#peter dunn

BF: Yeah, of course.

PD: So we started a Kickstarter to try and raise $12,000 to shoot the pilot episode. We were going to produce the pilot episode ourselves, do everything ourselves, blah blah blah. The Kickstarter failed, and when Kickstarter fails it means you don't get any of the money. I was honestly mortified because I was like, "My ego cannot take this hit. I finally talked about this project and put it out there. I can't be the person that failed, never got to actually do what they said they were going to do." So I went the old school route. I went to a lot of LGBT fundraisers and benefits and networked; I was just talking to people with money and handing out business cards and being like, "Hey, I have this thing if you want to read it, if you have any interest in investing a little bit of money in it, give it a read." Then we did an Indiegogo also. We somehow ended up raising enough to not only shoot the first episode, but to shoot the entire first season.

So we did that, and it was one of the most incredible and exhausting experiences of my life, because we were shooting 60 to 70 hour weeks. On top of that, I'd written it, was co-directing it, producing it, starring in it, which wasn't originally my goal — and just doing a lot. We had a budget, but it still wasn't a huge budget, especially for making things up to my standard.

I dressed all the characters myself, ordered all those clothes online and returned them, and I would cook for the cast and crew half the time, just because it was cheaper. So it was just a very, very, very, very, very exhausting experience, but incredible. I don't think I'll ever owe people more in my life than the cast and crew of that show. They gave me everything in them for a year and a half, basically.

Our goal was to release it the day of the next season premiere of Girls, which was January 2014. Oh, my God. And then, of course, Looking ended up premiering that same night too, so all of our initial reviews were comparing Gays to Looking, and the amazing thing is most of the reviews said that Gays was better, which I appreciated and kind of agreed with. We released the first season through the course of a year, and after that, I was kind of burnt out; I said I was going to take a three to six-month break then get back to working on season two. That was three years ago.

We still get messages from people being like, "Is it ever coming back?" So it's cool to know that the interest is still there.

BF: Oh yeah, there’s a definite fan base.

PD: Three years later! My goal is to get back to it this summer, hopefully, along with getting my summer body.

BF: Me too, girl.

PD: That people will still care about the characters and the storylines and that it's still four, five main characters that are relevant to the community and that have important stories to tell.

BF: I think that's so important. It's been a while since I watched it, but I know that when I did see it, there was such strong representation — like, I knew these people in my life, but I've never seen it on-screen. That’s what's so lovely about it. 

PD: Yeah. I really did feel like it was stories that weren't being told for our community that were important to tell. And the really cool thing about releasing online is that anyone who has access to the internet can watch this. There's this really cool thing where you can see all your statistics, and it shows you a picture of the world and all of the countries will either be gray or blue. If they're blue, it means that your content has been clicked on and viewed and played in that country. And, literally, Gays has been watched in 140 of 144 countries.

BF: Oh, shit. 140?

PD: It's insane. And seeing that map, and seeing all of these blue places, and it's like... Malaysia, it's been viewed four times. And places like Russia and a lot of Africa, that possibly this gave this little gay teen some form of escape to tell them that who they are is okay, and that they matter. 

BF: That's incredible. Growing up in the city, when did you come out?

PD: I feel like I was basically always out. Like, ever since I was like four or five, I was always just like, "I like boys." And I think everyone in my family thought it was a phase, but I was always just like, "I like boys." I rode the bi-train for a bit, "I like everyone, that's okay, I'm me, I just love to love people." Growing up having worked in theater, I was surrounded by a lot of gay men, which was very fortunate for me...in many ways.

But I was also surrounded by positive gay role models, so even though I was still teased a lot in school, it didn't effect me as much as it can effects other people, I think, because I knew I was fine. I guess I officially, officially came out in high school, but I never really had to have the coming out...

BF: So you have kind of always been out, and your family was fine with it?

PD: For the most part, yes. I mean, I still think that they would have preferred that I was not gay. I think the males in my family had more of a problem with it than the females in my family.

BF: Naturally.

PD: And my mom was fine with it. I think my mom was just worried about my overall well-being and how I was going to be treated for being gay more than actually having a problem with me being gay, if that makes sense.

There are things that she's had to adjust to a little bit, but compared to a lot of stories from other people I know, I would say it was a piece of cake for me, honestly. I was very lucky in that way. I was always just, if someone isn't going to love me for me, then I just don't really need that person in my life. I’ve cut out certain family members for that, but it's still never really been something that I've regretted. I can find people that will love me and that can replace you easily. That's what chosen family is for, you know?

BF: Did your family see Gays?

PD: Yes, and that was...weird. 

BF: I feel like saying you’re gay is one thing, but actually doing it can be something else entirely, especially when your identity is so involved in your art.

PD: Absolutely.

BF: Being a drag queen, I felt like I had to come out to my mother again. I was like, "Oh yeah, not only do I sleep with men, but I'm going to be a woman at night too," and she was like, "Oh, my God. What is this? What are you doing?"

PD: "I don't understand what's happeningI"

BF: "You're doing what?" I mean, she gets it now, but...

PD: It took a while. I just keep finding that becoming an adult, or being an adult — it’s such a weird fucking experience. Being a kid was much easier. I told my mom all about the show and she was there through the process. She cooked sometimes for the cast and crew and stuff.

She was on the show. She played my mom on it. She was only in a couple scenes. I knew that I was going to be uncomfortable watching some of it with her because a lot of it is autobiographical. I was dreading the sex scene. 

BF: Yes, of course. Of course.

PD: Even seeing that at our premiere party was 30 of the worst seconds of my entire life. She wasn't there, but we had that episode premiere party at Therapy and it was fucking packed with some people that I've known since I was a child. And I'm getting, like, fucking pounded out on a ginormous screen in front of a room full of people that do and don't know me. So my mom came to the first two premiere parties. She saw the first four episodes, because mainly she was like, "I need to see myself."

I do know that she didn't finish watching the show by herself. There have been times where I've brought that up and she has expressed disdain for some of the content of the show, and some of the things that I was doing. So she never finished the season because of that, which kind of makes me sad, but I understand.

BF: My mom doesn't like when I'm...well, anything but pure. She doesn't like when I'm dirty. With my act, she’s like, "Do you really have to talk about pussy?"

PD: I was just about to say, "So the pussy number is not her favorite?"

BF: Exactly. But I get it. I mean, I'm glad that she watched a little bit of it, to understand.

PD: I will say I wish she had finished it, only because the stuff I'm most proud of is the second half of the season, because that's when i feel like the show got to the really serious stuff.

BF: The meat of the season. I noticed that when you were talking about creating Gays, that it was not only the most incredible, but the most taxing experience of your entire life. I mean, personally, I have been doing so much. I've basically been slaying the game, artistically.

PD: Seriously.

BF: In the drag scene, trying to one-up myself, to keep doing bigger and bigger projects. But while my art was thriving, I kind of forgot about myself, taking care of me...and I'm still trying to figure it out.

PD: I feel like I'm always reminding you, "Remember, don't forget about Brita Filter."

BF: Right? Are there certain things you do to combat that? I think the thing that we have in common is that we push and push ourselves, and when I do that I’m all of sudden completely depleted.

PD: It's putting out so much energy and commitment, and thinking that you have 250% to put out there for eternity. None of us are invincible, you know what I mean?

BF: Yeah.

PD: I've learned to try to be my own therapist sometimes — to really analyze some of the habits and patterns I repeat. I realize I have this cycle no matter what I'm putting my energy into — X Factor, Gays, producing shows and stuff in the city — I just honestly go past what my actual limit is, and my body has to remind me. I mean, I literally had a heart attack before I was 30.

BF: I remember when that happened. That was scary.

PD: That was a little right after I met you, actually. Three years in June. June 23 was when that happened, 2015. That came from just me overexerting myself and not making myself a priority at all. Forgetting to do the basic things you need to survive, like eat food and drink water and sleep. Those basic things that humans need to survive. I was just like, "Who needs water? Why would I eat? I'm not hungry right now. I don't have time for that."

