#dancelogue

Our Interview with the star of salsa stage Shani Talmor was spontaneous but proved that famous dancers can be very communicative and open to their students. She has a great story of how to achieve a goal and make dance career being the partner of legendary Eddie Torres. At the age of 16 she broke up with her boyfriend and found something more interesting.

«When we broke up I went to the beach and they were dancing salsa there. That was something. And a friend of mine said that they taught salsa there and I should go. So I kept going with my friends about 4 times a week and fell in love with that. And then one of the instructors came up to me and said they had an instructor course and that I should do it. In Israel you cannot just start to be a teacher out of the blue, you have to go to instructor course, it was a 3-months course, and then if you are good and you pass all the tests they would accept you to work. So I did the course and I did it even before I completed all the levels. I think it's like 18 levels in Israel. It's a great system but I didn't complete it. I stopped at social dancing and that's why I'm using social dancing. I took classes and I was social dancing myself. And I learned how to partner work and how to react to guys from social dancing. Nobody told me what to do – I figured that out by myself. So until today it is always social dance, this is my passion. I like the fact that I needed to pay attention to the guys. I call it copy-paste – when in class they tell you what to do – you don't really understand the dance. A lot of my knowledge of what to teach and how to teach came when I was figuring it out by myself.

So then I became the instructor in Israel, I started doing all the lady style, body movements and all different levels and then I started to go to congresses and different events in Europe. Literally I took every class in the schedule, we were there to work and learn. I am in the old generation of dancers. When I started it was all about the dancing: I took classes with Johnny Vazquez, Super Mario, Juan Matos and many many others. And then I met Johnny and he asked me to dance with him. I moved to Spain to become his partner. And again I had to work really hard because I wasn’t there in the level. So I kept pushing it hard and that was worth it».

Now her style is very jazzy with a hint of hip hop but when Johnny met Shani her style was 50% Cuban and 50% LA style. She danced nothing on 2, she only knew about NY salsa but didn’t understand that. Learning other styles helped her a lot to invent her own style, she never copied anyone. As for nowadays Shani Talmor is one of the best salsa teachers who travels around the world. You can see her giving workshops in many countries and every class is done according to a strict timetable.

WLD: Today we can find many salsa lessons online. Do you think that this is a good way to study?

Shani: I think it’s not the same when you watch a combination on youtube because you don’t get the details and the technique and the flow of the teacher’s routine. It is important to feel the teacher’s vibe as a lot of them are very inspiring, they give you the energy of the class. They help you to be present in the moment. And if you are watching the youtube it doesn’t transfer. It’s like listening to the music in the headphones and in a full surround system or watching a movie on TV in HD and a simple screen. It all makes the difference. Today you can find many videos on youtube and it’s ok if you are in a different country and you watch your favorite dancers on youtube. But if these dancers come to your country and your city and you are not taking classes I would not agree with that. I always encourage my dancers and people I meet to take classes. I take classes in other styles like in jazz, hip hop, contemporary, Cuban style. I don’t just watch it on youtube, I need to be there with the teacher. I can’t wait for them to come to where I live and take a class.

WLD: Salsa is the style where the lady is usually shown off. What can you advise for girls to become more sexy and plastic or is it the partner who needs to do something special to show her beauty during the dance?

Shani: I think you have to do with training and feeling the music. And you need to feel comfortable. Try to surround yourself with its lifestyle: if you wanna do something authentic you need to live that lifestyle. And maybe that is the problem that people don't take class. You need to take class but maybe you need to go and social dance more so that you could be more involved and think less? I have a saying for that: know the rules – break the rules. So if you know the rules and you know the techniques of a dance, you practice it so much that when you go to the dancefloor for social dance you do that but you let it go as it is. You feel free. However I don't know why you ask that because I saw that girls are very good in Russia. The level here is very good for ladies. Cannot say that about the boys but it's just the matter of practice. Listen to the music, feel the music, let it go, feel more free, do not be afraid to explore different movement and forget how you look at the moment. It would all become softer and smother with the time. I remember when I was starting to dance in London, I was perfomring with my friends from Israel and I didn't even know what I was doing.  And my friends were laughing like «What was that? That was very funny» But to me that was ok, so I said to myself «Ok, whatever». But then I explored different styles and that made me create the things I put into my own style. So in spite of their laughs I was exploring my own style.

WLD: What should russian salsa dancers improve in their style – what do you think?

