rory ☆

tim probably jokes about rematches all the time, jason too. jason and tim have beef, but like they're still brothers, they still care for each other. it's just that next wednesday tim's going to the outlaws current hideout, dressed in a party city red hood suit, and beating the shit out of him because he's planned this shit for years and now is when jason will least expect it. he's not trying to kill him but a few broken bones wouldn't hurt, and then he's going to take some of jasons blood and write 'tim drake was here' just to spice things up.

Where they truly do hold distain for each other.

Jason, who, without hesitation would shoot Tim, for every second that Tim breathes there is just pure loathing in Jason. 

But also Jason, who Tim could knock on his door at 3 am covered in blood, and Jason would raze Gotham to the ground.

Jason, who knows deep in his soul if Tim ever died, he would be following him into the ground only after a massacre so great Slade Wilson would think it's excessive. 

Tim, who finds Jason so fucking annoying that even hearing his name makes him debate slitting his own wrists but is the first person to actually respond to Jason's emergency beacon. Who actually has open access to Crime Alley and is more than happy to bust trafficking rings with him.

They fight on every rooftop of Gotham until one either passes out or they both fall next to each other, the entire time bitching while nursing wounds.

Dick who seriously debates if one day he's just gonna get the phone call that they killed each other. But also once witnessed Tim talk Jason down from a panic attack.

Jason, who actually doesn't have the greatest relationship with Dick anymore but it's not because he doesn't trust him, he struggles with the fact that the hand reaching out isn't followed with a blood stained smirk. It's hard to be so comfortable next to someone only to turn to your other side and see everything you couldn't be.

Jason and Tim, who have never despised someone as much as they despise the other. But they also end every phone call with an I love you.

However, in media that's not always how he's characterized. Oftentimes, especially (but not exclusively) with the 90s dark, gritty, realism trend that shifted superhero stories, Batman isn't hopeful and empathetic, instead he's just another cop. He breaks the rules and crosses the line because no one else is willing to do what must be done. He's ruled by rage and his power comes from his immaculate control of his own impulses. He doesn't refuse to kill people because he believes that anyone can be saved, he refuses to kill people because that is the moral line he's chosen to defend. He'll mercilessly destroy anyone in his path. He'll indirectly lead people to their deaths. He'll cut his own son's throat and leave him to bleed out in the same chunk of pages where he refuses to kill the Joker. That's what gets people upset about the no killing rule. The hypocrisy and arbitrary levels of morality are what frustrate and confuse people.

This topic comes up a lot with Jason Todd, and there's so much debate about who was right or wrong and what was abusive or not, but there is no simple answer. There are so many versions and interpretations of these characters that we can't definitively say who's right or wrong. Is Bruce a spineless hypocrite hiding behind a borrowed moral code? Is Jason a jaded extremist who's using his trauma as an excuse to hurt people? Is Bruce a grieving father who can't give his son what he wants because he truly believes it will only do more harm than good? Is Jason a victim desperately searching for safety and family after losing everything all over again? Are they two people with two different views on what is right who love each other so much that they don't know how to not hurt and be hurt in return? Is it toxic? Is it hopeless? I think that their story can be so many things, and that's the beauty of a franchise like Batman. These characters have so many official versions that there is no meaningful distinction between canon and non-canon. The version you hold in your head and engage with does not need to be the perfect encapsulation of artistic intent because the waters have already been irrevocably muddied by all the different creators who have had their moment. So write the story you want to see, engage with the fan content that you enjoy, change your mind about characters every day.

We need to acknowledge that sometimes Batman's no kill rule is crueler than the alternative and completely senseless, but oftentimes it is a desperate cry for hope and love sprouting from darkness and decay. Sometimes the Red Hood is violent and aggressive without discrimination and cannot be forgiven on the basis of grief alone, but oftentimes Jason is hurting and lonely and deserving of nuance and capable of growth.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Establishing the rule.

(A Death in the Family, originally published in 1988)

First three panels are Jason Todd, make an important note of how his facial features are drawn, as well as his physicality. Bruce Wayne is the bottom right image. Reconcile all this with the fact that Jason is around 15-16 years old at this time.