That was one of the biggest wake up calls that I've ever had, clearly. It's like, "oh, let's just almost die," you know? So now I try and force myself to just stop sometimes. If I feel like I need a break, then that means I need a break. My peak so far was producing four to eight shows a month. Each show was already taking all of me, and I was doubling them and tripling them and quadrupling them up, to the point where I didn't do anything except produce shows and answer emails. My brain was constantly in overdrive and there was no actual relaxation. My brain was always over-processing 20 million fucking things.

So that, it was like: “Okay. We know where this can lead from the past, so let's take a step away from this, give yourself a little bit of time for a couple months, and then you'll know when you're ready to step back into that creative seat.” And I think, especially as artists, we kind of feel like we always have to be doing something.

We're like, "How am I going to get to whatever point I want to get to unless I'm always working on something?" But taking time for yourself and resting your creative mind can be just as important.

BF: So important. You have to live life in order for things to come. So I'm proud of you. You're doing a great job. 

PD: Aww.

BF: Lately, I've been taking a walk by the river, even if it's for just 20 minutes.

PD: It's crazy what that does to your mind. 

BF: Just stepping away from the fucking concrete and all these damn buildings and people.

PD: And all these damn people. Especially working in nightlife, in combination with being an artist, you're just constantly having to be on.

BF: 100%. Now you have so many other things going on. What are you mainly focusing on right now? 

PD: I'm back to producing a good amount of shows at The West End and also at The Cutting Room.

BF: That's a great venue. The Cutting Room.

PD: Oh, my God. It's fucking gorgeous. Yeah, my most recent show there, I was working with two amazing singer-songwriters, Selda Sahin and Derek Gregor, and we got over 200 people there. It was a pretty incredible show. 

I'm also very grateful for The West End for bringing me the perfect opportunity to use the kind of stuff that I was doing on X Factor in a hands-on, intimate way — to help artists thrive, and give them a safe space to create and feel genuinely supported. So many times in this city, you don't have real support. You don't have people who are coming out to your shows and who are telling you "I believe in you and I want to help you in any way that I can."

Also, I'm planning on starting work on Gays Season 2 soon, and thinking about exploring the music A&R world, and also working on my own music again. I had stopped songwriting when I was a teenager probably, but since getting more involved in live music, I was like, "I know I can write. Why not?” I was dealing with a experience with a boy and I realized literally the only possible way for me to get closure from this situation is music.

So I wrote my first song in 15 years and sent it to a friend, the amazing Morgan Riley, who helped me put music under it. I'm writing music more and maybe if I get the balls to do it, I’ll start putting that out into the world too. 

BF: Planting seeds. I feel like, as an artist, once you stop learning, it's time to give up.

PD: And once you think you know everything, it's definitely time to give up.

BF: The reason why I love being a drag queen is because I love our community so much. I love the LGBTQ community, I love giving people a safe space where they can come and they can forget about everything. What would you like to see the city’s LGBTQ community, or nightlife in general, move toward?

PD: I am still such a huge fan of the community, and of nightlife, and of the LGBTQ community, but I do wish that new connections were made more genuinely out and about. That was always my favorite thing about going out when I was younger, just meeting people and never knowing where the night was going. I was one of those people that would be going to 10 different places, picking up strays along the way, being like, "You're a good time, come with me and my friends." 

There was a genuine kind of spirit in the air. We're going out and we're going to make new connections and we're going to be a big old happy family — I miss that a little bit. If you go out, just meet one new person. You know? If you see somebody who's out by themselves, don't be a creep, but just smile and say "hi" to them. I always think it's really important to acknowledge people. I feel like people walk around a lot feeling like they're invisible in many ways, and a really simple "hello" or a smile can make a difference in someone's entire day.

BF: That's right. Smile at a stranger. I'm actually really glad that you said that because I'm really trying to take my drag to the next level — to be a New York City —

PD: Icon, bitch.

BF: Icon. 

PD: Legendary.

BF: You know, well, she's moving on up. The reason why I started is because I wanted to create those safe spaces for people, and to make people just laugh and get away. To create moments. You can never recreate that.

PD: Some of my best memories with some of my best friends — some who aren't even with us anymore — had so much to do with the genuine fun of feeling like you didn't want to be anywhere else but where you were, with the people you were with. I kind of feel like that joy is just not as available as much as it was before.

BF: Yeah, I agree. Well, bitch, Imma change that shit.