Shani: I don't know how it goes here in the salsa scene but I can tell mostly what it is like in the world. I don't think there are exceptions here. There are two things that usually happen. When you get to the level where you are good, people grow and get compliments, they just stop working. They get to the point when they say: «Ok, now I'm good, I can teach and perform, so I don't need to keep working on my class». That's a critical moment in a dancer's mentality. And if a person thinks «Oh, I am becoming popular, people start liking me, they come to my class, they love my show, I need to work harder». In this case he keeps practicing and creating new moves. But the bad thing is that a lot of dancers don't do that. They come up to a party but they don't social dance that much. They do the shows but don't create new stuff and show the same things.  That is the crucial part in people's career. I always say to my friend who become the independent dancers now – I always tell them: «You have to keep working, keep practicing, keep creating and getting inspired, make yourself grow all the time». If you thing that you are cool and you are done, you are wrong. No matter which style you dance you should never stop. Unfortunately in the salsa world people often stop. They think they are amazing. But in all the other dance world ( I come across hip hop and jazz a lot) – dancers there never stop, they always train. I know the dancers who work with the biggest stars like Beyonce and Jennifer Lopez – they always train. They are always in a class and they are always very humble. The bigger they are the more they are humble.  

WLD: Social dance is always a stress. You need to be communicative and not be afraid to dance with different partners. But how can one learn all this?

Shani: We are calling this a beginner's stage. It is very tricky because people are scared. They are new, they come to a club and only know three moves. The don't wanna ask anybody to dance with them. I know it, I was there. First of all it is the teacher who needs to mark it for his students – how important it is not to be scared. He needs to push the dancers. What I do when I have the beginners. I organize a day when my beginners and I go to a party. I ask them to dance, I pull them out to the dancefloor and I ask my friends to dance with them. And little by little they understand it is not that bad. Another way is to take them social. For example in New York there are many socials where I know the level is not that scary. A lot of beginners come there to practice. And I encourage them to go there. It is not easy but it is really up to the instructor to push the dancers. If a teacher himself relates to the students, it is easier for them to go through that. You need to tell them that it's ok even to know three moves and dance with them these three. Tell them not to compare themselves with a one-year-dancer if you dance only for two months. Help them to change their mentality. Give compliments when you see improvement. That stage is always hard but it's inevitable.

WLD: How important is it to change dance partners?

Shani: You cannot get used to dance with one person.  Because in this case you already know what that person is: you know his style, what he would do, you know his level and tempo and partner work. You are getting comfortable and not necessarily need to adjust to other people. That's not ok because then you would get stuck. You have to be able to dance with everybody and you have to know how to adjust yourself. Because some people are harder, some are stronger, some go softer, all of them are different. Salsa is a social dance. Originally it was brought by people from all over the world from different cultures. They were dancing in one place and there was no criticism or racism. Nowadays the world problem is getting into the salsa world. That is not ok. Back in the days they had Cuban dancing with Puerto Ricans, Jewish people dancing with Italians. During the Palladium Era most of them were Italians and Jewish and that was in New York. People forget that salsa is a social dance where you come to meet people. So you cannot get stuck on one person. That's not the point of salsa.

WLD: There are many dancers but there are always a few that are treated as favorite. How to become the one whom students would love to study from?

Shani: To be a leader you have to have the quality of a leader. Not everybody can be a leader. Not every dancer can say: «Follow me because I'm great!» I know a lot of dancers that are great but they don't have a lot of following because they don't have the quality of a leader. As a leader you have to be very humble and relate to different kind of people. And at the same time you need to understand that you work very hard to be where you are. You have to show strength to engourage somebody else. Our goal is to be inspiring and to be human. We are all human.  It is very important to create relationship because you can be a great dancer and an amazing instructor but as a person you don't get the connection with your students. There would always be a wall. Know your price. When my students attend other classes I don't panic. I would not tell them not to take somebody else's class, I am not insecure. I know they would come back to me. For me opening my mentality is showing the security. A lot of people try to make leadership by a whip. That's no good because in the end people would leave. So my best advice is to be human, to be humble, work hard and lead by example. This is the best thing. If I work hard, my students see me travelling in different places – and they wanna do the same.

Eric Gauthier is the choreographer from Germany. His talent is not to be doubted: there are not so many people who passed the way from a dancer to his own theater as fast as he did. He is very open-minded and his dancers seem to fly over the stage as well. We spoke to Eric during the Context festival in Moscow.

WLD: Eric, does a teacher need to enrich his students with his own experience or is it necessary to see the individual and try to develop it in your students? How important is individuality for a dancer?

E.G.: This is like a special thing still, if it is a workshop you have people of all different levels. So you don’t need to make those who are not so strong feel upset, you make everybody feel good. I always try to support my students with words «Good job», «Nice try», «Try it again». And for the other one I have to say nothing but I will still say «Good» or  «Nice». You need to make them believe that they are doing good because a dancer is a very special artist for me, you need to give him a lot of pampering, a lot of confidence. 

