The problem with this attitude "do NOT tag my art of these two characters with their #shipname, it is NOT ship art!" when it comes to canon ships is like................
baby it's canon.
And that doesn't mean you have to "ship" it (fandom-wise) or even like it, but it does mean that drawing Character A with Character B is still literally ship art.
āØ baby! they are a ship whether you like it or not!!!!! āØ
And if you're going to be upset about people tagging your art with the ship name, I think maybe you shouldn't be posting it to begin with?
Ship tags are morally neutral. In fact, they're responsible to use! If you draw dark art of CHARACTER A WITH CHARACTER B WHO HAPPEN TO CANONICALLY BE A SHIP, and go BUT IT'S NOT SHIP ART, all you're doing is preventing people from being able to filter it.
The fact that you're drawing something dark means you're exposing people to content that they might find triggering, and that you as the artist have made triggering on purpose. "Look at this suggestive pose of these two canonically involved characters because I'm viewing it from a HORROR context and it's PREDATORY and DARK and I do NOT SHIP IT!!!!!!!" And yet you don't want people to be able to filter it to protect themselves from something that is triggering, when you yourself know it's triggering.
Like, it's just beyond unsafe, but also such a rancid and selfish way to behave inside a shared space with other fans. I'm trying to be gentle here because I don't want to shame anyone, but come on man. Knock it the fuck off. It's so performative and obnoxious.
I HATE THIS SHIP BUT I STILL WANT TO DRAW IT SO YOU BETTER NOT TAG IT AS THE SHIP - do you hear yourself?
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yknow we talk a lot about like, calling fandom fascism & censorship out for what it is, instead of couching it in words like anti/proship that make it sound sillier and less abusive than it actually is, and I think we also should confront the way social media preys on anger responses for engagement and how participating in toxic fandom behavior feeds right into that.
it's not rebellious to lead fandom dogpiles and drown yourself in the mire of drama, it's playing exactly into the outrage algorithm and participating directly into capitalism in a way that is so deeply unethical, not to mention so self-harming. This isn't a situation of no ethical consumption under capitalism -- this is not shopping for groceries at Walmart because it's all you can afford or using a cable provider that endorsed MAGA because it's the only one available your area -- this is something so very easy to boycott and to refuse to participate in.
i was just peeking at some fandom drama on twitter because I am susceptible to watching the circus act just like everyone else lmao, and it genuinely astounds me the way the most abusive and petty people come online and try to cosplay as leftists who are somehow doing all of this for a righteous cause. It's just so deeply cognitively dissonant. (put a pin in this and remember everything we've learned about accountability vs shame and how often people use shame to make themselves feel better when it's entirely unproductive to the issue they claim to care about yatta yatta.)
anyway that's my thought this afternoon--framing fandom drama into more real world contexts always sounds a little bit silly, but I think if you're a person with hobbies who uses the internet as a social space, we have to stop treating it like it's silly and can't harm you, can't influence you, can't hurt your feelings. i'm sure we all have close relationships and countless GOOD things we've gained from fandoming and it's ridiculous to propose that you can't also cause harm in equal measure, and we can't spend every day reading fic, talking to other fans and making friends, hanging out in discord, and then pretend it's not an important space for you.
stop letting capitalism ruin everything. fandom is inherently anarchistic and there's nothing more anarchistic than continuing to be kind to each other when they don't want you to be!
I really would encourage everyone to do a mindfulness check before you post about your problematic blorbo and do a proofread for disclaimers and excuses.
ie: "Yeah they're terrible but I like them!" or "It's canon!" or "[misc discourse buzzword gotchas about fiction not being reality, blah blah]"
Just don't! You don't need to! It isn't necessary!
What if we were surrounded by people who didn't constantly assume the worst of us and didn't assume we endorsed the wrongdoings of a fictional character? What if we didn't feel the need to self-censor to appease conservatives?
Blunting every post you share, everything you lovingly create, every silly thing you have to say with a moral disclaimer is an affirmation that there is a moral deficit and adds to the stigma about liking dark fiction. What if we were unapologetic because there's nothing to apologize for?
And you know what? The people you're trying to please do not fucking care lmao. It's not going to change their minds. They're going to think you're a scumbag anyway so why are we wasting time trying to gain their favor?
So don't pollute your posts with it, don't take attention away from your art and your fics, don't try to fill a quota for how often every month you apologize for your interests, because all it does is start a negative conversation around something that's really boring and takes attention away from the thing you're actually trying to say!!! You're allowed to be proud of your fanfic and artwork and meta and silly memes and fun lil ideas and you don't need to invite discourse every fucking time!!!!!
i know a lot of the tv fandom hasn't like, read the books and whatever, which is fine, but they realize they're endorsing an author who wrote several hardcore bdsm erotica books about teenagers right? lmao
First, you write a lengthy post claiming that Marius treats Armand like an animal, and then you wonder why Armand and Marius shippers are seen as outcasts in the fandom. You present humiliation, disrespect and devaluation as something sexual and normal in their relationship. There is a difference between not seeing Armand as an adult and independent person and not seeing him as a person at all. Like, you're literally doing ALL the work for the antis, LMAO.
If Marius sees Armand as a cat, then maybe he shouldn't be left alone with animals
just saying.
Like, 'Armand, Marius picked up a shepherd dog from the street today. You both share the same level of love, respect, and significance! š But donāt be upset; being someone's dog can be great! And remember, you actually like it! š„ŗ'
BEST GASLIGHTING EVER
Maybe heās okay with this situation because he doesnāt remember what real kindness feels like? Roleplay in bed for the sake of temporary humiliation is one thing, but to see someone youāre in a romantic relationship with as nothing more than an animal is just messed up. What are you even talking about? š
Yknow what.
Iāve been marinating on this all day and thinking about ways to respond kindly, because I think leveraging literacy at people in fandom arguments is really fucked up and that isnāt the person I want to be. I've even had my own journey in VC fandom because when I first joined Tumblr, the big meta writers were condescending as fuck and used to make me feel really stupid for liking Marius, and that's such a destructive and unwelcoming attitude. It took me a really long time to feel brave enough to even share meta, because of those folks, and now I have to worry about you chodes. And it's just a never ending Sisyphean task to cultivate a space where Marius fans feel safe. And that's for EVERY Marius fan, not just the ones you deign pure & good enough to exist. In fact, it even goes for all the book fans in general. I don't give a fuck if someone likes Marius--everyone is allowed to participate if they're not going out of their way to hurt people. You're an adult. Block people and curate your space, it's not my job to do that for you.
Everyone, at every reading level, is allowed to participate in fandom, and I think we canāt be true leftists if we donāt acknowledge the education problem in the US. (Assuming youāre American because Americans Feelings Yakuza tend to behave like this but if youāre not American, good job blending in, it's really embarrassing for you.) I donāt think I can ethically condemn the degradation of our education system and I donāt think I can condemn this sect of fandomās violent anti-intellectualism if I donāt also show sympathy for its victims. I'm really sorry that your parents/teachers/whoever failed you this badly and I hope things get better for you, because I don't wish this on anybody.
So when I turn into a cunt in thirty seconds, I want you to know itās not because I think youāre stupid. Itās because I think youāre a fucking asshole. <3 Ā And I donāt care what the fuck your problem is, itās YOUR problem, and we donāt have to tolerate this type of thought policing and fascism in a fandom space. You donāt get to talk to me like this just because you donāt like stuff that I write.
Having said that, I also am just, particularly fucking baffled by how incoherent and ideologically unsound this ask is, not to mention how blindingly, willfully ignorant it is. Like, I hate to say this, but itās SO stupid that I almost canāt believe someone would actually say this to me, and it makes me wonder if youāre like, an outside agitator pretending to be one of these Mariusblr morons to bait me. So I wondered if I shouldnāt validate it with a response, but then I thought,
Fandom deserves to see this lol
You actually did a good job of imitating this attitude that I DO see, for real, in this fandom, so like maybe itās a public service to bait me to get me to talk about it. So I guess I will.
Now, I did talk about this topic here and I said what I need to say. I already said everything I needed to say on the topic of doting upon the cute little mortal, and to send me this anon after reading that post, the reading comprehension is either ABYSMAL or youāre just pulling an OH SO YOU HATE WAFFLES on me which is like. Why. Lol.
