i can't think; i don't have pants on.

it's also got trans!oswald and I'm so torn between not wanting to write any transphobia and putting in a bit of transphobia just to make oswald more uncomfortable

like.... I want to make him scared and miserable for a decent chunks of it, he's just built for whump. but idk if transphobia wouldnt feel too uncomfortable to me. it's specifically maroni I'm thinking about. I want him to tease around outing oswald because it's what he's using for blackmail. and on one hand I want him to go further and make demeaning and lowkey transphobic comments but I then I keep thinking maybe that's too much and maybe I just want him to be a bit of a dick to make oswald more uncomfortable

@redrose-alice ahh I didnt expect anyone to even reply to my rambling <3

it's super tempting to write him as this 100% bad antagonist, I kinda want to but also it feels too easy? fuck knows I like complicating my own life sometimes xD

so I kinda want to write him as still absolutely a bad person but being more... creative? more elaborate? like he'd play games with them and really make them both squirm for his own amusement.

the basic situation of the fic is that oswald after coming back to gotham in s1 still ends up with maroni somehow but maroni finds out he's trans and makes him fake date jim via pretending to be a woman to get insider info on whatever jim's department is working on. the blackmail is that he'll tell jim oswald is trans but also that oswald is back in gotham and that maroni knows he didnt kill him. which could in turn put Jim in his pocket to keep maroni from telling fish or falcone.

I feel like would be too easy for him to either take the route of 1) being homophobic towards oswald because he was seducing a man 2.1) then also being homophobic towards jim because who he was actually dating was a man (which would set in stone that maroni fully sees oswald as a man) or 2.2) going the transphobic route with oswald of outing him to jim because he wasn't able to get the kind info maroni wanted. and then hoping that Jim will be transphobic and potentially violent towards oswald.

I cant really see him trying to play both the "Jim is gay because he was actually dating a man instead of a woman" and the "oswald isnt actually a man" route at the same time, because those contradict each other?

I had the idea of him figuring very early on that Jim has feelings for Oswald and I do like that because that way he has leverage against both of them should he need it. but maybe I'll change that to him finding out later. will see

as for him playing out both options: the idea I had was that to oswald individually he could take the transphobic route but then to Jim individually the homophobic route. and when he interacts with both of them together (which is something I've partially written) I'm not fully sure yet. for now I wrote that as him trying to drop hints so that each of them figure out the thing the other doesnt want him to know about and getting increasingly obvious to make them uncomfortable or provoke them. I'm thinking specifically with that bit in s1 somewhere where he takes oswald to that remote cabin. he does show signs of intelligence and planning and insight there, so to an extent it's not out of the question.

another idea I already had was that I definitely need him to misjudge how Jim would behave when finding out that it's Oswald who he's been dating and/or that Oswald is trans. and what you've said about Maroni not being the best at reading people actually works miraculously well for that. so if I lean into that angle that actually gives me a really good reason why certain things wouldnt occur to him.

as for Jim recognising Oswald: there is a separate version I started where after a pretty short time, Jim realises it's Oswald but plays along because he has found out that Oswald is bugged and tries to figure out what the motivation/reason is. for this version however Jim has to remain clueless until Maroni sends someone to drop hints to Jim that who he's seeing is a man and/or Oswald. so I will need to find reasons xD one is definitely that Oswald would be wearing a wig, maybe one that's a different haircolour than his natural hair. and of course the effect of make-up cant be underestimated, specifically contouring can really do a lot to change someone's faceshape. (I'm thinking of that video thats like "if men find out we can shapeshift, they're gonna tell the church" xD) I'm definitely imagining that Maroni would find someone to do Oswald's makeup to get him ready for the date nights. Oswald on his own probably isn't particularly good at doing makeup in a feminine style and he needs to look really good. I'm thinking that they're gonna put him in 2010s style full glam makeup xD

what you said about Oswald scheming made me realise that that's really not something I've accounted for. I've mostly written Oswald being scared due to the blackmail and threat of violence that Maroni holds over his head. but Oswald is always scheming something xD so I will need to find ways to incorporate that and what it could be. maybe have him try and fail a couple of times to get away or something. he does fail a lot in his attempts because he often acts too impulsively. or maybe he could purposefully try to give false information in hopes of getting some important men of Maroni's killed but it backfires on him and he has to deal with the consequences of that (physical violence to an extent as well as being shouted at and berated). or he hears from Jim that the police are getting ready to raid a specific warehouse or spot and doesnt tell Maroni about it. and for some reason Oswald comes with them there, cause maybe he has the hope he will be able to run away once the police arrive to make arrest, maybe his secret hope is that Jim will be there. but either Maroni himself or one of his men notices Oswald behaving oddly so they change their plans last minute without informing Oswald.

from what I have so far (there's several options), Jim desperately wants to help Oswald to get him out of Maroni's clutches because he has feelings for him and has also started feeling protective (this is where how protective Jim gets about women he's dating could come in, in that he still partially sees Oswald as a woman because of how they met when they started "dating") I dont have any concrete ideas yet how they will ultimately make it work. that is definitely the plan. but no clue so far (you're welcome to say if you have any ideas)

one plot point is that there's a conversation Maroni has with Jim and Oswald together after Jim has found out that Oswald is the "woman" he's been dating. as a recociliation offer to Jim (that's what he frames it as anyway) he makes Oswald go with Jim to stay with him for a few days, if Jim refuses he threatens to have Oswald beat up really badly. he hopes that while Oswald stays with Jim, Jim will realise that Oswald is trans and whatever fallout will come from that. but what actually happens is that they talk and realise they do in fact have feelings for each other (but Jim still doesnt know Oswald is trans because he keeps that very well hidden). and when its time for Oswald to go back to Maroni Jim doesnt want to let him but Oswald expresses he doesnt have a choice. so then Jim tries to make him say what it is that Maroni has on him but Oswald refuses. they argue about it and leave on bad terms basically. or at least from Oswald's side. Jim might get over his frustrations pretty quickly but I think Oswald would stay upset for a while that Jim would try to pressure him so much.

The two things I wanted to mention/ask are: Oswald's eyes are, I think, his most recognizable feature. So I think if there's any chance that Jim would NOT recognize him immediately, it'd be when he's wearing sunglasses (a pair that isn't his usual style). And - a question: What is Maroni's end goal, why is he even blackmailing them? Because blackmailing them separately ("I'll tell Him you're trans/ I'll tell Oswald you're gay if you don't do x" makes sense. But once they're together, the chances of whatever Maroni has planned turning out a success are getting slimmer by the minute.

I've added a few small things here and there. I also started making a spreadsheet with the scenes to get them into some semblance of a linear plot structure. because they're kind of all over the place, not really chronological and I was starting to lose oversight over what's even there and what isnt xD but starting that list was so exhausting at times that I haven't continued in over a week xD

as for Oswalds eyes: yeah that's definitely something to contend with. his nose is pretty recognisable too. I feel like with the eyes I could get away with saying he's just wearing heavy makeup and that makes his eyes look very different I'm thinking like mid 2010s full glam smokey eye with glitter or something). and then just adding a large heap of plot armour xD the issue I think is that for this plot I need Jim to not recognise Oswald xD so how realistic it is can't really matter because I am at this point committed to having it go this way. I've dug my own grave that way xD

Maroni's endgoal & why is he blackmailing them: I had to go back into my document to read up on that xD what I wrote down is that it goes like in the show where Oswald reveals to Maroni he used to work for Fish and Falcone. but then instead of getting Jim to confirm what Oswald told him, Maroni confirms that on his own by having his men do some research. His main goal is to find out confidential police info to help him in his business endeavours. I'm thinking of that time Maroni calls Oswald something like "you snitch, you snake, you beautiful turncoat son of a bitch", meaning he recognises Oswald's ability to play many roles and charm his way into someone's good graces because he has the charisma for it. (tho he doesnt recognise that is also what Oswald did to him xD) I dont really have any idea yet why he would try to go for Jim specifically. I wrote down the idea that maybe in the research Maroni's men uncover something about Oswald and Jim potentially having worked together in some ways before Jim was made to kill him (which is not something that happened in canon). so from there he could make Oswald go for Jim because Oswald already has some knowledge of how to manipulate Jim. but that's really flimsy reasoning

as to why Maroni is blackmailing them and how once they're together Maroni loses his leverage: I want to have that be a plotpoint actually!! okay but first: why blackmail Oswald? so he complies with trying to get info out of Jim why blackmail Jim: ?? kinda unclear? Jim has reason to be scared what would happen if Falcone finds out he didn't kill Oswald so Maroni could try to get Jim in his pocket to get confidential info directly from the source. (but then why go through the whole song and dance of having Oswald fake date him via pretending to be a woman? makes very little sense rationally. the only way to explain it is that Maroni is a bastard and wants to make Oswald suffer)

as for Maroni losing leverage: I definitely want things to drag on for bit. Jim wants to know what Maroni is holding over Oswald's head so he can help him but Oswald doesn't want him to know because he's scared of facing discrimination. so then because he's scared for Oswald's safety, Jim tails Oswald and that's how he finds out what it is. then Oswald finds out Jim went behind his back and of course that makes him angry. due to that Maroni would have lost influence over Oswald however Oswald would still not stay with Jim because he feels betrayed. There would need to be a reconciliation of some sort but I have no clue yet what that could be. and what would happen beyond that, I have no ideas for yet either. it would ideally end with Oswald becoming free of Maroni's clutches but how he gets there I dont know.

@postmortemboobjob behold!!! our boy (adult man)!! *gestures excitedly*

hand(s) knife fear quiet

thank you so much for the ask!!!!

i wasn't able to find anything for 'fear' but i have some for the others!!!!

Hand

from my vamp!Oswald fic!

He hopped off and flew to his room, regained his human form, and put on a robe he found hanging over the back of a chair. He walked back to the little kitchen and leaned against the counter, reaching over to start stirring the soup before she swatted his hand away. She pointed very firmly at the table and stared him down until eventually he walked over and sat down in one of the chairs.

Knife

from my alfred fic!

When Alfred started working for the Wayne’s, there were a couple times where he thought it was ridiculous. He had been trained to kill, seen the horrors of war, and had the scars and medals to prove it. And yet here he was, making tea and sandwiches and learning how to make pastries. It seemed absurd, trading a gun for a rolling pin and a uniform for an apron. Eventually, he came to the conclusion that it didn’t really matter. He had a roof over his head, a good income, and a full belly. And when a young Bruce asked him about a scar on his arm, he said it was a knife, and when Bruce told him he should be more careful when cooking, he simply replied, “Of course, Master Bruce.”

Quiet (technically 'quietly' but shhh it's fine)

also from my alfred fic!

it's also got trans!oswald and I'm so torn between not wanting to write any transphobia and putting in a bit of transphobia just to make oswald more uncomfortable

like.... I want to make him scared and miserable for a decent chunks of it, he's just built for whump. but idk if transphobia wouldnt feel too uncomfortable to me. it's specifically maroni I'm thinking about. I want him to tease around outing oswald because it's what he's using for blackmail. and on one hand I want him to go further and make demeaning and lowkey transphobic comments but I then I keep thinking maybe that's too much and maybe I just want him to be a bit of a dick to make oswald more uncomfortable

@redrose-alice ahh I didnt expect anyone to even reply to my rambling <3

it's super tempting to write him as this 100% bad antagonist, I kinda want to but also it feels too easy? fuck knows I like complicating my own life sometimes xD

so I kinda want to write him as still absolutely a bad person but being more... creative? more elaborate? like he'd play games with them and really make them both squirm for his own amusement.

the basic situation of the fic is that oswald after coming back to gotham in s1 still ends up with maroni somehow but maroni finds out he's trans and makes him fake date jim via pretending to be a woman to get insider info on whatever jim's department is working on. the blackmail is that he'll tell jim oswald is trans but also that oswald is back in gotham and that maroni knows he didnt kill him. which could in turn put Jim in his pocket to keep maroni from telling fish or falcone.

I feel like would be too easy for him to either take the route of 1) being homophobic towards oswald because he was seducing a man 2.1) then also being homophobic towards jim because who he was actually dating was a man (which would set in stone that maroni fully sees oswald as a man) or 2.2) going the transphobic route with oswald of outing him to jim because he wasn't able to get the kind info maroni wanted. and then hoping that Jim will be transphobic and potentially violent towards oswald.

I cant really see him trying to play both the "Jim is gay because he was actually dating a man instead of a woman" and the "oswald isnt actually a man" route at the same time, because those contradict each other?

I had the idea of him figuring very early on that Jim has feelings for Oswald and I do like that because that way he has leverage against both of them should he need it. but maybe I'll change that to him finding out later. will see

as for him playing out both options: the idea I had was that to oswald individually he could take the transphobic route but then to Jim individually the homophobic route. and when he interacts with both of them together (which is something I've partially written) I'm not fully sure yet. for now I wrote that as him trying to drop hints so that each of them figure out the thing the other doesnt want him to know about and getting increasingly obvious to make them uncomfortable or provoke them. I'm thinking specifically with that bit in s1 somewhere where he takes oswald to that remote cabin. he does show signs of intelligence and planning and insight there, so to an extent it's not out of the question.

another idea I already had was that I definitely need him to misjudge how Jim would behave when finding out that it's Oswald who he's been dating and/or that Oswald is trans. and what you've said about Maroni not being the best at reading people actually works miraculously well for that. so if I lean into that angle that actually gives me a really good reason why certain things wouldnt occur to him.

as for Jim recognising Oswald: there is a separate version I started where after a pretty short time, Jim realises it's Oswald but plays along because he has found out that Oswald is bugged and tries to figure out what the motivation/reason is. for this version however Jim has to remain clueless until Maroni sends someone to drop hints to Jim that who he's seeing is a man and/or Oswald. so I will need to find reasons xD one is definitely that Oswald would be wearing a wig, maybe one that's a different haircolour than his natural hair. and of course the effect of make-up cant be underestimated, specifically contouring can really do a lot to change someone's faceshape. (I'm thinking of that video thats like "if men find out we can shapeshift, they're gonna tell the church" xD) I'm definitely imagining that Maroni would find someone to do Oswald's makeup to get him ready for the date nights. Oswald on his own probably isn't particularly good at doing makeup in a feminine style and he needs to look really good. I'm thinking that they're gonna put him in 2010s style full glam makeup xD

what you said about Oswald scheming made me realise that that's really not something I've accounted for. I've mostly written Oswald being scared due to the blackmail and threat of violence that Maroni holds over his head. but Oswald is always scheming something xD so I will need to find ways to incorporate that and what it could be. maybe have him try and fail a couple of times to get away or something. he does fail a lot in his attempts because he often acts too impulsively. or maybe he could purposefully try to give false information in hopes of getting some important men of Maroni's killed but it backfires on him and he has to deal with the consequences of that (physical violence to an extent as well as being shouted at and berated). or he hears from Jim that the police are getting ready to raid a specific warehouse or spot and doesnt tell Maroni about it. and for some reason Oswald comes with them there, cause maybe he has the hope he will be able to run away once the police arrive to make arrest, maybe his secret hope is that Jim will be there. but either Maroni himself or one of his men notices Oswald behaving oddly so they change their plans last minute without informing Oswald.

from what I have so far (there's several options), Jim desperately wants to help Oswald to get him out of Maroni's clutches because he has feelings for him and has also started feeling protective (this is where how protective Jim gets about women he's dating could come in, in that he still partially sees Oswald as a woman because of how they met when they started "dating") I dont have any concrete ideas yet how they will ultimately make it work. that is definitely the plan. but no clue so far (you're welcome to say if you have any ideas)

one plot point is that there's a conversation Maroni has with Jim and Oswald together after Jim has found out that Oswald is the "woman" he's been dating. as a recociliation offer to Jim (that's what he frames it as anyway) he makes Oswald go with Jim to stay with him for a few days, if Jim refuses he threatens to have Oswald beat up really badly. he hopes that while Oswald stays with Jim, Jim will realise that Oswald is trans and whatever fallout will come from that. but what actually happens is that they talk and realise they do in fact have feelings for each other (but Jim still doesnt know Oswald is trans because he keeps that very well hidden). and when its time for Oswald to go back to Maroni Jim doesnt want to let him but Oswald expresses he doesnt have a choice. so then Jim tries to make him say what it is that Maroni has on him but Oswald refuses. they argue about it and leave on bad terms basically. or at least from Oswald's side. Jim might get over his frustrations pretty quickly but I think Oswald would stay upset for a while that Jim would try to pressure him so much.

The two things I wanted to mention/ask are: Oswald's eyes are, I think, his most recognizable feature. So I think if there's any chance that Jim would NOT recognize him immediately, it'd be when he's wearing sunglasses (a pair that isn't his usual style). And - a question: What is Maroni's end goal, why is he even blackmailing them? Because blackmailing them separately ("I'll tell Him you're trans/ I'll tell Oswald you're gay if you don't do x" makes sense. But once they're together, the chances of whatever Maroni has planned turning out a success are getting slimmer by the minute.

I've added a few small things here and there. I also started making a spreadsheet with the scenes to get them into some semblance of a linear plot structure. because they're kind of all over the place, not really chronological and I was starting to lose oversight over what's even there and what isnt xD but starting that list was so exhausting at times that I haven't continued in over a week xD

as for Oswalds eyes: yeah that's definitely something to contend with. his nose is pretty recognisable too. I feel like with the eyes I could get away with saying he's just wearing heavy makeup and that makes his eyes look very different I'm thinking like mid 2010s full glam smokey eye with glitter or something). and then just adding a large heap of plot armour xD the issue I think is that for this plot I need Jim to not recognise Oswald xD so how realistic it is can't really matter because I am at this point committed to having it go this way. I've dug my own grave that way xD

Maroni's endgoal & why is he blackmailing them: I had to go back into my document to read up on that xD what I wrote down is that it goes like in the show where Oswald reveals to Maroni he used to work for Fish and Falcone. but then instead of getting Jim to confirm what Oswald told him, Maroni confirms that on his own by having his men do some research. His main goal is to find out confidential police info to help him in his business endeavours. I'm thinking of that time Maroni calls Oswald something like "you snitch, you snake, you beautiful turncoat son of a bitch", meaning he recognises Oswald's ability to play many roles and charm his way into someone's good graces because he has the charisma for it. (tho he doesnt recognise that is also what Oswald did to him xD) I dont really have any idea yet why he would try to go for Jim specifically. I wrote down the idea that maybe in the research Maroni's men uncover something about Oswald and Jim potentially having worked together in some ways before Jim was made to kill him (which is not something that happened in canon). so from there he could make Oswald go for Jim because Oswald already has some knowledge of how to manipulate Jim. but that's really flimsy reasoning

as to why Maroni is blackmailing them and how once they're together Maroni loses his leverage: I want to have that be a plotpoint actually!! okay but first: why blackmail Oswald? so he complies with trying to get info out of Jim why blackmail Jim: ?? kinda unclear? Jim has reason to be scared what would happen if Falcone finds out he didn't kill Oswald so Maroni could try to get Jim in his pocket to get confidential info directly from the source. (but then why go through the whole song and dance of having Oswald fake date him via pretending to be a woman? makes very little sense rationally. the only way to explain it is that Maroni is a bastard and wants to make Oswald suffer)

as for Maroni losing leverage: I definitely want things to drag on for bit. Jim wants to know what Maroni is holding over Oswald's head so he can help him but Oswald doesn't want him to know because he's scared of facing discrimination. so then because he's scared for Oswald's safety, Jim tails Oswald and that's how he finds out what it is. then Oswald finds out Jim went behind his back and of course that makes him angry. due to that Maroni would have lost influence over Oswald however Oswald would still not stay with Jim because he feels betrayed. There would need to be a reconciliation of some sort but I have no clue yet what that could be. and what would happen beyond that, I have no ideas for yet either. it would ideally end with Oswald becoming free of Maroni's clutches but how he gets there I dont know.

@postmortemboobjob behold!!! our boy (adult man)!! *gestures excitedly*

hand(s) knife fear quiet

thank you so much for the ask!!!!

i wasn't able to find anything for 'fear' but i have some for the others!!!!

Hand

from my vamp!Oswald fic!

He hopped off and flew to his room, regained his human form, and put on a robe he found hanging over the back of a chair. He walked back to the little kitchen and leaned against the counter, reaching over to start stirring the soup before she swatted his hand away. She pointed very firmly at the table and stared him down until eventually he walked over and sat down in one of the chairs.

Knife

from my alfred fic!

When Alfred started working for the Wayne’s, there were a couple times where he thought it was ridiculous. He had been trained to kill, seen the horrors of war, and had the scars and medals to prove it. And yet here he was, making tea and sandwiches and learning how to make pastries. It seemed absurd, trading a gun for a rolling pin and a uniform for an apron. Eventually, he came to the conclusion that it didn’t really matter. He had a roof over his head, a good income, and a full belly. And when a young Bruce asked him about a scar on his arm, he said it was a knife, and when Bruce told him he should be more careful when cooking, he simply replied, “Of course, Master Bruce.”

Quiet (technically 'quietly' but shhh it's fine)

also from my alfred fic!

"All I wanted was a little respect. And they hurt me. So cruelly."

@postmortemboobjob behold!!! our boy (adult man)!! *gestures excitedly*