#snake avoidance training

I did it at [REDACTED] who is a licensed and certified snake avoidance trainer (I double checked the claim with the relevant department too, asked about what other trainers had heard about them, they checked out) and it went as advertised…for us.

it’s definitely a tricky one to go with, and it only takes the one miscalculation to have the negative side effects (class of 4 dogs, qualified experienced trainer. 3 dogs having negative side effects a year later). it’s not obvious at the training itself (it was a group one, the goal is avoidance so it is hard to pick if they were avoiding the snake or generalising, except that one of them did at one point leap like a meter in the air and run backwards. i’m unsure if it was the novelty the animal, the strength of the collar or a combo factor) - the point is, the building up  side effects are easily overlooked at the time when the dog is MEANT to be avoidance and tend to be more noticeable afterwards.

it is recommended after training to take them home and cuddle them because you have just spent a few hours intentionally scaring your dog, so they need a break after that. i’m ‘meant’ to do a follow up this year, but i’m not going to as i do not think it is worth the risk. 

I liked the life scenario set ups and wide variety of snakes/snake sizes/other reptiles. She will subtly avoid on sight and smell, recall around, refuse to come to me if I’m near one or even holding one etc and hasn’t had any of the side effects e.g. avoiding leads on ground, being afraid of sticks, being overly edgy in the following days and weeks etc. Picture perfect result for us. 

But I think that was due to how clear I was to the trainer on the need for careful training re: the context and situation combined with her being big nervous girl and that I work at [REDACTED].

I already know she still remembers as she spotted a snake about a month ago and avoided. Studies do find after two or so years the fear will fade and i will re-evaluate then but honestly I probably won’t. I don’t want my luck with risky tools to run out. 

If you’re going ahead with I just want to re-state that you are intentionally scaring your dog, it can backfire to varying degrees, and you need to personally decide if you are okay with that risk. 

please do not imitate any of this at home, im sharing this for informational purposes on why i was okay with this trainer and her methods, and to journal our training as i’ve been doing from the start. can’t say im super comfortable with all this. but also i live 400m from a waterbird sanctuary, in australia.

Thistle worked it out real quick, did really well. She didn’t shut down, bolt or freak out. She was however quite nervous by the end. Considering that is the actual goal, to scare my dog and make her worried (about snakes), that is good(?).

It is internally conflicting though, considering all the time I spend working on her confidence...to then go an intentionally have her scared.

My biggest concern was her having an adverse reaction to the people around or anything but the snake. That thankfully did not happen or seem to be an issue. The trainer had really good timing and kept it specific to the snakes.

Here is how it went:

live target animals (snakes, a lizard)

familiar environment where the only “novel” item is the snakes (to draw the dog’s attention)

ecollar set at dog’s ‘working level’ (the level they can detect it. for thistle, this was a 7. this means she is quite sensitive and only needs a tingle)

first time with largest snake (so dog notices it) - walk directly at snake with leashed dog. stop 1 metre away. keep secure grip on the dog.

when the dog focuses on the snake and chooses to move towards it the trainer uses the ecollar

as the dog is alarmed/surprised, the dog retreats. owner follows and praises the dog

turn around and walk back at the same snake. this time the dog will slow down or turn away. join the dog in avoiding and praise!

then your dog goes have a break

praise your dog more and give a treat

go watch the other dogs

you then have 3-4 passes each on the other two snakes and a lizard. it’s no more than that as session needs to be small.

the goal is to alarm/scare the dog without having them shut down, panic or become aggressive. the goal is wary avoidance, not mindless fear. you must go with your dog when they avoid, you must praise your dog for avoiding!

our scenarios of proofing avoidance included:

on leash walking directly at snake (she does the 180 pictured)

me standing next to snake calling offleash dog (intelligent disobedience, she went to the other people)

sitstay the dog, have snake between, recall dog (dog went around)

the lizard was harder, thistle needed a shock for this (and at a higher level). suspected due to her murder of one so less fearful. after that she had a longer break to account for the extra stress.

obedience heeling and she breaking focus from me to avoid (intelligent disobedience)

jogging towards the snake - my dog deserts me to my death

tossing dog food at the snake - she approached and got a correction. did it again and she did not approach.

Then we left for a nice relaxing snake-less walk and went to our christmas bbq. everyone was told to give her extra space so she could de-stress. the trainer says 3-5 shocks throughout the whole thing is about average

We have a second lesson next week. It will be the snakes in different locations, a field, a car park, a path. Places you may take your dog and encounter a snake.

The lesson will be seeing what they remember and doing more proofing of avoidance, ideally without any shocks needed at all.

So that was it. it’s all rather anticlimatic on the day. I still feel funny on the inside, but I’m hopeful that in the event of a snake, it will give us an edge to get away safely.

Disclaimer: please do not imitate at home! if this is something you may want for your dog, talk to a trainer in your area. not me. not some other dogblr. not a blog post. not a youtube video. find someone experienced with shock collars local to you and speak to them, see what method they use (there are multiple shock collar methods), think about your individual dog, is it actually necessary? are you in a snake zone? don’t rush into it!

I’m happy to answer messages about my thought processes/feelings but they’re not training advice.

