Random Thoughts on The Falcon and The Winter Soldier:
I have no knowledge of what the comics say, or what any of the writers may have said to clarify anything in interviews or what have you. This is based solely on the movies as they played in the theatres, and the series as broadcast on Disney+.
The Super Soldier Serum
Red Skull stole some serum from Dr. Erskine before it was perfected. And I don't know how he injected it. Nor was he the kind of person Dr. Erskine would have chosen. And he had a terrible side effect.
Steve was given the serum that was as good as Dr. Erskine could make it. He had probably done exhaustive experiments, and he was just waiting for the right person. Dr. Erskine chose him because he was a good man who didn't want to kill anyone, he just didn't like bullies. Howard Stark designed the optimal way to administer it. He had the best result.
Bucky could only have been given a version of the serum that had been distilled from Red Skull's blood. We don't know what kind of experiments Zola did on him after he was captured after the battle of Azzano. But he certainly did something if it helped him to survive the fall from the train, and the loss of his arm. So he was given a version of an imperfect serum, administered in some way, along with whatever else had been done to his body, and then his identity was removed. But, as of TFATWS. It doesn't seem to have had any adverse affects, physically or emotionally. Though he's been through such trauma, it would be difficult to tell if the serum had any affect on it. However, Bucky was a good guy, before his identity was removed, so now that he has come back to himself, it makes sense that the serum wouldn't react badly with his actual personality. He seems to continue to have a good result.
The other people in the winter soldier program were given the serum as Howard Stark had recreated it. I don't know what he had to begin that formula, but it must have been untested. Maybe he was handing it over to the Pentagon to be tested? Zola may have fooled around with it as well. Bucky said that they were erratic. And one of them turned on the Hydra guy and tried to kill him. They had a poor result.
Isaiah was given a form of the serum, I don't know what it would have been distilled from, or how it was administered. They were told it was for tetanus, so it wasn't administered with Stark's technology. But it killed many of the other guys. Isaiah though, I think, had the best personality, morals, and ethics for the serum. He seems to continue to have a good result.
Nagel distilled the serum from samples of Isaiah's blood. He said he found semi-stable traces of the serum in the blood. We don't know if that says anything about the serum in Isaiah's blood. It could be a result of how it was stored, especially during the time after it was stolen before it got to Nagel. Then he worked on it so that it would not make noticeable physical changes. So it was all kinds of messed up. It isn't really shown if it has enhanced and negative or positive traits that Karli and the Flag Smashers may have already had. But from what we know, it seems to have had a good result.
John Walker took one of those vials of serum. It had not been kept in optimal conditions, that may have affected it. He was already very angry, dishearted, and embarrassed from everything that had already happened before he took it. So it didn't change him physically, but he obviously has some after effects. We can see him having odd twitches. And his anger was there before the serum, but it seems as if now, once he gets angry, it gets turbo boosted. He doesn't seem to be able to make good decisions in the heat of battle, the way Lemar said he did, or the way that would earn you three medals of honor. I would say it had a less than optimal result.
So when they say super soldier serum, they aren't talking about the exact serum that was given to Steve. Not all iterations of the serum are the same. So every person given it will not react the same way.
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Also side note: The show makes it so clear that originally, Karli and the Flagsmashers are stealing food and medicine, nothing else. Yet they're already branded terrorists long before they do anything openly hostile. Also not something many people acknowledge. //
I meaaaaan.... They were branded like that by the American government, right? It fits with the rela Americans government tbh lol
oh yes of course it fits, it's 100% how the US government (and other governments) operate against anyone who resists violent oppression, especially if like the Flagsmashers they're largely bipoc. Fandom just missed the point where you're meant to walk away NOT agreeing with Walker and the US government - you're meant to at LEAST question the validity of that label and the timing of its use in comparison to the Flagsmasher's actual canon actions.
Crazy to me that I still see people defending John Walker for killing that Flagsmasher cause the Flagsmashers killed Lamar. Cause like even disregarding the fact that he's Captain America, John Walker, a member of the United States military, murdered an unarmed, surrendered, and innocent (at least of the crime John was killing him for) assailant, on a rogue mission, in a foreign country that he had no right to be in in the first place. John. Committed. A. War. Crime. No shit he had the title of Captain America stripped away
Echo's costume designers when Marvel already ripped off indigenous symbolism for their non-indigenous villains on Falcon and the Winter Soldier and have to do Maya Lopez' costume without her trademark handprint.
AN: Iâm so glad you guys liked the first chapter!! Iâm sorry itâs taken longer than expected to get out!!
Summary: You were chosen as one of Karliâs elite. You became a super soldier to help your cause, make the world a better place but taking the serum came with a price. After being cornered one day, youâre taken by the famous Helmut Zemo to give him answers or face the consequences.
