Not Everyone Is Dtf, Timothy.

They couldn’t have cared less that forcing her to carry an already dead fetus to term, and then deliver it even though it had a 9:1 ration of her dying, because “Abortion is murder”.

Abortion helps predators cover up crimes

Abortion aids trafficking and exploitation

Abortion forces women to kill their child for a career or education 

Abortion doesn’t bring women out of poverty 

Pressuring, manipulating, coercing, or otherwise forcing pregnant people to continue or to terminate their pregnancy would violate their bodily autonomy and reproductive rights.

Having the right to make your own reproductive decisions is empowering.

Having your body and rights violated is not.

Consider an analogy: May we do whatever we want with anything that is on our private property? May we attack or kill innocent people who are passing through or seeking refuge? No, we must respect the rights of other people. Mere ownership does not give me the right to kill innocent people whom I find on my property. 

May a pregnant woman ingest drugs that she knows will cause her child to be deformed or disabled? Clearly not. And if knowingly harming the child is wrong, killing one  (through abortion) is even worse. Bodily autonomy is important, but there are obvious limits to that autonomy when someone else’s body is also involved.

The right to control one’s body does not justify the intentional killing of others. Nor does it nullify our obligations to the youngest and most vulnerable members of the human family.

Indeed, the autonomy argument turns common sense and justice upside down. The unique nature of pregnancy — the bodily dynamic between an unborn child and her mother — is not, as the argument supposes, a reason to think that killing or neglect is permissible. It is, instead, a reminder that human beings are connected to and dependent on each other.

An unborn child is not an intruder. They are precisely where they naturally belong at that point in their development. If the child doesn’t belong in the mother’s womb, where do they belong?

A person’s body is not comparable to property. But, if you really want to go THAT route, I’d suggest you research castle laws/doctrines. Next.

Yes, pregnant people may injest drugs that they know could harm the embryo/zygote/fetus. Next.

That’s it? Cool.

People, including those who are pregnant, have the right to decide if they want kids, how many kids they want, when they want to have kids, etc. A person may even decide to use contraception, even though this would be “actively doing something to prevent someone else from having a life.”

People also have the right to decide who uses their body and for what purpose. Even if someone needed to use your body for survival, you could decide not to allow this. For example, organ donations are voluntary. Even though one donor could potentially save 8 lives, they could decide not to donate. It doesn’t matter if the person needs the donation because of their actions (i.e. they caused a car accident), or if it was their child or other family member. They could still decide not to donate.

All together, this means a person, while pregnant, has the right to decide if their pregnancy is continued or terminated. And if you were to pressure, manipulate, coerce, or otherwise force a person to continue or to terminate their pregnancy, this would violate their bodily autonomy and reproductive rights.

Yeah, I appealed to the unborn baby’s bodily autonomy in hopes that you’d understand a bit more since you’re so hung up on bodily autonomy anyway. So, are you saying that people who are physically dependent don’t have a right to bodily autonomy? Welp, say goodbye to the bodily autonomy of all those people on life-support or anyone who is literal dependent on anything or any person.

Ah yes, the utterly stupid “right to refuse argument” which contends that a woman has a right to refuse to let the unborn child use her body to survive just as a person is not obligated to donate an organ to save the life of someone else.

This argument has enormous problems. Abortion, in the vast majority of cases, is not merely the withholding or withdrawing of “life support” from the unborn child — it is the intentional and active killing of that child, often by dismemberment. This killing violates the child’s right to life (the right not to be intentionally killed) and the right to bodily integrity. Indeed, if people have a right to bodily integrity and so do not have a duty to donate a kidney, then people in utero have a right not to have their bodily integrity fatally violated through abortion.

Moreover, even if abortion were not intentional killing (i.e if it were simply a refusal to aid the child by removing her from the womb), abortion would still be wrong because a pregnant woman does have an obligation to allow her baby to live and grow in the womb. Here’s why.

First, the father and mother, except in cases of rape, willingly engaged in an activity that caused (and is biologically ordered to) the creation of a new, dependent human being. So they bear responsibility for the resulting child. Second, parents have special obligations to their dependent offspring that they do not have to others. Fathers, for example, must pay child support even if they did not intend or desire to become fathers. Parents may not abandon their children or refuse to provide for their needs (though they may relinquish those obligations through adoption).

The parental obligation may not require extraordinary acts (like donating a kidney), but it does require basic, ordinary care, such as the nourishment and shelter provided during pregnancy. If unborn children are valuable members of the human family, like born children, then the same parental duties that apply after birth are present beforehand as well.