I personally don’t think shock collars should be used outside of purposes for demotivating a dog on wildlife/stock and certainly not without attending training with an established experienced trainer on how to use them.

I thought long and hard on this. I attended two classes on using shock collars (introductory and advanced) before i even considered putting this on my dog. I’m not really comfortable/keen on this.

Please do not imitate any of this at home, I attended this training under a experienced professional who specialises in snake avoidance avoidance training with many recent positive reviews and all the appropriate licenses.

I was less internally conflicted this time, because the purpose of having the session a month later isn’t to train the dog on avoidance but to test to see how well they remember. Some of the other dogs needed reminders, but I’m happy to say Thistle didn’t need any reminders in any life scenarios at all :D :D 

We had breaks between each scenario of about 15 minutes while other dogs did their thing.

Scenario one: Giant black headed snake on a bush path. This dude was huge and moving. We walked along on lead and she didn’t seem to notice it until we were about to walk over the top of it when she stopped dead, did a 180 and dragged me off at a walk. Once about 8m away from the snake she got treats, praise, comforting strokes. We went for another repeat but she curved us away from that snake again. However, on our return awhile later we walked through the same spot with barely any hesitation. I assume, due to the wind, the scent had faded enough to be “old”.

Scenario two: Small yet lazy brown snake on a footpath. Again, on lead. Just walking along as if on a walk and suddenly Thistle decided no, we need to go 45 degrees to the left and she just kept going. Again, once at a safe distance from the snake, praise and rewarded her. Comforting pats. Go for a sniff of some not-snake twigs. We repeated the scenario, this time me pretending to be a dumb human who cant see the snake and she stopped dead. I pretended to notice the snake and did a “oh god!” and a 180 walk fast away with a treat party. As that would prob be how IRL so good to practice linking me speaking in alarmed fashion.

Scenario three: small and speedy snake. This is when they realised she was doing it by scent because Thistle changed direction before either of us could physcially see the snake near the shrubs. We did it again and this time she saw it and again changed direction. Lots of rewards!

Scenario four: offlead in a field. For this one, focus on intelligent disobedience. So things like me commanding thistle to heel towards the snake and she’d break off each time to go around in a curve and join me on the other side. Recalling her to me with the snake between us (Thistle goes around). Recalling while I’m standing next to the snake (Thistle standing there looking at me like: You’re a fucking idiot mum). I believe they took some videos of us but I haven’t seen any. Treats and praises for each time she disobeyed a command!

At the end of the session we went one step further with Thistle. I held the snake, and commanded her to investigate it. This was a tricky one because I frequently offer Thistle things she is uncertain of to investigate. Two times Thistle obeyed me and the trainer corrected her at her working level. The third time, she intentionally disobeyed me. She was verbally praised while I untangled the snake enough to toss her some treats. 

The session ended there. That last extra exercise is a huge thing for her to do - so ending it there, and going off to do our own thing and relax will cement things in her head without scaring her unnecessarily or turning it into a truly bad experience instead of uncomfortable. Time to go home and chill, eat food, cuddle etc.

So those two were her only times today and I am glad we can now put this training behind us. I am glad to confirm she can identify a snake in either sight or scent, and that her method of avoidance is just to go around - not fleeing mindless or hunting it. This is the goal for all the dogs. 

Recap from last time: This is done at the dogs working level because you don’t want to overcorrect and create mindless fear. The working level is sufficient because the dog is already on the alert from the unknown creature, and that is enough for it to go from a background “odd feeling”, to that same feeling in a new situation becoming “alarming” and causing them to connect it to the novel creature and add physical space. Then you confirm they made the right decision by praising fervently, to cement it in their brains that they made a good decision. They don’t need those brains zapped out, that’s when you fuck up and just make everything worse. Don’t do that.

Of note, Thistle appears to be avoiding the snakes on both sight AND scent. This was true for one other dog in our workshop, a GSD and fellow companion in teaching our dogs scent detection.

I’m sure with enough repetition the other dogs would make the connection as well, but we found it notable that the only two dogs already trained to an advanced level in scent detection made the connection between the novel item (snake) and the novel scent (snake) in one session and carried it through to a second session over a month later while the other dogs were going purely off sight and needed reminders.

Also of note, the gsds were still unsettled on getting home - while Thistle recovered really quick. Our current going hypothesis is that...Thistle is, in a way by her own nature, used to being alarmed by new things and recovers really quickly once the alarming-thing is gone. The confident GSD however, is NOT used to being startled and so had a tougher time of recovering from concerns and carried some superstition with them.

So if your dog is the kind to take some time after being startled to recover, consider that and be ready to accommodate them the rest of the night in keeping things chill and nice. Nothing too challenging. This is a routine I kind have down pat for Thistle after any alarming situation anyway, but those not used to such behaviour may not know how to go about speeding up startle recovery.

Disclaimer: please do not imitate at home! if this is something you may want for your dog, talk to a trainer in your area. not me. not some other dogblr. not a blog post. not a youtube video. find someone experienced with shock collars local to you and speak to them, see what method they use (there are multiple methods), think about your individual dog, is it actually necessary? are you in a snake zone? don’t rush into it!