And I canāt help someone whoās determined to misinterpret everything I will ever say, no matter what. But again, Iām kinda posting this as a fandom PSA because this is a great example of the braindead nonsense that goes on in Mariusblr and I think the people deserve to laugh at you lol, so if you want to misinterpret me some more, I canāt help you.
Weāre not gonna discuss Marius in this post. What weāre going to discuss is the idea that āāāTHE ANTISāāā are out to get us, and the irony of couching anti hysteria in this exact message.
So letās go back to basics and refresh on what the fuck a fandom anti is.
So when you talk about FANDOM ANTIS, I actually have to ask: Babe are you seeing yourself right now? Are these antis in the fucking room? Is the call coming from inside the house?
You donāt get to have a little bit of censorship, or a little bit of harassment.Ā If someone outside of our fandom saw this post, without the existing context of who Marius and Armand are, theyād think YOU were the anti for telling me how to interpret this ship, not to mention whatever the fuck is this weird kinkshaming. Censorship is bad, full stop. It's not, censorship is only bad when it's the thing I like. Same for leaving people twatty anons. Bullying people is still bad, and you don't get decide who deserves it.
You donāt get to cry about antis and then pop into peopleās inboxes to ridicule them because they didnāt read the book the same way you did. You donāt get to lecture me about kink and ship dynamics. YOU ARE NOT FIGHTING ON THE SIDE YOU THINK YOUāRE FIGHTING ON.
And isnāt it ironic that Iāve been Mariusing on tumblr for like, unfortunately, eight fucking years now lmao RIP, and Iāve been harassed about Marius MORE by you fuckin dweebs than I have by the actual antis.
Now, again.
I never want to tease anyone for their reading comprehension. Iām not making fun of you. Iām gonna spell this out because I want to help you, because I can see that reading isnāt your strong suit.
The fight about antis & proshippers & censorship is not a crusade about character apologism and defending ships as being moral, itās about distinguishing fiction from reality and allowing people to enjoy fucked up art.
You arenāt accomplishing what you think youāre accomplishing here. Like, first of all. I donāt give a single flying fuck about āāthe antisāā. Let them masturbate in abject shame in the privacy of their pitch black bedrooms. Itās not my business. What horrifies me here is that you yourself are the anti in this situation.
You are in my inbox scolding me for my amoral shipping.
You are in my inbox upset with me because I celebrated that a ship I like is fucked up.
A proshipper wouldāve read my post and gone āEh. I disagree but thatās okay.ā And kept scrolling. Maybe they even block me! Thatās fine too!
But how the fuck are you gonna sit there crying about antis when youāre the one harassing everybody lol.
And letās not jerk off here; the sincerity with which you are complaining about antis in my inbox is SO fucking lame. Like can we please go outside?
Iām no stranger to fandom drama (like I said, Iāve been Marius Tumbling for like 8 years and Iāve done my time in Sheith Hell) and I understand when these terms are useful shorthand for a fandom-specific problem. But I also think, what if we grow up and speak honestly about what antis are? It really blunts the harm of the entire ideology, especially when you're misusing it this egregiously, and I think there are times when we deserve to take censorship and fascism seriously, because it's not a coincidence that it's spreading inside fandom at the same speed it's spreading outside in the real world, and I want you to think really hard about which side you're on.
Like, what if we use the term āconservativeā or āFrolloā or āfandom policeā or āFANDOM MAGAā ?? You come to me upset that Iām somehow giving some boogeyman ammunition when like. THEY ALREADY HATE MARIUS, WHO THE FUCK CARES. When you change the topic from āFiction is allowed to be fucked upā to āItās okay to like Marius because he actually didnāt do anything wrongā youāre COMPLETELY missing the point, and in the same motion you are upset with ME for implying that Marius did something wrong.
And itās so fucking hypocritical? Like this is the same as when the fandom conservatives have ACAB in their bio while also harassing people--you are adopting language to fit into an identity when you don't actually understand what you're saying. I would've thought VC fans--especially Marius fans--would be more aware of cult behavior & groupthink and see the red flags more easily. (Again, having sympathy for you: Please escape this cult.)
