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@thecelestialsyzygy
That's my son I gave birth to him š

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giving us that film reel was giving chocolate to a dog before it was put down
Argyle saving their ass in season 4 by having the solution to where El can use a bath with salt only to be completely discarded in season 5 as if he never existed... Awesome way to ragebait me personally
Argyle was THAT guy and the duffs randomly disposing of him was bogus. Instead of introducing 50 new characters in S5 they should have just kept some characters they already introduced over the seasons but nah. They either killed these characters off or acted like they never existed which is why it's crazy to me they had such a big cast for S5 to the point that that they said they should have "killed off" some of them. But that may be because I'm blocking things out. āļø
GUYS????

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OMG š idk who all saw my last post- I deleted it fast, but I'm kind of catching up on some fandom discourse since I don't come here super often like I used to.
I usually try and avoid any discussions on the "gay bar Will" topic personally because, for one, I'm not a gay man. Even though I wanted a different ending for Will (not saying that from a place of villainizing gay bars or sex) I know this topic is very sensitive and can be very personal for people, so I donāt want to speak over anyone or say something insensitive. I never want to hurt anyone.
One thing to know about me for certain is that I do not like the duffers. I do have some more nuanced opinions about them and agree with some of the more nuanced opinions about them, but you will find find me criticizing them more often than not.
Just to be clear, when I saw this particular post, I was simply agreeing that Mike and Will were tied together till the very end of the show and that they made Mike Will's focus (no matter how much the writers try to claim otherwise) when they could have shown Will expressing his sexuality in ways that didnāt just revolve around Mike, but they didnāt. Thatās why a random kind-of-not-really āloveā interest didnāt work for me. I think Will, Noah, and the LGBTQ audience watching deserved better. And it hurts we didnāt get that- but we proceed.
thank GOD.
Byler, man. FUCK my life.
So true š
Jane!!

