HELLO, this is sideblog where I say things. Main blog I don't really use is @distantsobbingnoises, reblog blog that I Really use is @noisesdistantsobbing
Asks preferably go to this blog! (Though no one will perish if they go elsewhere, I'll just reblog them over unless I don't)
Old pinned post here, please do have a nice day :)
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I just know Simon Iron Lung could thrive in the environment presented by 1995 video game Descent. He'd drive that spaceship with 6 degrees of freedom so well.
It's actually a bit fascinating how people more or less appear to be in agreement that Hummer is the Leviathan. When I was watching, my main thoughts about Hummer were
This guy is trying to sacrifice Wifies to the Leviathan
The Leviathan might be his (missing? deceased?) friend
He is afraid of the Leviathan as much as he wants to find it
I did NOT trust that guy. This is incredibly funny in retrospect, BUT HE KEPT DOING SUSPICIOUS THINGS. "You go first," he said to Wifies, multiple times. "You go search the deep ocean, I'll search the coast," he said to Wifies, suspiciously.
(My current theory is "Hummer is the Leviathan or is connected to the Leviathan but doesn't consciously know it". He seems to be operating mostly on vibes rather than knowledge—see him not knowing about the -20,000 -20,000 ocean either—and calls his being invested in the Leviathan a "personality quirk".)
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The thing about the "Hummer doesn't exist" theory going around that I don't quite agree with is that. he quite literally does exist? We see him in the recording. He's in the video. He's right there, guys.
What does this MEANNNNN. Bio radius 10...Of the astrophage? Of the astrophage with a diameter of 10 μm? Surely I'm missing something...What is a bio radius...
I think it would make sense to say that Simon would use the metric system over imperial. Honestly, I'd even go as far as to say it's not unreasonable for him to be completely unfamiliar with imperial units.
He grew up on Mars and Eden 300 years post martian colonization. The initial people that moved to Mars surely used metric for most of their measurements (equipment, experiments, etc), so martian society evolving to exclusively use the metric system makes sense.
He becomes a COI prisoner, but there's reasons the COI could use almost exclusively metric too. They're 300 years in the future, and stuff changes in 300 years: the metric system was only invented 200 years ago, and now it's the default for most countries. Plus, these are the Earth people that were sent to space (a mostly metric environment), so there's bias for the metric system in that.
All this to say. I think "feet" as a unit of length is really funny, and there are so many opportunities for misunderstandings.
Grace: You look like you're...5 foot 10?
Simon: You think I have how many feet??
Rocky, just as confused: Simon has 2 feet. I have 5 feet.
Aaaand then Grace gets to explain that usually he thinks in one system of measurement and but sometimes another. And it's different for different properties he's measuring and different things he's measuring. And that many people on the 21st century Earth do this, often in different ways depending on where they live. He knows that Liberia uses miles for distance, he can talk about it.
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It's super easy to approximate conversions between EIC and IMC now that I think about it. An Earth year is about 0.53 Martian years and a Martian year is about 1.88 Earth years.
Just multiplying/dividing by 2 can get you in the ballpark, but you can also add a correction step to get even closer.
IMC ≈ EIC/2, plus a year for every 30 EIC (or 31)
EIC ≈ 2 IMC, minus a year for every 8 IMC (or 10, or 8.3)
The EIC -> IMC approximation is accurate to the whole number until about 1000 or until about 4000 with 31. The IMC -> EIC approximation is less accurate, but it's not terrible. The 8 approximation works to the whole number until about 250 (or to an error of 2 until 500), the 10 approximation works to the whole number until about 40, and the 8.3 approximation works to the whole number until about 2700.
8 excerpts done, only 20+ to go. This is actually a much more optimistic number than I thought, oh snap. AND my tech (my work skin) works on ao3, I just need to do some debugging to make the keyboard look-and-feel better on mobile. Winning :)
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“My son, those stars are already dead. Mere ghost light.”
Okay. So. Long post so most of this will be under a cut (I’m not completely cruel), but I wanna talk about this, because it’s something that I frequently see people get wrong about the Iron Lung universe, and like I’ve said before, space is the one thing that will forever put me in “UHM ACKSHULLY ☝️🤓” mode, so that’s what I’m about to do. And you all have to listen or I’m going to be very upset.
