#deconstructingchristianity

do you have any advice for someone who doesn't have much background knowledge on how to get started? e.g. how to work with Mary, how to find Saints that resonate? thank you!! -- seashellspirit / garden-goth

Well hi! I'm so pleased to hear from you!

You are lucky in that there are more resources nowadays for getting started, especially when you don't have much of a background in Christian culture and beliefs. I know that it is daunting to see centuries of material and wonder "where do I even begin!?", especially when there's so much venom coming from far-right sources from their supposed Christian lens.

For me, even as I was raised in a Catholic but not very religious household, I had to teach myself too. Sources like Sara Raztresen's book Discovering Christian Witchcraft is a great starting point! It talks about working with Mary in a Christian context, angels, demons, the liturgical calendar, and it especially breaks down and re-explains how Scripture was and is used to demonize witchcraft, when in fact, we can definitely do a personal Christian practice that includes it. She's coming out with a book "Discerning Christian Witchcraft" in December 2025 and I'm counting down the days! For my prayers to Mary, there's online resources for praying the rosary. As long as you're comfortable with the prayers (even making your own prayers), you can call Mary with it. It's like holding her hand. AND! I recommend Sara's books because she has a super well-researched and comprehensive bibliography in that book that can help you explore even more things, like books from theologians and scholars who critically read Scripture and aim to dismantle the centuries of harm other interpreters have caused! Not many spiritual books have that. She also has a Youtube channel.

For saints, if you find a book on Saints A-Z, or any encyclopedia on them, read through it. See if there's saints in there that through their struggles, lives and patronages, you can resonate with a few.

Saints, Angels & Demons: An A-to-Z Guide to the Holy and the Damned by Gary Jansen is excellent, beyond gorgeous, and comprehensive! I found Judika Illes's book Encyclopedia of Mystics, Saints & Sages is also a good book if you still need to make your search non-suspicious to your folks. I find some of the information in it to be not that elaborated on, sometimes with too much of a New Age interpretation for my taste.

edit I guess the other huge thing for me that I can enunciate now but couldn’t quite put to words back then was that they forced you to be emotionally dishonest and to lie about it to appease the leaders. Everyone had to do this…I grew up under a narcissistic abuser so I recognized the pattern of disallowing emotional honesty and replacing it with something false, like taking pieces of your real heart and replacing them with cyborg pieces, but in the spirit/soul realm. This is a trauma response…and one that watchmen for the nations dealt with in some of the Gen X gatherings. We traded the foreign governors we had placed on our hearts to keep them from getting too passionate with God because of past misunderstanding around this/leaders who didn’t hear God or keep in step with the Holy Spirit quenching what God was doing and shaming us for wanting to stay with Him…with healed hearts and renewed passion. This is a type of relational violence (it was done with hardcore shaming and use of anger/rage) that I now call emotional rape. They’re replacing your unique identity with their group identity against your will, forcing you to birth their stuff and not the stuff you were called to birth. The hierarchy structure at the River only worked because the leaders were the ones who got to choose the narrative of what was happening…very typical of narcissistic abuse. The power is in the hands of the one who chooses the narrative. What actually happened has no bearing on this. They decide reality and gaslight and abuse the hell out of everything and everyone until and theirs is the only accepted version. Nobody else’s perspective or perceptions or experiences were valid. If you were emotionally honest, they would guilt and shame you for it, saying that you were being too needy and you needed to surrender to the Lordship of Jesus Christ in your life. They were taking pieces of themselves and crucifying even that which Christ had already redeemed – demonizing good gifts like delight in drawing and freedom to paint and create and placing religious restrictions on them. That was huge for me. Are they healed enough to create? Ts THE litmus test of whether or not people are emotionally healthy enough for me as an artist/creator to remain around and stay productive. And the answer was no. They were severely hobbled in their ability to create because of the cages in their own minds. The only two people that I was allowed to have ‘real conversations’ with were a single mom career artist and her daughter. I was a little wary of this relational weirdness, but I was like, OK, I guess I’ll try it and see… So they invited me to bring a painting to show them and then they…were really weird about it…it was like the strangest invalidation of my gift and the gift that I was opening my heart and sharing this intimate thing…like when Julia Cameron talks about “dragging home the invisible bone…” (The Artist’s Way) that is exactly what this was. They then proceeded to tell me I needed to be very careful with this gift because it can be used improperly…she said she draws cars for a living, and she HATES cars…she would have preferred to draw clothes but she chose cars so she could crucify herself and live a life of submission to God. That was when I politely excused myself, went straight to the pastor’s wife and told her what they’d said. She basically brushed me off, said she didn’t want to hear it. I said – they’re not really healed enough to lead me in the arts tbh and she said she trusted what they had to say and that if I wanted to participate in the church then I’d better listen up and submit to it. I said…they’re still REALLY wounded. She responded “so is everyone.” And that’s when I knew she was talking about herself, and her husband, the head pastor. I think that’s when I left the church emotionally. I think that parts of me still went back after that, but at that point, I’d seen enough to know these were not safe people – they were in fact very messed up, deceived and dangerous to my calling and they would kill it if they were given the chance.

So, to avoid what happened to @AbbyTownsend -people invalidating what she said because she made generalizations without specific examples, I will be putting names of churches and their cities and denominations, as well as the time period during which I attended. If people really want to know which leaders were there at that time they can do the work of digging that up. I'm not here to name or expose specific people - God knows who they are and will hold them to account.

Maybe I grew up in a bubble with my dad as a doctor - we didn't have excess, (in my mind) but we also didn't want for anything. I have detected a pattern in my dealings with people over the years, starting in those years of struggle - I noticed that church people are really weird about money.

They're really nice until you need something. Then they begin this evaluation of whether or not you deserve their help. (Which is completely unbiblical and against Jesus Christ's teachings). I think my inability to see this coming was a huge reason that I got walloped with a lot of spiritual abuse from big-city Christians in my early 20's.

For me, as a redemptive prophet, we know our lives are forfeit, and we have already given everything, so we will give to the point of hurt if we see someone in need.

But not most leaders. Their response most of the time when I asked for something material was to dole out judgement while withholding what I needed.

I seem to remember hearing a sermon from the pulpit at Westwood Mennonite in Prince George (2001-2002) about not saving people when they ask for help, so that they can turn to God instead. I get the point of this, and I agree with it in general, (having boundaries and teaching others to rely on God as source) but there is a time and place when God does want to pour through you, so this takes discernment.

Someone had given me bread when I ran out of food and were dealing with flack from the leadership of the church for having done so. The pastor who railed so hard against me in this season was caught in a major theological conflict with his congregation not long after he persecuted the call of God in my life. He was ousted and chose early retirement (rather than relocation) soon after.

But by far worst example of this was probably in Vancouver/Burnaby, with two churches that are no longer in existence. Perhaps there is a bit of poetic justice to that.

So I had been attending Point Grey Community Church in Kerrisdale/Kits for over a year when I had lost another couple jobs due to my anxiety, physical weakness (due to the bowel issues) and neurodivergence, and I had run out of money for food and medicine (you're not supposed to go cold turkey off SSRIs).

I had been wrestling with what to do for months. I screwed up the courage to go to the pastor after a service one night and asked if they could help with food.

Now I really liked this pastor and he had a heart for the broken and even rebellious, as he had once been a rebellious youth. I was never rebellious, though a lot of people liked to label me that way because I had to go so much against the grain to follow God's call in that season. A few months prior I had asked him if he would be a spiritual father to me and to my surprise he had said yes. To my surprise he didn't want to talk much or even interact much though. So I hadn't seen him in a while or connected with him since the initial ask.

He told me that the job market in Vancouver at the time was in a slump, and a number of people were struggling. He told me they normally helped people with these types of things but lately they'd had to be more choosey about who they helped and look at the person's situation.

He informed me that they'd already helped five families that month and they couldn't help any more, especially given who my friends were in the church - an ex-drug addict who was in recovery had been hanging with me and my roommate a lot.

He then told me point blank without even asking for further explanation that I "just needed to get a job," and that was it. Judge and jury.

I hadn't told him about the chronic illness and I wasn't aware enough of the neurodivergence. It broke my heart and completely ruined my relationship with him. I never went back.

But I did start attending a different church in Burnaby, a church that called itself, "The River." This church promised to solve all my problems tout suite.

These are the ones that once they heard I had a job interview and had asked for spare change for the bus - decided not only not to give me any, but to tell everyone else not to give me any either. I heard later that they were sort of rubbing their hands together and waiting for a show to see if I was an addict or what type of person they were dealing with given my performance of what I would do without the money to get on the bus.

Of course, I didn't make the interview. The new friend who arranged it was really angry. She also attended the church. And when I told her what had happened, she couldn't let it go and never spoke to me again. I guess the leaders had told everyone not to give me any money. They told me to ask my landlady (home stay host). But alas, she didn't carry cash/change so she said no, just please ask your friends. I did, and they didn't give me any, as they had been instructed by the church leadership not to.

As I'm writing this I can't help but think how f9d up it is that they did this. As a parent, I'm horrified. As a Christian, I'm mortified. As a people called living stones, being built together into the church - who are supposed to be loving servants of humanity, I am speechless. I literally feel nauseated right now.

I stuck around for a few months longer than then eventually realized that the cult-like behaviours present at this church were a core part of their identity. I broke up with the church by spending a lot of time (and I would say dating and he would say not) with a backslidden blues player who was cracked out, drunk or both, most of the time. But at least it got me out of there.

RIGHT?

So I've been awake and crying for an hour now, sleepless in bed. I got up to add these questions, because I know that everyone who reads these will be making their own judgements, whether they realize it or not.

If I had done any of those things that I had been accused of doing, (mostly drugs) would that have made me worthy of such treatment?

Maybe. That's the strongest answer I can come up with that feels right.

And even if the answer were a resounding yes, would Jesus have treated me that way when I came to him for help?

Edit

Virtually all my bad memories of The River have resurfaced since I wrote this just a couple days ago.

And some more questionable conversations/accusations with/from elders from Point Grey Community Church. Should the first response if someone has trouble navigating the bus system in a big city (from living in a wilderness rainforest most of their life) be to jump to conclusions about alcohol and drug abuse? I am neurodivergent and while that was undiagnosed, it was clear to a lot of people. I needed some extra help with directions and when that wasn’t given, I didn’t feel confident taking buses into the middle of nowhere in case I ended up stranded with no food and a blood sugar low.

There were two instances where I was unreasonably criticized for this.

One was when a youth from the River church decided that my problem was I needed a job, and I needed one pronto. My best guess is that she overheard leadership talking about me in my absence and decided she could solve this problem.

Without asking my permission or speaking with me about my strengths, weaknesses, or illness, she arranged for a job interview with her boss at Starbucks, in a part of the city I was unfamiliar with, and at least half hour forty-five minute bus commute away from where I lived. She had asked me initially, but ignored my, “protests of no, I’m processing right now and need some time to just deal with life, I’m not ready; besides, I’ve already interviewed with them, they only hire coffee drinkers – I can’t handle caffeine.”

She called me a week later to give me the time and date of my interview, and asked if I thought I could make it, to which I replied, “No, I’ve been feeling really sick lately and need some time. I also don’t know the buses in that part of town or where you are describing without an exact address and specific instructions on where to catch the buses and at what time, how and when to switch, etc.” (there were no google maps back then).

She apparently didn’t cancel the interview, even though I said this, and she did not then nor since call back and give me directions or a clear destination. So when I didn’t show up, she got really angry and let me have it. I was upset too, because I had clearly stated at least twice that I did not want this to happen and it was not a good fit for me. She didn’t really listen to my points, just accused me again of making her look bad in front of her boss, and making me look even worse, for not showing up. (This P.O. attitude was typical of The River staff and head pastors.) When I tried to turn the conversation to a more friendly tone, she spun on a heal and flounced away.

Her mom did call me a few days later and cleared up some of the misunderstanding of why she was acting so strangely. She said that her daughter was neurodivergent, and didn’t always understand how to give directions, but that even though she and her husband were listening on the conversation, and probably should have intervened at that point to give me directions, they liked to allow her to keep her friendships without their intervention, so they decided against it. I asked why she couldn’t take responsibility for her actions without blaming me, and she said that although her daughter held no ill will toward me after her mom explained what had happened, her neural net was overloading whenever she thought about the situation and she didn’t understand it and she didn’t want to deal with me (ever again) because it was overstimulating to her.

The second was a few months or even a year after I left PGCC. I had been befriended by a grandfatherly type while attending, who had even been to Bella Coola or had some relatives who lived there for a time, I think. He met my mom when she came to the outdoor service visiting me in Vancouver (and we had the same haircut, even though we hadn’t spoken in months). I ran into him some way or another and we went to Mcdonalds to have a chat. I told him how anxiety was making my life unbearable and he told me I just needed to keep busy. He later called me up and invited me to the family easter dinner at his house because I had no family in town.

It turned out he lived really far from where I was living, and I needed to take several buses to get there. At first he offered me a ride with oen of his kids, but then a couple weeks later called back to say that person couldn’t give me a ride but that I could take the bus and it was probably better for everyone that way. I asked for directions and he said he didn’t know buses or directions. He gave me an address and a general area where he lived but there was no google maps and I really had no idea where it was. I told him I wasn’t confident about taking the bus and he said he knew someone – a young man, who did it all the time, so not to worry. So he called me a couple days before and I said I wasn’t feeling well and probably wouldn’t make it because of the bus situation. I said I’d love to come but this was a barrier for me. He said they hoped I would come.

He called me back a week or two later, feeling angry and hurt that I hadn’t shown up. I told him that I had been honest about feeling sick and that I couldn’t figure out the buses on my own without help, especially if I wasn’t well. This made him feel a little better but he kept defending the thing about the guy who couldn’t give me a ride. (Like who cares! Just don’t expect me then!) Then he said that it wasn’t that a big of a deal but that they were expecting me and they even set a place for me at the table with my nametag, so they were disappointed that I hadn’t shown up. He proceeded to tell me what a good meal it had been and how amazing of a family time it was.

I said I would still like to come out – and he said, well there’s lots of people that want to come to my family dinners and can’t because there are so many who want to- we’ve turned down lots of people. So you should consider yourself lucky that you were invited. We will invite someone else next time and maybe in the future you’ll get another chance.

Then he said he was talking with the pastor/elders at PGCC and that he had to ask me these questions because of his involvement with the church.  He proceeded to ask me why I was feeling sick – had I been drinking? Partying? Doing drugs? Was I hungover?

I never spoke to him again.

The thing that's scary about books like "The Power of a Praying Wife," by Stormy Omartian, is that it lumps all marriages into one, as if every situation is the same, and deserves to be labelled the same way. I suppose this follows from a fundamentalist worldview. However, the promises of fundamentalism rarely pan out. God doesn't make sure everything works, just because you do. Just because I believe in marriage and did 'everything right' according to purity culture doesn't mean my marriage was healthy, or that I should fear to speak aloud the D word and do everything in my power to avoid it.

It's scary because this book (and the people in whom I confided) kept me in a bad situation for a lot longer than I should have been there. Insisting that the woman change first, when most women are basically decent, and it's the man's decisions that determine the health of the relationship? (See previous post on scientific studies.) Maybe it worked for her, but that doesn't necessarily mean it can be applied across the board or that it isn't being used as a tool of oppression.

I’ve stepped back from deep involvement with the church because I found that my perspective wasn’t wanted. People wanted only to reinforce what they already believed, which is what their close inner circle did.

So they started trying to disqualify me, whispering behind my back (literally) about my billowy dress pants that were “too much like Pyjamas,” and other ridiculous, superficial things.

They did not like it when a prophetic type landed beside them and started challenging their religious assumptions.

I had them too, believe YOU ME, but I went through a gauntlet of personal circumstances for almost 20 years where God humbled me and showed me where I had been wrong to align with religious assumptions rather than seeking truth from the Holy Spirit and confirmation in the Word of God on His perspective on the issues.

Because a lot of what the body of Christ believes isn’t really as PERFRECT as most people think. And to be honest, groupthink is what’s wrong with Americans, especially the American church. You join a group so they can do the thinking for you, and, to jab back at the Trump supporters who like hearing the brutally frank, well I guess this makes sense for a nation of farmers. They weren’t the brightest bulbs to begin with, (although the intellectuals joined them later) and they were too tired from farming all day to want to think.

Even to this day, they want the hot blond girl, with the big lug footballer (and not the other girls who have just as much to give and possibly more, but are darker shades of blonde/brown.)

 But it doesn’t make sense anymore, church, the charismatic movement taught you that you can have intimacy with God and hear his voice on the issues.

So why don’t you?

Not only was my experience and wisdom mocked, I was also rejected as ‘believer,’ because I had too much faith, too much confidence, too much beauty, too much style, too much health. In other words, I had too much manifestation of the faith they were afraid to gasp, because of their slavery mindset which kept them locked in unbelief.

This is laughable to those who have known me for a long time, especially in YWAM because I was so socially awkward and unfashionable, and I still thought I was fairly unattractive, fresh out of the middle and high school bullying.

It wasn’t just being pushed back and contradicted when I spoke, it was the assumptions based on surface things -shallow depth at which I was known and judged, that really made me question whether these people of God were operating at a level of wisdom I could get behind.

When we talk about facing truth according to Jesus, it’s not about memorizing Bible verses or checking boxes of religious behavior. Jesus didn’t come to burden us with a rulebook. He came to show us a way of living that revolves around love, justice, and mercy. Jesus made it crystal clear when He confronted the Pharisees, the religious leaders of His time. He told them, “You have neglected the…

Intro to the Intro

Welcome to my series of explorations titled “Elephants Fill the Room.” These micro-essays will spotlight facets of ourselves that many people, especially those who grew up in the Church, suppress or conceal. Ironically, my introduction is far longer than my pieces will be.

All are welcome here – if you are a practicing Christian, please know that my attempts to come to grips with cosmic truth are not in a spirit of mockery. I don’t look down my nose at you. I don’t think you are stupid. I’m not trying to trick you. At times I will use the word “you” to address the Church as a whole. While I’m not targeting any individual person, I invite Christians reading to think about the ways they may have contributed to these harmful mindsets.

For these pieces to be truly illuminating, I must be honest about the ways in which the Church has hurt me. There is so much pain. So much struggle. So much…stuck-ness. In times when I’ve found the courage to speak up about this pain, I’ve been met with platitudes like “Well, everyone is human, no need to keep talking about it, it was in the past.” Or worse, a simple “HOW DARE YOU TALK ABOUT THE BRIDE OF CHRIST THAT WAY.” Yes, everyone is human, but there are consistent, traceable, tangible patterns of harmful behavior within the Church that continue unchecked.

Power imbalances abound. Women are silenced and mistreated. Child abuse is quietly normalized. These repeated and continuous cyclical behaviors are not the same as a one-off mistake.

Yes, it was in the past — and our past experiences heavily inform the inner world of our present. Attempting to silence people about their pain only buys extra time for their wounds to fester.

How do we begin the arduous task of working towards resolution together? By truly listening to one another with genuine curiosity and care. We are not enemies. We are siblings.

This is the breaking point. I must speak. In fact, I should have spoken sooner. I apologize in advance for how difficult and harsh this conversation is. I care for you, reader, and I am grateful to you for bearing witness to my pain.

I Contain Multitudes. Who wishes to walk with me?

Many of us end up deconstructing our faith because we feel ostracized within the church. Humans “contain multitudes,” as Walt Whitman famously said—yet, to have a place in the Church, many of us are forced to shove and compress our multitudes into neat, pre-made containers that are the wrong shape and size. It’s not sustainable. Eventually the container cracks. Soon thereafter, it shatters altogether. Alone and confused, we are forced to reckon with our true selves. It’s a mess, and who can help us pick up the pieces? The Church? How can a person confidently trust-fall into a community that never accepted them in the first place?

Deconstruction is a broad term, and we all experience it differently. To me, it means examining my beliefs objectively, with brutal and sometimes painful honesty, to determine whether or not they are true. I am currently confronting the very real possibility that I’ve wasted the majority of my life thus far in vigorous study and lived application of colossal, harmful falsehood. That’s not fun. I am not enjoying this. None of us are going through this with an attitude of “Yay! No God, no rules!”

The reaction I’ve seen from the Church about the uptick in people who are undergoing this process is disappointing to say the least. We are villainized. We are accused of never having been ‘true’ believers (No True Scotsman fallacy, anyone?)

I hope the impasse here has become clear: On one hand, the Church wants us to return and repent (as if honest questioning were ‘sinful’). On the other hand, the Church will not even acknowledge that we left because we were ostracized.

You claim unconditional love. You claim inclusivity. But Church, your “inclusivity” has an asterisk and an astounding amount of sticky red tape.

The devil is not pushing us away from the Church. You, Church, are. This is a harsh truth that cannot and should not be softened.

Meaningless, Meaningless!

If your knee-jerk reaction is to argue with me right now, you are proving my point. My questions are uncomfortable, so people force answers. The most recent example of this is when I shared my internal turmoil over the Ukraine crisis with one of my Christian friends:

I am both Ukrainian and Russian. There is not even one generation of separation between me and those who are living in former Soviet nations. I am first-generation Slavic-American. I am watching two sides of myself destroy each other. The entire world is watching two sides of myself destroy one another. Bombs. Blood. Devastation. The heavy haze of human suffering.

Much like the speaker in Ecclesiastes, I am looking for order, and all I see is the heavy fog of chaos that looms over the world. The YHWH of the Bible is characterized as a God of order. A God who is in control. How could this God of order be in control when the constant state of the world is suffering and chaos? Worse, what kind of God is this? The latter question would earn me some serious heresy points in many American Christian circles. But it is a question frequently asked in the Bible itself.

When I opened up about this to my dear friend, who had the best intentions, she said:

“It’s not God. It’s the devil.”

Well, let’s unpack that.

Occam’s Razor states that the simplest explanation is most frequently the correct one. Which of the following is the simpler explanation?

The world is chaotic because God (who we cannot see) is mysterious and allows the devil (who we also cannot see) to commit cosmic evils for ultimate cosmic good. We cannot understand this but must accept it and move on.

OR

The world is chaotic because there is no God.

These thoughts are physically sickening. They shake me to my core.

HA HA HA! LAUGH AT THE CLOWN AND HIS MAKEUP! [Warning: Hyperlinks to explicit lyrics]

I recently studied the book of Jonah in-depth with my dad. When God spares Nineveh, Jonah says, “I fled to Tarshish at the beginning; for I knew that you are a gracious God and merciful, slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love, and ready to relent from punishing. And now, O Lord, please take my life from me, for it is better for me to die than to live.”

I’ve heard many people in American Christian circles actually, legitimately, laugh at Jonah in this moment of literal s**cidal ideation. “Ha! He’s so dramatic.” Or even, “Wow, what a jerk. He should be happy for the people of Nineveh.” My dad offered a vastly different evaluation of the situation. He had me read the above passage aloud, then asked me, “Which attribute of God is missing in Jonah’s list?”

Justice. God’s justice. Jonah does not call YHWH a just God. God made known to Jonah the destruction Nineveh would inflict on his people. And the same God chose mercy.

I am Jonah. You are laughing at me.

Before you deny this reality that I’ve experienced, know that I’ve spent most of my life in Christian circles. I’ve heard the laughter firsthand. I’ve even participated in it. I’m sorry for laughing.

The Church seems to think that voices like mine are the voice of the serpent: Did God really say? We are not the serpent. We are Solomon coming to grips with a world where justice rarely wins out. This is not an issue of ignorance; rabbinical tradition dictates that Solomon penned Ecclesiastes in his old age. 1 Kings 4:30 states that Solomon’s great mind “surpassed the wisdom of all the people of the east, and all the wisdom of Egypt.” If Solomon, in his old age, was still coming to grips with these truths, why is it so shocking that young people are doing the same? Ecclesiastes, like many other books of the Tanakh, is about dwelling in questions—for whatever length of time necessary. This shouldn’t be silenced, and it most certainly shouldn’t be policed. Western Protestant Christianity has become so cerebral that the deeply emotional, human aspect of faith is seen as unimportant or even unholy. In reality, coming to grips with the suffering of the world is deeply holy. Christ showed us this on the cross.

So, what can be done, Church? It’s simple. Put aside judgment. Allow us to dwell in the question. Better yet, dwell in the question with us. Some of us deconstructing are angry. Some are confused. Some are just plain sad. You may find my approach to deconstruction more palatable than others’, but that does not mean it’s more correct. Others should be heard as well, even if they are angry.

People are tired. I’m tired. For too long, we’ve been silenced; told we’re wrong for feeling what we feel. For too long, we have been laughed at by you. For too long, you have tried to evangelize to us in moments that we simply must be heard.

Growing up Slavic, family meals would often be followed by hours upon hours of talking over tea. Slowly picking at desserts. Slowly picking at ideas. These were not surface level conversations; they dug deep for meaning. Sometimes laughter abounded. Every so often, there were tears. Reader, we need not be fearful of the emotional aspects of these topics.