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Kind of frustrated that I started therapy again and they're saying I seem fine when I started therapy again for a reason because then I feel Iām wasting rescources. Like I fear I just have very high highs and lows lows and actually just like talking to someone about my problems despite how mundane they are because Iām easily affected and want to discuss when I feel those things. I feel like what I want isnāt something therapy can offer but I do not want my friends to feel they need to be my therapist because I have no one else to talk to about things and besides thatās not fair to them. As much as I understand time limits I hate them because it makes me feel guilty and like Iām wasting people's time.
The way I wanted to get a wizard hat tattoo because of Will Byers since he is one of my favorite characters of all time but the devil on my shoulder likes to remind me that he was written by the duffer brothers who treated his character like shit so ST is overall ruined for me and even though I love Will and fanon itās hard to look at things the way I used to before it all came crashing down because the fandom can also be a prison š«©
can I just say that you guys doing this during pride month is an extra fucking shame
no, noah did not queerbait. ever. he was invested just like we were, and was hyping up the potential before he got the scripts for the latter half of the season, then he stopped. not to mention none of the cast had an idea about all the character's endings until they were already months into filming. holding byler endgame signs at cons isn't baiting either, it was not something valid enough to turn down AND it made his fans happy so of course he'd go along with it. you all KNOW how noah is. he's excitable and positive, he's so young (or definitely as byler picked up after st4) and always had a close bond with his fans. he wanted to share joy with bylers/will's fans and was let down along with us
he was also 17 when people started throwing queerbaiting blame onto him. a child who was in the closet himself, with no control or power as an actor against writers despite what (uninformed) people may think. now it's still going on years later and so many of you think it's okay and don't call it out when you should
and along the way, this fandom hardly ever defended him against actual homophobic abuse, never stuck up for another member of your own community, put expectations on him to make a ship happen while knowing how difficult it is for queer people in the entertainment industry
noah has been consistent about showing disappointment in how mike has been a bad friend to will, with finn even expressing the same thoughts along the way because it was TRUE. I hate what the writers have done to byler because of their bullshit to fix what they apparently "accidentally" set up, but noah and finn and others are just speaking for what they see in the show which is fair. we now have really shit scenes that (when viewed from the byler endgame lens) don't have an explanation for, and DO make mike look shitty (rain fight and the "no homo" moment at the airport). they were so desperate to cleanse their self insert after season 4 that they made mike's priorities and behaviour so messy, that's on them not on noah and how he speaks about the ship š«©
noah has vouched for will so many times across the years. he and jamie have spoken about asking for more and being denied it - it's not their fault! he understands how will's coming out scene should've been different and intimate. he fought for byler's story after seeing how tossed aside the pairing was, he literally got us that scene on the tower. despite it being a pathetic and cruel, barely even bare minimum script that essentially said "fine, here" to noah, he didn't have control of that. he fought for the fans that the duffers didn't care about because HE cares. and always has
noah was quite literally in the middle of this whole situation for years now until the show ended. a whirlwind of needing to be in will's mindset, as well as then being interested in fan's reactions. he's only just had time to really start processing it all, so how can anyone be surprised that his opinion fluctuates as he spends more time thinking about byler AND seeing what points fans are making
if you don't think that it's perfectly normal for noah to have developed his thoughts in recent months just like we all have, then idk what to tell you. I saw people say he changed his tune despite saying byler would be roommates (sorry, where in that answer did he imply romance anyway?), despite bringing up him talking about will confessing his love in mike's arms as he dies, but that wasn't about byler endgame either? that was just a scenario for "will tells mike how he feels". so I don't get why people think he was still vouching for byler endgame after the show ended and is now doing a 180 when he's been consistent in his priority of - what is best for WILL. as he should be. god forbid the actor of the one character who didn't get ANY romance or a kiss want him to find it somewhere, to find his community, and not stay stuck
he didn't say he hates byler, he's going off of what is on screen, what the story sadly ended up telling and yes, it is so fair of him to say will should not beg for mike. will did all that he could and was SO brave to even come out. he's also not real so NO he can't be blamed for mike not figuring his own shit out lmao?? do you hear yourselves?? will got nothing and you still want him to do the work, unbelievable
from everything I've seen over the years, I do think noah believed in the same story we all thought was being set up. narratively it made sense, the duffers had the biggest fumble of the century and the month after the sorcerer scene proved that with how much bigger byler got, but now with what they actually gave us? yeah it's not great for byler. that's okay, or can eventually become okay as we process, because we push forward and create and love
noah just wants will to be loved how he deserves, I thought that's what we should all want as a fandom? do you not love will outside of byler? I'm a hardcore byler, they're my endgame absolutely but that is not gonna blind me to the nuanced point of view of the gay actor who brought the will we love to life
keep directing your grief to the duffers, to shawn, and keep showing people exactly why the narrative pointed to byler and how embarrassing of a fumble they had, and stop directing your grief at noah who is the one person with no blame in this whole thing. that should be obvious but clearly this fandom still has so much maturing to do
noah reached the will deserves better than mike level of byler grief itās ok bro weāve all been there
I think what makes it annoying is peoples reactions and the way they want to completely ignore Noahās point. I understand Will has been through a lot and shouldnāt have to chase after Mike and Mike would need to figure his crap out. That, and according to the duffers, canon Mike just sucks apparently (I will always love you fanon Mike) but people saying āfinally he (Noah) got over itā and āBylerās need to understand this, it was never going to happenā never fails to make me rage, so congrats to the baiters. The one thing I can agree with the duffers on is that this fandom sucks, though we say that for wildly different reasons š.
They spent one whole season (more imo) setting up and focusing on Will being secretly in love with Mike, then set up the lie about the painting that was never resolved, spent half of the new season making Will have RANDOM hope (after years) that Mike likes him back, made Will have superpowers and save Mike and focus the memory that he has that gives him the strength to use these powers on Mike and Will as if to visually say that the love he has for Mike helped him to reach this powerful state to save his life (and this was said also by many of the GA that thought that that scene was insanely ROMANTIC and thought that byler was going to become canon because of it. because in any straight story where something like that happens the couple gets together.) only to then do a complete inversion of everything and make Will call it just ''a crush'' and immediately accept that Mike is actually ''straight'', and he should just limit himself to being the couple therapist for Mike and El's nonsensical relationship... prompted by? ''visions from the villain'' that we never even saw to understand this change of direction... ridiculous writing behavior. I don't understand how anybody could be serious about this and especially not being a professional screenwriter, you have something deeply wrong in your brain to think this is a normal plot to propose to your viewers
It's especially bizarre because the conversation he has with Robin just hours earlier suggests that he's preparing himself to shoot his shot and ask Mike out. Which would have been the logical path to take. Even if Mike was straight/still dating El/just uninterested in dating Will (none of which make narrative sense but I digress,) Mike deserved to know who the painting actually came from and to decide for himself if he wanted a relationship with Will, and Will deserved the opportunity to be open about his feelings.
This is part of the larger problem within Stranger Things. In the later seasons, every character's actions are dictated not by what the character would reasonably do or what has been built up, but what best supports plot convenience. The Duffers wanted the people who were rooting for Mike and Will to end up together (which was a considerable portion of their audience) to continue watching the show. So Will was being encouraged to keep pursuing a potential relationship with Mike - whose feelings and relationship status with El were left intentionally ambiguous.
Then when the eleventh hour struck and the Duffers could no longer straddle the "will they /won't they" line, Will suddenly decided he'd only had a crush on Mike that he was now completely over.
It doesn't really matter if people personally wanted Mike and Will to end up together or not. This is just one of many examples of the Duffers drawing out plot lines unnecessarily, then rushing to give them resolutions at the last moment - resolutions that are unsatisfying and often nonsensical. This is objectively bad writing.
This all still makes me angry.

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because my head is full of poison and my heart is full of doubt
just twenty more years before this happens to bylers.... just twenty more years....