In This Chapter: You wake up to find Zemo has taken you hostage to find out information on the whereabouts of Karli Morgenthau.Â
(PART 1 HERE)
Pairing(s): Zemo x Fem!Reader, Karli Morganthau x Platonic!Reader
Word Count: 1,721
Warnings: Spoilers for TFATWS, violence, strong language
Zemo caught the young womanâs body as her eyes rolled back. He couldnât help but let out a grunt as he lifted her up over his shoulder to remove her from the sewers before her accomplice could catch up.Â
As he returned to the surface, he peered around the surrounding streets and then carried her over to a parked car.Â
He placed her down beside the vehicle as he worked on opening it and getting it started.Â
Laying her across the backseat, he made sure he had another syringe handy in case she woke before reaching the desired destination.Â
Zemo pulled inside the large building, one of the many he confidentially owned, and removed the flagsmasher from the vehicle before taking her down to the basement of the building.Â
He took a moment to remove his large coat as he began to sweat, tossing the expensive garment on the ragged old couch in the corner of the room.Â
He carried the girl to the shackles on the wall and stood her up long enough to get the cuffs around her wrists and the thick metal band around her neck. It was a precaution taken to stop her from kicking off the wall if trying to escape.Â
Zemo tipped her head back to allow access for the band to wrap around her neck, clasping it on wall behind her. He contemplated removing the flagsmasher mask but ultimately decided it would be easier to gain information from the woman if he couldnât see just how young she was. Was it wrong for him to admit that? Yes. But he knew it would keep it less personal this way.Â
He chained the girlâs ankles together before wiping his brow with his handkerchief and returning to fetch his coat. He figured she may not wake for a while so returned upstairs to make sure the site was secure.Â
--
Zemo was grateful when he finally noticed signs of the woman stirring. He had waited long enough to be able to get his hands on one of Karliâs acolytes.Â
He introduced himself but you already knew who he was.Â
âWe have a few things Iâd like to discuss first.â Zemo admitted.Â
âLike what?â You scowled at the man.Â
âLike the whereabouts of Karli Morgenthau.â Zemo pressed his hands together behind his back as he looked upon you.Â
You scowled at the man with his mention of Karli.Â
âWhy would I tell you anything?â You scoffed.Â
âBecause if you don't, I will simply find the means to force you to.â Zemoâs eyes never left yours as he spoke.Â
âGo ahead and try.â You daringly invited him despite the hard knot in your gut. If someone had told you that taking the serum meant being stuck in some freaky torture chamber with Helmut Zemo a few months ago, you werenât so sure you wouldâve taken it.Â
Zemo was infamous both as an agent of Sokovia and for single handedly ripping the Avengers apart.Â
âAre you really that willing to die for someone who doesnât even know or care where you are?â Zemo frowned, tilting his head at you. You tried to deflect his mind games but there was a speck of doubt starting to crawl into your mind.Â
âTheyâll come for me.â You proclaimed.Â
âPerhaps they will.â Zemo shrugged, âPerhaps theyâll willingly come to their deaths or perhaps theyâll leave you here to be a martyr for their cause.âÂ
âYou canât beat us all.â You argued against his threat.Â
âOn the contrary, I can.â Zemo lifted his finger, his lips turning up into a small smirk as he began to slowly move around the room. âI have experience, and patience. A man can do anything if he has those.â
You tried watching him through your mask that had become increasingly more uncomfortable the longer you wore it.Â
You decided against fuelling the fire and remained silent.Â
âWhat's the matter?â Zemo cocked his head towards you. âCat got your tongue?â
Again, you chose not to respond.Â
Zemo quietly scoffed as he started to approach you.Â
âHolding your tongue, MilĂĄÄik, will not aid you in any way.â
Once he seemed close enough, you tried to jolt forward against your restraints but ultimately failed.Â
You choked against the metal neckband and your wrists cried out against the cuffs. They had been much stronger than anything you had encountered before.Â
âVibranium.â Zemo gestured to your holds. âVery difficult to get hold of and very expensive.â
Zemoâs fingertips pressed together as he studied you. You were avoiding eye contact with the man but instead searching the room for any way to get out of your restraints.Â
âThere is no escape.â Zemo announced as he clocked your behaviour. âThe only way you are leaving this place is if you give me the location of Karli and her comrades.âÂ
âIâll be leaving this place in a bodybag you mean.â You spat back.Â
âWell, that all depends on how long it takes for you to give me what I desire.â Zemoâs smirk dropped. He lifted his chin slightly, glowering at you.Â
âFuck you.â You sneered. Zemo didnât react to the deprecation, his face cold and hard as he stared unblinking.Â
You almost thanked the universe when Zemoâs phone began to rang.Â
Zemo answered it swiftly, walking off to the furtherest corner of the basement to take the call to stop you eavesdropping in any way.Â
You tried fighting the restraints on your ankles but they were just as strong as the holds on your wrists. You wondered how long Zemo had planned to take one of you hostage. You internally scolded yourself. You should have been more careful.Â
âI have some business to take care of.â Zemo interrupted your thoughts as he pulled his mobile away from his ear. âIf I were you Iâd consider my options whilst I am away. Once I return, we shall be having a little conversation one way or another.âÂ
You felt an ice cold chill roll down your spine from Zemo's threat. His voice sent goosebumps over your skin and his eyes held enough power to kill you right there.
