not that we need another reason to believe that mileven is not meant to be, but... we are shown repeatedly that the touch of the person you love can wake you up from the trance. for max it's lucas. for will it's mike (s2 halloween, hospital, famous spy scene). hell, sometimes for will it's enough to just hear mike's voice (s3 cinema, s5 abyss). it is that deep for will.
but we also should take into consideration the situations, where the touch fails. this is how the show reveals to us what someone truly means to the person in the trance.
for example, nancy doesn't wake up from vecna's trance when steve is touching her. stancy? not gonna happen is all i'm saying, steve is not that person to her.
so what does that mean when they make a big deal of showing how mike grabs jane's hand and she doesn't wake up? well, he isn't that person to her either.
jane is not in love with mike, he's not her soulmate. the same as nancy is not in love with steve.
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Why was Mike involved in all the dick jokes and water burst symbolism for uncontainable feelings??
Why is Mike calling Will "magic"?
Why does he compare Will to El, that if she is in the upside down (something he seems unconcerned about), he could use some magic up here?
Why does Will come up in so many conversations with El?
Why is Vecna stopping El and Mike having a happy ending, and then Mike calls Will sorta "Vecna"?
And Will didn't create the burst symbolism pipe, MIKE DID. By himself. And Mike wanted Will to help him repress it, but then makes Will take off his jacket (which represents making him more vulnerable and truth). And I think this is because Mike is very much flustered by the flirting they just did and is getting frustrated at not knowing for sure, even if he is scared of knowing the answers either way. (Nobody is mentoring Mike)
Why have Mike have multiple seasons worth of giving the "signs" Will, and thus the audience, has been told are signs Mike wants to date? Signs Mike, nor Will, have with Lucas or Dustin.
The show was telling us Mike has big feelings that he wants to go away, but they just get more intense until it is written all over his face in "Sorcerer".
In the immediate aftermath, Mike can't contain how into Will he is. Then suddenly he becomes much more muted about it, as if he has realised it's too obvious.
He withdraws from touching Will, and from showing more care than anyone else when Will is unconcious.
It's like a recycled season 2 and Snowball thing. Mike realises he is too deep in his feelings and tries to create distance in s3 and over performs heteronormativity with El. There is no other reason for the awkward "Santa has good taste" line in to El in s5 about her clingy wetsuit, which El receives poorly.
Will is in a fkng coma and El is focused on trying to save him, and has not been able to so far, and Mike wants to comment about her sexy figure? Gross, Mike.
And the water bottle sharing? The lightning happening just as Will drinks to emphasise it? This indirect kiss trope is so unnecessary.
And then it leads to a tragic scene with El sacrificing herself. They are clinging to each other, but look like they are put off by each other at the same time. The whole narrative to this point has told us that the emotional spillover is meant to be Mike and Will, and yet we are with El and Mike. And El is still wearing Santa's sexy wetsuit...
Nothing new is revealed with El and Mike either. For a climatic moment, their relationship doesnt become any more meaningful. It actually becomes less.
She didnt trust him with any of this. Didnt care for his input on anything. Actively had rejected his advice prior: "you don't get to write the ending'.
And Mike doesn't even show that he can say "I love you" and mean it after Will forces him to finally say it in s4. Nothing is fixed.
And the song choice.. "Purple Rain" is not about romance, but severe dysfunction and letting go of those relationships without bitterness. The same-titled movie Prince starred in, wasn't a romance either.
Also, Prince was an awful person.
Prince was a Jehova's witness after 2000s and against homosexuality while profiteering off cosplaying queerness. He groomed a 16yo. Openly was known as an egotistical bully to anyone he saw as "beneath" him. Forbade his wife to talk about their stillborn child and left her to grieve alone, etc.
Anyway, the ST story would have felt right if it was Mike falling apart over Will in it's climatic moment. Everything had been building to an emotional reveal for Mike. THE HEART. MIKE THE BRAVE.
And he wouldn't have to say "love" to Will. That word is diminished now that it has been used as a lie to his gf, and made familial by saying it to his mum (the dialogue was pretty forced for it too). And this is because we have an easy callback of "I didnt say it." "You didn't have to." We were being told that Mike can say "love", but just didn't to El. It's not subtle.
And we also have Will foreshadowing that a kiss is a good way to end an argument.
With Byler, we were narratively being prepared to-
1. See Will struggle with his connection to the hive mind. Life and death. (He got put in a coma already and Vecna did some weird shit to him, and it is never relevant again?)
2. See a kiss ending an argument.
3. Feel intense, romantic love -without the word "love" ever being said. It would be shown very very clearly. No room for doubt like El.
And they make us feel insane because they just don't deliver on the most emotionally critical part of the whole show.
And this is the primary reason I can't let go of there being at least some sort of additional content to resolve this coming. They set me up not to!
I honestly side-eye anyone talking up how satisfied they were with the ending, because it shows a severe inability to connect narrative dots..
If someone was drawing a crocodile. And you see them drawing the teeth, long body, scaley tail.. and then you suddenly get shown a completed drawing of a horse in a swamp? You should have questions!
Anyway, I just want the byler cookie that had been narratively promised for about a decade.
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Hereâs all the proof that I found that S5 was already written when they started filming and the documentary is bullshit.
First of all.
They had it planned out. YET-
Okay, want more?
They had the entire episode written in 2022. BITCH???
Again,
What the fuck?
Those are CLEAR scenes from S5 Vol.1
And mind you, this shit was made in AUGUST 2023. So the bullshit that they hadnât even finished writing Vol.1 is just bullshit.
This is only from Stranger Writers btw.
You have to have a script ready before
THAT SHIT EVEN SAYS McCorkle Farm ARE WE FUCKING STUPID and oh, ep.4. In 2023. August. They had the first 4 eps already written and planned out in AUGUST OF 2023. Mind you, this is ep.4, which means the other eps had already undergone the process.
