plus the wip i gave up on bc i didnt like batman's face lolol
it was a bit of a dan mora study that i wasnt taking too seriously- just rlly in the face and hair but i still hated it lol. maybe ill do an actual dan mora study bc his style is sooo yummy
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rotating dick grayson in my head like a rotisserie chicken...
returning to this post for a moment — it's intriguing how nightwing is popularly & textually perceived as a beacon of faith, hope, light, redemption, etc, not only in contrast to batman, but also by those whose lives he touches (eg superman: american alien #4, “darkness needs light; fear needs hope”) (eg detective comics #1000, “he will be better. a hero forged in the light”) (eg nightwing vol2 #99, which i personally feel is a must-read, “ever since you were a child, i have seen in you such luminosity of spirit... it was truly almost visible—/ ...but of course he has optimism! he has had you”) (eg justice league of america (2007) #11, one of my favorite comics ever — roy harper & mari mccabe trapped beneath a rapidly flooding building... & then swimming toward the light, “like dick taught me/ ... everything we need—it’s all within us”) — you get the picture — and yet simultaneously the corners of dick’s mind pre-taylor run are often pulled taut between anxiety, adrenaline, doubt, despair, & sheer desperate bone-headed will-to-power (eg new teen titans, titans (1999), nightwing (1996-2009, sans tomasi's run maybe), outsiders (2003), batman/nightwing: bloodborne, etc)...
there is such an impressive (?) schism between the self as perceived by the self vs as received by others, like even in spite of his insufferable, high-handed, hot-then-cold dick graysonisms, even for people for whom he exists as a fallible person & not (purely?) an uncorrupted ideal, he's still associated with hope & perseverance... in a way i feel that grayson #5 (the famous dick-in-the-desert issue, one of my favorites from that run) & nightwing vol3 #30 (“we fall because someone pushes us. we get up to push back”) kinda-sorta scratch the surface of it — that dick keeps moving not because his faith in (insert whatever core value the comic wants to explore here) is unassailable, but because — & i'm spitballing here, so maybe there is a better way to phrase it — someone must (gotham knights # "dick, leave it alone"/"i can't, you didn't teach me how")... it's almost like a childlike denial? it must be so, it must be this way, i refuse to heel... but personally speaking i think that must mean so much to other people, in a way that's probably incomprehensible to dick himself (in part because he knows very acutely when/where he's faltered...)
five months and more than a 110K words later, the last chapter of door, opening is up 🥲💔 thank you all for coming with me on this adventure, and I hope to write more for this universe in the future!
When people say that Dick “has a temper” what do they mean? Is he the type to blow up over an inconvenience, be impatient, or rage-quit?
Ahhhh, I had a lot of fun with this. Thanks for the ask, anon. <3
My main feeling about Dick's temper is it's an important part of his characterization, and it's a fun part of his characterization, but I also try not to overemphasize it? A lot of my thoughts are here; also @theflyingwonder has some good panel collections here and here and here if you want to see what Dick generally looks like when he's grumpy about something.
General thoughts / caveats:
Anger is obviously not the only emotion Dick ever feels!! He feels many other emotions too!! The fact that he is capable of getting really angry sometimes does not mean that he is angry all the time!!
He's a person who feels emotions very deeply - anger, love, loyalty, etc. - but also has a very conflicted relationship with his emotions. He aspires to be perfectly controlled, like he imagines Bruce is, and he's ashamed of moments when he loses control. Because he's wound pretty tight and represses a lot, his emotions can be a bit explosive when he loses his grip on them.
I would never describe him as "an angry person." He doesn't walk around fuming at the world and looking for things to be mad about, y'know? He's a person who wants to be optimistic and tries to be optimistic. This very much includes when he's Robin.
He wouldn't blow up over an inconvenience unless he was already really upset about something more serious. But yeah, if he's upset about something important, sometimes he'll lash out at whatever's closest.
He's methodical and focused; he'll sometimes get impatient when he's, say, bored by his friends' TV preferences, and in general he gets restless and likes to be moving, but if he's got a challenging task to complete he's completely capable of hyper-focusing on it.
In his civilian life, he generally has a pretty good grip on the anger - so e.g. I don't remember him ever shouting at Clancy or civilian friends in general. When a reporter tries to get dirt on him by interviewing his neighbors at his apartment complex, they universally gush about how nice he is.
Meanwhile, in his vigilante life, he's got a rigid moral code and a rigid sense of duty. He cares a lot about helping people and protecting civilians, and he's emotionally-fulfilled by it, and he can be very kind. But he's also a super-intense person who takes his responsibilities seriously, and he'll get sharp with people that he feels aren't being serious enough. He only screws around when he's with people who are very serious themselves, like Bruce.
In an argument, Dick's generally direct and confrontational: he'll snap at you to your face, not sulk behind your back. Even when he's being a bit more passive-aggressive, he's not subtle about it. If Dick's annoyed with you, you'll know. If he doesn't like you, he makes it obvious.
Jean-Paul: I've seen you with Robin - you like Robin.
Dick: You got a problem with Robin?
Jean-Paul: No! I like Robin, too. He's an exceptional young man. I just mean... it's obvious when you like someone. And equally obvious that you don't like me. (GK 14)
Dick's just a very dynamic character in general, rather than a static one. When he's relaxed, he can be very easygoing and friendly; if you get off on the wrong foot with him, he's prickly and often harsh. He's got a very serious core, a strong sense of principle, and a passionate sense of loyalty to the people he cares about. Here's a light-hearted moment with Dick and Tim fooling around playing tag:
Dick (grabbing Tim from above): Gotcha!
Tim: Augh! (B: Transference)
This is from the exact same arc as the panel at the top - but before Hugo Strange almost kills Bruce. And just in general I think this panel is a good reminder that Dick does all kinds of things that are not about being angry, that he's also the person who keeps Tim fed and repeatedly saves him from falling, that sometimes he'll pour his heart out to Bruce, that he really really really loves his friends, and so on.
Now, all that said, if you would like an extensive deep dive into Dick yelling at people (and really, who wouldn't? yelling is fun!), I've collected a super-long list of quotes which I've attempted to corral into organization. Below the cut:
Dick vs. criminals
Dick vs. Bruce
Dick + list of reasons he gets upset
Dick + annoyance at friends/teammates
Dick + lashing out at loved ones (rare! but, uh, very memorable)
Dick + first meetings with future siblings (+Steph)
In conclusion
Anger at Criminals
Dick's temper is an important part of how he thinks of himself: he's intensely self-aware about his temper and also conflicted about it. It comes up most often when he's fighting criminals, especially when they're threatening people he loves:
Dick (internally): At first, I couldn't believe what they were saying… but as the truth sank in, I felt a rage growing so great inside me - that it felt like I was just a part of the anger, instead of it being a part of me.
Kid!Dick: Those animals! They murdered my mother and father! I'm going to the police!
Bruce: No... not yet. (Secret Origins 13)
Deathwing: You've been so angry for so long, Dick. Learn to accept it because you have no choice. You will become me, Dick, and I know because I am your worst nightmare! I am you!
Dick: Never! I'm not you and I'll never be you! Yeah, I get angry. Sometimes I get so pissed I want to break everything in sight. But everyone gets mad. Everyone gets frustrated. But I don't fight out of anger! I fight when there's something wrong that needs to be stopped! And that's why I'll never be you! I don't fight to kill - I fight to protect! And what you said about Batman - well, pal, screw you. He's the best mentor anyone ever had! (NT 100)
Dick (internally): I hit him harder than I should. Not sure why. It worries me that it feels so right. (N 2)
Dick: I thought I was more in control than that. But I lost it.
Tim: It was made right, Dick. The Joker is alive and not well in a maximum security cell.
Dick: It’s not right with me. I never thought I could be a killer. I’m wrong. There’s a part of me I never saw before. The rage. I never felt anger like that. I feel like it clawed me up inside. (N 64)
Dick (internally): Nothing Jason says can be taken for truth. He says Tim is dead. I'll need more proof than his word and an empty cowl. Because right now, I need to keep that hope alive. If for nothing else, then to keep me from losing control… and I won't let that happen. Can't let that happen. Can't.
Dick (punching Jason): WHERE IS HE, JASON?
Jason: Depends on what kind of life he led.
Dick (breaking Jason's nose, then internally): There goes his nose. Control your anger. (BftC 3)
Jason (internally): Dick is different from Bruce. In the way he fights. In the way he thinks. And the way he feels. And he gets angry. Really angry. That anger, it'd make him a great Batman, if he'd let it. He's trying too much to be like him. The good son. Man, I hate him. (B&R 25)
So something you'll notice about all of these moments is that Dick isn't proud of his anger. He doesn't experience it as cathartic, and he isn't proud of the things he does when he's angry. His anger is an enemy; it's the person he doesn't want to be, to the extent that after the fact being angry almost feels like an out-of-body experience, because in the burn of anger he'll do things that his conscious mind rejects.
I tend to think of anger for Dick as akin to a temptation. He's strong and talented and smart. He's capable of really hurting people. He also believes - viscerally, fiercely - that it's wrong to do so.
Worth remembering: Dick's big confrontation with Zucco, in most of his origin stories, involves taking the photo that gets him arrested:
Dick (remembering): Twenty-four hours later, we were on the trail of Boss Zucco... and when he murdered his own henchman, I took the photo that sent Zucco to prison! (Secret Origins 13)
And in Batman: Year Three, he's furious when he thinks that Bruce might have arranged for Zucco to get killed - when Dick's calm and thinking clearly, he believes it's wrong to kill even people who are clearly evil. It's only when he's swept up in emotion that he'll get violent.
Anger at Bruce
... Look, I had to give Bruce his own category.
Dick and Bruce have a lot of fights. Like, a lot of fights.
Now, this isn't at all particular to Dick! Dick's just one of many, many, many people in Bruce's life who periodically get fed up with him. So I wouldn't gloss this as Dick being unusually short-tempered - post-Crisis Bruce would provoke a saint (and does! at one point Clark briefly votes him out of the JLA!). And Dick doesn't always get angry when Bruce is being a jerk to him - sometimes he's just discouraged, or depressed.
But at the same time, Dick's not a pushover, and when he's sufficiently provoked, he'll often track Bruce down to confront him / demand an explanation / demand better behavior / etc. Paradoxically, I actually tend to see these confrontations as an expression of Dick's faith in Bruce. He gets angry because he expects better.
Here's a small sampling of Dick-angry-at-Bruce moments (some confrontations, some where Dick's just fuming on his own):
Bruce: Listen to me.
Dick: Listen to you? You hand Gotham over to that nutcase altar boy. You leave this kid out to dry without a snowball's chance. Then you throw everything you’ve lived for aside like it was nothing! Killing this creep doesn’t make you as bad as the scum we hunt. It makes you worse. Because they never stood for anything. (R 8)
Dick: If you say anything about 'finding myself,' I think I'll puke.
Bruce: I thought you'd be glad to see me back.
Dick: That depends on why you came back.
Bruce: To take up the mantle again. To take back my place.
Dick: For how long this time?
Bruce: Not now, Dick. We can talk about this when -
Dick: Right now. We're settling this right now, Bruce. (R 12 - Bruce has abruptly reappeared in the Batcave after leaving Dick and Tim in charge during Prodigal)
Dick: It was you who told us to stay out of Gotham. I’ve got a life here. I can’t just walk away from that. You’ll have to - (Bruce hangs up on him) Damn you! (N 34 - Bruce has been AWOL for months and now abruptly summons Dick to join him in No Man's Land)
Dick (internally): Bruce is playing martyr. Keeping us at a distance. […] Why does it have to be this way with us? WHY? (He punches his car, and his hand comes away bloody.) Uncontrollable rage. The same rage I felt when I killed the Joker. Thought I had it under control. (N 65 - Bruce is accused of murder and freezing out the Bats)
Bruce: What are you doing out of bed?
Dick: You did it again, didn't you? You pushed everyone away! (N 99)
Bruce: I assume this isn't a social call?
Dick: What the hell is the matter with you? I mean, aside from the obvious! Ignoring the many layers of denial, and the fifty feet of psychological body armor that you throw up to avoid feeling anything! Aside from that! And the pathological need to control everything on Earth and beyond! Ignoring all that! What exactly is your compulsion, your burning desire to deceive, lie, and manipulate the only people who give a good god damn about you?!
Bruce: You getting to a point? (O 21 - Dick just found out that Bruce was secretly funding the Outsiders)
Dick's relationship with Bruce is Complicated (TM), because he's also incredibly loyal, and - despite everything - he loves Bruce a lot. A lot of Dick's anger comes out of this frustrated loyalty - Dick feels betrayed and hurt because he loves Bruce so much. Here's a panel from later in Outsiders 21:
Bruce: You shouldn't place that much faith in me.
Dick: I have more faith in you than anyone.
Reasons why Dick gets angry: an incomplete list
So if Dick isn't really the type to, say, rage-quit a game, then what does he get angry about (other than criminals and Bruce in general)?
I've tried to loosely categorize what seem to me to be the main things that can make him lose his temper:
as above, somebody Dick loves has been hurt and he's furious at the person who did it (so e.g. trying to kill the Wildebeests when they threaten the Titans, trying to kill Hugo Strange for trying to kill Bruce, lashing out at Tumult when he hurts Tim),
he's feeling attacked or betrayed and he's lashing out in self-defense (so e.g. a lot of the fights with Bruce, punching Roy after Roy fires him in New Titans, or calling Roy a junkie when Roy tells him he's just like Bruce in Outsiders, or yelling at Tim when Tim's insisting he should be Robin again),
he's angry about a lack of loyalty (so e.g. he's furious and feels betrayed when he learns that Bruce has replaced him with Jason; he's angry at Bruce for picking Azrael as Batman instead of Dick; he's angry at Tim when Tim suggests Bruce might be a murderer)
he's jealous (so e.g. he's hurt and angry when Kory marries someone else; his resentment of Azrael is much more about Bruce than it is about Azrael)
he's angry at another vigilante for behaving too violently/irresponsibly (so e.g. he has multiple fights with Kory insisting that she can't kill anyone; he's similarly furious with Bruce when he thinks Bruce has tried to kill someone; he snaps at the Titans in general after a failed mission; he's harsh about Tim and his team during Graduation Day)
he's unhappy and taking it out on someone else, often to drive them away (so e.g. he snaps at Donna and Alfred when he's depressed about Kory's marriage - arguably there's some supernatural influence here, but IMO he'd do it anyway; he gets snappish with Tim when he's depressed about his own lack of progress with Chulo/in Blüdhaven and also when he's actually mad at Bruce about Jean-Paul; he's very harsh to Babs and Wally when they try to comfort him post-J:LL; arguably most of his behavior in Outsiders after Donna's death falls under this category too),
he's unhappy and he's taking it out on an inanimate object (so e.g. smashing things after hearing about Kory's potential marriage; punching his car until his hand is bloody after Bruce has been a jerk to him, smashing a sign when Babs is jabbing at him by comparing him to Bruce),
his privacy is being violated by paparazzi (Dick hates photographers and will not hesitate to punch them or destroy their equipment)
I think something important about all these reasons is... they're understandable? It's not surprising that Dick is upset about the woman he loves marrying someone else; it would be stranger if he wasn't upset. It's not surprising that he lashes out defensively when he's feeing attacked - this is an extremely common thing to do! Dick's anger isn't a weird cloud of rage that just descends on him for no reason; he gets angry when he has something to get angry about.
That said, he does have particular things he's especially touchy about - loyalty, privacy, control, etc. And his anger can be physical - he does break things.
Dick + annoyance with friends/teammates
Dick calls a team meeting to rebuke the Titans in Titans 13
This is lower-key, so I wouldn't always describe this as anger per se, but it feels relevant: Dick can get snappish if he's in a bad mood, though he'll usually back off if it's pointed out to him:
Dick: Half this world goes to hell in a handcart and you do nothing?
Donna: Hey, don't shout at me because your personal life has gone crazy. We had a crisis…
Dick: You had a crisis? Who hasn't? And my personal life, for what it's worth, is a: just fine, and b: none of your business. Do me a favor and go. I want to be alone. (NTT 18 - Dick's upset because Kory is marrying someone else)
Dick: Roy! What the hell is this? Why is Lian in the way? She should be in a crib or something, not where people can step on her.
Roy: Dick, my daughter is in nobody's way, and I'm watching her every move.
Dick: Oh, yeah? Well, I've had it -
Roy: Dick, your friends are here to help you and you're not making it any easier. C'mon, pal - calm down.
Dick: You're right. I'm sorry. This is all getting to me.
Roy: Really? The immediate world and I never noticed. (NT 100)
Dick (surprising Tim): You should've known you wouldn't hear anything. Not in this wind - but if you'd been downwind on the other side, you might have scented me.
Tim (startled): Nightwing!
Dick: You did want to meet - or do you just like playing computer games? Now let’s make it snappy - I’m in New York on my own business.
Tim: And a big fat hi to you, too.
(Showcase '93 11 - Dick's upset because he's blaming himself for someone Chulo murdered)
Dick: He didn't send you to check up on me?
Tim: Huh?
Dick (scowling): Don't play dumb.
Tim: Batman? I came down on my own, Dick. What's with the attitude?
Dick: Sorry, Tim. I haven't been making a lot of progress since I got here. (N 6 - Dick's self-aware here - he's on edge because he thinks he's doing a bad job)
Babs: Okay, calm down, take a deep breath, and explain again why you’re so angry…
Dick: Why am I angry? I’m not angry, I’m–I’m–I’m dismayed, okay? I’m dismayed that there can be a Robin who believes Batman could be guilty of murder! How could that happen, Babs? How could that happen?! (GK 26)
Kory: You could say goodbye to your teammates.
Dick: They're not my teammates anymore.
Kory: They noticed. (TT/O Secret Files 2005)
You'll notice that several of these include Dick backtracking and apologizing. He doesn't hold grudges or fume forever! And Dick's generally self-aware enough to realize why he's snappish once he takes a step back:
Dick: I…I’m sorry…I know this isn’t your fault. Here I’m attacking you - and you’re probably just as scared as I am. I just feel so frustrated. Batman could always remain calm in a crisis. I guess that’s just another difference between us. Maybe I’d be better off if I just cut myself off from all feeling like he does. (NT 77)
Something Dick generally isn't apologetic about: Dick is intensely self-critical about badly-done vigilante work, and in a team setting, he's not that patient with other people's mistakes.
Here's Dick calling a team meeting so he can scold the team in Titans 13:
Dick: Lock the doors, sit down, and pay attention. And that's an order. ... Our performance against Tartarus and the HIVE was unacceptable. Each and every one of you should thank God you weren't killed.
Here's an argument between Dick and Donna in Graduation Day 2 - the context is that Young Justice just screwed up an earlier fight, and Tim's berating himself and Conner while Dick and Donna eavesdrop (you'll notice that like Dick, Tim tends to be pretty self-critical + impatient with teammates):
Conner: The Titans got their lumps.
Tim: No, the Titans got our lumps. They were looking out for us. There we were, shoulder to shoulder with the inspiration for Young Justice. And we lose half our team and half of theirs.
Conner: Tim, I bet they were a lot like us when they started.
Tim: No, I don't think so.
(Donna and Dick are eavesdropping.)
Donna: He's being awfully hard on himself. Kind of reminds me of someone.
Dick: I don't know what you're talking about.
Donna: You could tell him he's wrong.
Dick: Is he?
Donna: We stepped in it plenty of times, Dick. Plenty. We got beat by Dr. Light. Completely pantsed by Trident. We had the ill-conceived idea that the Mad Mod was a threat. There was that time in South America when we left Garth in the sun for three hours. Lots of stuff… We even got kidnapped by Count Vertigo. How embarrassing was that?
Dick: I didn't get kidnapped. I got nabbed when I was coming to save Roy.
Donna: Nevertheless, they could use a kind word.
Dick: I'm not sure a kind word is what they need.
The upshot is that Donna goes to comfort Cassie while Dick goes off alone.
Again, the point is not that Dick goes around fuming about his teammates 24/7! He cares about the Titans and trusts them to watch his back; he feels the same way about Tim.
But in the heat of the moment, he'll sometimes get snappish or impatient, especially with people he's close to. The friends that Dick has who stick around are the ones who are tough enough to stand up to him, and who understand him enough not to take his occasional moods personally.
Dick + lashing out at loved ones
This one's a bit meaner. Dick's really good at picking out other people's insecurities, which he almost never uses against them ... but when he's retaliating, he's got an instinct for what will hurt the most:
Dick: No, I won't stop it. How dare you tell me what to do when you screwed up so badly Raven could be dead by now? Who knows what Mento did to Gar and Vic? Maybe your failure killed Kole. No, I won't stop. I won't!
Donna (punching him): Shut up, Dick! Shut up! Shut up! Shut up! Shut up! I don't want to hear anymore!
Dick: But you're going to, Donna. You made me listen to what you had to say. But you don't like hearing the truth about yourself, do you? The perfect Donna Troy maybe isn't so perfect after all.
(NTT 19 - Dick's under an ambiguous amount of Brother Blood influence during this period, but he's also just really upset about Kory, and I tend to interpret BB as "reducing his self-control" not "he's a totally different person")
Bruce: I didn't expect to see you again.
Dick: I heard about Jason. I'm really sorry, Bruce.
Bruce: You weren't at the funeral. People asked about you.
Dick: C'mon, Bruce - talk. Don't turn your back on me. I'm here… now.
Bruce: You were lucky. When you didn't listen to me, your injuries weren't fatal. Of course, by the time I properly trained you -
Dick: Bruce, c'mon…lay off. I'm not here to fight.
Bruce: Then don't!
Dick: Are you blaming me? I left, so Jason replaced me, and because I left he died? No way, pal. Jason wasn't me. I was a trained acrobat. I could think quickly in perilous situations. But why did you let him become Robin before he was ready?!?
Bruce (punching him): Don't you dare blame me for Jason's death! Don't you dare!
(NT 55 - this fight is ofc 110% Bruce's fault even before the punch, but Dick absolutely is blaming Bruce for Jason's death here)
Dick (trying to punch Roy): GET YOUR HANDS OFF ME, YOU TRAITOR!
Roy: Dick, I'm your friend… Blast it, man - why are you doing this?
Dick: Friends don't turn on friends, Harper. I've been there every time you called me. I sat up with you all night while you were detoxing. That was not a pretty sight. (NT 101 - Dick's upset about getting fired as team leader)
Dick: I disgraced myself and my uniform. Both uniforms. I have to learn to live with that or quit. No more surprise visits, Babs. Don't make me sorry I put an elevator in this building. (BoP 37)
Roy: Look at you! Your greatest fear in life, the thing that eats at you - is that you're terrified of becoming Batman!! A cold, detached, emotionless loner. I've got news for you, that's exactly what you are. You've become the man who raised you.
Dick: Yeah…and you're just like the man who raised you. A shallow, self-loathing, womanizing thrill-seeker. Except he was never a junkie. (O 16)
Gar: I guess it doesn't bother you that your new teammate killed your old one? 'Cause it sure bothers the hell outta me.
Dick: Enough. I'm here to find Kory and Tim. I don't need Terra's best friend lecturing me about loyalty. (TT/O Secret Files 2005)
Dick + 1st meetings with future siblings (+Steph)
I hesitated including this on the list because it's lower-key and not always anger per se, but I think a lot of times when people say Dick "has a temper," they're not necessarily talking about his angriest moments so much as pushing back against the idea that he's happy or welcoming all the time.
If you're reading post-Crisis canon, Dick's a prickly introvert who can be slow to warm up to newcomers in Gotham. He's not exclusively cranky by any means! But he's not all smiles, either. Here are some snappish moments from first meetings with Jason, Tim, Cass, Damian, and Steph:
Dick: They'll probably switch to another lab, now that you've spooked them.
Jason: Then it's no big deal! We'll just locate their new digs and bust them when they take possession.
Dick: Wrong! I'll locate the new lab all by myself! You're going home to tell Batman how you screwed up tonight!
Jason: Come on...
(from Dick's first meeting with Jason in B 416 - Jason attacked a group of criminals too hastily)
Dick: Now, who the hell are you?
Tim: That doesn't matter now. Dick, look at this please.
Dick: Kid, I don't like games.
(from Dick's first-technically-second meeting with Tim in LPoD - Tim's been chasing him all around the circus, and although Dick doesn't yet know this, also broke into his apartment)
Bruce: You can trust her.
Dick: Six months ago, that would've gotten you further than it will now. Now, I'm not sure it's enough.
Bruce: What more would it take?
Dick: An explanation of who she is for a start.
(from Dick's first meeting with Cass in B: LotDK 120 - Bruce went AWOL for months and has now resurfaced with a protégé)
Jason: It's a new world. It's not all backflips and balance bars. You were good. Were. But Gotham needs a tougher Robin now.
Dick (internally): A sneaky, mean little punk. Maybe you hired him before the Joker could.
(from the retold version of Dick's first meeting with Jason in N 104 - Bruce gave stupid instructions leading Jason to misunderstand and pick a fight with Dick)
Dick (internally, when he notices Damian's makeshift Robin costume): Damian's costume. Note to self: smack a clue into this kid.
Damian: You're embarrassing me!
Dick: You do that just fine on your own.
(from Dick's first meeting with Damian in N 138 - Damian's probably scared, which means he's snarky; he's making rude remarks and resisting Dick and Tim's attempts to protect him)
Dick: What in the hell were - are - you thinking, throwing someone so reckless into the field like that?
Babs: Gosh, Dick - I'm sorry I haven't spent more time trying to train a murderous little twit.
(from right after Dick's first meeting with Steph in BG 5 - Steph accidentally froze Damian)
How much you weight these moments depends a lot on your personal aesthetic preferences! I love conflict, and Dick's initially kinda thorny relationships with his siblings are part of why I enjoy him as a character. I don't feel the need to "fix" this kind of grumpiness and honestly I don't even really see it as a flaw? Dick's not morally obliged to like his future siblings on first meeting them, and if he never got snappish with any siblings ever, no matter how annoying they were being, he'd be a lot less interesting to me personally.
For me, Dick's prickly side adds an important nuance to his characterization, and makes it more compelling. He's a human being, not a conduct book! His strength is that he's willing to reconsider his first impressions, not that he never has negative first impressions.
That said, obviously genre and context matter! I have enjoyed plenty of softer takes on the Batfamily in fanworks, and in a softer, gentler world like e.g. WFA, it would be weird to keep Dick's grumpier moments. Also, Dick obviously isn't 24/7 harsh to his siblings - he can also be really empathetic and protective, and although he never gets especially close to e.g. Steph, he does change his mind about her, and he's ultimately a huge source of emotional support to Tim and Damian (they grow on him! ... eventually).
In Conclusion
One of my favorite Dick stories of all time is Nightwing 139, and I think it nicely encapsulates how I see Dick's anger - it's an important contrast to his softer side. He's a person with an instinctive temper, and compassion and understanding aren't always immediate or easy or effortless for him. But he's also a loving person with a big heart, and it's the love that always matters to him in the end.
Here's Dick discovering that Tim is thinking about using the Lazarus Pit, getting angry, and leaping down to try to physically stop him ("He may not stop you, but I sure as hell will!")
Dick (sarcastically): So, Robin... you think maybe we can hug this out?
It's important to me that Dick's first instinct is to have a physical fight, not to try to talk! He does all the wrong things before he does the right thing! He doesn't magically know the right thing to say to Tim right away!
But doing the right thing matters to him, and Tim matters to him, which is why he gets there eventually. When Tim tears up Dick softens at once:
And in the end Dick backs off and lets Tim make the choice, which isn't easy or instinctive for him either! But it's the right thing to do, and it's what Tim needs to pull himself out of the power struggle and realize he's making a mistake, and then Tim stammers apologies and Dick reassures him and they do hug it out, and it's very tender:
Without Dick's anger, you don't have a lot of his stories. But his anger doesn't define him - he doesn't let it. As Dick puts it,
"Yeah, I get angry. Sometimes I get so pissed I want to break everything in sight. But everyone gets mad. Everyone gets frustrated. But I don't fight out of anger! I fight when there's something wrong that needs to be stopped! And that's why I'll never be you! I don't fight to kill - I fight to protect!
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why do you think tim agreed to be adopted if he doesn’t really see bruce as his father? is there anything parental happening in there??
He does! And he doesn't! And it is and isn't. It's a wonderfully messy thing!
To answer the first question first, there are a lot of reasons for Tim to be adopted no matter what. On the milder side, it's logistically convenient to have a guardian, and specifically to have one that is aware of and endorses his vigilantism.
But more than that, in the time after his dad died, Tim was in a very dark place. One of the things Tim does when in a dark place is self-isolate. He made up this whole fake uncle thing to stop Bruce from adopting him after the first offer, so that he could live completely on his own without being beholden to anyone. And that was bad for him! Self-isolating is bad for Tim!
So in that sense, accepting Bruce's second offer of adoption is a huge symbol that Tim is doing better. He (and Bruce and Dick) had the whole One Year Later cruise around the world to heal and improve, and Tim is less locked in grief now and willing to connect. And he shows this by accepting an offer of adoption from someone who loves him and choosing to live in a house with people he loves too. Hooray!
Because, no matter what, he does care about Bruce. And he cares about Alfred, who he independently had a close relationship with, and about Dick, who'd been calling Tim his little brother for years. (Dick and Alfred being the other members of the family at this point.)
So I don't think it really has to be father/son at all between Bruce and Tim for Tim to agree to be adopted, nor for it to be a good thing.
That said, I also don't think it's entirely not parental. I was being a little silly and flippant in that post, because I do think Bruce and Tim are weird about their vaguely defined relationship.
It is an absolutely key part of that relationship that, for ~4 years, Bruce and Tim were Batman and Robin, and worked closely together, and cared about each other, and were not father and son at all. Because Tim still had his own dad! Of course Bruce wasn't his dad! That would be just weird.
That doesn't mean there's nothing paternal to their relationship in the Robin years. Adult mentor/kid protege, sure there are absolutely angles here.
And it also doesn't mean they never became father and son after the adoption. A lot of this is based on vibes and personal interpretation! There's this story shortly after Tim's adoption where he puts a lot of effort into getting Bruce a perfect father's day gift. They do refer to each other as father/son periodically when talking to others.
My personal read on it is that Tim was very consciously trying to Be A Proper Family after the adoption, and adjust super fast. And I do think that by the point Bruce "dies" (or maybe at that point?), Tim sees him as more of a father.
(Also I think probably Tim is Bruce's son much more than Bruce is Tim's dad. Or at least sooner. Again, vibes.)
But I also don't think they necessarily need to be defined so sharply. They're never going to be like Jason and Bruce, who were father and son right away, or even Dick and Bruce, who were family and ward/guardian right away. They are always going to have known each other as non-family first. Which doesn't mean they aren't going to care about each other.
But I think it should mean they get to be little weirdos about how they do define their relationship when forced to.
#this is my dad#is easier than#this is my father figure with whom I have a complicated and undefinable relationship#I take care of him sometimes and he taught me how to play tennis and one time he left me#to babysit this one guy while he went looking for my kidnapped dad#and he's my partner but also my mentor but I do my own thing and sometimes he is affectionate#and one time his birthday present for me was trying to gaslight me into thinking I couldn't trust anyone I know because#if anything ever happened to me he'd blame himself for not having prepared me enough#and sometimes I bring him hot chocolate after he spends a whole trying to subdue a prison riot#and nobody makes me feel as safe as he does but I know there's something so dark in him#and if loses himself in it or dies then I didn't do my job#anD (@captainragtag)
#it’s the way Tim’s piece in dcu halloween special ‘09 is called ‘our father’s sins’ and it talks about grieving his dad (Jack)#while he’s looking for his dad (Bruce). but only jack is referenced as his father in text yet bruce is his father too? but not#tim has two dads (Jack & Bruce) but he only has one dad (Jack who is dead) yet he only has one dad (Bruce who is alive)#yet he has two dads (father & mentor)#it’s fun I love messy complicated relationship dynamics#they’re not dad at the same time (except when they are) or the same way (don’t ask him what way)#tim drake#bruce wayne#batfam#dc#ALSO ‘[bruce and i] both learned to be men as children’#that’s Tim about Bruce and Jack imo b/c they’re both the reason tim became an adult before he was ready#the ongoing problem tim had with Jack where ‘I basically raised myself’ while Bruce mentored him to be Robin & did aforementioned abuse#and they also died before tim made it to adulthood#all of that leading into. yeah he had to grow up before he was ready & he’s *relating to Bruce* with that#that short story isn’t even that well written but it’s still become one of the first things I think of when I’m thinking abt bruce & tim#Bruce isn’t a dad he’s a Symbol except when that symbol is also. a dad?#don’t worry about it [tags via heroesriseandfall]
I think one of the big fun tensions of Tim's story is that in a lot of his Robin career he kinda secretly wants to be part of the Wayne family - it's textual in "To the father I never knew," and subtext in other comics - and often Bruce and Dick and Alfred kinda wish he was part of their family.
But he's not! He can't be! Because Tim has a dad, and he's loyal to his dad, and his dad would be terribly hurt. His dad is jealous of Bruce, and jealous of Tim's attachment to Bruce, and rightly so - I mean, this isn't a very mature response, but this isn't all in Jack's head. Tell him I don't love Bruce more than him, Tim says in Contagion, the thing that he wants Jack to be reassured about if he dies, but of course he doesn't actually want Jack to be there when he's sick. When Jack finds out about Robin he accuses Bruce of stealing his son.
And I mean. Jack's wrong-ish, but also... he's not, entirely. Because Tim is close to Bruce and family in a way he's not to his own dad. Because Bruce and Dick and Alfred have monopolized Tim's life for the past couple years. And that's not their fault, because it's not like they made Tim do it! Tim chose it! Tim sought them out; they didn't seek him out! But it isn't untrue that Tim's secret life is a huge wedge between him and his dad, and it isn't untrue that they've functioned as a kind of surrogate family, and it isn't untrue that the story of Tim's Robin career is often a story of Tim choosing Bruce and Dick over his dad. Sometimes very directly - in No Man's Land, Tim sneaks into Gotham with Dick and because of Bruce, leaving Jack behind. Time and truths.
And then Jack dies.
And Tim's... so mixed-up about it? He's miserable. He's grieving. He's mad at Bruce about Steph. He's overwhelmingly touched by the adoption offer. He's too much of a coward to simply say no. He's scared Dick wouldn't like it if he said yes. He's not even sure if he wants to say yes or not. He does not feel comfortable talking about any of this with Bruce. He comes up with a ridiculous lie to avoid it. Bruce figures out the ridiculous lie and is impressed with it and maybe secretly a little relieved himself. Neither of them know "what's best" for Tim. Tim moves to Blüdhaven.
Bruce's life falls apart in new ways and the city that Dick and Tim were living in blows up and now Bruce is thinking maybe he'd like them a bit closer than they've been. He decides to invite both boys on a trip "as a family." They both say yes. Bruce ends up ditching them for a full month to meditate in a cave and do a ritual that Tim will later wonder if it drove him mad, because Bruce is Batman and of course this is what he does.
Bruce and Tim go back to Gotham and Tim moves into the converted stables, not the house. Tim keeping his distance? Tim anxious about presuming? Probably both; it's complicated. Bruce lets him - ditto. Then Bruce decides maybe he should offer adoption again, and have Tim move into the Manor. You get the strong impression he's gotten some coaching from Dick and Alfred and he's still stumbling on his words. But it doesn't matter! He manages to spit it out! And then he's still not sure if it's a good idea, but maybe it is, because Tim tackle-hugs him... and then starts crying.
It's all right, Bruce says, awkwardly trying to comfort him. They're both still in costume: Batman and Robin, not Bruce and Tim. It's still meaningful. It's still tragic. It's a name for something they've always avoided naming. It's only happening because Tim's parents were murdered. Your parents are dead. You have no one. It's always gonna be unfair.
snippet (Robin!Tim and Nightwing!Dick in Blüdhaven)
LISTEN this is totally unedited but I read this post by @batposts two hours ago and immediately had a vision and had to write it sdfsfs.
* *
“You come into my house,” Dick says.
“Are you doing a meme? Don’t do that, it’s weird when it’s you.”
“It’s not a meme, it’s a movie,” Dick says. And hey, wait. “I can do memes!”
“You shouldn’t,” Tim says.
“You come into my house—it’s The Godfather, you illiterate, not a meme—into my house, but you don’t offer respect, you don’t offer friendship, you criticize my housekeeping—”
Tim's barricaded himself against one side of the couch and is shielding with a pillow, but it's not gonna save him. "I stand - by what I said - about the cardboard - ow, ow, leggo!"
"You disrespect me in my own house and you pay the consequences!"
One scuffle later, the pillow is a lost cause, but Dick's won - Tim is really getting a lot better at breaking holds, but he still gets majorly disoriented when you flip him upside-down. Dick seizes the opportunity to stride - okay, stagger, but who's counting - over to the window, buffeted by occasional kicks from his target.
It's awkward trying to hold onto Tim and open the window at the same time, but luckily Tim gets distracted by trying to figure out what he's doing. "Izzer something outside -" Tim is saying, when the window finally pushes open and Dick - with a great sense of personal satisfaction - wedges him head-first in a snowdrift, and then slams the window down.
* *
Okay, so it's not like he's worried exactly, but he can only see Tim's legs and the immediate escape he was kinda assuming hasn't happened. Tim's almost certainly playing possum, but -
Oh well.
He opens the window again, climbs out, and cautiously wades toward Tim's legs. "Tim? Are you - hey!"
He's prepped for a kick in the face, but instead the snowdrift grabs him by the ankles which - embarrassingly - hadn't occurred to Dick as a downside of the upside-down positioning. Another scuffle later, they're both covered in snow and shivering, but Dick gets his target in a headlock.
"Uncle?" he offers.
Tim nods emphatically, but doesn't try to break away from the hold, so Dick keeps a loose grip on him for a moment, taking quick stock. All limbs intact, no injuries, good. Man, it's freezing out here, actually. It's fun, the play-wrestling, but in retrospect this would've been a better prank in-costume.
He must've given away the uncertainty somehow, because Tim shifts a bit and presses the side of his face against Dick's chest: all good, in Tim-speak. Dick cups the back of his head - message received - and lets him go.
Tim immediately shakes his head like a dog, so the snow caked in his hair goes flying and hits Dick in the face.
"Brat," Dick says.
"Jerk." They're both knee-deep in the snow now, but it's still soft from all the wrestling they've been doing, so when Tim backs away, it doesn't seem to take too much effort. With a bit of distance, Dick can get a better look at him. Tim's grinning, his cheeks are bright red from the cold, and he's absolutely covered in snow. It's fantastic. He looks like a mini-abominable snow-monster.
"Hot chocolate?" the snow-monster says hopefully.
Dick stands his ground in front of the window and holds up a finger. "Take back what you said about the boxes."
"I'm dying of hypothermia," Tim whines. Dick does his best stern I-am-definitely-not-bluffing face. "Fine. I take it back. But you do have an awful lot of -" Dick holds up the finger again. "It's the best-organized apartment ever. Please let me in."
"Of course," Dick says, magnanimous in victory, and virtuously doesn't retaliate when Tim - on his way back through the window - "accidentally" dislodges the windowsill's remaining snow in Dick's direction.
* *
Dick manages to wedge the window closed after them. There's snow all over the apartment now from when the window was open, and his own clothes and Tim's are basically a lost cause.
Eh. Worth it.
Tim's teeth are chattering now. "I'm s-s-so cold n-now," he says, stamping his feet and shaking more snow off his clothes. He has the decency to relocate himself to the kitchen and the tile floor, at least. "D-d-did you know that hypothermia sets in faster if you're w-wearing wet clothes and -"
"Yes, fine, you can borrow some of mine," Dick says. The crocodile tears disappear, along with Tim, who bolts for the bedroom. Shit. "But not the leather jacket! Hands off my jacket!"
"No take-backs!" Tim calls back.
"My apartment, my rules! This is not a democracy!"
"You're a sadist! I'm staging a rebellion!"
They do, actually, need to change, so Dick follows. When he peers in the door, Tim's left a pile of wet clothes on the floor and is burrowing into one of Dick's old sweatshirts - not the jacket, thank goodness. The heating's already cranked up, which will hopefully solve most of the mostly-but-not-entirely-hypothetical hypothermia problem. Tim startles when he notices Dick there, but Dick leans against the door frame to signal he's not a threat, and Tim eases down.
It's silly, the screwing-around, and it's not like Dick really has any lofty reasons, but there's still something kinda satisfying about watching Tim get better at reacting spontaneously, in the moment, instead of getting caught up in overthinking. Just move. Action and reaction. No hesitation, just you and the moment. Reacting to things wasn't something Dick had actually thought you could be bad at until he met Tim, but Tim gets so caught up in his head worrying that it slows him down sometimes.
Spontaneous-reaction-time is definitely over, though, to judge by the way Tim's carefully folding his hands into the sweatshirt sleeves. Dick raises his eyebrows.
"You should change too," Tim says repressively, and then adds, "With wet clothes, hypothermia can kill even at temperatures as high as 50 degrees." He sounds like he's reciting from a manual. He probably is.
"Fussbudget," Dick says.
"That's not even a word!"
Tim is fussy, but he's not wrong about the clothes. "I'm changing too, okay? You can sit next to the radiator," Dick offers.
"Uh, yeah. Try and get me away."
Heh. Dick ditches his own clothes for dry ones - Tim took the most comfortable sweatshirt, which is typical, but he's got others - and gets some blankets for Tim. No harm in being cautious.
Then he goes to track down the hot chocolate.
* *
Huddled up with blankets next to the radiator probably isn't super-safe, fire-hazard-wise, but they are vigilantes. It'll be fine. And it's worth it, honestly - sprawled out on the floor, Tim curled against his side, the adrenaline fading until it's just the pleasant exhaustion after a good sparring session. And - it's just good. It's good. A little reckless, the snow thing, in retrospect. Tim's fussy, but hypothermia's real. It could've gone wrong. God knows what Bruce would think. But Tim's cautious enough for the both of them, and - they do reckless stuff all the time, is the thing, risking their lives, and-
He catches himself trying to justify everything to Bruce in his head. A bad habit - even Bruce himself isn't usually as critical as his voice in Dick's head is. He can win arguments with real-Bruce all the time - fake-Bruce, not so much. And it's silly to psyche himself out about this, because sometimes - sometimes there are these things that he just can't put into words, what he knows and can't explain, that the roughhousing's good for Tim. Puts color in his cheeks and a smile on his face. He can imagine Bruce frowning, pointing out the risks, talking about warnings and self-control, and he doesn't have a comeback argument, but...
"I want marshmallows next time," Tim says. He's got his mug just peeking out from under the blanket so he can sip on it. "You should get marshmallows."
"You come into my house and criticize my hot chocolate offerings," Dick says.
"And I'll do it again," Tim says, but he throws Dick a sideways look like he's a bit uncertain - second-guessing himself, worried he's pushed the bit too far - so Dick reaches out and loops an arm around his shoulder. Tim leans against him: message received.
"And you'll do it again," Dick agrees. "I guess I'll just have to endure it somehow." He jostles Tim a little, careful to keep it gentle enough to not spill the hot chocolate. "I will kick you out if you criticize my packing supplies again, though. Final warning."
Tim's mouth quirks up, like he's thinking of a comeback, but he doesn't say anything, and they let it go. After a while, the hot chocolate is gone, and Tim puts his mug aside and curls in closer, and yawns, and then - typical - falls fast asleep.
tim drake & dick grayson fanfic recs for the lovely @grxceblqckthxrn !! some of these she showed me but im adding them in case anyone else who comes across this hasnt read them yet + i'll link my other lists below too (steph and dick so far)
(as usual, these will be mostlyyy focused on tim and dick, but some of them are so good i had to include even tho there are other relationships)
only you will have stars that laugh - Tim's alone on Christmas Eve. Dick finds out, and fixes it.
honeymuscles - Second chances are uncommon, sure. But Dick built his whole life on second chances.
call this my funeral - Dick breaks into Arkham to kill the Joker. He won't let anyone stop him—not some measly defense systems, not his baby brother, and not this mercenary who seems to be trying to break the Joker out.
hisstamine - Dick gets bitten by a venomous snake. Tim pretends to know exactly what to do.
brothers have the worst timing - Tim crashes Dick and Helena’s ill-advised one-night stand; this is awkward for everyone involved.
timmy the explorer - Tim was on a very important and grandiose mission. A mission to get a hug from Dick Grayson.
streaks - Months after Dick's return from Spyral, Tim has revelations that were a long time coming. In which the author uses Snapchat streaks for Bat purposes, there are tea parties, and more tears appear than expected.
head bonk - After he’s injured while home alone, Tim is the only one not worried about his personal well-being. (He has a number of other things to worry about instead.)
operation flight failure (plan #15) - Tim is going to meet Dick Grayson today. No matter what. And he's going to make him his big brother. But that'll come later.
an ode to the passage of time - when you don't feel it - Dick doesn't know when his brothers got so close, considering how last week the two almost came to blows over a missing batarang, but it's seeming a little... obsessive. (time loop!!)
the center cannot hold - Every so often, it all catches up with him.
five times dick was tim's safety net and one time tim was his - Dick has always been there for Tim, even before they knew each other.
I'd fly far away from here - “Tim, you’re in a strange city you don’t live in, staying with a person your dad barely knows. He’s probably worried sick.”
aite - Dick is high on morphine and says some things Tim doesn't think he meant to. Using bedrest as an excuse, he pries.
the irony - There's some cruel, bitter irony in the fact that Tim, at eighteen, is back to stalking Dick to check on his health and well-being.
it was not your fault, but mine - Dick gets caught and tortured. Tim finds him. Dick thinks he doesn't care enough to help him. Tim, frankly, doesn't care what Dick thinks.
Things about fighting I always wish made it into Batfamily fics, in no specific order:
The weird way people flip up their tongues to protect their teeth before a fight (if they’re not wearing a mask/mouthpiece)
Exhaling right when you’re about to be hit during a fight so it reduces pain/impact and your body doesn’t tense up
People getting yanked around by ponytails/longer hair (and how much that fucking HURTS)
The fact that you can’t really prepare to get the wind knocked out of you, it just happens and it sucks no matter how well trained you are
Feeling vasodilation start before a fight begins because of the adrenaline surge and increased heart rate
The Batkids taking cues from Cass and targeting an opponent’s weaknesses during a fight (limps, old injuries or scars, preference for right handed weapons, etc)
Night vision/low light vision - the domino masks automatically adjust their vision so they don’t need to wait between bright lights and darkness, but others do
At a certain point you really can’t run anymore - maybe Bruce-as-Batman can, but a teen will tap out from a chase a lot sooner
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sanguineterrain left this tag from my previous art post about bruce being 40s heartthrob coded and they are SO right!!!!!! can't stop thinking about it!!!!!
vesalius in zante, edith wharton // batman (1940) #213 // batman (2016) #138 // detective comics (1937) #38 // the naomi letters, rachel mennies // batman (1940) #682 // assassin's fate, robin hobb // nightwing (1996) #75 // the lover, marguerite duras // batman: black and white (2021) #5 edited by @/fourcorpsemen (x) // my brother my wound, natalie diaz // nightwing (1996) #153 // the death of me, johnny dombrowski // unknown // batman/nightwing: bloodborne (2002) // two zuihitsu, tamiko beyer // batman (1940) #676 // batman: gotham knights (2000) #10 // human acts, han kang (translated by deborah smith) // batman and robin (2009) #7, 16 // the end of the pier, nicole callihan
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