Just another friendly reminder that the revised and updated version of Exploring the Land of Ooo can be pre-ordered through the University Press of Mississippi’s website! You all don’t know how excited I am for this book to come out!

What Are Folks Saying about the Book?

“As thorough and comprehensive an account of Adventure Time as one could possibly hope for. I’m grateful for and flattered by all the care that Paul A. Thomas put into this work.” —Tom Herpich (Writer/Storyboard Artist)

“Fascinating revelations from the world’s foremost scholar of Ooo.” —Casey James Basichis (Composer)

“Pen Ward’s Adventure Time is just the sort of bellwether series that deserves the thorough and thoughtful historical accounting Thomas has given us here. I love it (but I still freaking hate Trudy).” —Eric Homan (Associate Producer)

  Click here for the other posts of ‘Behind the Scenes with Bee and PuppyCat’

Now that Bee and PuppyCat: Lazy in Space has dropped on Netflix, I thought I would share some of my recollections as to how this special series of Natasha Allegri’s came to be. –Fred Seibert

Taking a break from the BTS chronology I’m going to take a minute for some thank yous. Of course, I’ll forget to include some people, but you shouldn’t take it as more than swiss cheese brain.

Some say that filmmaking is a collaborative art, and in my case, that’s been totally true. Yes, for me, that’s an understatement. Getting to a series like “Bee and PuppyCat” is a collection of experiences where I learned from hundreds of people, and then worked directly with hundreds more. In cartoons alone, I’ve had 30 years of a lot of ups, too many downs, some great successes and greater misses.

It was clear to me right at the beginning that American cartoons suffered greatly from relegating women to support positions rather than primary creative ones. Within weeks of starting at Hanna-Barbera I’d voice the lament to anyone who’d listen. It was a long time before anyone even pitched, but by 2006, with Random! Cartoons, we had more women coming in with their ideas than ever before, and in the end nine women created finished cartoons. And during Too Cool! Cartoons, for our Cartoon Hangover channel, almost half the shorts were by a new generation of creative women, including Natasha.

Onto the thanks. Please remember that these posts are about the “behind the scenes” of what makes B&PC. None of us miss the plain truth that it’s our fans that makes everything worth it.

I’m not sure if there’s a way to thanks Natasha Allegri enough, is there? An amazing artist, a deep storyteller, a lovely person with a stunning vision.

Eric Homan and I were colleagues for 27 years, the last 15 or so, heading development at Frederator Studios. It was Eric who, for us, spotted what a special talent Natasha had. He was the person who saw her web comic that kickstarted the Fionna and Cake phenomenon. And, of course, he invited Natasha over to show us the cartoon she’d been working on in 2013.

Carrie Miller has been another indispensable presence during my Frederator years. She ran our New York operation, produced our first original cartoons for Channel Frederator, and by the time Eric sent over the PuppyCat storyboard for a second opinion (”Greenlight this cartoon right now!”), she was running the entire New York office and our YouTube channels.

Don’t think I’ve ignored Pendleton Ward. Because it was Pen’s and Natasha’s friendship, built around the web comics that they traded over years, that inspired Pen to convince her to join the Adventure Time team, her first foray into professional cartoons. Without Pen, I’m not at all sure that any of us could have become her great followers. And don’t think he didn’t help B&PC creatively whenever possible.

Kevin Kolde and I met during my time at Hanna-Barbera, and during his pre-cartoon and SPüMCø lives I did everything I could to bring him over to my side of things. Eventually he succumbed, and while he was developing what has become the ”Castlevania” universe, he patiently worked with dozens of the creators –almost none of whom had ever run a professional cartoon production– I foisted upon him during various shorts productions. Natasha was definitely a mature artist and storyteller who had relatively scant experience in production, and over the decade that Bee and PuppyCat has lived it’s Kevin’s subtle hand that has made all the productions possible.

Efrain Farias and Hans Tseng have been key creative collaborators with Natasha throughout the decade of the B&PC saga. Both of these folks are talented artists, but that doesn’t begin to catalog their contributions to the shows.

Larry Leichliter has worked on everything. As far as I’m concerned, Larry Huber introduced him my way to direct on ChalkZone; Eric and Kevin suggested him for the Adventure Time short, and he eventually became the series’ original supervising director. He served on Bee and PuppyCat the same way where set the directorial vision.