Fuck everyone for calling me delusional. Try to debunk this bitch
I actually think el asking mike if they would be like siblings is really sad. she didn't know what a friend was. her only terms for close relationships are familial (papa, brothers and sisters). the only word she has to conceptualize closeness between two people of close age is fraternal.
I find her getting her first kiss without even knowing about the concept of romantic love, let alone kissing, even sadder. she was never exposed to parents kissing, or saw an older sister getting her first boyfriend. she's only known about the concept of friendship for about a week by that point. it doesn't feel cute to me, once I actually start thinking about her life experience up to that point. it's really, really sad. she didn't need a boyfriend. she was 12. her romantic feelings, her desires, they were never taken into account, even by the writers. it's why we never hear what she likes about mike, because from the beginning that didn't matter to the duffers. she was always just a tool for mike to get his first kiss and his first girlfriend and his first heartbreak. they used her to validate their own fantasies
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I've been following the YouTube channel Still Watching Netflix? (SWN) the past few months and was curious about their Stranger Things videos. I decided to compile a list of the videos posted and compared them to other series/movies released last year to see the difference in release structure. What i have found only further solidifies CG theories that we have not yet seen the actual finale.
I compared the release dates/videos for You, Frankenstein, Squid Games season 3, Wednesday season 3 against the released Stranger Things videos and major discrepancies are noticeable.
Still Watching Netflix? ST related Releases and Comparisons (shorts not included) Link: https://www.youtube.com/@stillwatchingnetflix/vide
There are no deep dives on the soundtrack, no laugh reels, no vfx dives, ending explanations missing, no reactions to volume 3, no cast q&a's no creature design dives, bts production design, no Duffer q&a, no sound design videos, ect.
I have no doubts about CG being real because of hard data like this.
Quite a while back someone noticed that in the sorcerer scene the positioning of the characters doesn't make sense. At least not in the order of things happening that are presented to us. (I really don't know who it was sorry. If you know pls tag. Ty <3)
Specifically this scenes here:
The kids are moved during Vecna's monologue to will. But during the monologue Vecna and Will were right in front of that fire. The should be here
The scene with the kids being dragged is from Mike POV
But I think there are more parts of the whole scenepack that are quite weird and super sus because things don't really add up.
Starting already here:
When Mike get Thrown against the wall in the Bathroom some weird light is cast around his eye and temple.
It's already gone a second later
From this point one Mike's apparent shoulder injury is utterly ignored and never brought up again.
Then we have this scene with Joyce and Sullivian
a) it's weird that Joyce reveals her name. There was no reason for that. At least not with everything that we have seen so far. In a situation like this you rather wanna be anonymous until you are forced to reveal your identity.
b) because Sullivian, the guy who ordered to shoot up a suburban house in Lenora with Teenagers inside because he wanted to kill El, seem to recognize that name but can't put it properly. Like his memory had been partially erased but the name BYERS does ring a bell. (I see the side eye sullivian)
and c) because the knowledge of the involvement of Joyce Byers is never used again. although Sullivan survives and talks to Dr. Kay and Lieutenant Akers later.
Then we have Mike being focused twice, while sensing and recognizing Vecna at the portal.
In the first scene Mike senses Vecna before everyone else, when Vecna approaches the Gate from the UD side and you can see his shadow. The other one is when Vecna starts to throw soldiers around and Mike recognises him.
Than we have very interesting inconsistencies in the positioning of Mike when Vecna arrives and attacks the MAC Z.
Because from the perspective from the last two pictures Mike should be somewhere around here
but he isn't. He could be behind the Humvee because you can see the lights of the other truck in the background but then this scene doesn't make sense.
Because from this perspektive they should be here
but there are just soldiers and no Mike and no kids.
There also should be visible in this shot
Or this one
or this one
right behind the Humvee. because that's directly in front of the radio shack
Also: Where is the demogorgon during the explosion (notice Dereks shoes)
And how convenient that Mike is not visible in this scene
while he is laying right in front of the humvee where the soldier sits against the tier.
Partially this can be put off as "well they wanted to make things easier and don't have Finn on set for lying around, that's why he is not visible in some scenes" but it seems to me that we have a constant change in perspektive. One where Mike is there. And one where he isn't.
So everything that is happening there is at least partially fake and/or questionable. welcome home distorted memory.
COMING TO NETFLIX: "A legend returns"... Who? Lonnie "The Hawk" Hawkins. Uh. Are we supposed to know who that is?
Well, no (duh). I believe this 'show' is sending a message. (Read that post first if you have no idea what I'm talking about, and to read the show's whacko, suspicious description).
"The Hawk"
The show itself is called "The Hawk", so let's start there.
Ok, we've seen the teaser for The Hawk. But what does that mean? Well, we see "the hawk" -> A hawk? ->
(parade . com)
"Messengers of the air" - 'on air' is what we say about something being broadcast on radio or television, 'messenger'... is this show meant to be one? The signs are pointing towards yes.
"Be more observant of the subtle signs", "activate our inner vision to see what we might normally miss". Hey, remember when the Duffers told us to pay extra attention to the details in ST5? Yeah.
"A legend returns": Lonnie (vs) Hawkins?
The word 'legend' has a few different definitions. In relation to a professional golf-player, the most fitting would be "a famous or important person who is known for doing something extremely well". (britannica)
But the original meaning of a 'legend' is "a story from the past that is believed by many people but cannot be proved to be true". (britannica)
Could it be that this new show, 'The Hawk', is a "story" that is "believed by many people but cannot be proved to be true"?
Seems like a reach?
Have a look at what PGA Tour themselves say about 'Lonnie Hawkins':
(pgatour . com) credit to @persistentmimicgrail for this find!
->"One of the greatest names in golf history, that you're somehow only just hearing about." Right, okay.
He's a 'legend' that we've never heard about before. So.. he's not "a famous person known for doing something extremely well". What kind of legend is he, then? I think he is the other kind: a story (..) believed by many people but cannot be proved to be true.
