Shit. Wow. First of all, let’s just hear it for Deb [Ann Woll], dude. She’s such a gangster, man. She’s such a gangster. She’s such a big joy, you know. I am allowed to say, she’s working on Punisher [Season 1], which is like the biggest gift in the world, man. All of us know [gestures to Charlie Cox and Elden Henson ] it’s such a thrill and such an honor to be able to work with her. She’s so smart it’s like, SCARY, dude.

But you know, for me, with that relationship, I don’t know if anybody else agrees with this, but for me, I always thought that Frank looked at Karen—at her bravery, at her drive, her intelligence, her kindness—I think he always looked at her as the woman his daughter could have grown up to be.

Questioner: I wouldn’t suggest his daughter.

Yeah. But I mean, that’s what he would have hoped for [Lisa], you know. And I always sort of thought that. But I think what’s so cool [about that relationship], is that it’s completely unspoken and it’s completely—there’s no labels on that relationship whatsoever, and it could really be anything, and that’s what sort of keeps it, I think, alive and organic, and I really commend the writers for not trying to define it in any way and just to sort of let these two people kinda exist, and see what happens between us. It’s a badass way to work, and I’m super grateful to work that way with [Deb].