You watched Zemo climb the rickety staircase without a second glance back to you.Â
Sweat began to roll down your forehead under your mask. You growled, rubbing it against your arm to try and remove the damn thing. It didnât take too long before it was clattering against the floor and you felt like you could finally breathe again.Â
You inhaled the damp air deeply and rested your head back against the wall.Â
Your mind diverged back to Deedee, you hoped she had gotten out before Zemo could have done anything. You knew heâd take her out if she tried to help you, he only needed one of you alive for information.Â
You closed your eyes to try and hone in your senses. You tried to listen for any hint that might tell you where you were. The building was eerily silent despite the howling wind from above; you figured there must be some kind of broken window or hole in the wall causing the whistle. From the state of the room around you, you could tell this was an older building, vacated for a while.Â
You couldnât hear any cars, planes or voices. You had to be somewhere pretty secluded from the rest of the city.
Your eyes snapped open when you heard the latch of the door at the top of the stairs.Â
Zemoâs footsteps were heavy as he descended back down to you.Â
Your eyes found his hands as he rolled his sleeves up to just below his elbows.Â
âAre you ready to talk?â He asked. When he lifted his head from his arms back to you, he froze in his step. Not that you noticed.Â
His mouth closed and his jaw seized as his eyes absorbed your features.Â
He hadn't expected you to have removed the mask. He recognised you from the mugshots but you looked very different in person.Â
You were young, with soft features and your eyes were narrow with vexation. You were also very beautiful. He couldnât deny that.Â
He had to drop his eyes back to his sleeves when he felt an odd familiarity about you begin to impel.Â
âWhat happened to the other woman I was with?â You asked, taking a minute before responding to the man.Â
âShe left you.â Zemo announced. You felt a wave of relief, realising that she escaped unharmed.Â
You watched the man turn his back on you, approaching the small metal cart to his left and picking up a small scalpel. He examined it as he spoke.Â
âThis isnât personal.â Zemo muttered. âI have no quarrel with what you are trying to do. Itâs how you have decided to do it. Super soldiers should not be allowed to exist. I have spent years trying to end the super soldier line and I wonât stop until my work is finished.âÂ
âUntil we are all dead.â You corrected him.Â
âNot all.â Zemo shook his head. âYou may still have a chance of survival after all this.âÂ
âTo live whilst the people I care for are dead? That isnât a chance I want to take.âÂ
âYou may care for them but I am certain they donât care for you. Your so-called comrade left you alone in the tunnels despite your cries about trouble. Your death means nothing to them.â Zemo finally looked back at you. âYou were a sacrifice they were willing to make.âÂ
You were hesitant to answer. You knew Deedee had only left because you had commanded her to. The team must all be sat around now wondering where you were, wondering how to get you back and if you are still alive. They wouldnât just leave you. Karli wouldnât leave you.Â
âHow can you expect me to give up any information if I know youâre just going to murder them if you find them?â You catechised Zemo.Â
âMurder is a strong word. Would you say you murdered those innocent people in Vilnius?â Zemoâs mention of Vilnius made your stomach twist tighter. Nausea began to creep up on you and Zemo noticed the paling of your complexion. âEverybody has a breaking point. We just have to find yours.â
AN: NEW PART NEXT WEEK! Ask to be added to the taglist to keep up to date with all new parts!
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Can I just make this post as a tribute to Lemar Hoskins and Nico, that flagsmasher Walker killed?
I know Lemar was perhaps John Walker's best friend, and people didn't like him for several reasons. I for one, don't think he deserved that death. He was fairly civil with Sam and Bucky, and didn't appear to be a petty and arrogant person like Walker. He did do bad things, one of them being backing John up in many things, but he also did think Sam's idea of negotiating calmly with Karli could work, and he expressed this. He wasn't somebody with ill intent.
R.I.P Lemar Hoskins
The now deceased Nico earlier on in the episode told Karli how he used to look up to Captain America. How cap led him to believe there was still good in the world. He's now dead, and his blood is on the hands of someone he respected. He wasn't killed by the Captain America he idolized, but he was killed by Captain America nonetheless. He too, wasn't somebody with direct ill intent.
Here's how I think the finale of TFATWS is going to go.
We have two people claiming the Captain America title, with one common goal: stop the Flagsmashers.
The main ideological battle of the show is what kind of Captain America do we want and can accept as the symbol of our nation. I think the final episode will cement itself in favour of Sam by juxtaposing him directly against John Walker, in moment when they're trying to achieve the same goal. They both have different reasons for stopping the flagsmashers and therefore different strategies.
John Walker is avenging something personaI. There's a lot of rage there. His background is already cemented in war crimes (in Afghanistan presumably). He is the American government.
Sam Wilson is a pacifist, and his background is in helping veterans with PTSD since his own wingman died. He's been anti-government ever since we met him, and has stayed that way.
Sam Wilson's race and his anti-government history means he's going to be a divisive Captain America. I don't think the US government is just going to roll over and accept him the second he shows up. I don't think that would be true to what the show has been about so far. The conversation with Isaiah will not be discarded as a cynical old man's drivel, and Sam Wilson's Captain America, though a better choice to anyone with a sound mind, will have to stay on the run.
