SayYouMe

AND SOMETHING I FIND REALLY FASCINATING ABOUT DOING THESE TWO THINGS (reading the script and watching the finished scene) IS HOW DIFFERENT THEY ARE—different lines. different directions. different blocking. different subject emphasis.

But it's stupid that they removed it. Because they already showed it. Their storyline is about that, even small acts of kindness were done because he knew it will be good, even how he was interacting with all of them, it's not exactly a demon it's more like a sassy guy. Or like he was protecting Dawn when Buffy didn't see it even, because he knew what is good and what is bad and he chose to do the latter. And his biggest decision when he decided to fight for his soul is about that. A demon decided that he needs a soul. It's like the opposite of the devil. We know that lusifer was an angel at the beginning but chose evil, he was corrupted by his own ideas and thoughts. It's about that nth is decided in advance, eventually it's about what choice you make and what person you become. And it's a good message. And they already showed it.

Spuffy cuddles are called Spuddles.

But if we look at the narrative they do not state it clear. And Xander's speech here doesn't sound and doesn't look like his own small opinion about it, they show it the way like what he says is true. They show that R did sht but then they suddenly try to justify it saying that he's the best guy she could ever have and it's mostly her fault that things went this way and they even make her run after him to try to "love him better" but she's late. That's the storyline. And from here it's absolutely not that obvious that the message is that they're not right for each other. The story had a choice to state that they're different better but they chose not to do that.

i need everyone to stop projecting their ideas of normal/traditional healthy human relationship/dynamics onto spike and buffy because there is literally no way in hell anybody in this show is redeemable or worthy of forgiveness by any standard if you do that, including buffy herself. and it's a complete waste of nuance that was very deliberately crafted into the story too. spike is a villain and buffy is a hero and both want to kill each other for different reasons and they both actively try to do exactly that multiple times. both feel deep deep hatred for one another for most of the time they spend in the other's presence. spike should by all accounts try to kill her constantly because he is the villainnnnn. it's almost his job. same way buffy should want to kill him any chance she gets. that's the standard that's set and that the characters should meet. it's only when they get caught off guard by their own self reflected back to them through this other being that their preconceived ideas of how they should behave take a step back and they engage with each other almost softly, very gently. like in the scene that's referenced in the op.

i guess my problem with it is that it comes across as if fans only like spuffy because james marsters is hot and people are too dumb to think critically about the media they're consuming. which sure, seeing these dynamics could be harmful if you're a teenager watching, but not more harmful than, say, bangel. not by any standards. bangel might be worse by the simple fact that angel is not supposed to be perceived as a villain so anything he does gets idealized and romanticized, while spike is perceived as a villain and punished for it all the way to the end of the show.

And I find Spike very attractive but I do not ship him with Dru at all, for example. And it's still Spike and JM there. So it's not that easy. And regarding spuffy I believe that the plot tried a lot to deliver the idea that this is not just romanticism and a positive love story. They did a lot of damage to it, intentionally. So the audience should see that it's not that romantic. Unlike the way bangel was shown. Despite of it being controversial they romanticized the sht out of it. That's the difference between these 2 approaches. And that is also why I do not want to support bangel because it's like the plot doesn't want to see the problem in it and push them to your face because they need to support their second show and it's main character. And in contrast to this the plot uses almost every opportunity to do the opposite with spuffy. And that's also the reason why I like their sweet moments, because they are so rare. And you value it because this chemistry deserves it and more. And because it's touching.