Actors, we’ve had a few. You’re undoubtedly familiar with Allyn Rachel, Kent Osborne, Pretty Patrick Seery, but I think if you peruse the who cast you might get a few surprises.

Didn’t Will Wiesenfeld do an amazing job? Just check out Baths too! Natasha really scored here.

The entire Frederator Studios production team, small as it was, kept things on track, particularly Sylvia Edwards and Steve Worth, who had a lot going on at the same time. The editors, sound department, special and visual effects, Garrett, they all did incredible work. Thank you!  

Meredith Layne has voice casted and directed both series (among a whole lot of others for us). And if you look at the credits closely, these shows do not in any way tread the expected paths when it comes to actors.

Heather Kenyon and Junichi Yanagihara really made the difference when we moved the animation to OLM in Tokyo, and kept it up during “Lazy in Space.”

Matt Gielen had recently joined Frederator Networks when we started looking at storyboards for Too Cool!. Though “influencers” were already flooding YouTube, which de-emphasized scripted, character based programming, Matt became an industry leader understanding how to help us build a loyal community of viewers who became the backbone of the Bee and PuppyCat fandom.

We heard from Nate Olson in Part 4 of this BTS series, but as I said there, a Bee and PuppyCat series might not have existed with his sweat, blood and smarts he brought to bear in shepherding our community of viewers-turned-fans into a group of committed supporters, first with the Kickstarter, then with the product companies that came aboard. Maybe more than anyone else, Nate was the loud voice representing the community, keeping all of us in line, understanding that without that special audience all our work would be for nothing.

Making a show like B&PC should be enough. The Cartoon Hangover crew in New York –Cade Hiser, Nicky Fung, Zoe Barton, and all the interns– lost a few years of their lives helped our fans stay fans. No, it’s not as easy as it looks.

Tom Pickett had bought my company, Next New Networks, for Google and YouTube to help them find audiences. And when he started Ellation (owner of Crunchyroll) and VRV to work with independent streaming networks, he reached out to see if Cartoon Hangover might be interested. His programmer, Arlen Marmel and business development head, Eric Berman, were particularly interested in “Bravest Warriors” and “Bee and PuppyCat.” Without these intrepid entrepreneurs we couldn’t have made “Lazy in Space.”

Michael Hirsh, Canadian animation innovator, saved Frederator when we ran into some tough times. “Bee and PuppyCat: Lazy in Space” probably wouldn’t have seen the light of day without him.

Brian Gucciardo was in the law department at my other company, Next New Networks. He’s been around the block, and then some, in almost every facet of the entertainment business. Let me tell you true, doing the kind of agreements we have with first time creators for “Too Cool! Cartoons” (home of B&PC) and “GO! Cartoons” (throw Sony Pictures Animation in that mix) is no easy rolling. Not to mention our arrangements with Netflix and everything else we through at him (thousands –thousands!– of Channel Frederator Network members!).

Fred Pustay and I have worked together for decades, starting at MTV. He's saved my bacon more often than I can say. And he kept Frederator on an even keel no matter now hard I tried to screw it up. We couldn't have gotten through the treacherous waters to get Bee and PuppyCat made without him.

Like I said, it takes a village. And any villagers I’d neglected will be added as they yell at me.

Wow! On Netflix now. Finally.

Illustration of Eric Homan + Fred Seibert by Natasha Allegri.

Eric Homan.

Soon after I got to Hanna-Barbera Cartoons, my Fred/Alan colleague, Tom Barreca, joined up, running the Enterprises group (he developed our characters into award winning partnerships), and he introduced me to a recent hire in his group, Eric Homan.

And a wonderful 30+ year cartoon relationship began.

"The World of Hanna-Barbera" edited by Eric Homan

Eric and I played a lot of roles together, from animation art to Frederator-on-the-internet (he critical to the founding of Channel Frederator and Cartoon Hangover). But, really it’s the cartoons.

Eric is most known and successful because of his development of the entire Frederator slate from 2004 on, starting with the Nicktoons Film Festival, and on through Wow! Wow! Wubbzy!, Random! Cartoons, Too Cool! Cartoons, and GO! Cartoons. And, not for nothing, Eric and Kevin Kolde double handedly ran Frederator Studios when I lived on the East coast and was starting up our YouTube channels, among other things.

But he’s rightly most revered for his roles in Pendleton Ward’s Adventure Time and Natasha Allegri’s Bee and PuppyCat. Networks and streamers like Netflix, Nickelodeon, Cartoon Network, Max, Amazon Prime, Cartoon Hangover, and Channel Frederator owe a lot to Eric Homan.

(And lest you be skeptical about the work that goes into the “development” of cartoons led by such stellar creators, remember that Eric personally sifted through at least 5000 shorts pitches for our 60+ creator led shorts and honed in on the creators that created the series that spun off. I might have founded the studio, but Eric carried the weight.)

By the way, I’d be remiss if I didn’t tell you the crucial role Mr. Homan played in Adventure Time’s life. As part of his constant search for special talent at Frederator, Eric visited end-of-semester student film showcases at CalArts outside of Los Angeles. In the early aughts, he caught a film of junior Pen Ward’s and introduced himself; the next year, they bumped into each other again and a month after graduation, Pen pitched his AT board. A few weeks later, Pen pitched me. 

And I turned it down.

At the end of a long day of not-so-great presentations, Eric, Kevin Kolde and I retreated to my office to review. I made the classic executive mistake of thinking I knew what was right.

“He doesn’t have any professional experience. His drawing is primitive. We don’t make student films here.“

Eric and Kevin were surprised, they loved Pen and his idea. They pushed. I pushed back. And then Eric delivered the zinger.

“You try to be polite, you usually have a fake laugh in our pitches. But you actually laughed with Adventure Time.”

Busted. Eric knew me better than I did, and he knew a great piece of work when he saw it. The rest is history.

There are more stories that I can tell you. It comes down to the fact that’s Eric’s role in the modern history in cartoons is unique. Bottom line, it’s been an honor to work with Eric Homan, and not for nothing, we continue to collaborate in the wide world of cartoons. Thanks bud.

PS: Eric doesn’t love having his picture taken, hence Natasha’s illustration up above. But, I thought I’d share this snap of Eric, Pen Ward and me from 2008.

In 2020, I released Exploring the Land of Ooo, which took a behind-the-scenes approach to Adventure Time by detailing its complex production history. The book was (at least for me!) a smash success, and the University Press of Mississippi soon agreed to re-release it. And so, I whipped up some more content, conducted more interviews, and produced an updated version.

I’m excited to announce that this version is finally available for pre-order! Here’s the cover:

Here’s the description:       

Exploring the Land of Ooo: An Unofficial Overview and Production History of Cartoon Network’s "Adventure Time" is a guide through the colorful and exuberant animated television series that initially aired from 2010 to 2018. Created by visionary artist Pendleton Ward, the series was groundbreaking and is credited by many with heralding in a new golden age of animation. Known for its distinct sense of humor, bold aesthetic choices, and memorable characters, Adventure Time has amassed a fan-following of teenagers and young adults in addition to children. Popularly and critically acclaimed, the show netted three Annie awards, eight Emmys, and a coveted Peabody.

In this thorough overview, author Paul A. Thomas explores the nuances of Adventure Time’s characters, production history, ancillary media, and vibrant fandom. Based in part on interviews with dozens of the creative individuals who made the show possible, the volume comprises a captivating mix of oral history and primary source analysis. With fresh insight, the book considers the show’s guest-directed episodes, outlines its most famous songs, and explores how its characters were created and cast. Written for fans and scholars alike, Exploring the Land of Ooo ensures that, when it comes to Adventure Time, the fun truly will never end.

And here’s what some cool people have said about it:

As thorough and comprehensive an account of Adventure Time as one could possibly hope for. I’m grateful for and flattered by all the care that Paul A. Thomas put into this work.—Tom Herpich

"Pen Ward’s Adventure Time is just the sort of bellwether series that deserves the thorough and thoughtful historical accounting Thomas has given us here. I love it (but I still freaking hate Trudy).—Eric Homan

Exploring the Land of Ooo is a wonderful book offering an extremely engaging and thorough production history of the popular show Adventure Time.—Paul Booth

Fascinating revelations from the world’s foremost scholar of Ooo.—Casey James Basichis

Best of Original Cartoons: Adventure Time [2010-2018+]

I’ve been public that I turned down Adventure Time when creator Pendleton Ward first pitched it. Luckily, Eric Homan and Kevin Kolde pretty much locked me in my office (not quite) until I finally said yes. Actually, they were pretty disappointed in me (can’t blame them) but one meeting with Pen and I turned around on a dime. Lucky thing. And yes, I know how stupid I was.

I’ll cut to the chase and then fill in the backstory. Here’s an excerpt of the most penetrating, on the nose review that I’ve read about the series, from The New Yorker’s Emily Nussbaum:

The animated series “Adventure Time,” now entering its sixth season on Cartoon Network, is the kind of cult phenomenon that’s hard to describe without sounding slightly nuts. It’s a post-apocalyptic allegory full of helpful dating tips for teen-agers, or like World of Warcraft as recapped by Carl Jung. It can be enjoyed, at varying levels, by third graders, art historians, and cosplay fans. It’s also the type of show that’s easy to write off as “stoner humor,” which may be why it took me a while to drop the snotty attitude, to open up and admit the truth: “Adventure Time” is one of the most philosophically risky and, often, emotionally affecting shows on TV. It’s beautiful and funny and stupid and smart, in about equal parts, as well as willing to explore uneasy existential questions, like what it means to go on when the story you’re in has ended.  

My version? Pen Ward has created the most emotionally complex shows of the “peak TV” but accomplished something no one else has even attempted. A show with a likeable hero instead of the now typical anti-heroes as exemplified by Walter White and Tony Soprano.

No easy feat. But Pen is not a typical creator. (If you’re an Adventure Time fan you know I’m right. If you’re not, what are you doing reading this anyhow?!)

Long story short, Eric saw one of Pen’s films at the annual end of year CalArts showcase, then again the next year, and invited Pen to pitch us for my upcoming shortsfest Random! Cartoons. I quickly got over my hesitance and we greenlit the short for Nickelodeon. He came in with his school pal Adam Muto (who would go on to create his own cool short for Random! and eventually become creative director and then, when Pen left, the showrunner of Adventure Time). Another pal, Pat McHale, was hovering in the background (for what reasons I never found out) and would go on to a critical role in the series and his own stardom.

The short was done with only a few hiccups (as hands on animators, the team was a little gun shy about doing the animation in Korea; we prevailed since it would be great practice for how the TV industry worked) and Pen had accomplished the (almost) impossible. A cartoon that seemed to be influenced more by early 20th century animations (those spaghetti arms and shape shifting bodies) than Looney Tunes, a film whose surrealism was tempered by an incredibly sly, at the same time, in your face humor. Wow! When Pen’s short was done everyone knew it was something special. 

Except, it seemed, the powers that be at Nickelodeon.

I knew it was going to be a problem. Here was a film that was like nothing else, drawn with a clear, simple and wholly original design. It was funny beyond the beyond, but was that character in pre-school? (”I’m 12 years old!” How much clearer did it need to be?) Was the humor for adults or kids? The executives were completely confused. I anticipated their focus groups by pointing out the four reasons they’d come back with a ‘no.’ They returned with the four, plus one more! Rejected!

What was wrong with these people?! Nickelodeon had an exclusive option to make a series on Adventure Time. So I went back and back and back and back. Five times altogether. To different executives in different divisions. “It’s not a ‘Nickelodeon’ show.” What the hell does that mean?

What it meant, bottom line, is that 1) that particular executive team was brain dead, and 2) they didn’t really want to produce a show with me. There was a feeling I’d been in business with them for too long and had gotten too much from them and that I was the former management team’s talent. Nickelodeon was moving on.

At that point I’d had an exclusive producing deal with Nickelodeon for several years because I was also a programming consultant to the network; there was a feeling that I knew their secrets and they didn’t want them shared with the competition. This situation usually meant that a rejection of one of our show pitches had no other life. But, this time, I kept going back for more pain. Five times Nick said no to Adventure Time. Finally, I’d had enough and told the president to please, rip up my exclusive. It had been a good decade in their clutches but I was done. Any place that couldn’t see that AT was a winner wasn’t the place to be locked down. Nickelodeon saved a lot of money, and honestly, that management team couldn’t care less about me, Pen Ward, or Adventure Time.

The rest of the saga is, as they say, history. I brought the show over to Cartoon Network. Former programming head, Michael Ouweleen (now the president at Adult Swim). He convinced CEO Stuart Snyder, and with a bit of a push, the new Chief Content officer, and we were off to the races. (Here’s the short oral history the LA Times’ Robert Lloyd ran after the series ended).

It was that rare moment when everything changed. Cartoons were never the same after Adventure Time.

Best of Original Cartoons: Costume Quest [2019]

This tale is one of a sadly overlooked, but great, cartoon series I produced last year. Costume Quest is another proof point, if any is needed, in Kevin Kolde’s belief in video games as great raw material for filmmaking.