How often do we see arguments break out in fandom where we go āIf youāre upset with Marius, why arenāt you upset with everyone else?ā Or like, I CAN ACCEPT THE MURDERING AND RAPE BUT DRAW THE LINE AT WHIPPING THE 17 YEAR OLD. Like. Where do YOU draw the line?
Is it okay to talk about Marius as a murderer? But weāre not allowed to say that he has some emotional problems? Also didn't one of you chucklefucks accuse me of being ablest lmao the irony.
Itās also fascinating that this camp in fandom is constantly crying about how like, antis DONāT UNDERSTAND ANNE RICE and how MARIUS/ARMAND IS CANON and yet ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦. Was anything I said not also canon? And where do you get the balls to use Anne Rice as a shield when she also said the same things that I said. She wrote the fucking book.
You know what.
I feel really strongly that like, in a fandom, people need to have better etiquette when they complain about THE THING vs THE FANS OF THE THING. For example, I have zero problem with someone coming out of TVA disgusted and triggered and writing analysis of Marius being a disgusting creep. We donāt have the right to tell someone not to feel that way.
What I DO have a problem with is when people say āMarius is a disgusting creep and his fans are gross for enjoying it.ā
And what YOURE saying, essentially, is that Iām gross for enjoying Marius in the way I read him.
Not to be like, a fucking, egomaniac, but. I have to say this lol. Do you know who I am?
Are you new here?
Have I not worked hard enough to establish that heās my favorite literary character of all time and I adore him to death?
But I have different headcanons than you so Iām a bad person?
Anyway.
This has gone on long enough, I think Iāve made my point.
I genuinely canāt tell if someone like ChatGPTād this anon to me just to rile me up and get me mad at that side of Mariusblr, but the truth is that like. Iāve seen them say these things. Iāve been blocked by these folks. Every time I write meta where I acknowledge that Marius isnāt perfect, they vague me to fuck. So honestly like. Itās not out of the range of possibility and Iām going to take this opportunity to talk about it because some of us are fucking normal about a book and we just want to have fun and post meta and write fics and like. If you donāt like my meta and fics you can simply move along.
And you know what else!!
WE ALL SEE THIS. You make fandom uncomfortable for everybody. Every time I do acknowledge this, I get people in my inbox talking about how uncomfortable youāve made them and how they became hurt and decided not to share in fandom anymore. Thatās you doing that. It isnāt ~ the antis ~. Itās you, because you donāt let anybody enjoy the books the way they want to enjoy the books. And I think itās really interesting that Iāve noticed that half of fandom sort of cannibalizing itself lately. And I donāt think itās a coincidence that Ā this whole group of clowns blocked me around the same time, when their jackass ringleader originally got mad at me for flagrantly misunderstanding something I said. This is that same abysmal reading comprehension and violent anti-intellectualism coming back to bite you in the ass. And so like, I have to also ask, if you have some issue with me, maybe consider the source, and if this person is perhaps a complete douchebag who will cannibalize their own friends the second they step out of line. And I wonder if there are any receipts for my alleged atrocious behavior, or if I was always just minding my own business and writing fanfic and sharing meta and being nice to people, and encouraging people to ship whatever they want, and allowing people to read the book differently than I did.
You donāt get to tell people what type of content theyāre allowed to create. If youāre very concerned about how people read Marius, maybe write your own meta. This is MY space, not yours, and youāre not going to kinkshame and censor me, and youāre not going to bully me.
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something about................ some of the most vocal anti-Marius folks on twitter being outed as child predators...
something about............... how the anti-marius folks said they hope marius fans experience what armand did (and to their understanding, theyre saying they hope we [actual humans] get raped).
it's never sincere. It's Never Sincere. Hit dogs holler, etc. There is no world in which you can defend a fictional character while wishing actual real life harm on actual real life people. You do not win, you are not a good person!
Like we all know that the tv fandom contains the most rancid drama weāve ever seen and hysterical conservatives trying to appropriate a canon that was written by and for complete freaks but itās so much more bizarre when youāre a book fan who was here the whole time like I canāt believe this is happening in my house š