THE STARS ARE NOT “GONE” FROM THE NIGHT SKY IN IRON LUNG.
Yes, I hear what you’re all gonna say - “but Sammy, that’s LITERALLY the main plot point! The opening line in the movie is ‘the stars are gone’, what are you talking about?” Please allow me to explain, because for this to actually make sense, y’all need to understand just how unfathomably big space is.
The closest star to Earth is, obviously, the sun. The sun is approximately 8 light-minutes from Earth, meaning that it takes the sun’s light just over 8 minutes to reach us. When you look at the sun (which you shouldn’t do btw), you’re seeing it as it was 8 minutes ago, not what it looks like currently. So, if the sun were to suddenly just vanish Quiet Rapture style, we wouldn’t know it was gone for over 8 whole minutes. For 8 minutes we’d have no idea anything had even happened. Life would continue on as normal.
Now let’s look at the second closest star to Earth. That honour goes to the red dwarf star Proxima Centauri, which lies about 4 light years away from the sun. So, it takes light from Proxima Centauri over 4 years to reach us, and vice versa. If Proxima Centauri got Quiet Rapture’d right now, we wouldn’t know it was gone for 4 years.
Are you starting to get it now?
“We can all still see them!”
~10 year old Simon was very much right to say this! Space rambling aside, it’s a very astute observation that points to the intelligence and curiosity of his character, even at such a young age (as clearly no one else is questioning why the stars are still visible while The Father is preaching about them being gone).
So let’s look at the Quiet Rapture from the perspective of ~10 year old Simon, watching it happen in real time.
Let’s say Eden’s space station is just outside of Mars’ orbit (which is fairly accurate to the movie based on the flashback scene). And then BOOM, Mars is gone.
Several minutes pass. What’s that? Earth is gone too?
A few more minutes and it’s Venus, a few more and it’s Mercury. In 13 minutes, the sun is gone too. In a little under 5 hours, Pluto is gone, and you’re starting to think this is a pretty widespread thing. The whole solar system is vanishing before your eyes.
But then it seems to stop there, and you’re thinking, well that’s it then, the whole solar system disappeared and we’re all that’s left here on these space stations, but I guess the rest of the universe is fine, right?
But The Father is saying the stars and planets in the entire galaxy - possibly even the universe - are gone, and it doesn’t make sense. The stars are literally right there??? Nobody else seems to question it. You get weird looks when you try to argue about this because nobody talks back to The Father, and he just laughs coldly and gives you this vague explanation with “ghost light”.
(And the worst part is that he isn’t even wrong).
Four years pass and there’s a new surge of panic. Proxima Centauri* and it’s two companion stars, Alpha Centauri A and B, have just vanished from the sky.
*Bear in mind Proxima Centauri isn’t actually visible to the naked eye (more on that later in the post), so whoever discovered it was gone was most likely using a telescope, if any of those survived the Quiet Rapture. Alpha Centauri A and B are visible in the night sky, so you would be able to see them blink out in real time in the Iron Lung universe.
It only cements The Father’s authority over Eden because somehow he knew they would. He knew they were already gone to begin with.
It’s slowly starting to get to you too, because as the years go by, more and more stars wink out of existence, silently taking their planets with them…
But while I was thinking about all this (read: stewing about all this because I’m not gonna lie, it’s a pet peeve of mine in this fandom. No hate to any of y’all, I’m just a huge nerd and probably undiagnosed with the ‘tism so I get a little uppity about these things, hence this entire fucking post), I started to wonder what the actual timeline of the stars disappearing would look like, so I did a little research, and it’s gonna blow everyone’s minds;
Here I’ve compiled a list of all the stars within less than 20 light years of Earth and the solar system, complete with some color coding based on stellar type. (The metric of 20 light years specifically will make sense by the end of the list.)
❤️ - M class (red dwarf)
🧡 - K class
💛 - G class (stars similar to the sun)
🤍 - F class
🩵 - A class
🩶 - white dwarf (stellar reminant)
[NOTE: I’m not worrying about B and O class stars because there are none within 20 light years of Earth.]