(assorted Detective Comics, I believe Batman 1940 for the bottom right? either way, these are pre-1988, around 1986 to 1987 maybe)

Mind you he's 13-15 here, and most likely only a year or two younger than his appearance in ADtiF. Got some wonderful side by sides with Bruce too. Compare with the panels above. My oh my, how much this logistically wasted and stunted--because he lived in abject poverty for all his life pre-adoption--boy grows in two years. 😑😑

110% this was done to make his death less tragic, because a grown ass adult dying is more palatable then yk. an itty bitty who was all cape. Additionally, people are more prone to giving children leeway when they make mistakes. If a toddler broke your favourite mug by throwing it against a wall, you'd be more likely to forgive them than a teenager, because maturity tends to come with age.

Not only does Jason looking like an adult, or at the very least an 18 year old soften the blow of his death, it also allows for less blame to be placed on Batman. Subconsciously, you may start to agree with the idea that Jason was reckless, impulsive, but most of all: how he should have known better.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Following the rule.

its titans tower time (Teen Titans 2005)

hey sexy lady 😻😻

Sorry. Now, this one gets a lil tricky because Jason got dipped in the pit, and common headcanon/fandom thoughts that just try to make dc stuff make sense have his malnourishment-stunted growth fixed there. So his size isn't too off for his age/situation. Jason is 18-19 here though, and Tim's like 16. But you don't see that, because Jason's physical appearance is close to Bruce's. Reference the first image here with the Bruce panel above from ADitF. Your honour, its the same picture.

I would say obviously the physical difference between Jason and Tim was to make this event more dramatic and shocking. Which is fine, its a comic. I mean if Jason actually looked 18, this would literally be the equivalent of a high school jumping. Less "Man this is terrible for Tim, I hope he doesn't die" and more "omfg get up 💀💀"

I know DC isn't exactly known for its continuity, but consider:

Under the Red Hood, 2005-2006

This is like the only side by side I could find of Jason and Dick from this point in time.

Now a Tim and Dick side by side.

left is from Robin, 1994 i believe, and the right is Titan/Young Justice: Graduation Day, 2003.

Tim's not as tall as Dick, but its not a 4ft vs 6ft kind of height difference.

Jason often matches Dick's height in comic appearances, and is usually close in muscle mass as well. (im not caring about what their height is said to be rn, we're focusing on the art) Mainly because Dick is DC's favourite, second only to like Batman and Superman. (never wonder woman oh my love how they hate you there. i miss your promised games and how you were never just the girl member of the trinity) And because DC can't let Jason have shit, whenever they fight or collaborate, he and Dick are very very similar in stature.

So why in the flippety frackety fuck is Jason an absolute giant in the 2005 titans? Because the comic wants you to be sympathetic towards Tim. He's the one getting attacked, he's the one getting hurt, he's the victim and Jason's the perp. But we should all know damn well its not that concrete/black and white. Hell, Batman's entire Rogues Gallery has their sympathetic moments.

However, Jason's physical appearance undermines the nuance of the situation, because it makes him look entirely unreasonable. It doesn't look like it could be an even match, or a fight where one person has a slight advantage over the other, it looks like an adult attacking a child. It serves to make Jason appear overly violent and villainous, when in terms of age, its the equivalent of a high school senior punching a sophomore because they took their umbrella when the senior left it at the library table to go to the bathroom. Unreasonable? Sure, depending on your perspective. Murderous? Not so much.

The Titans Tower incident was a fight, where Tim got hit hard. Not an entirely unbalanced assault, and not a murder attempt. Why's it often forgotten that Tim gave as good as he got? Because it looks so unfair, if you don't remember the entire issue panel by panel, you may subconsciously assume it was more violent than it actually was. You remember reading Tim - Jason - fight, and you remember seeing kid - adult - fight. Your big beautiful brain puts together what you remember seeing, and connects it to other similar situations, combining both into a new narrative.

Various "ugly" Jason panels

These weren't even the worst ones and it pained me to do this.

But why is this important? You all know the halo effect. This is the opposite. You may associate poor people to be lazy, and the homeless to be addicts. People who have facial scars are associated with evil/danger. "Ugly" people also bear the horn effect. You judge books by their covers, and that's okay so long as you realize and accept you are doing so. In this case, Jason's physical appearance may reinforce the idea that he is brutish, stupid, aggressive, etc.