Just like another story that is believed by many people though it cannot (yet) be proved to be true: The widely spread conspiracy about Stranger Things' fake ending.
->"Lonnie Hawkins' biggest fans are waking up"
Lonnie Hawkins is returning, sure, but no one's ever heard about him. So, how could he have fans?
Well, we've heard of Lonnie; Will Byers' father, who's not shown up on our screens since ST1. And we've heard of Hawkins; the small town in Indiana that was made up for the story of Stranger Things.
None of us consider ourselves fans of Lonnie, I'm sure. So, it's Hawkins' biggest fans that are are waking up. That's us, ST fans! We're waking up. (Though many of us have been awake for a while.)
->"They're ready to make some noise"
Noise, noise noise. That is becoming a very familiar word by now. Which is the whole point. Remember all the talk of radios in ST5?
Radios have a huge presence in season 5, both literally with the WSQK and many a walkie talkie, and metaphorically with Robin saying Will is like an antenna connecting to the hive mind, telling him to look for signals from Mike, and so on.
Most infamously, "noise" was the word the Duffers used when questioned about the Byler fandom:
Many took this as them calling Bylers "noise", but that's really not what they're saying at all! "For us, there's always noise": They are actually calling outside input "noise", because they intended to "tell the story they have been planning since the beginning". And....
"This story and the story of Will (...) has been building to this moment for eight years now." Because, as many of us are aware, the moment the story has been building towards is, in fact, Byler getting together.
They mention this "noise" in the ST5 documentary as well, when they're writing the Disastrous eight episode, where literally everything that could go wrong, goes wrong (at least from the perspective of someone who understands the story ST has been telling since the start).
And spoiler alert: the story does not build up to what ep8 gave us.
Stranger Things is a story about love (friendship, family, trust. being true to yourself!). So, actually, the reason that we got that finale - is noise.
This scene at the start of ST5 ep1 told us exactly what would happen: Robin's lovesong to Vickie gets cut off by static noise.
Love gets cut off by noise.
(delved a bit more into this in my analysis on the themes of ST5)
This scene, after Robin tells Will about "signals", showed us... Mike giving Will the SIGNALS!! Now, isn't that just random. No! See the radio tower? It's grey.
And here, it's suddenly red. Right before Mike begins laying it on thickkkk to convince Will he can take control of the hive mind. Suspicious? Yes, and even more so:
Mike suddenly looks different, one frame to the next. He looks the same when walking down the hill (when the tower is grey) as he does when he stops Will by the hatch (when the tower has turned red). And with Mike, the lighting and colors change, too. And this is when he says Will is Vecna, that he is "evil and hell-bent on destroying the world".
Then, from an outside perspective, the tower is grey again, as Mike (basically) says Will is "magic" - suggesting an even sweeter sentiment.
And then, of course, it switches back to Will's perspective when Mike reacts weirdly to Will's playful shove. We don't see the tower for any of the shots in this perspective, but that's why they put it in the corner right before it switches to closeup on them.
Something's messing with the antenna, making both Mike and Will pick up noise and cutting off their love!
But then, why would we want to "make some noise"?
We wouldn't! There's a double meaning:
We, the audience, are Hawkins' biggest fans - we want the crew to win and save Hawkins.
And Lonnie's biggest fans, well.... those would be Vecna and the Mindflayer, of course.
Lonnie = Fear
Because it was Lonnie that planted the seed to Will's core fear: that he can't ever be loved by the person he loves. That is the fear we see Vecna use against Will. The thing that could possibly beat him, just as Henry was.
Henry believes that this world is broken, because the Mindflayer convinced him that this is the truth.
And because he started to believe it, Henry joined the MF.
Henry says he could have resisted it, as the camera focuses on Will.
And Will said the two of them are the same.
So.....
(1) NEW MESSAGE: Lonnie returns to Hawkins
"The Hawk" is sending a message. Lonnie returns to Hawkins, because Lonnie plays a huge part in Will's trauma; he is the root of Will's fear. And Hawkins, i.e., our brave group of characters, are fighting him, in the sense that they're fighting Will's fear. But Lonnie's fans are ready to make noise, because they don't want Hawkins/the group/Will to win - i.e. Vecna and the Mindflayer want Will to join them.
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ST Narrative Structure Analysis + CG Analysis/Prediction
Introduction
Whattup, fellow bus-goers.
Okay so⌠from all the way in late January until recently there have been two things that have been bothering me. One was that I felt like I couldnât quite wrap my head around the very basic narrative structure of ST. The other was that, for a while now, I have felt pretty strongly that if weâre right and CG is real, weâll be getting about another seasonâs worth of new content, but until writing this post I couldnât quite explain why.
Over the last several months, Iâve been both trying to essentially solve the show like a Rubikâs cube and also figure out if thereâs any logic behind my intuition on CG. Now, I think Iâve finally figured out both well enough to write a post about them, and how the two overlap.
First, let me explain my methods.
(Warning: this post is pretty long)
Section 1: What Do I Mean By Narrative Structure Analysis?
Okay. So. If youâve ever taken a high school literature class or something similar, there is a very good chance youâve seen this before. If you need a refresher, itâs essentially the framework by which you can understand how the order and pacing of events in a story create unity and cohesion for the story as a whole. There are lots of varying perspectives on the best way to approach narratives and different ways to slot them into structures(although many of them use the same basic principles). For this post, I wanted to have a reference roughly explaining the one I will be using:
Inciting Incident: turning point! Conflict enters normal world. Call to adventure.
Key Event: adding info, tension rises. Character crossroads, deciding to act. End act 1. Struggles to understand, plans go awry.
Midpoint: Story turns! Twist or disaster, moment of truth.
Cross Roads: Figuring things out, moving toward action, reminder of stakes.
Dark Moment: all seems lost, dark night of the soul. Reexamine motives, commit to go on.
Climax: final confrontation, problem overcome.
Resolution: wrap things up, end hook.
Lol, yep. This thing. Yes, I just found this through google. This version of it is very simple and pretty straightforward, which is part of why I picked it.
(To be clear, I pulled these definitions straight from this infographic, I was going to put the actual image in but it was big and annoying so I didn't. The website it originates from is at the bottom.)
Something Iâve felt for a while is that, while I love the common theories going around that rely on either analysis of things like set design/dialogue/acting choices/other little details, or real world tangible things like promotion choices and copyright deadlines/trademarks(and those perspectives are definitely very important and we shouldnât lose sight of them, keep âem coming, please), one perspective that I personally havenât seen much of in CG analysis(although I havenât been online as much so itâs possible I just missed it) is the fact that this show is, first and foremost, a story, and stories generally follow predictable rules and patterns. ST from what weâve seen of it so far, seems to be following the common patterns of your typical linear narrative.
When I say analysis, I mean that for the last few months Iâve basically been trying to sort the various big plot points in the show into these neat little boxes/labels the way I think makes the most logical sense, while also trying to consider multiple possibilities for how much new content could be coming out.
First, thoughâŚ
Section 2: A Few Disclaimers
Firstly, Iâm aware that the basis of this post kind of inherently ignores certain theories like bandersnatchgate, or at least partially operates under the assumption that if itâs real, it will exist in a way that wonât really change the major story beats of Season 5. However, I donât think this theory and those ones necessarilyyy have to totally contradict each other? Idk, youâll see.
Secondly⌠if youâre the kind of person whose mental health is still lowkey riding on this show, and you know that believing even a little in a full new seasonâs worth of content only for something less than that(or nothing at all) to be released will crush your heart and break your soul, I give you full permission to ignore me, plug your ears, yell LALALALALA out loud, preferably not in public, and keep scrolling.
Anyway, onto the post.
Section 3: Short Narrative Structure Lesson
Okay. So.
While I feel like most people could get the basic gist of what it is just from reading the infographic, I wanted to apply this structure to another story that most people are familiar with, to use as a somewhat simpler example of what Iâm going to do.
Structure Analysis of Star Wars: A New Hope:
Hook: The very beginning scene.
Inciting Incident: Leia is captured and the droids are sent to Tatooine with the Death Star plans.
Key Events: Obi-Wan and Luke are introduced, Lukeâs aunt and uncle are murdered, they meet Han Solo.
Midpoint: They get caught on the Death Star.
Crossroads: They find Leia, get stuck in a trash compactor, and nearly escape.
Dark Moment: They escape, but Obi-Wan dies.
Climax: They manage to defeat the Death Star.
Resolution: The award ceremony at the very end.
See how the different plot points can be fit neatly into the beats that the infographic describes?
Okay, bear with me, I want to do another one, but this time for a work with multiple installments and several different plotlines, since thatâs more similar to how ST and TV shows in general work. Hereâs an attempt at a breakdown of the Harry Potter series(yes, I know, I think it works well as an example for what I want to do, for this I'll be talking about it extremely neutrally):
Harry Potter Structural Analysis:
Hook: Harryâs living with the Dursleyâs, he keeps getting weird letters.
Inciting Incident: Hagrid shows up and tells him heâs a wizard, he goes to Hogwarts.
Key Events: The events of the first few books/movies.
Midpoint: Book 4, Voldemort comes back, Cedric dies, but Harry escapes.
Crossroads: Events of books five and six.
Dark Moment: Dumbledore dies, and Voldemort takes over Hogwarts.
Climax: Voldemort is killed.
Resolution: the very end of the book and the epilogue.
(I would recommend trying to either internalize these analyses of these structures or your personal constructive criticisms of them at least a tiny bit before you continue.)
Now, back to Stranger Things.
Section 4: My First Attempt(s)
Back in January, when I first tried doing this, my theory at the time was that the current finale felt like it could potentially be the Midpoint of a completed season 5. I tried to apply the structure to the season itself from the perspective that it was over, then compared that to an analysis of the perspective that it wasnât. I also tried to analyze the structure of the whole show, to try and figure out how season 5 most logically fits into it.
During this phase, I was working with the idea that this was the narrative structure of the show as a whole:
Hook: First episode, weâre introduced to the 80s setting, the kids, and their relationships with each other.
Inciting Incident: Willâs kidnapping.
Key Event(s): Elâs appearance, Will getting found, Willâs possession.
Midpoint: Season 3, but particularly the Season 3 finale, Billy and the meatflayer, Hopperâs âdeath,â the Byersâ move to California.
Cross Roads: Vecnaâs introduction, Maxâs possession, Nina Project, Byler being gay in the desert.
Dark Moment: Season 4 finale, Max and Eddie dying, Vecna escapes, Mikeâs confession.
Climax/Resolution: If CG isnât real, Season 5 finale and epilogue. If it is, we havenât seen it yet.
You may or may not notice a few issues with this way of structuring it. I will get to those later.
Trying to fit Season 5 into this structure under the assumption that it wasnât over was sort of working, but I kept getting stuck. While the season not being over inherently implies that the finale canât be the climax, I felt like I couldnât prove that the finale was specifically the Midpoint and not the Dark Moment of the seasonâs narrative. It certainly seemed like it could be a Dark Moment; the villain winning and the characters being stuck in an illusion world is pretty Dark, lol. Plus, Willâs scene where he gets powers seemed to be functioning as the seasonâs Midpoint(which in itself is CG evidence actually, I think I will write a different, much shorter post on that).
Basically, it just wasnât working. Then the Superbowl happened, and I got distracted. Then life happened, and I got distracted even more. I proceeded to forget about this post for about a month(lol).
When I came back a few weeks ago, I had a few new thoughts. I wanted to consider the possibility that instead of a second half to season 5, we were actually getting what would effectively be an entire season 6. A season 6 wouldnât require a recontextualization of the basic structure of season 5, because season 5 would be complete, and season 6 would have its own structure. This fixed many of the issues of my original analysis.
However, that alone still didnât fix the problem of why I felt like we were getting around a new seasonâs worth of new stuff. It just gave me a new place to start looking.
But now that I was looking at season 5 as a penultimate season instead of an ultimate one, that was making my original analysis of the structure of the show as a whole start to look a little wonky. If season 4âs finale really was the Dark Moment, and the Climax is going to happen in a potential season 6, then season 5 and 6 would be two entire seasons happening in between those plot beats. Generally, that is not the case. The Dark Moment is supposed to happen relatively soon before the Climax. This being the intended structure would be like if in Star Wars, after Obi-Wan dies, the movie just decided to introduce some other plotline and do that for like fifteen minutes before getting back to the Death Star plot. It would be really weird to do it that way.
I also considered the possibility of there being two Dark Moments⌠for some reason, or one really long one that lasted like a season in totalâŚ
However, I donât think either of those are right and you may have already figured out why.
Season 5âs finale is the real Dark Moment of the show.
When I realized this, my first response was basically:
OhhhhâŚ
Fucking.
Obviously.
I mean, come on. I think we all understood this unconsciously, even though most of us maybe didnât quite realize it, at least in terms we could fully explain to others. Look at the way weâve been talking about it: the villain won. If the story ends now, it will be cynical. A tragedy. Something needs to happen to save the characters. It's not just the dark night of the soul for the characters, it's the darkest hour for us. We talk about the ending the way people would probably talk about the end of A New Hope if it ended right after Obi-Wanâs death for no reason. Dark Moments donât generally make for very good endings(a Dark Moment is different from a tragic ending, to be clear).
Imagine if the sixth Harry Potter book ended with Dumbledore dying and Voldemort taking over Hogwarts like in canon, except that last part was kept hidden and non-explicit. Instead of announcing the next book, J.K.9.5. Rowling went around gaslighting everyone into thinking that that was the end, and there was no more coming. Thatâs literally exactly where ST is at right now.
Plus, when you actually compare the two, the season 5 finaleâs âthe villain wonâ makes the season 4 finaleâs âthe villain wonâ look like chump business. Whatâs a couple characters dying(with one being there for a season and the other being immediately resuscitated) and the villain being injured but escaping compared to the entire cast being trapped in the villainâs mind without even realizing it?
And thereâs another reason why, in the context of there being a season 6, season 5âs finale being the Dark Moment makes perfect sense.
Quick exercise. Think of a TV show, any TV show. Or, well⌠one thatâs comparable to ST anyway, in the sense that itâs three or more seasons and is primarily one long arc instead of multiple one or two season long arcs. It should probably also be finished, or almost finished. Now, think of the moment that was the darkest for the characters, the moment where it felt like all hope was lost, the Dark Moment of the entire arc or series.
âŚIt was (most likely) in the finale of the penultimate season, wasnât it?
Thatâs almost always where it is, because itâs generally where it makes the most sense for it to be, pacing-wise. Thatâs part of why I, and others, assumed that the season 4 finale had to be the Dark Moment, because we thought it was the penultimate finale, but when you actually look at it in the context of season 5, itâs not really that dark.
Plus, the season 5 finale being the Dark Moment of the entire series and not the Dark Moment of only season 5 gives any new content room to have its own Dark Moment(Will fake-out death Harry Potter parallel, anyone? That was the Dark Moment of the seventh book, by the way).
So, the season 5 finale being the Dark Moment makes sense. Itâs fitting. But it presents a new problem.
Because, if Season 4âs finale isnât the Dark Moment, then what is it, exactly? Itâs clearly an important moment for the plot, so itâs got to fit into the structure somehow.
Before we can answer that, we need to take a look at the other question that was starting to bother me around this point:
Wait a second. What actually is the Midpoint?
Section 5: Where the Fuck is the Midpoint, Actually
No, seriously. You might remember my earlier attempt at an analysis of the whole showâs structure, where I said the Midpoint was this:
Midpoint: Season 3, but particularly the Season 3 finale, Billy and the meatflayer, Hopperâs âdeath,â the Byersâ move to California.
But now that I no longer believe the season 4 finale is the Dark Moment, this is starting to seem like it needs reevaluating too.
Real quick, letâs remind ourselves of the exact definition of Midpoint that the infographic Iâm using described:
Midpoint- Story turns! Twist or Disaster, Moment of Truth.
While this definition works, itâs a little simple, and I would like to add more.
After reading several articles on the topic and reflecting on my own experience with paying attention to narrative in stories, Iâve come to the conclusion that there are a few things that usually signify that youâre looking at a Midpoint.
The first is what the infographic described: thereâs usually a twist of some kind. In A New Hope, it was the characters realizing that Alderaan was destroyed and the plot point of them getting caught by the Death Star. In Harry Potter, it was Voldemort officially returning.
Another thing that many agree on is that a Midpoint usually signifies the moment that the protagonist(s) starts being less of a passive force reacting to events happening around them and instead an active force whoâs pushing back. Before book 4, Harry mostly just defended himself when something big happened. After Voldemortâs return, Harry starts trying to fight back by creating the DA and looking for horcruxes.
It also generally raises the stakes of the story in a significant way, as is the case in the examples I mentioned.
âŚDoes anything that fits any of that really happen in season 3? I mean, sure, season 3 has its own season Midpoint, but nothing that I would say really works as the Midpoint for the whole show.
But just to be safe, letâs go over season 3 for a second.
One important thing that happens is that Hopper dies. If this moment is the Midpoint, that means that this is the moment in the story that is THE twist of the story, the moment that totally changes the rest of the narrative going forward, raises the stakes, and marks the point that the characters start acting instead of reacting.
Thatâs⌠not really true, is it?
The climax surrounding Billy and the meatflayer doesnât really do that either.
Now what about the Byers moving to California? Thatâs also not really a âdisaster.â It has some negative consequences, but itâs far from a âmoment of truthâ of the entire series.
El losing her powers? At most it raises the stakes, but El reacts to the plot of Season 4 just as much as she does in Season 3.
It gets worse when you try to analyze it from specifically a Byler perspective. I could not for the life of me figure out what Bylerâs Midpoint was while under the assumption that it happened in season 3. I tried to be lenient with it and looked through the entirety of season 3 for a possible Midpoint for them. Again, the Byersâ move just doesnât quite feel like a âdisasterâ that changes their entire relationship for the rest of the show- at most it feels like a build-up for another later event.
The only other really significant scene for them in this season is the rain fight, so I tried to consider that too. While it feels(and is) significant to us as the audience because itâs the first time we see them fight, I wouldnât go so far as to call it a full-fledged disaster, or moment of truth, and it doesnât really raise the stakes, at most just reminds you of them.
So, what moment does, for Byler, and the show as a whole, work as a âtwist, disaster, or moment of truth?â
Well I donât know about you, but when I first tried to find the Midpoint using that specific definition, for Byler and for the whole show, the first thing that popped into my mind was⌠Mike saying the words âI love youâ to El.
Yep. Youâve probably guessed it by now. The Season 4 finale is the Midpoint.
It fits the definition of a narrative disaster perfectly, for all of the particularly important plot threads. Vecna has escaped, Hawkins split open, Byler is in shambles, platonic Elmikeâs not doing so hot either, really all three of those important characters are having a rough time of it and/or making bad decisions. Itâs not just them though- basically all the characters are going through a disaster of their own. Eddieâs dead, Dustinâs having the beginning of a TimeTM, Max is entering a coma, Nancy and Steve are relapsing⌠etc.,
It also raises the stakes more than anything in Season 3 does. The Upside Down and Hawkins are now connected through the rifts. They know about Vecna now but they donât know where he is and he can still access them. Max is in a coma. Several different relationships are struggling in some way, including Bylerâs. Will and El are back in Hawkins now.
Bylerâs stakes are raised too. Now thereâs the possibility of Mike finding out that Will lied about the painting.
Additionally, if you look at Season 5 compared to the seasons before it, Season 4âs finale also marks the turning point where the characters are no longer passively waiting for the Upside Down to come to them(reacting), but instead are actively going towards the danger to try and end it(acting).
So, all in all, Season 4 is basically the perfect Midpoint for the show as a whole. When I first realized this at like 1a.m. three weeks ago, I was so excited because I felt like I had finally solved the whole show, at least from the one specific angle I wanted to, after months of thinking about it.
But⌠hold on. This presents another problem.
Even in the context of there being six total seasons, the final episode of Season 4 isnât really⌠quite the middle of the show, is it? Like⌠itâs almost there, but itâs a little off. The whole thing with the Midpoint is that itâs supposed to be⌠the point in the middle. That was why I had originally assumed it had to have happened in Season 3.
But thereâs an answer here, a way that this all makes sense. And it lies all the way back in Season 1.
Section 6: Season 1(and 2)âs Role in the Narrative
So, hereâs the thing. This whole time, Iâve been assuming that the story starts in Season 1. Because, you know, itâs the first season. Thatâs generally where stories start: in the beginning, lol.
But thereâs another option. I know Iâm not the first one to conceptualize the show this way; I wasnât really in the fandom until soon before Season 5, but Iâm pretty confident that this was an idea that was going around at one point.
Basically, I think Season 1 is the prologue of the show.
What does this mean? It means that in terms of narrative, Season 1âs main purpose is to set-up and provide context for the rest of the story, which actually starts in Season 2. If this is true, then that means that the primary narrative of the show doesnât start until Season 2.
If you think about it, most if not all of the story threads that are core to the majority of the show donât actually start until Season 2. Byler donât really interact until Season 2. Dustin and Steveâs friendship starts in Season 2. El and Hopperâs father-daughter relationship starts in Season 2. In season 2 El and Will, two of the main characters of the show, both become actual full-fledged characters instead of primarily plot devices like they were in Season 1. The Mind Flayer is introduced this season. Max and Lumax are introduced this season. If youâre a Bobgate truther, Bob is introduced this season. Etc.,
Season 1 creates set up for the world, the characters, and future storylines, but itâs primarily self-contained in its narrative. The narrative of the show overall doesnât really start until Season 2. This explains how Will can be the Main Character of the show according to many of the creators and actors despite not really being present in the first season. It also explains how Byler, who many of us Bylers agree is the core of the narrative, can not directly interact with each other much at all until the second season. Season 2 is, in my opinion, the only season that feels more like a sequel to the season that came before it rather than a direct continuation.
So what does this mean for us? Well, if Season 1 is the prologue, Season 2 is where the narrative starts, and the show is theoretically six seasons longâŚ
Well would you look at that! Season 4 is now effectively Season 3/5 in the narrative, and its climax is pretty roughly the middle point of the whole story. That means Season 4âs finale has all the freedom in the world to be the Midpoint. Hooray!
Plus, if it is, and Season 5âs finale is the Dark Moment, then thatâs great for us Byler shippers, and our argument that Byler is the center of the narrative, because it means that the Midpoint and the Dark Moment of the entire story are both centered pretty strongly around them and their godawful communication issues(the s4 climax is Mike saying he loves someone else, the climax of the s5 finale is the symbolic manifestation of their relationship dying, may she rest in peace until s6). It means that Byler having a heart attack in the Season 4 finale is narratively similar to Harry nearly dying to Voldemort in book 4, and from a certain perspective their romance flatlining/El dying in the Season 5 finale could be considered to have similar narrative significance as Obi-Wanâs death and its impact on Luke in A New Hope(Iâm choosing to interpret this as meaning that Obi-Wan Kenobi should be considered a Byler variant).
So, in my mind, that settles it. Season 1 is the prologue, Season 4 is the Midpoint, and Season 5 is the Dark Moment.
Section 7: Narrative Structure Analysis Final Version(for now�)
Okay. Hereâs our new and improved breakdown of the structure of the entire show under the assumption that there will be a season 6, 2026, colorized:
Hook: Season 1 as the prologue, beginning of Season 2.
Inciting Incident: Events in Season 2(admittedly I havenât yet pinpointed in this post where exactly it is, but I donât think I have to for the conclusion of this specific post to work. I think I might make that part of a different post too).
Key Events: Season 3 and 4 plotlines.
Midpoint: Season 4 finale!!!
Crossroads: Season 5 build-up to Vecnaâs win at the end.
Dark Moment: Season 5 finale.
Climax/Resolution: to be seen in Season 6.
Look at it. Behold.
Section 8: Why This Structure Suggests a Season 6, Summarized
In this post so far I have laid out two different pathways that support my argument of CG leading to a possible Season 6.
Pathway 1: If Iâm right and Season 4âs finale is the Midpoint, then it logically must be roughly in the middle of (or about 50% through) a finished narrative, since thatâs about where Midpoints are supposed to be if a story wants to be well-paced.
If Season 1 is not the prologue, and CG isnât real that means the Midpoint for some reason is about 80% of the way through the narrative. If Season 1 could be called the prologue, and CG isnât real, then the Midpoint is about 75% of the way through the narrative. If Season 1 could be called the prologue, AND if there is a full Season 6 coming, then the Season 4 finale is about 60% of the way through the narrative. That is much closer to an exact 50% than any of the other options(and also pretty close to HPâs 57%).Â
However, the less new content weâre given, the more that number goes up, the more the Season 4 finale gets farther and farther away from actually being in the middle, and the more and more wonky-looking the pacing of the whole show gets.
So either Iâm wrong and Season 4 is not the Midpoint, the Duffers have decided they donât care about the pacing of their beloved show being super weird for some reason, or there will be at least a full Season 6(or a secret fourth option that I will get to in a moment).
Pathway 2: If Iâm right and Season 5âs finale is the Dark Moment, then it is most likely the finale of the penultimate season. Generally speaking, for good pacing, stories with multiple installments will have their Dark Moment at the end of the second to last installment, and then use a full last installment to take the story from the Dark Moment to the final climax. This allows the Dark Moment to have the fullest impact it could while preventing the story from dragging out too long before the climax. Not just TV shows do this, the Dark Moment of HP is at the end of the second to last book.
So either Iâm wrong and Season 5 is not the Dark Moment, the Duffers have decided they donât care about typical pacing for some reason, weâre getting a full Season 6, or⌠secret fourth option.
Section 9: The Secret Fourth Option/Have Any of You Guys Seen the Owl House?
Sorry, I'm going to plant some doubt real quick(so I can then try and uproot it before it grows).
Okay so, at this point in my analysis, I was very proud of myself. I had made the structure of the show make sense(to me anyway) and partially explained how a Season 6 would fit into the narrative if it were to exist. But there were still a few holes, and now a few new possibilities had occurred to me that my narrative structure analysis alone couldnât debunk.
For one, Netflix interference.
If you havenât seen the Owl House, or know what happened to it, basically it was a very popular show with a prominent sapphic couple that was canceled after its second season. Unlike most cancellations, it was allowed to finish its story, but with three special episodes instead of a full third season.
That show followed the same structure Iâve been using. Its Dark Moment happened in its season 2 finale, but its overall pacing was punched in the face by executive meddling. The general consensus was that its shorter third season was still very good, but that it wouldâve been much better if it was allowed to be a full final season.
This proves to me that it is technically possible to have a relatively good final season that is cut short. It also provides an example of how creatives donât always have full control of their stories and how corporations tend to be motivated by appealing/conforming to homophobic audiences. Itâs very possible that Netflix had the same qualms with Byler that Disney(presumably, technically I donât think they ever specified why they canceled it) had with Lumity. In which case, itâs possible that they couldâve done the same thing and cut a potential final season short.
So⌠is it possible that thatâs whatâs happening here?
I canât say for sure, but I have a few reasons why I think it isnât.
1- I honestly do think Netflix was iffy about Byler(and probably other future plot points too, not just them), and I do think weâre seeing a compromise between them and the Duffers. However, I think that compromise is CG itself. I think instead of cutting a possible gayass season short but still allowing them to make it, their compromise is that theyâre: hiding the the fact that the particularly gay season exists at all until soon before it comes out, milking the homophobic audience as much as they can by putting the fake finale in theaters and releasing Tales of 85, and pulling off a large publicity stunt that will motivate people to watch Season 6 even if they disagree with its contents. If they did that and cut the season short, that would be a little over-the-top and also a bit incoherent.
2- No fucking way in hell Dana Terrace wouldâve banked her entire career on The Owl House Season 3 the way Matt and Ross Duffer have with the new content for ST. Theyâre clearly extremely confident in whatever new content will be coming out in a way that I doubt she was, even if she clearly put a lot of work into it. That, plus Shawn Levyâs comments on how an amazing ending can make up for a saggy middle, as well as Finn saying that theyâre going to âgo back and rewrite historyâ of endings like GOTâs, implies that multiple people who are at least baseline level knowledgeable in storytelling think the ending is good. This to me suggests that, at bare minimum, the ending will do a half-decent job at fitting the pacing of the show as a whole. Iâve already explained why a Season 6 would do that better than anything shorter.
3- Netflix makes way more bank from ST than Disney ever did from TOH. On the one hand, this means they stand more to lose from homophobes rage-quitting, but it also means that cutting the season short would just be preventing them from making a lot more money from just a little more content. Plus, weâve seen that theyâre willing to pour a ridiculous fuck-ton of money into this show, which suggests to me that theyâre relatively more willing to take risks than others might be.
4- A shortened final season would be significantly harder for ST to pull off than it was for TOH. TOH only had to wrap up two seasonâs worth of story, with the first season having a lot of filler episodes. ST has to wrap up five while also having way more important characters and plotlines than TOH did.
5- The kicker... I really think that they've known they were going to be doing CG for a while now. Obviously the entirety of Season 5 is written with it in mind, and we know that they had extra time to plan both Seasons 4 and 5. I don't think they would've written those seasons the way they did, including the amount of set-ups for future story that they did, if they weren't planning on executing. It's possible that they didn't know Season 6 would be shortened until after they made Season 4, but again, that would imply that Season 6 is not what they were planning on doing, and therefore unlikely to be their very best work, and thus probably not something they would put this many stakes on.
Itâs also technically possible that the Duffers chose to have the last season be shorter of their own free will⌠for some reason. That would imply that either they have their own reason for writing it that way that my brain canât currently comprehend⌠or theyâre bad writers who make weird unfathomable decisions, and isnât half the point of CG that theyâre not?
In summary, it is technically possible that the new content could be less than a full season despite the fact that I think it would be worse for the story, because we live in an imperfect world, but that seems very unlikely to me.
Section 10: Okay But⌠How Though
Iâm not going to lie to you, there is one potential big hole in my reasoning⌠logistics. I lowkey donât one hundred percent know how it would be possible that they filmed an entire season in secret without anyone noticing. Iâm not familiar enough with the filming process to understand how that would work. Plus, it seems like paparazzi caught all the outdoor locations they used(with the exception of the mysterious circus tentâŚ). Not to mention that with how many things about Season 5 were leaked, it seems unlikely that so little wouldâve gotten leaked about Season 6 in comparison.
However, I will say that I donât personally think itâs impossible. To start, I think a good chunk of the leaks couldâve been leaked on purpose. Itâs objectively kind of insane that basically the whole epilogue was spoiled like a year ahead of time and Netflix didnât do jack shit about it.
And weâve seen that they can keep things hidden if they really want to. Will having powers was never spoiled, people only guessed Kali would come back because her actress was at the premiere, and Maxâs whole plotline was never leaked either.
Not to mention, they filmed the whole thing in a year, with a very large budget. It's been long enough now that if they only started editing Season 6 right after 5 came out, I'm pretty sure they could be at least most of the way done by now.
Plus, we donât know what happens in Season 6. Maybe they couldâve just filmed the entire thing indoors, lol.
Section 11: Bonus Supplementary Evidence
There being a Season 6 would explain why everyone on the cast keeps specifically debunking a possible episode 9 of Season 5. If thereâs a Season 6, then Season 5 is over and therefore yeah, there isnât an episode 9 lol. Theyâre not lying, technically.
Certain things that were said about the latest season that seemed to be lies couldâve been about Season 6. Iâm pretty sure the Duffers said at one point there would be no new characters introduced in the new season⌠maybe thatâs true for Season 6. Some rumors and things actors said implied that each episode would be movie length⌠maybe thatâs true for Season 6. Maybe Season 6 is the âgayer than everâ season that Amybeth was talking about.
The talk of a âdouble featureâ in the show⌠two seasons of a TV show released less than a year of each other when normally they take much longer to come out could be considered, in a way, the TV equivalent of a movie double feature.
In regards to the whole âA sideâ vs âB sideâ thing, itâs possible that the new content could technically be called Season 5b instead of Season 6, but it would effectively be the same thing.
At this point I just assume that half of what the actors say is the exact opposite of the truth so Finn Wolfhard apparently saying it would be âridiculousâ for ST to have more than five seasons⌠lol.
So now⌠weâve arrived at today.
Final Thoughts
In conclusionâŚ
I believe I've found the most logical way to narratively structure ST as a whole, at least when it comes to the Midpoint, the Dark Moment, and the role of Season 1/2 in the overarching narrative.
I think a Season 6 that contains a real finale for the series as a whole would be the most logically consistent way for ST to progress, for all the reasons listed above, but especially my best and currently preferred understanding of the underlying structure and pacing of the story itself.
Through making this post, I hope I succeeded in reverse engineering the showâs narrative structure as well as CG itself to produce something that makes cohesive sense. If nothing else, I hope I gave someone something to chew on until Tales comes out.
If you spot any issues in my reasoning, or just have questions, please tell me. I promise to at least try not to let my attachment to the time I spent on this post cloud my vision lol.
I have a few more CG and ST related posts I want to make using this type of analysis. For example: I have some thoughts on which characters I think might die in the new content, which relationships and plotlines I think will most likely be important, and why I think Jancy in particular is still going to be endgame, lol, as well as the other posts I mentioned I will possibly write. Please let me know if any of you would be interested in seeing those!
âŚI spent way too fucking long writing and rewriting this post you guys. Jesus. Anyway.
In light of MurrayBaumanLives' (on Tiktok) most recent video (below)...
I wanted to share something I noticed a month-ish ago about the Pennhurst scenes:
Could that be an older Vickie in S4?
Could there be something behind the patient calling out to Robin, "Cinderella, you lost your shoe?"
Could we have an older and younger version of a character at the same time/place (e.g., older versions of the character getting "stuck" in present-day Hawkins after multiple attempts to intervene)?
Could the patients at Pennhurst be survivors (or current subjects) of MK Ultra and/or HNL's "sleep study" (part of the "Stranger Things Experience")?
Are their Pennhurst residents' minds currently being used (Inception-style)?
Or, maybe have/do they "play" roles in any of the scenes we've seen, in "a silly, terrible play," in a game, and/or simulated world (like NINA)?
Is this where they get put if they're considered a "burnout?"
As much as it might seem like I'm spiraling out on it, I'm not really. I just think there's something about Pennhurst that'll eventually be revealed and thought I'd share the orange Beetle-thing.