Additionally, stars highlighted in BLUE are visible to the naked/unaided eye
AQR = After Quiet Rapture
- 1 year AQR
- The sun 💛
- All planets in the solar system
- 5 years AQR
- Proxima Centauri ❤️
- Alpha Centauri A 💛
- Alpha Centauri B 🧡
- Barnard’s star ❤️
- 10 years AQR
- Wolf 359 ❤️
- Lalande 21185 ❤️
- Sirius A 🩵
- Sirius B 🩶
- Gliese 65 ❤️
- Ross 154 ❤️
- 15 years AQR
- Ross 248 ❤️
- Epsilon Eridani 🧡
- Lacaille 9352 ❤️
- Ross 128 ❤️
- EZ Aquarii A ❤️
- EZ Aquarii B ❤️
- EZ Aquarii C ❤️
- 61 Cygni A 🧡
- 61 Cygni B 🧡
- Procyon A 🤍
- Procyon B 🩶
- Struve 2398 A ❤️
- Struve 2398 B ❤️
- Groombridge 34 A ❤️
- Groombridge 34 B ❤️
- DX Cancri ❤️
- Epsilon Indi A 🧡
- Tau Ceti 💛
- GJ 1061 ❤️
- YZ Ceti ❤️
- Luyten’s Star ❤️
- Teegarden’s Star ❤️
- Kapteyn’s Star ❤️
- Lacaille 8760 ❤️
- SCR 1845-6357 A ❤️
- Kruger 60 A ❤️
- Kruger 60 B ❤️
- DENIS J1048-3956 ❤️
- Ross 614 A ❤️
- Ross 614 B ❤️
- Wolf 1061 ❤️
- Van Maanen’s Star 🩶
- Gliese 1 ❤️
- TZ Arietis ❤️
- Wolf 424 A ❤️
- Wolf 424 B ❤️
- Gliese 687 ❤️
- Gliese 674 ❤️
- LHS 292 ❤️
- 20 years AQR (when the events of Iron Lung take place)
- Gliese 440 🩶
- GJ 1245 A ❤️
- GJ 1245 B ❤️
- GJ 1245 C ❤️
- Gliese 876 ❤️
- LHS 288 ❤️
- GJ 1002 ❤️
- Groombridge 1618 🧡
- Gliese 412 A ❤️
- Gliese 412 B ❤️
- AD Leonis ❤️
- Gliese 832 ❤️
- Gliese 682 ❤️
- Omicron Eridani A 🧡
- Omicron Eridani B 🩶
- Omicron Eridani C ❤️
- EV Lacertae ❤️
- 70 Ophiuchi A 🧡
- 70 Ophiuchi B 🧡
- Altair 🩵
- EI Cancri A ❤️
- EI Cancri B ❤️
- GJ 3379 ❤️
- Gliese 445 ❤️
- 2MASS J15404342-5101357 ❤️
- GJ 3323 ❤️
- Gliese 526 ❤️
- Stein 2051 A ❤️
- Stein 2051 B 🩶
- Gliese 251 ❤️
- LP 816-60 ❤️
- Gliese 205 ❤️
- Gliese 229 A ❤️
- Alsafi 🧡
- Ross 47 ❤️
- Gliese 570 A 🧡
- Gliese 570 B ❤️
- Gliese 570 C ❤️
- Gliese 693 ❤️
- Gliese 754 ❤️
- Gliese 908 ❤️
- Gliese 752 A ❤️
- Gliese 752 B ❤️
- Gliese 588 ❤️
- Eta Cassiopeiae A 💛
- Eta Cassiopeiae B 🧡
- 36 Ophiuchi A 🧡
- 36 Ophiuchi B 🧡
- 36 Ophiuchi C 🧡
- YZ Canis Minoris ❤️
- GJ 1005 A ❤️
- GJ 1005 B ❤️
- HR 7703 A 🧡
- HR 7703 B ❤️
- 82 G. Eridani 💛
- Gliese 268 A ❤️
- Gliese 268 B ❤️
- Delta Pavonis 💛
By the events of Iron Lung, only 107 stars (excluding the sun) will be undetectable by any telescope.
Of those 107, only 22 stars (excluding the sun) will have visibly disappeared to the unaided eye.