Finally, the purpose of the uterus is to gestate the unborn child — it is where that child belongs. All human beings, during their prenatal stages of development, rely on it for care and protection. The uterus exists for the unborn child rather than for the mother. It is reasonable to think that a child has a right to live in her natural environment.

I’d like to break it down a little bit, beginning with the comparison of a mother’s providing for a fetus to someone being “forced to donate blood, tissue, or organs.” There is a huge discrepancy here that isn’t being noted: when you fail to donate blood, tissue, or organs, you are not directly killing a human being. Yes, your lack of donation could lead to the death or ailment of someone. However, with an abortion, a child is being killed, by your own hand, by your own choice. Not simply getting its resources removed. A fetus clearly doesn’t have the ability to speak or to persuade the mother to keep it, either. The parallel cannot be clearly drawn here for that reason.

So far, you’ve compared a pregnant person’s body to property and a machine. Not a great route to take.

Wait, so even if abortion is comparable to organ donations, then pregnant people still wouldn’t have the same rights as a potential donor? Unbelievable.

1. It doesn’t matter if the pregnancy is a result of sex or rape. And if it does matter to you (i.e. if you support a rape exception), then your issue is with people having sex. Not abortion.

2. A person may actually abandon their child. Add “safe haven laws” to your list of things to research. Oh, and it might be a good idea to add “bodily autonomy,” while you’re at it.

2a. If donating a kidney is an “extraordinary act”, so is pregnancy and childbirth.

3. The uterus is part of the pregnant person’s body. To say it exists for anyone else is unreasonable.

It actually doesn’t matter if you think it’s right or wrong for another person to make their own reproductive decisions. It’s not your pregnancy, it’s not your body, it’s not your decision. If someone else wants or needs to abort their pregnancy, you thinking it’s wrong should not stop them from aborting. They should not have their rights and body violated because you think abortion is wrong.

I’d assume you also think it’s wrong for a person to decide not to donate organs, as they would not be fulfilling their obligation to the other humans who are connected and dependent on them. Either way, that also doesn’t matter.

You’re right: It doesn’t matter if the pregnancy is a result of sex or rape. A human being is always a human being, no matter how they were created. Pregnancy and childbirth are natural parts of life and is something a woman’s body is literally designed to do. 

Abortion isn’t equality; it’s hypocrisy. You’re literally saying that one human being has less value than another solely based on their size, location, and level of dependency. The only “freedom” of abortion, is freedom from your own responsibilities. 

Carrying a pregnancy to term isn’t giving up the right to control their own body. You can still do whatever you want while you’re pregnant, you’re simply advised against doing certain things like drinking or smoking. But is alcohol really worth killing your own child? 

If you think that killing a pain-capable unborn child by ripping it limb from limb for any reason is perfectly okay, then you’re a bad person. I’m sorry.

Sex is a natural part of life and something a person’s body is designed to do. Yet, nonconseusal sex is wrong.

No, but feel free to point out where I literally said that.

If a person *has no choice* but to carry the pregnancy to term, than they do not have control over their body. If you can do whatever you want while you’re pregnant, then you can get an abortion if you want.

“Perverted baby-murdering ways”? Someone has been sipping a little too much of that pro-life kool-aid.

But, you’re right about one thing. It’s pointless to continue. Have a day.

P.S. https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-46/page-6.html#h-9

Either they usually admit they think pregnant people should be forced to carry a baby to term (that’s considered torture, folks!) that’s a result of assault, or that there’s a difference in their mind between a fetus made consensually and non consensually.

Abortion does not help predators cover up crimes, it is not a way for men to avoid responsibility, it doesn’t uwu force uwu a pregnant person to murder their child or have a career. Many many MANY peoplee with infants still work. It doesn’t aid in tradfixking or exploitation. Actually, human trafficking victims are encouraged to have a child, so they won’t be able to leave. Abortion actually CAN help women get out of poverty.

Dont act like you are having an abortion because you “care about the baby.” You don’t care about her at all. All you care about is yourself. You don’t want to get fat, you don’t want to get stretch marks, you don’t want to have to give up alcohol.

Anyways if you’re a man, you deserve the same love and respect as a woman. If you’ve been abused or raped, you matter. If you want to kill yourself, please don’t, there are people who care about you, there are people who love you. Also heterosexual people exist. And if you’re a man in a hetero relationship, theres nothing wrong with you no matter what this disgusting excuse for a human thinks. Men are just as important as women.

Anyways if you’re a man, you deserve the same love and respect as a woman. If you’ve been abused or raped, you matter. If you want to kill yourself, please don’t, there are people who care about you, there are people who love you. Also heterosexual people exist. And if you’re a man in a hetero relationship, theres nothing wrong with you no matter what this disgusting excuse for a human thinks. Men are just as important as women.