A dancer is very sensitive and just with the wrong word or even a clap it can all go wrong, it is a very special kind of artist. And also it depends on a country. In Germany for example you can be rougher and here I don’t know yet how to treat them so it also depends on the culture of the country where you give lessons.

WLD: And if you are at a workshop but you have a lesson with your company and you already know the dancers, how to empower them with confidence? How to make them feel confident and open his or her individuality?

E.G.: It is a bit the same: being very positive and make them feel they are on a good way. You are doing well but you are not there yet but you are on the way and the person feels «Wow, I am doing better».

WLD: Do you think that a dancer needs to follow the example of great dancers and copy them? Or it shouldn't be done because it ruins your own style?

E.G.: All the dancers need to watch other dancers, this is so important. You always need to look at them to realize that you can do better.  And if you find the right artist like I dance with Diana here. So I told my dancers: if you have time, if you are in the wings – just watch her because you will take something.

WLD: What about the mistakes? What is the right way to show them to your students?

E.G.: If you just say No, It is not like that – a dancer won't understand you. If you want a dog to do a trick you cannot yell at him. He will only do the trick of you explain it to him. A dancer is also an animal, he has to understand. You have to explain everything and tell the dancer what is missing to do it correct.

WLD: Your career from dancer to choreographer was quite quick. And also you have your own dance troupe. Should a dancer be doing everything quite fast or everything comes as it is and to realize it you need to make your own mistakes?

E.G.: I think it depends on an artist. Some dancers discover they want to be choreographer very early so it is good that they start early and have more years. But for the normal person who wants to be a dancer I think this is a good idea at least to try to make a number. You understand things a little bit different. Everybody should try it.

WLD: What will be you major advice to young dance teachers? What is the main thing during the class?

E.G. There are so many, I don’t know. I always say: «It looks so easy what we do but it is so hard». I always say to my dancers: «Nobody said this would be easy, no one ever said dancing is easy». So when my dancers are tired I always say: «Don’t show me that you are tired» and they get it. Don’t give up. Always finish and never give up. And they understand it.

Chris Martin is a famous dancer, choreographer and member of dance team «Cookies». We met him before the start of Show Me What You Got festival and asked him about Russian dancers.

 WLD: Music tells a lot about a person. Can you tell us which track is in your player now?

C.M.: Music played a big part in my life ever since I’ve been a kid. I grew up dancing with my parents and my sister. We liked soul, funk and jazz exactly. We usually had dinner and put the music on. It was just my Mum, Dad, my sister and myself dancing in the kitchen. It brought me a lot of happiness. So what I play now is a lot of classic music that I listened to when I was younger – old music. I also like new music that still have instruments: like guitar, drums, horns, sax, – all of that. Any musical artist that has a life band with him (like Allen Stone) is someone who I would applaud.

WLD: You are one of the judges in Show Me What You Got show. What do you look at when you judge?

C.M.:Many times when I judge competitions it almost seems like everybody is trying to be someone that they are not. I want to see people like genuine and happy for what they do. And on top of course there’s technique, choreography, timing, formations, all of that. But what is most important to me of something not original but true: like you’re not faking to be someone else.  

WLD: It is not your first visit to Russia. Is there anything you appreciate in Russian dancers?

C.M.: What is really cool – you have little kids and professional dancers in the same pursuit where they both have the same respect. They respect each other and this seems really amazing because you don’t see this in many places. It’s cool because for everybody it’s about learning. This is what a lot of other countries could take from Russia.

WLD: You started with breaking. Why have you given up your b-boy career?

C.M.: B-boying was really fun. But it came to the point when it’s too competitive. For the team that I was with it was like winning battles. But when I started trying to win all the time I wasn’t having fun.

WLD: Is it still competitive when you dance hip hop?

C.M.: It’s just fun. We do it when we enter competitions but it’s just fun.

WLD: Your team is the winner of Body Rock this year. Was it difficult?

C.M.: It’s difficult as the best teams from all around the world go there. But I think we don’t do it for the competition. In our mind it’s never like “It’s gonna be hard to win!” It’s like “We gonna do what we do!”

WLD: What would your profession be if you were not a choreographer?

C.M.: I would have been cooking food out in the street. I love cooking so much. Or maybe with my sister and my parents we would have opened a restaurant like food-truck: it’s like a store on wheels with which you can go everywhere!

WLD: You are travelling a lot. Do you bring souvenirs or maybe you collect women’s hearts?

C.M.: Nooo! I collect tiny rocks from every country. I have a bonsai tree at home and I put the rocks into the pot.

WLD: Do you know how many valid visas there are in you passport?

C.M.: You don’t need a visa for everywhere you go! I have about two pages left in my passport.

WLD: Can you give any advice for all the dancers?

C.M.: I’d say you have to want to get better. Not just go to the class and do the movements but really push yourself as hard as you can.