So that means that by the time Simon is being sent down in the SM-13, the solar system and 22 additional star systems are visibly missing. There are many more that would no longer be visible with a telescope, and thousands more will follow in the next few years, decades, centuries.
Unless, of course, the Quiet Rapture is somehow reversed, but that’s a post for another day.
All of my incessant ranting aside, I’m really glad that Mark and David made ghost light canon in both the movie and the game, because not only is it scientifically accurate, but it’s also something that makes the Quiet Rapture that much more terrifying. It’s not something that happens quickly in the blink of an eye, it’s slow and it’s long and it’s agonizing because you already know what’s happening, and you already know it’s too late, so all you can do is watch the sky as one by one, over years and years and years, the stars disappear, the sky gets darker, and the universe seems to get smaller…
{@ctrl-shift-alt-9 I’m tagging you bc this is in-depth worldbuilding stuff and I feel like you’d be interested in it :3}
What gets me is that the sky will look relatively unchanged, at least in regards to the stars.
(The planets and some moons are some of the brightest things in the sky, but they are being disregarded in this post because their light will disappear within the first few hours of the Quiet Rapture anyway. If you want to see where they rank, look at this post. There's also two galaxies which land around #15 and #50 in the list of brightest natural objects in the sky, but they are also being disregarded in this post, for no good reason this time.)
From Earth, there are about 9096 distinct stars that can be seen with the naked eye (this is adding up both hemispheres, so closer to about 4500 at any single place and time). This is assuming the best possible viewing conditions you can get on Earth, but it's even a lowball estimate for what they'd be seeing from space—in space, you don't have to worry about an atmosphere scattering starlight, so you see more stars and they're a little bit brighter. (Also, apparently they don't twinkle the way they do on Earth, but that's diverging from the point.)
To create a very generous estimate of just how few stars are visibly gone from the sky even 20 years after the Quiet Rapture, 22 visible stars / 9096 visible stars = 0.00241864556, so just 0.24% of them are visibly missing. That's already a very small number, but how many of these 22 visible stars are even bright enough to be easily discernible?
Just 6. And to the naked eye, 2 of them look like one star, so it's really just 5 if we're going about it visually.
The Sun - the brightest star in the sky, 8 light minutes away
Sirius (Sirius A) - the brightest star in the night sky, 8.6 light years away
Alpha Centauri (Alpha Centauri A and Alpha Centauri B) - 3rd brightest star (system) in the night sky, 4.34 light years away
Procyon (Procyon A) - 8th brightest star in the night sky, 11 light years away
Altair - 12th brightest star in the night sky, 17 light years away
The other 16 stars visible to the naked eye within 20 light years don't even make the list of the 94 brightest star systems in Earth's sky. Unless you really know what you're looking for, you probably wouldn't be able to tell at a glance that they're even gone.
It will actually take a really long time for every one of the 94 brightest star systems to disappear. About 60% of them are over 100 light-years away, and the the farthest and 20th brightest—Deneb—is about 2600 light years away. Here's a graph showing this off; note that after 30 light years, I use variable increments.
And here's a timeline view of how far the 32 brightest star systems are:
So what does this mean?
For the most part, you wouldn't even be able to visually see that the Quiet Rapture happened: the sky would look more or less the same as it did before, even 20 years in. However, it would be possible to see that 5 of the current 13 brightest star systems are missing with the naked eye.
Here's also a couple interesting events in the timeline that I've noticed by compiling this data:
For the first 11 years after the Quiet Rapture, one of the brightest star systems in the sky will disappear every 3-4 years: the sun, Alpha Centauri, Sirius, and Procyon. Each of these are in the top 9 brightest stars currently and in the top 6 brightest stars at the time of their disappearance
Then, there's a 6 year break in this pattern until it's broken by Altair disappearing in the 17th year after the Quiet Rapture. Altair is currently the 13th brightest and will be the 9th brightest when it disappears.
8.6 years after the Quiet Rapture, Sirius, the second brightest star in our sky after the sun, will disappear. It's between the 5th and 7th brightest natural object in our sky today, but it will be the brightest natural object in the sky after the solar system's light disappears (not considering the IL-universe-only moons, but they probably aren't brighter anyway).
After Sirius, the brightest star in the sky will become Canopus, which is half as bright as Sirius was and currently the 3rd brightest star in the sky. It's also a whole 310 light years away, so it's not going away anytime soon. I imagine this would be a significant moment, an end of an era.
Only 5 stars from this list will have ever been bestowed with the title of brightest star in the sky: the sun, Sirius, Canopus, Rigel, and Deneb. Not counting the sun, Rigel is our current #7 brightest and Deneb is our current #19 brightest. Rigel is about 860 light years away; Deneb is about 2600.
On the 25th year after the Quiet Rapture, 4 years after the events of Iron Lung, 2 of of the brightest stars in the sky—Vega and Fomalhaut—will disappear around the same time, within 3 months of each other. Today, they are the 5th and 18th brightest stars in the night sky, but just before they disappear, they'd be the 3rd and 14th brightest natural bodies. (3.14! Pi! Total coincidence.)
After Vega and Fomalhaut disappear, it will be another 9 years until the next star, Pollux, disappears from the sky in the 34th year after the Quiet Rapture, the longest gap between disappearances of stars making up the 94 brightest star systems until that point.
And that's what I've observed :)
If anyone else would like to see this data, here is my spreadsheet! Feel very free to clone it, modify your clone, distribute that clone, anything. I'd love to hear any insight anyone obtains from this data.
If you notice anything blatantly incorrect (especially if it's not the data itself but my spreadsheet doing bad things with it), please do inform!! I am in no way an expert, this is all Wikipedia knowledge.
Here is a little approximate comparison of how the notable celestial bodies within our solar system (mostly planets) look from Earth and Mars :)
From Earth, the following bodies are the ___ brightest in the sky:
Sun - 1st
Moon - 2nd
Venus - 3rd (looks like the brightest star in the sky)
Jupiter - 4th
Mars - 5th max, 19th average
Mercury - 6th max, 13th average
Saturn - 9th max, 16th average
Uranus - 352nd max, 351st average
Neptune - not visible with the naked eye
From Mars, the following bodies are the ___ brightest in the sky:
Sun - 1st
Phobos - 2nd
Deimos - 3rd (looks like a bright star, brighter than Venus from Earth)
Venus - 4th max, potentially 5th average (dimmer than for Earth)
Jupiter - 5th max, potentially 4th average (bit brighter than for Earth)
Earth - 6th (about half as bright as Venus from Mars)
Earth's moon - 7th-ish (about as bright as Sirius, the brightest star after the sun)
Mercury - 8th-ish max, unknown average (bit brighter than Saturn)
Saturn - 10th-ish max, 17th-ish average (bit brighter than for Earth)
Uranus - 353rd-ish max, 352nd-ish average
Neptune - not visible with the naked eye
Earth's numbers were taken entirely from the table on this Wikipedia article.
Mars' numbers are a bit funky because it's a list I compiled myself, so there are more than likely inaccuracies because I have zero expertise in this topic. Good enough for a tumblr post with no stakes in it. Most of my claims are made with the information on pages 124 and 146 from Astronomy for Entertainment by Yakov Perelman, which I found from this website using it for their claims. This reddit thread was also a reference.
More info about how I got Mars' numbers below the cut.
Perelman gives some numbers for the apparent magnitudes of various planets from various planets, including both Earth and Mars. I compared these numbers (plus some verbal comparisons he makes, like Earth's moon from Mars to Sirius from Earth) against the previously linked Wikipedia article and ended up with an approximation of how the planets shifted placements.
This is in no way exact; do not trust me. I don't know how Perelman got his numbers (he might have explained it, but I didn't read the entire book), and his Earth numbers don't match up entirely with the numbers on Wikipedia, even if they're not too terribly off. I'm relying on how I didn't found any insanely different numbers in other places.
If you want to figure it out yourself, there's math you can do to turn a celestial body's absolute magnitude (how bright it objectively is) into apparent magnitude (how bright it looks from somewhere), but this is more complex for planets than stars because they're illuminated by the sun on one side rather than emitting light themselves, the distances between planets vary, and likely several other reasons.
Here are the relevant portions of Astronomy for Entertainment: