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asoiaf ౷ disco elysium ౷ ben 10 ౷ tadc
icon by h.j. ford ౷ header by jc barquet
some tags for navigating this blog:
greenbloods.txt
asoiaf animated series
asoiaf heritage posts
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karma in asoiaf

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How it feels trying to show anyone anything
evrart claire is just such a delicious mix of intricacies he's very sociable and charismatic while being a recluse with a very sheltered and controlled lifestyle + environment and he carries himself as a caricature of his position while being genuinely ruthless and he has an unflappable cheery demeanor surrounding a heart full of deep seated hatred
thinking again about TvTropes and how it’s genuinely such an amazing resource for learning the mechanics of storytelling, honestly more so than a lot of formally taught literature classes
reasons for this:
basically TvTropes breaks down stories mechanically, using a perspective that’s not…ABOUT mechanics. Another way I like to put it, is that it’s an inductive, instead of deductive, approach to analyzing storytelling.
like in a literature or writing class you’re learning the elements that are part of the basic functioning of a story, so, character, plot, setting, et cetera. You’re learning the things that make a story a story, and why. Like, you learn what setting is, what defines it, and work from there to what makes it effective, and the range of ways it can be effective.
here’s the thing, though: everyone has some intuitive understanding of how stories work. if we didn’t, we couldn’t…understand stories.
TvTropes’s approach is bottom-up instead of top-down: instead of trying to exhaustively explore the broad, general elements of story, it identifies very small, specific elements, and explores the absolute shit out of how they fit, what they do, where they go, how they work.
Every TvTropes article is basically, “Here is a piece of a story that is part of many different stories. You have probably seen it before, but if not, here is a list of stories that use it, where it is, and what it’s doing in those stories. Here are some things it does. Here is why it is functionally different than other, similar story pieces. Here is some background on its origins and how audiences respond to it.”
all of this is BRILLIANT for a lot of reasons. one of the major ones is that the site has long lists of media that utilizes any given trope, ranging from classic literature to cartoons to video games to advertisements. the Iliad and Adventure Time ARE different things, but they are MADE OF the same stuff. And being able to study dozens of examples of a trope in action teaches you to see the common thread in what the trope does and why its specific characteristics let it do that
I love TvTropes because a great, renowned work of literature and a shitty, derivative YA novel will appear on the same list, because they’re Made Of The Same Stuff. And breaking down that mental barrier between them is good on its own for developing a mechanical understanding of storytelling.
But also? I think one of the biggest blessings of TvTropes’s commitment to cataloguing examples of tropes regardless of their “merit” or literary value or whatever…is that we get to see the full range of effectiveness or ineffectiveness of storytelling tools. Like, this is how you see what makes one book good and another book crappy. Tropes are Tools, and when you observe how a master craftsman uses a tool vs. a novice, you can break down not only what the tool is most effective for but how it is best used.
In fact? There are trope pages devoted to what happens when storytelling tools just unilaterally fail. e.g. Narm is when creators intend something to be frightening, but audiences find it hilarious instead.
On that note, TvTropes is also great in that its analysis of stories is very grounded in authors, audiences, and culture; it’s not solely focused on in-story elements. A lot of the trope pages are categories for audience responses to tropes, or for real-world occurrences that affected the storytelling, or just the human failings that creep into storytelling and affect it, like Early Installment Weirdness. There are categories for censorship-driven storytelling decisions. There are “lineages” of tropes that show how storytelling has changed over time, and how audience responses change as culture changes. Tropes like Draco in Leather Pants or Narm are catalogued because the audience reaction to a story is as much a part of that story—the story of that story?—as the “canon.”
like, storytelling is inextricable from context. it’s inextricable from how big the writers’ budget was, and how accepting of homophobia the audience was, and what was acceptable to be shown on film at the time. Tropes beget other tropes, one trope is exchanged for another, they are all linked. A Dead Horse Trope becomes an Undead Horse Trope, and sometimes it was a Dead Unicorn Trope all along. What was this work responding to? And all works are responding to something, whether they know it or not
An incomplete list of really useful or interesting reads from TvTropes.
please note that yes many of these are concepts that exist elsewhere and a few are even taught in fiction writing classes but TvTropes just does an amazing job at displaying the range of things that can be done with them
legitimately so much of the terminology I use to talk about storytelling, and even think about it in my own head, i learned about from TvTropes
Willing Suspension of Disbelief
Watsonian vs. Doylist
Trope Tropes, for all the ways tropes are used, deconstructed, subverted, and played with.
The Oldest Ones in the Book, which is basically my favorite thing on the entire Internet
Punk Punk, for -punk subgenres
Sliding Scale of Silliness vs. Seriousness, Sliding Scale of Idealism vs. Cynicism
The Weird Al Effect is a fun one
Chekhov’s Gun, Chekhov’s Boomerang, Chekhov’s Skill, and further variations
Law of Conservation of Detail
Law of Conservation of Normality
Anthropic Principle
Word of God, Death of the Author
Sliding Scale of Fourth Wall Hardness
Mohs Scale of Science Fiction Hardness
Genre Savvy
Flashbacks and Chronology breaks down all the ways you can handle chronology in storytelling
Show, Don’t Tell is a very good breakdown of what is showing, what is telling, and how both can be used effectively.
Lampshade Hanging
Noodle Incident is just fun imo
Genre Title Grab Bag
Fridge Horror
Rule of Cool, and also Cool of Rule
The Smurfette Principle
The Hays Code - not a trope but a very good breakdown of how the Hays Code affected storytelling in film
this is just a really short list of examples I encourage people who write or otherwise create stories to browse around on this site it’s so useful
Informed Attribute is one of the ones I reference most often as an editor.
Theory of Narrative Causality is one of my personal favorites, because it's kind of fun when a story acknowledges that things are happening in the story because that's what makes it a good story.
Also Applied Phlebotinum, because sometimes you don't need to know how something works, it just does, and that's all that matters for the purposes of the narrative.
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google dot com how to be cool and mysterious while also being known and loved
im fucked
google dot com how to be cool and mysterious while also being known and loved
has anyone figured out who they are and what they want yet
one of the unfortunate side effects of splitting AFFC and ADWD into separate narratives is that Jon threatening to burn an infant alive and Jaime's baby-in-a-trebuchet threat don't happen in the same book.
#and jon's scene happens first chronologically
#anyway this “fuck them kids” parallel isn't commented on nearly enough. like practically never that i can recall???
i'm going to pin this on most readers not being as revolted by Jon's treatment of Gilly as i am.
#there was no reason Jon couldn't have treated Gilly like an equal. #no reason why he couldn't have said to her 'look – this baby's life is in danger. please. i beg you. help me save him.' #instead he uses his power over Gilly #someone who has been treated like an object her whole life #to coerce her into giving up her child AND her bodily autonomy #and the reason he does this is partly his inexperience as a leader yes but also his sexism and classism.
Yes.
But you're not alone. I recommend these posts on the subject: @bitchfromtheseventhhell's comparison of Jon's two encounters with Gilly, @lyannas's meta on Jon's treatment of the one woman with lower social status than him., and @dwellordream's comparison of Gilly's speech vs Val's. Also, Celia's Jon and Gilly and Jon and women tags have some other excellent posts on the subject. And I would be incredibly remiss if I didn't mention @asoiafuniversity's Gilly tag, where many of the above posts are reblogged, among others.
But it was just fascinating to me that within all the metas I've seen about Jon's horrific treatment of Gilly - which to be fair there aren't nearly enough in proportion to all the puff pieces declaring Jon the Most Feminist character in asoiaf - I've never before seen anyone comparing Jon “killing the boy” in his Gilly confrontation with Jaime acting as “Tywin's son” in his Edmure confrontation? Not once in 14 years on this site reading meta since ADWD. Even though in retrospect the scenes are obvious parallels.
"And if I will not yield?" Must you make me say the words? Pia was standing by the flap of the tent with her arms full of clothes. His squires were listening as well, and the singer. Let them hear, Jaime thought. Let the world hear. It makes no matter. He forced himself to smile [...] Jaime got to his feet. "Your wife may whelp before that. You'll want your child, I expect. I'll send him to you when he's born. With a trebuchet."
Jon closed the fingers of his sword hand. “Take both boys and the queen’s men will ride after you and drag you back. The boy will still burn … and you with him.” If I comfort her, she may think that tears can move me. She has to realize that I will not yield. “You’ll take one boy, and that one Dalla’s.” [...] “You will make a crow of him.” She wiped at her tears with the back of a small pale hand. “I won’t. I won’t.” Kill the boy, thought Jon. “You will. Else I promise you, the day that they burn Dalla’s boy, yours will die as well.”
"I'll leave you to enjoy your food. Singer, play for our guest whilst he eats. You know the song, I trust." "The one about the rain? Aye, my lord. I know it."
“Men say that freezing to death is almost peaceful. Fire, though … do you see the candle, Gilly?” She looked at the flame. “Yes.” “Touch it. Put your hand over the flame.” Her big brown eyes grew bigger still. She did not move. “Do it.” Kill the boy. “Now.” Trembling, the girl reached out her hand, held it well above the flickering candle flame. “Down. Let it kiss you.” Gilly lowered her hand. An inch. Another. When the flame licked her flesh, she snatched her hand back and began to sob.
And of course the fan reactions: the way Jon's threats to Gilly's baby aren't taken seriously, where "kill the boy" is interpreted that he's being cruel as a show to convince Gilly, that his heart is not in the threat and he wouldn't go through with it, that “our hero would never burn a child!” and theories that it's Val who will burn the baby to resurrect Jon (???). Whereas Jaime is taken seriously re his threats to Edmure's baby even though he has the same kind of “forcing himself to say this” thoughts, and thus this scene is treated as recidivism to his villain status and the main reason “it's not a redemption arc it's an identity arc” etc. It's just... interesting, that's all.
Thank you so much for the links!! I look forward to reading them.
Going kinda off topic, it seems like the existing framework focuses on intent, rather than considering the threats themselves to be acts of violence or the first step in self-fulfilling prophecies. Personally I think that’s the more fruitful way of looking at it. Like, let’s say that both Jon and Jaime are 100% bluffing and neither of them intends to go through with it. That assumes that they’re going to be around to stop the events their actions set in motion. Let’s say that, in an incredibly unlikely series of events, Jaime Lannister disappears and is incommunicado for an extended period of time while Roslin remains in Lannister custody. Jaime’s threat was heard by his men, who have every reason to believe that putting that baby in a trebuchet was their Lord Commander’s wish should things go south for them. Jon’s got the opposite problem - nobody else heard his threat besides Gilly. If, in another unlikely series of events, Jon is killed and the Wall is thrown into chaos with multiple competing factions vying for control, Jon has created a situation in which the burning of Gilly’s child is the very predictable outcome. The damage is done, both Roslin’s and Gilly’s babies are going to die, as a direct consequence of Jon’s and Jaime’s actions.
Leave it to the Theon stan to argue this, but it seems clear to me that GRRM is preoccupied with the question of how much responsibility you bear for the unintended outcomes of your actions. That’s where the interesting bit lies, not in “what does this say about the contents of these characters’ souls.”
i'd argue gilly's baby is in a more precarious position than roslin's despite nobody else hearing jon's threats. jaime's threat was conditional, not just on IF edmure refused to surrender but also IF roslin gave birth while they were still storming the castle. everyone misses the context of that exact line, what he said about what definitely would happen if edmure refused him was bad enough: that riverrun would be stormed, reduced to ruins, and all its defenders killed, with the first attackers including edmure's own bannermen (kinsmen of his wedding guests forced into fighting for the enemy by the captivity of their missing relatives who were edmure's friends), but idt he's saying that if the castle falls and then roslin gives birth sometime later that jaime would have to return from kl with a new trebuchet to kill the baby, just "your wife may whelp before then" (ie, before jaime's done at riverrun). the possibility of his child's death in such a manner, on top of the certainty of everything jaime said before, is enough of a risk to sway edmure and make him accept that family, duty, honor actually allows for his submission in those circumstances.
gilly's baby is in danger from being seperated from the one person in the world who truly cares for his well-being and would protect him, leaving him in the care of jon, who made the threat, and val, herself a glorified hostage also under jon's protection. edmure/roslin's future child has more worth and more people to care about the baby's fate just by virtue of being highborn. the fact that roslin believes the baby's sex could determine edmure's death date shows that old walder frey still cares about having the next tully heir in his custody/bloodline, even if the lannisters have formally given riverrun to his second son (and the lord paramount title to baelish). lord walder does not value his children and grandchildren in a loving way, but he does in a family pride sense similar to tywin, housing all his descendants in need of it and bragging about how many men he'd sired, only willing to sacrifice one (developementally disabled) frey as the price for refusing to end his revenge and allow robb stark to go free at his mother's request. jaime himself could have the authority to summon roslin and her newborn child in the name of the crown, but any of his men acting in his absence would likely have a much stickier time getting roslin from their ostensible lordly ally, as she is still in her father's custody, yet to birth, at the end of affc.
i say all of this not really wrt jaime's blame level, but just to emphasize how jon's treatment of gilly is not treated proportionally, no matter his intent. his threat is unheard but unconditional, and, unlike baby trebuchet frey tully, jon's would-be baby!victim has no possible political protection in the absence of jon and gilly. even if the child died of natural causes, some childhood illness, or else was killed in a white walker-related death rather than killed by any living human at the wall, it's still on jon if he dies alone and gilly never sees her boy again after such a painful parting and everything she went through to escape craster's for her son's sake.
deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3
lol
ralsei spending all the time to make elaborate rooms and tea parties and baking cakes for everyone that he doesnt even taste and then making nothing for himself. everyone say thank you toby fox for writing ralsei
dont do this to me
happy for you two but can you lock in kris is actively battling the dissonance between the player and avatar rn
why do they keep bringing up it. what do they mean by this
asriel's retainer...in dess's room....hmm.....
mr dreamurr please lock in

Anya is live and ready to show you everything. Watch her strip, dance, and perform exclusive shows just for you. Interact in real-time and make your fantasies come true.
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deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3
lol
ralsei spending all the time to make elaborate rooms and tea parties and baking cakes for everyone that he doesnt even taste and then making nothing for himself. everyone say thank you toby fox for writing ralsei
dont do this to me
happy for you two but can you lock in kris is actively battling the dissonance between the player and avatar rn
why do they keep bringing up it. what do they mean by this
asriel's retainer...in dess's room....hmm.....
deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3
lol
ralsei spending all the time to make elaborate rooms and tea parties and baking cakes for everyone that he doesnt even taste and then making nothing for himself. everyone say thank you toby fox for writing ralsei
dont do this to me
happy for you two but can you lock in kris is actively battling the dissonance between the player and avatar rn
why do they keep bringing up it. what do they mean by this
deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3
lol
ralsei spending all the time to make elaborate rooms and tea parties and baking cakes for everyone that he doesnt even taste and then making nothing for himself. everyone say thank you toby fox for writing ralsei
dont do this to me
happy for you two but can you lock in kris is actively battling the dissonance between the player and avatar rn
deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3
lol
ralsei spending all the time to make elaborate rooms and tea parties and baking cakes for everyone that he doesnt even taste and then making nothing for himself. everyone say thank you toby fox for writing ralsei
dont do this to me
deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3
lol
ralsei spending all the time to make elaborate rooms and tea parties and baking cakes for everyone that he doesnt even taste and then making nothing for himself. everyone say thank you toby fox for writing ralsei

Anya is live and ready to show you everything. Watch her strip, dance, and perform exclusive shows just for you. Interact in real-time and make your fantasies come true.
Free to watch • No registration required • HD streaming
deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3
lol
deltarune playthrough chapter 3+
previous thread for undertale and chapter 1+2
right now kris is having a lot of fun being back in the dark world because it's an adventure for her.
i wonder when it'll stop feeling like fun
a game within a gameshow within a game. this is getting too meta
theres something going on genderwise with everyone here
rouxls kaard throuple. why not
Crazy line teasing kralsie throuple. you can tell how Tumblr this game is by the amount of shipbait there is between every major character pairing
chapter 3 was v fun. i feel like the story is just going to ramp up from here. a lot of time spent on tenna and what it means to spend your time in a nostalgia of the past, chasing the glory days that will never come back.
after chapter 3 deltarune is firmly a work of children's literature (positive) for me now, in how it spends a lot of time paying attention to what it means to be a kid growing up, the uncertainty of school and fitting in with peers, the growing pains associated with being too old for certain fantasies while still looking back to them for comfort, and the strangeness of looking back at your childhood while still being a child.
and now that toriel and undyne are out of the picture officially, and with susie's general attitude of not telling anything to a trusted adult, we've gone full into the roald dahl school of storytelling of "Get the adult out of the picture."
what does it all mean. what do the parallels mean
ok <3 yay <3