hi Traincat !! i hope you're doing good. i just wanted to ask if we actually know from canon / source material who were Peter and Johnny's first times? thank you !
So we don't have hardline canonical answers here, but you can come to your own conclusions if you scope out their relationships. I can tell what I think, but that's no more or less canon than anyone else's eighty billion issue informed opinion.
With Peter, I think you can pretty much go with what you want. I don't think it was Betty, although I do think they slept together later after Betty left Ned the first time and I don't care what Marv Wolfman says. My personal opinion is that it was Gwen, but there's conflicting accounts here. Things like Spider-Man: Blue support me on this.
"That's when you had me, Gwen Stacy. All of me." (Spider-Man: Blue #6)
However, other canon disagrees -- originally, Sins Past kind of hinged on Peter and Gwen never having had sex, because Peter was 100% sure he couldn't be the father of her kids. (Despite the fact that the original story called for him to be the father of the twins before editorial got in there and we ended up with a worse alternative.) (None of this matters anymore because Sins Past is out of continuity and Gwen doesn't have kids because the kids were clones.) (Anyway I don't believe Gwen and Peter never had sex.) Anyway, Peter's kind of a fast mover in relationships in general, so there's options. I do think it was Gwen, but hey, it could have been Cissie Ironwood.
For me, I don't think MJ and Peter were each other's firsts, but that's because part of what I enjoy about their relationship is that it's not this like, First and Only kind of deal. They both had their own experiences and baggage going into the relationship, and they grew together, but I don't personally consider them each other's firsts. Your mileage may vary -- if someone wants to headcanon them as each other's firsts, that's their prerogative. We do know when they first had sex, granted.
"One hour ago, it was all right. Mary Jane was here and Peter Parker could lose himself... in her, in their closeness, in their mutual need." (ASM #149-150)
When the post-nut clone crisis hits.
Johnny is a little bit more up in the air. We've talked a little before about how until well after his marriage and subsequent Skrull reveal, Johnny doesn't really have sex scenes. Or even like, particularly flirty scenes, like Peter specializes in. Which is weird for a character with Johnny's reputation! But here we are anyway.
Johnny's first time definitely could have been with Crystal. There's definitely enough opportunity while she was living with the Fantastic Four. I think that's the best, nicest option here, and there's nothing that contradicts it. There's just nothing I really can point to and say it supports it, either, other than Johnny and Crystal being young and in love and cohabiting for the majority of their relationship. I don't think it was Frankie Raye, although it could have been -- after her powers were revealed to her. Before the powers reveal, I think it's pretty clear Johnny and Frankie weren't having sex. Not in the least because Frankie's got her magically disappearing and reappearing gold leotard practically soldered onto her. After the powers reveal, sure, maybe. Again, nothing that says they weren't having sex, but also nothing that says they were, and the relationship gets strained pretty quickly.
The first actual like, confirmed instance where we know Johnny had sex is Fantastic Four #275, with the person who was Alicia at the time of publication and was later retconned to be Lyja.
It's not a super comfortable scene, and you can kind of read into that whatever you want -- that Johnny feels guilty over Ben, that Johnny subconsciously recognizes something's wrong, that he does actually regret it. Any combination of that. And I'm not saying this is his first time -- again, I have nothing that supports that, but I also have nothing that contradicts it. It's just the first scene we have with him that's obviously a direct morning after scene. And I looked! For an earlier example! I combed through that book! There's just nothing. So again, this is a "you have to come to your own conclusions" kind of situation.
I hope that helps a little!
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