#snicketstrange

-The Truthful Time Period-

When EXACTLY do the events of ASOUE (Netflix & Book) occur?

Firstly:

*Happy New Year, wherever you are celebrating from!*

(This post debuts on my, @unfortunatetheorist's, blog; 00:00 GMT)

The subject of time has been one of great debate throughout the ASOUE fandom, especially with references such as the Baudelaires' favourite film being the 1938 version of Dawn Patrol and Olaf saying he bought the hourglass from TBB online.

In this theory, @snicketstrange and I have come up with what we believe to be a definitive answer, for each case - Netflix Canon and Book Canon.

A firm starting point is this line from TBB:

"In the years since, I've inquired what became of the Brothers Poe. One followed his father into the world of banking. The other lives in a cave and talks to sheep. They each think the other has it better."

This means that the time between the main events of ASOUE and the release of the first season of the series on Netflix in the ASOUE universe is enough for Mr. Poe's children to grow up and one of them to become a banker. We can assume that it would be reasonable to think about at least 10 years. This should be approximately the age difference between Lemony who appears in TSS and Lemony who narrates.

Also, Violet's line from TRR:

"Um, Dawn Patrol, the 1938 version."

This implies 2 things: there was a later remake of Dawn Patrol (hence, "version") and the Baudelaire parents must have been at the suitable age rating to watch the movie when it came out, as:

Monty: "It was your parents' favourite too."

Let's estimate to see how accurate we can be. In 1938 the film was released. Bertrand probably saw this film when he was a teenager, but perhaps not at the premiere. But maybe. (Favourite films when we are adults often arise when we watch these films in [pre-]adolescence).

So, Bertrand in 1938 could have been 12 years old. Let's put this scenario as the oldest. If he was 12 years old in 1938, he must having got married and fathered Violet at around 28 (estimate based on all of Beatrice's history with Lemony prior to her marriage to Bertrand, and Bertrand's appearance in TE). In this case Violet would have been born in 1954, and the series' main events would have been 14 years later in 1968. Lemony would be narrating the story in about 1978.

Now, thinking about the upper limit, we would have the case where the premiere of the Netflix series in our universe happened in the same year as in Lemony's universe. In this case, 2017 would be the year of Lemony's narration, and then 2007 would be the year of ASOUE's main events. So, to date, our estimate is between 1968 and 2007 (book + Netflix).

The main problem is that ASOUE in the books is quite anachronistic. Despite the aesthetics Netflix exists within the universe. But, in contrast, we can argue that Netflix at the time was a video home delivery service, as was the original Netflix. (We don't see people with internet at home in ASOUE, and a computer like in Prufrock Prep was quite rare, hence it being called 'Advanced').

[And apparently something not connected to the internet.]

And this is very interesting. ASOUE's Netflix series is meant to be a video delivery service. After all, we see in THH that there are video delivery services in the library and devices for showing videos.

The first type of Home Video to exist in our world was Betamax in 1975.

And the first microcomputer for personal use was also launched in 1975, the Altair 8800.

And if we look at a detail in LSTUA.

They are separate universes, but this photographic record is the only one dated in the entire Unfortunate universe: October 1977. It wouldn't be surprising if the series' writers (who are fans of the books) had this enigmatic date in mind, and made ASOUE take place in the 1970s.

And 2 years after the launch of home video and after the launch of microcomputers would be exactly the time needed for a newly launched technology to have spread enough to suggest services like Netflix in the world of ASOUE.

Long enough for some people to buy video cassettes and even cameras.

Here's the full picture:

So the answer to our original question:

The Masked Ball - Book Canon VS Netflix Canon

After quite a wait (my [@unfortunatetheorist's] bad), here it is.

The Masked Ball that Duchess R invites Lemony to in LSTUA is notably different in both the book and Netflix canon. This post will try and take into account all of the differences that both Masked Balls have.

Obviously, the Very First Difference is that:

BOOK: The Ball happens AFTER the Baudelaire fire, during the events of The Carnivorous Carnival.

NETFLIX: The Ball happens 'IN THE PAST, a phrase which here means BEFORE THE BAUDELAIRES WERE BORN'.

This impacts the storyline greatly, as the book canon allows for the possibility of Beatrice surviving the fire, before Lemony met her at the Masked Ball and tried to save her, where she ultimately died.

This also paves the way for a slightly chilling possibility, especially when you look at it in terms of Lemony:

According to Netflix canon, if the Baudelaires weren't born at the time of the ball, and we know Beatrice was there... who's to say that Bertrand was not? The possibility is there, however slim it may be.

This COULD, in THEORY, mean one thing - Beatrice CHEATED on Lemony with Bertrand, and he didn't know. He found out later when she confessed to it, out of guilt, in her 200-page book. This, in turn, is what led to Lemony spiralling into depression, and is what makes him say this line in TPP:

"The man in the back of that taxi is myself, many years ago when I was much younger and more naive than I am now."

His naivety is referring to his unrequited love for Beatrice, despite the fact that she cheated on him.

It also, referring to BOOK canon this time, makes him say this line in TAA:

"[And] because I felt like a different person, I dared to approach a woman I had been forbidden to approach for the rest of my life."

The only reasons he would've been forbidden to approach her are:

a) Bertrand

b) Beatrice - if she ever saw him again, it would bring back all those emotions of guilt and sadness that she didn't want to hold on to.

(But that's just theoretical. Back to the point...)

Another key difference is that:

BOOK: Olaf is not present at this ball.

NETFLIX: Olaf IS present at this ball.

This is important, as @snicketstrange points out in a theory, Lemony sees Beatrice at the ball and says to her "Count Olaf is dead" - in book canon only.

Here's an interesting one:

BOOK: The Masked Ball is mentioned in TAA.

NETFLIX: The Masked Ball is only mentioned/shown in TCC.

This plays quite a part, as it allows for the possibility to be referenced in TEE, and therefore, for Esmé to have been at the ball, as she says in the Netflix series (TSS):.

"You once threw a Masked Ball here and didn't invite me - not that I care! A face this gorgeous should never be hidden behind a mask."

However, it is also not made explicitly clear in the books as to whether or not Esmé was invited/there.

BOOK: It is not mentioned whether or not Esmé is at the ball.

NETFLIX: Esmé is clearly NOT INVITED to this ball.

Another similarity is that both Balls were held explicitly by the Duchess of Winnipeg, Duchess R:

BOOK: Duchess R of Winnipeg holds the Masked Ball.

NETFLIX: Duchess R of Winnipeg holds the Masked Ball.

Speaking of people at Masked Balls, let's refocus on the main man himself - Lemony. Here's some things @snicketstrange pointed out:

In the books there are two dances mentioned. One of them was during the main events described in TCC. But it was NOT the same ball at which Lemony was captured nor the same ball at which he said "Count Olaf is..." This other ball is the one mentioned by the narrator Lemony in TAA, but it took place after the publication of TWW.

It's important to think in 5 dimensions here. (@snicketstrange is one of the few people that can do that!)

Lemony published his books over the years after the main events described in the books. And over these years, Lemony experienced some things that he, as a narrator, INCLUDED in the books as he published them. And the Ball at which Lemony was captured was one of those events.

Some more differences are:

Lemony's outfit

According to Lemony, it was the only time in his life that he wore this outfit. This detail is VERY significant. During the Netflix show's second season, Daniel Handler was still on the show's creative team.

It may be that he made these demands to ensure that people knew that the ball depicted in the show was a different ball than the ball depicted in the books, even though there were similarities.

In other words, in the show they weren't trying to replicate what was described in the books, even though there are SOME thematic similarities, and purposeful differences.

The fact that Lemony is being chased or not

The people described at the ball. Note that there are no people who died (with the exception of one Beatrice present) at the book ball. Monty, Dr. Orwell, Josephine, are not mentioned.

[Thank you again @snicketstrange, your words continue to provoke wisdom and thought into the minds of keen ASOUE fans...]

I can't be sure, but I've been told by two different people that, yes, he is.

Olá. Vc pensou nisso depois de ler meus textos ou antes? Porque ficou muito bom

Olá! Obrigada. Eu tinha pensado antes, mas era apenas um protótipo de uma idea. Depois de ler a sua teoria eu vi que existe embasamento para a existência de mais de dois lados da organização.

Os três lados são mostrados pelos trigêmeos do hotel Desenlace

Cada um deles defende um lado 

Exato! Dewey expressa desatisfação com os métodos tradicionais da organização (”fumaça e espelhos”), o que é um dos grandes sinais que há uma divisão de ideias. 

Ismael, é das antigas

Quando participou da cisão, ele ficou do lado que nunca usaria armas

Mas mudou seu ponto de vista na ilha

Pra tristeza de Olaf

Isso explica muita coisa sobre ele, e por que Olaf achou que conseguiria tomar a ilha facilmente.

Os bibliotecários no trem do livro 4 de ATWQ também nunca entrariam numa briga

Por isso uma criança com um porrete pôde dominá-los tão facilmente