name: mnbvah, lookie, l444
species: human (he/him)
age: 21
current interests: Undertale/Deltarune, ralsei, Dragon Ball, JJK, ralsusie, ralsei
other info: i'm currently suffering in the depths of hell known as 'university', i've also been a dragon ball roleplayer for 7 years until july 2025, dabbled in writting and art (non serious), if you want to find my slop it should be down there somewhere
will defend against megumi slander, ralsei erasure, ralsusie slander and 'deltarune player is evil' allegations with my dying breath
i've also opened my ask box so you can go ahead and torment me there
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With us being 4 Chapters in, halfway through the game, and still not knowing what object Ralsei embodies, I think part of it could be due to his Light World form being something unusual, but I think another, possibly bigger, reason for this narrative choice not to reveal what he embodies has to do with the theme of Darkners being people, despite what he tries to tell us.
Ralsei claims that Darkners are just objects, that they don't matter, that they love serving their purpose, and in Chapter 1 he even said that being useful to Lightners is the only way for them to be fulfilled, but Susie has consistently questioned this or shut it down; this is one way that we as the audience are nudged towards questioning it. Darkners are also written with the same complexity as Lightners, and most of them are content in Castle Town, where they're just living their lives in the Dark World and forming social bonds with each other, largely away from Lightners, and not being "useful".
Even Tenna, another lonely Darkner with low self worth, who reduces himself to just being a TV and claims he was happy just serving his purpose, indicates that he has dreams beyond it. As the Chapter 5 cutscene shows, his unhappiness in Castle Town doesn't come from being useless, but rather from being lonely in the Dark World; he lost his partner (the only person that truly understood him), and then seemingly lost a friend as a result, being left all alone. He dreamed of having a family with Spamton, he dreamed of traveling... he has desires beyond his purpose, and when his survival doesn't depend on being useful, those desires actually appear to matter more to him.
We're clearly meant to question the idea that Darkners are just objects, that they have no desires outside of their purpose, or that serving their purpose will give them a truly happy and fulfilling life. Especially when you consider the existence of a Darkner like Spamton, for whom being useful to Lightners is outright impossible; he's spam mail, doomed to be ignored and useless.
Ralsei himself wishes he could join Kris and Susie on their adventures in the Light World, wishes he could do their homework, and is starting to develop interests and opinions that aren't in service of Lightners; the previous lack of those wasn't due to him naturally being just an object with no real feelings, but due to him repressing himself because he believed he's not "supposed" to have any real personality or desires. He also claims that being useful is what makes Darkners happy, but we see that the things that actually make him happy are spending time with his friends and being treated like a friend rather than a servant; being comforted when he's upset, being told it's okay not to smile... he's not being "useful" there, and his Lightner friends are actually caring for him, but it makes him feel better.
He's clearly not just an object. He's a person. And I think the choice to not reveal what object he embodies is, at least in part, meant to emphasize this, along with his visual design.
If the player doesn't know what object Ralsei embodies, that makes it harder for them to reduce him to just being said object. There are theories about what his Light World form is, but we still don't have anything concrete. The player only gets to knowingly interact with him in the Dark World, where he is a person. His Dark World form strongly resembles the Dreemurrs, which is brought up even within the narrative itself, where he's especially noted to resemble Asriel (their names are even anagrams of each other). He could easily be another child in the family, and he wouldn't look out of place; the pink horns are a small enough difference that they could be assumed to be some kind of fantasy condition or just a color variation.
In the Dark World, he looks like a lost Dreemurr kid, and he acts like a kid. This, along with our lack of knowledge of his Light World form, makes it harder to believe him when he says he's nothing more than an object, and makes it more apparent that he's an unreliable narrator.
YES. EXACTLY. I find it so interesting that any Ralsei Object theory is incapable of providing a full picture of his character, and that the more we know about him, the less certain any one particular object becomes. Not to mention that the game has directly disproven the idea that he's something Kris carries around with them. Whatever Ralsei is, it's entirely secondary to who he is as a person, but the game has left the object, the thing that we can use to overwrite his identity with something else, as an open question about his character, leaving us to weigh the question of what Ralsei is as opposed to who Ralsei is. We want to find an answer to what he is so we can better understand him, fit him into the rules of Darkners that we've been given, but we risk losing that understanding if we hold ourselves to the "what question" too closely and sacrifice the ability to think of him as a person.
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This is gonna be a shorter post than usual from me; I just wanted to air out some quick thoughts I have on the Last Prophecy. Of course, right now we aren't really in a position to confidently reach any secure conclusion about what the Last Prophecy is, but I do think we can establish some basic facts about it and rule out some things which it probably isn't. This way, we can come to a rudimentary idea about what to expect, and we'll be better equipped to suss out what it actually is should we get substantive new information in the next Chapters.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS THE LAST PROPHECY
Obvious, maybe, but it's worth stating. The Last Prophecy is the ending of the prophecy, which is to say that it's one of the very last events that the prophecy accounts for. An unused variation of the prophecy states "FOR TO SAVE THE WORLDS, WE LAST OF ALL SAY", which further emphasizes that these are some of the very last lines of the prophecy. It is likely that "ONLY THEN, WILL THE WORLDS BE SAVED" is the very final line in the prophecy. The Last Prophecy probably happens right before, concurrently with, or right after the prophesied banishing of the Angel, given that we know from Ralsei's summary that the saving of the worlds centers around banishing the Angel's Heaven. Ralsei speaks of the Last Prophecy synonymously with the "one ending" which Toby has teased multiple times when talking about Deltarune.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS A TRAGEDY
The Last Prophecy is described as a tragedy in the prophecy. This could simply be a fancy way of communicating that it's a sad event, but I'm inclined to take the specific rhetoric here more seriously. A key feature of most classic tragedies is that they are, seemingly at least, preventable. Frequently, in fact, tragic heroes are given prophetic information about the impending catastrophe, which leads them to try to prevent it. However, because of the hero's hamartia - a tragic error, usually resulting from a lack of information - they unwittingly bring about their own downfall. By the end, both the audience and the hero are liable to judge the events that have unfolded as a kind of cruel joke played by fate itself (often embodied by some specific god(s)) and the callous injustice triggers cathartic feelings of sympathy and mourning in the audience. All this is to say that Susie knowing about the Last Prophecy might be a significant part of the prophecy coming about, and that fate will likely be playing cruel tricks to make it inadvertently result from whatever actions she takes.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS THE FINAL TRAGEDY
"THE FINAL TRAGEDY" only unveils "WHEN ALL HOPE IS LOST FOR THE TALE". This is significant context, because it tells us that this ending will follow a series of unfortunate events which will likely distill feelings of hopelessness in both the heroes and the audience. The end of the world seems all but inevitable, but then a final option presents itself, involving some terrible event needing to happen in exchange for the saving of the worlds; this option, however, is no cause for celebration, and judging by the way Ralsei speaks about it, the cost may be so great that the victory is pyrrhic at best.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS NECESSARY TO SAVE THE WORLDS
The Last Prophecy is not arbitrary and does not happen in isolation. It has a specific causal relationship with the saving of the worlds, and is in fact the only option the prophecy presents for that to happen, at least given the events which previously transpire in the prophecy. Ralsei, however, thinks there might be another option to save the worlds, seemingly involving kindness, but it would require early intervention to change the course of the prophecy.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS A CONSCIOUSLY WILLED ACTION
Tumblr user duxarcana translates the unused variation as "If (one) intends to save the world(s)". This gives us the important information that the Last Prophecy involves something which the heroes must consciously decide to do with the specific intent of saving the world.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS IMMEDIATELY INTUITIVE
Susie does not look at the prophecy for more than a few seconds before destroying it, and takes no time to interpret its possible meanings. This suggests that the prophecy does not use vague or ambiguous language but instead bluntly states what happens in such a fashion that its meaning is immediately clear.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS EXTREMELY BAD
It cannot be emphasized enough: the Last Prophecy is insanely, catastrophically terrible. It's so bad that Ralsei, whose purpose is to be the Lightners' guide and to follow the events of the prophecy (a purpose he takes very seriously), attempts immediately to subvert the prophecy and guide it towards a different path. It's so bad that Ralsei is having a Chapter-long panic attack throughout the Dark Sanctuaries and hyperventilating and crying to Susie about the prospect of her seeing it. It's so bad that Susie's immediate instinct is to smash it with her fist in rage and panic.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS ABSURD
The Last Prophecy isn't just bad, it's apparently also kind of ridiculous.
Susie says:
* You're worried about THAT!? Seriously!?
* ... this stupid prophecy?
* Like something like that would happen.
[...]
* Why wouldn't you laugh?
* It's just stupid.
Susie's obviously indulging in some pretty wishful thinking here - she has good reason to believe that the prophecy should be taken seriously - but her reaction nonetheless speaks to an absurd quality of the Last Prophecy. Susie has a hard time seeing how things could possibly get that bad. The scenario just doesn't really make sense to her, so she laughs at it, and finds the idea that it would happen 'stupid'. Obviously, Susie is pretty scared, deep down. But she uses the outward absurdity of the scenario the Last Prophecy is presenting to discredit it, in an attempt to ease the worries of both herself and Ralsei. This tells us that the Last Prophecy is something of a twist - it's not something you'd expect to happen, and it's hard to predict how things could develop in that direction.
THE LAST PROPHECY INVOLVES THE GIRL
The Last Prophecy first appears in the Second Sanctuary, right off the heels of prophecies about the Girl:
"AND LAST, WAS THE GIRL.
AT LAST, WAS THE GIRL"
"LOVE FINDS ITS WAY
TO THE GIRL."
The fact that a prophecy about the Girl involves her coming "last" also suggests her ties to the Last Prophecy.
Ralsei is particularly concerned about Susie seeing the Last Prophecy. In isolation this doesn't tell us too much, because Ralsei is likely aware that Kris already knows the prophecy (which we also know because Kris plays music from future chapters on the piano, including a piece internally titled lastprophecy). That said, it further contributes to the feeling that the Last Prophecy is narratively tied to Susie specifically. It could also have to do with Noelle, if we take "love finding its way to the Girl" to be alluding to Susie's love interest (alternatively, if we take Noelle to be a candidate for the role of the Girl).
THE LAST PROPHECY IS WHY RALSEI HAS BEEN ACTING STRANGE
* I'm sorry, Kris.
* I'm sorry I didn't say the whole prophecy at first.
* I just
* I thought if I said something different
* If we did something different
* If we were just kind enough
* Perhaps by the time we got here... it would change.
In the 1-2 era, it was widely agreed that Ralsei behaved suspiciously. Ralsei reveals here that the reason for his being so reticent to share certain bits of information is that he was trying to prevent the Last Prophecy. This tracks with some of the things he said in Chapter 1:
* This world is full of all kinds of people, Kris.
* In the end, how we treat them makes all the difference.
* So let's try our best to get by without FIGHTing.
* If we can manage to do that...
* I believe this tale may have a happy ending.
* Otherwise, I fear that...
* ... you may not... find the result favorable.
Ralsei's advocacy for a pacifist playstyle is here explicitly tied to Ralsei's desire for a happy ending. For whatever reason, he believes that using violence is the sort of thing that would bring the Last Prophecy about.
* Kris...
* Perhaps I shouldn't have been so hard on her.
* ...
* But, I just worry that if Susie is too eager to fight...
* Then...
* Well, let's just be kind to her, OK, Kris?
Again, Susie seems to figure heavily in Ralsei's thoughts about the Last Prophecy. He really doesn't want Susie to use violence. Pretty uncharacteristically, he snaps at her a bit in Chapter 1 over her eagerness to fight. He feels bad about being hard on her, but he's especially worried about her using violence. Ultimately, he falls back to his general rule: "let's just be kind".
Advocating for a Pacifist playstyle is not the only thing that Ralsei does in an attempt to prevent the Last Prophecy. He says "I thought if I said something different", which seems to be alluding to the fact that he gives the heroes a modified version of the prophecy in Chapter 1, which neglects to mention the Roaring, the Titans, the Knight, and the Last Prophecy. It's quite possible all of these things factor heavily into the Last Prophecy taking place. Ralsei seems to be afraid of 'speaking these things into existence', and it appears that he believes if he successfully prevents the heroes from knowing about them, he stands a better chance of steering the prophecy away from these things. Ralsei's refusal to talk about the Knight at all until the end of Chapter 3 is particularly strange, and even in Chapter 4 he's still advising the heroes not to worry too much about it.
* … If it's any consolation…
* I don't sense any immediate danger.
* If the Knight's only goal was to hurt people…
* They would have acted sooner, right?
* For now, let's make sure no one else gets taken.
* … Susie…
* I understand how you're feeling, but…
* We… have our own advantages, too!
* The Knight only seems to show its face in the Dark World.
* If we can just seal the Fountain over to the right…
* Then… it'll at least… buy us a little more time.
* … until we… have to face our difficulties again.
And at the end of Chapter 4 Ralsei seems very panicked about the Knight creating a Titan. It seems as if the Knight creating the Titan confirms to Ralsei that his actions have been in vain, that the prophecy hasn't been changed and they're still en route to the calamity awaiting them in the Last Prophecy.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS A TRAGEDY FOR THE LIGHTNERS
Ralsei's arc throughout Deltarune's narrative involves him coming to value himself, his autonomy and his own identity. But this necessitates starting from a position of not valuing himself at all. This is perhaps most clearly on display in Chapter 3, where Ralsei tries to urge Susie not to care about him too much, and tries to convince Tenna that caring about his own desires as opposed to the needs of the Lightners is selfish. It's clear to me, then, that the Last Prophecy is not about Ralsei dying, or the Darkners being permanently sealed away, or anything like that. Ralsei simply would not care this much about that - his primary concern is and always has been the Lightners. If the Last Prophecy were about the Darkners going away, he would simply do what he did in Chapter 3, and urge Susie and Kris to forget about him. I also find it unlikely Susie would seemingly think the Last Prophecy is an unthinkably absurd scenario which none of them would let happen if it was something as predictable as the Dark Worlds needing to be sealed away - something which Ralsei has been clear about from the very first Chapters. I get that Susie is slow on the uptake, but like, c'mon.
THE LAST PROPHECY IS SOMETHING SUSIE THINKS THE HEROES WOULDN'T LET HAPPEN
Susie (thinks she) knows her friends, and she (thinks she) knows that they would never let whatever happens in the Last Prophecy transpire. This suggests that whatever act the Last Prophecy describes likely involves a callousness that we wouldn't expect from the Fun Gang.
THE LAST PROPHECY REPRESENTS AN END TO THE HEROES' FRIENDSHIP
Following some confident posturing, Susie gets pretty morose after seeing the Last Prophecy and says to Kris:
* Hey, Kris...
* ...
* Can I tell you
* ... a stupid dream
I have?
* ...
* No matter what
* I... want to keep
being friends
with you and Ralsei.
* When the sun
comes up again...
* I want tomorrow
to be the same
as yesterday.
* And the next day
* To be just the
same as that.
* That in the end
* We can always go back
to the way things were
before.
* ...
* You don't have
to say anything back,
Kris.
* I...
* ...
* I know...
* You're thinking the
same thing
* ... aren't you, dumbass?
The placement of this monologue here suggests that whatever Susie saw in the Last Prophecy has her worried that her friendship with Kris and Ralsei might not last forever.
THE LAST PROPHECY HAS A DEDUCIBLE RHYME SCHEME
The prophecy regularly employs an AABB rhyme scheme.
And wouldn't you know it, in the Last Prophecy we read:
AND THEN. WHEN ALL HOPE IS LOST FOR THE TALE
THE FINAL TRAGEDY UNVEILS.
TO SAVE THE WORLDS, THERE IS ONLY ONE WAY.
[ Prophecy panel shattered ]
And if you have any doubt, the unused variation seals the deal:
FOR TO SAVE THE WORLDS, WE LAST OF ALL SAY:
From this we can deduce that the Last Prophecy ends on an "-ay" sound, rhyming with the words "say" and "way".
Here's a list of possible candidates:
ASTRAY
AWAY
BETRAY
DAY
DISMAY
GRAY
LAY
PAY
PLAY
PRAY
PREY
SLAY
STAY
It could also be a word that imperfectly rhymes with "way".
We can also deduce that the Last Prophecy is likely somewhere in the range of 7-10 syllables long.
THE LAST PROPHECY PROBABLY DESCRIBES THE DREAM WHICH SPAWNED DELTARUNE
Toby Fox has spoken multiple times about the fact that the inspiration for Deltarune came from a fever dream he had in 2011 about the ending of a video game. We don't definitively know that the Last Prophecy was the subject of this dream (for example, the Last Prophecy could hypothetically come to pass in Chapter 6, opening the way for the actual ending which was the subject of the dream, or there could be a postgame with a different ending like in Undertale, etc.), but it would make a lot of sense if it was. The Last Prophecy (the "one ending") being conceptualized first and the rest of the plot having been written backwards from it would tie very neatly into the fatalistic themes of the game, and it introduces a very interesting metafictional parallel between Gaster - whose Deltarune is "still waiting" while the other characters try in vain to resist its coming - and Toby, who's been waiting for more than a decade to depict the dream he had, but may have grown attached to the characters he only initially conceived of as pawns to fulfill the original vision he had. The tension between the inevitability of the ending and the struggle to hope that things can change would be a living part of the text itself.
I'm sorry but I find it baffling spamton is aware of the player
I know that [Angel], [Angel] line exists but Noelle is right there. And after you buy the thorn ring he states that "it might sting" so he's referring to her
What's more is that after that scene Spamton never addresses the player or the angel. When it's him and Kris in a 1v1 Neo fight at the end of the weird route he never refers to Kris as the angel or makes mentions of any entity pulling the strings and controlling Kris. All that he refers to Kris as is either "kid" or "little sponge".
KID! I'M BUSY BECOMING [God]. GO PLAY [Minecrap] OR SOMETHING!
I REMEMBER WHENYOU WERE JUSTA LOST [Little Sponge]
ENJOY THE FIREWORKS,KID!!!!
What is happening then?
Well, Spamton is a salesman. He's trying to sell the thorn ring, so I find it obvious he'd try to play words and smooth talk, hence he refers to Noelle as an "Angel". The fact that he calls her "side chick" or "hochi Mama" is telling.
* ... WAIT! WAIT [ONE 2nd]! IS THAT MY [Esteem Custom3r]?!
* THANKS TO YOU AND THAT LIL [Hochi Mama]
* I AM LIVING [Big]!
NO, I GET IT!IT'S YOU AND
THAT [Hochi Mama]!
YOU THINK MAKING [Frozen Chicken] WITH YOUR [Side Chick]
And yes, there is the thing with Spamton calling towards heaven "HEAVEN, ARE YOU WATCHING!?". Point is, Spamton is borderline batshit insane, especially after ascending into NEO, and likely his mind is making things up. Even the narration supports this with Spamton interacting with an audience that isn't even there
Spamton turns to the audience and laughs.
* Spamton appeals to the audience with a festive jig!
* Spamton begs to the audience, Spamton prays to the audience.
* There is no audience.
* Spamton begs the audience to stop taking the furniture out of his room.
If this were in-game, this'd be what would play before the credits rolled.
Text in case my chicken scratch is unintelligible:
"(He's breathing slowly. It might be your imagination, but he seems cold...)
Finish the job.
You gently place the pillow onto his face. Then you push. And push. You make sure no air can enter his lungs. You hold it down. He twitches. He lurches. He bucks up and down, trying to resist even in his current state. But you keep the pillow down. Until...
(Your LOVE increased!)"
bonus because i thought it would be a cool callback:
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