Even though Frederator hadn’t yet found a home for Castlevania, over the years we developed a relationship with Tim Schafer’s Double Fine, a then-indie video game developer in San Francisco. One of their games was for kids, developed by Tasha Sounart, and adapted into a beautiful graphic novel by artist/writer Zac Gorman. To us, CQ looked ripe for cartoons.

Originally slated to be part of Too Cool! Cartoons, our Adventure Time friend director Pat McHale (Over the Garden Wall, Adventure Time) and producers Eric Homan and Kevin Kolde put together an animatic. Amazon Prime stepped right in, another buddy, Will McRobb (Bravest Warriors, Pete & Pete), came aboard soon joined by writer/director Bryan Caselli (Star vs. the Forces of Evil, Sanjay & Craig). And in a blink, we produced the best cartoon show on Amazon (if I do say so myself).

Sadly, also in a blink, Amazon pulled back from children’s shows and so while there was a full season and a holiday special, a lack of promotion and attention let it sit there (forever) without a real chance at attention. But, you’re a cartoon freak so *you* should give Costume Quest a whirl. Money back guarantee.

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Costume Quest Executive producers: Fred Seibert, Eric Homan, Kevin Kolde, Will McRobb Based on the smash video game series by Double Fine Productions and the world originally created by Tasha Sounart

Best of Original Cartoons: Nicktoons Film Festival [2004-2009]

Before there was Channel Frederator, before YouTube or iTunes video podcasting, there was the Nicktoons Films Festival.

My entire career in animation has been based on working with the best new talent in the world. And though the “world” of American cartoons was generally limited to who lived in Los Angeles (with some conspicuous exceptions), by the 2000s the internet opened the entire globe. It seemed to me to be a shame that some of the wonderful short films I was seeing at film festivals needed to be shown to a wider audience of fans. The cable TV universe had expanded enough (the channel line up had grown by 500% since the 90s) that I thought there should be easy pickings for my idea.

Keith Dawkins was the open minded general manager of the new Nicktoons Network from Nickelodeon in early 2004 when I approached him.

“Look, kids have a bedtime. What are you playing for everyone else at night?”

The Nicktoons Film Festival was born.

Nicktoons Film Festival poster & logo designed by Michael Uman & Luis Blanco

Eric Homan was running development for me in Los Angeles. Eric and our old friend, producer (and former editor/publisher of Animation Magazine, our festival media partner) Rita Street would program and produce the festival. They reached out across the world for the next three seasons and recruited filmmakers from all over to join in. Along the way we went across the globe from Asia to Europe, from the UK’s Jonti Picking (Mr. Weebl to YouTubers) to JG Quintel (with his early stirrings of The Regular Show) and dozens of films in between. The first season alone showed 81 short films. 

NNFF was a blast. Until it wasn’t, particularly. Why? iTunes, YouTube, and by 2005, Channel Frederator. I figured out another way to show animation to the world. 

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Nicktoons Film Festival 2004-2007 Created by Fred Seibert Executive Producers: Eric Homan, Fred Seibert, Rita Street Network: Nicktoons

Inside Frederator/NY 2014

My family moved from Santa Monica to New York in 1999, so I could take on the presidency of MTV Networks Online. It was pretty much a bust, but it got us back to the East, a place we felt better about raising our two boys. Oh, it also catapulted me into the streaming video age, somewhat unusual for at that time folks of my generation.

When I quit what would be my last j.o.b., Frederator Studios in Hollywood/Burbank thrived under the leadership of Eric Homan and Kevin Kolde, and we started stuttering through the building of Frederator/NY. When the dust settled, we were doing a bit of animation production, but it was mainly the home of our Frederator Networks' YouTube efforts, building on the shoulders of Channel Frederator, Next New Networks, eventually starting a cartoon multi-channel network (MCN) and several other channels around adult cartoons, video games and anime.

The most consistent leader in this effort was Carrie Miller, a key person in the Frederator story, and due for a post all her own (coming soon!). Who, not for nothing, designed our unique working space.

Anyhow, the video above took quick tour of one of our New York offices, soon after we'd re-located towards the end of 2013. Ari Zapata, my assistant at the time, asked her partner, photographer/director Erik Motta, to come by and shoot some video around our staff built Lego conference table.

I think it'll give you a sense of why we were able to do such great work. Talented colleagues, people you wanted to spend time with everyday.

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