything from wishing John would betray Sherlock, to headcanoning about Molly taking over his role in Sherlock’s life (talk about character erasure), to wishing other characters would be violent towards him, or wishing he would DIE.

These people have always hated John and felt threatened by him because Sherlock loves him more than anyone - and they know it. And in S4 they were thrilled to finally have an excuse for all that hatred. That’s why they literally can’t shut up about the morgue scene. For a group that claims to be all about love and sunshine and positivity and turning lemons into lemonade, they sure can’t seem to shut the fuck up about a character they hate so much.

But then on the flip side, no one but them is allowed to touch Molly Hooper, even if what we have to say about her is in no way hateful at all. They get so personally offended when anyone other than them has an opinion about Molly. No, not a bad opinion necessarily - just an opinion. If we dislike her, we’re misogynists. If we are totally neutral towards her, we’re erasing/discarding her. If we pity her, we’re still misogynists. Heck, we’re not even allowed to like her because then it’s obviously “fake.” We get attacked for saying literally anything at all about her, even when it’s harmless. But LORD just IMAGINE if some of those above screenshots were things johnlockers said about Molly. BOY would sherlollians be foaming at the mouth and sharpening their pitchforks. We’d be called sexist assholes for calling her story boring, blatantly replacing her with a male character, calling her a traitor, and wanting her to be beaten up or literally DIE. But they can say whatever they want about John because #doublestandards and “Sherlollians are love uwu.”

Johnlockers never say that sort of crap about Molly. Yes, we will criticize her sometimes and talk about her poorly written arc because guess what? That’s not a fucking crime! But god, if we dare make a post about her that isn’t completely worshipful, we get assaulted with cries of “Keep your filthy hands off our girl!” “Stop the character hate!”

“I have some points I’d like to put forward to Johnlockers after watching the recent episode of Sherlock.”

“John Watson is not a good person.” Yeah, he wasn’t in S4. We know that. And Mary also wasn’t a good person is Season… well… all the ones she’s in.

“Yes he loves Mary and Rosie but not enough to resist the temptations of a smiling woman on a bus” Yes, and Mary loves John but not enough to resist trying to kill Sherlock twice to protect her own lying ass instead of remembering how much it destroyed her husband to see Sherlock die the first time. And Mary loves Rosie but not enough to uhh… raise her instead of running away.

“After watching TST I truly believe that John does not deserve Sherlock Holmes” Okay…… and? Were you expecting anyone to read this and think “oh shit ur right! Imma just delete my blog and jump off a cliff right now thanks so much for opening my eyes!” Do you not think we watched the same episode and had our own discussions about what John did? If you respect Johnlockers so much, why did you feel the need to say this to them instead of just posting about this topic while staying in your own lane? What was the point of this? Do you really think your ideas are so groundbreaking you have come in our tag and enlighten with them? 

We know this post has already been featured in our John hate compilation, but this particular post deserves some extra attention. 

We see a number of whacky things here:

1. First, let me ask: why is John betraying Sherlock a good story to tell? Yes, it hasn’t ever been done before. But why do they think it’s a story that should be told? These men and their ridiculous adventures have survived centuries because people love their dynamic, their partnership. It’s not about the cases. There are good crime stories everywhere. It’s about them. Why do they want to destroy that? (Me thinks they feel a bit threatened by how much Sherlock loves John... it’d be a shame if someone were to.... ruin their relationship...)

2. Love how they put “break” in quotations. They probably typed it and were like “oh wait. That sounds too gay.... better put it in quotes.” Lmao

3. John has no interesting back story??? Are you kidding me? Being a doctor who treats wounded people in a foreign war zone isn’t interesting? Being a soldier who got shot and invalided isn’t interesting? Being an ex-army doctor with an adrenaline addiction isn’t interesting? Get the fuck outa here. There’s SO much material there. Just admit that you hate John and wouldn’t give a shit about his story even if it was the most complex and interesting thing in the world. 

4. So apparently, this kind of reveal would “enrich” John a lot since he has “no backstory.” Interesting. Isn’t that what a ton of Johnlockers said about Mary after S3? Mary didn’t have any backstory until HLV, which opened up a whole world of possibilities. Given the parallels between her and Sebastian Moran and that she’d already tried to kill Sherlock, we thought it was possible that she is/was working for Moriarty. How fascinating would that be? It would add an actual purpose to all the shit from HLV. Otherwise, what was the point, if they were just gonna have a normal marriage until her plot device death. Our version objectively made a lot more sense and made Mary a much more interesting character. Oh, but of course, we only wanted her to be a baddie because we’re sexist, right? And ya’ll wanting John Watson of all people to be bad when there’s NOTHING to back it up has everything to do with ““enriching”” him and nothing to do with wanting to remove him from the picture, right?