And once again, this isn't even true to his character considering how many times he's said to look like Dick, who's said to look like Bruce, who are both considered extremely attractive. I wouldn't give a flying fuck what Jason looked like in comics if it didn't affect other peoples perceptions of his character.

Various "ugly" Tim, Dick, Bruce panels

But Jason's the only ugly one? Right, right.

I'd argue the halo effect's in reverse for this. DC frequently writes/implies Bruce, Tim, and Dick as being smart, capable, and prudent, so we all assume they also must be good looking.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Exception to the rule?

Green Arrow, 2009

whoops sorry, wrong panel.

case 230 of not being able to find a good side by side.

Regardless, Mia and Jason actually have a somewhat similar height and build. Fitting since they're the same age. They match each other decently well in the fight, although Mia does lose (?). But prior to this fight, the comic sets up that Jason is a lot like Green Arrow's villain, Brick.

This run makes you draw parallels between Mia and Jason, and forcibly, Brick and Jason. Now, his physical appearance here matches Mia's (good), and his characterization parallel drawn between Brick is mostly because they're both respectively rogues of Green Arrow and Batman (at this point in time).

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Shifting Into the Conclusion:

I'm going to break my own rules and talk a little about the writing here. It's basically given to you that Brick is faster than he looks. Why wouldn't you assume he's fast? Well, he's built like a brick shithouse (ha), high muscle mass, and durable, you'd assume he goes for blunt force impact a lot of the time. Brute force.

*cracks knuckles* (ha) lets talk about the implications behind that word.

When you say brute force, you mean merely physical. But once again, your big beautiful brain draws connections because its like that. It's important to recognize that even without consciously drawing conclusions, you may associate the adjective with the noun.

Jason is generally characterized as the brawler of the family, next to Bruce. Despite Cassandra and Dick both displaying incredible feats of physical strength, with Dick's weapons literally being baton tasers, they are often characterized as being agile, fast, less blunt, never brutish. Do you see where I'm going yet? Despite often having a similar build to Nightwing, you'd characterize Jason as someone who fights with blunt force because it makes sense for his build and his character. Why?

break in the serious talk to ask why we cant call the escrima sticks Batons. as in like. bat-ons. get it. because bat.

When the story requires him to be more reckless, more angry, more violent, Jason appears more muscular, bigger, older as a byproduct, and overall tankier. Like a brick shithouse. And the story often needs him to be the reckless one, because that is the narrative, and has been the narrative for about *checks watch* a short 37 years.

But why is it a narrative, and not the characterization? Jason has consistently displayed high degrees of planning and intelligence in his exploits, see Green Arrow 2001, #69-72 as one example. (Don't even fight me on this, he ran laps around all three of them.) Same with UTRH. His fighting style mainly involves guns and swords, hand to hand when neither are an option. It's not exactly go-to blunt force with him, same as how Deathstroke and Deadpool have tanky builds but use swords and guns. Hell, Deathstroke's plans get foiled too, and he doesn't get called reckless/stupid to the extent that Jason is. But by biased association, Jason when compared to the rest of the batfamily, is seen as such.

Is it reckless if you don't succeed? Is it bad if you're angry?

Jason is highly paradoxical with how much he plans, wins, runs laps around the batfam on occasion, and is believed to be the most stupid Robin. He's damn near seen as more villainous and more hated than actual villains. He dies protecting his mother, but not a hero. We're simultaneously supposed to believe that he wants nothing more than to sell drugs for his own monetary gain to one-up Batman, and that he came in guns blazing in UTRH because he believed Batman's mode of justice was wrong, that victims need more help than what Batman can offer. The reason why one take is more true to his character than the other, is because of the critical events that define his history.

If Jason cared more about hating Batman, then it wouldn't make sense for him to care so much about the victims like Gloria Stanson, enough for it to drive a rift between him and Bruce, eventually leading to ADitF. If he was stupidly reckless, why wouldn't he risk Sheila's life/safety and fight back against the Joker? If Jason is so blindingly angry, why hasn't he once tried to, and follow through on killing a member of the batfamily?

Because of the way comics are made, your brain isn't just taking in the words on the page. The art affects how you take in the message. Don't believe me? Believe history.

but like mainly the first one. The words are effective and the art draws attention to them. It will be, and forever is, that deep.

NEVER forget how itty bitty she is

bonus max: