Excerpt from Yesshift Ep. 44 - Interview with Billy Sherwood
This is a long read, but a very worthy one in my opinion
Billy: ā¦Somewhere around 2015, [Yes was] getting ready to go out and tour with Toto. I-I forget what the dates were but, ummā¦Chris called me and says āSo weāre supposed to go out and do a tour with Toto, but Iām kinda sick.ā And I said āWhat do you mean ākinda sickā? Like, what kind of sick?ā And he said āWell, Iāve just got this thing that I gotta have checked out, and itās just gonna take me out of the loop for a while,ā He was being kinda coy.
And I said āWell, you need to, yāknow, do what you gotta do to keep your health in order, obviously, so I guess youāll have to postpone the tour ācause you canāt tour Yes without you, you know what I mean? Tell the guys in the band youāre gonna need some time and get it done.ā And he was like āYeah, yeah, yeahā¦alright well Iāll talk to you tomorrow,ā Yāknow, like he always does.
Ten minutes later I get a phone call from his wife, Scotty, and she says, āHeās not being honest with you in terms of whatās going on and I need to tell you. He just didnāt want to tell you. You need to know heās got this real serious case of leukaemia, and itās cominā on strong. Heās in trouble,ā Whichā¦not just set me back; it was likeā¦probably the most mind-blowing phone call Iāve had since, like, āYour dad just died.ā Which was traumatisingā¦
Billy: ā¦back when I was a kid. Chris was that figure for me of likeā¦yāknow not like a father but, like, an older brother to me.
Billy: Andā¦so Iām kind of blown away and soā¦next day Chris calls and goes āSo she told you whatās going on,ā and I said āYeah, man. But, lookā¦I know people personally whoāve had this, yāknow, andā¦have beaten it. Itās not easy but they beat it. Soā¦youāll be fine, you know what I mean? You get in the hospital and you get the treatments you need and youāll be fine,ā And he was like āYeah yeah yeah, Iām just kind of bummed out that Yes canāt do this tour because thereās so much responsibility on the line, in terms of-ā
This was where his head was at, as heās just being diagnosed with thisā¦thing. Heās thinking the crew and their families who are not gonna have an income, the guys in Totoāyāknow heās kind of thinking of everybody else. I brought him back to the centre and said āLook. You need to get in there and get healed, so you need to tell the band theyāre gonna have to wait.ā And he goes āYeahā¦Iāll do that, Iāll do that. Iāll talk to you tomorrow.ā
So he calls me the next day and he says, again, āI just, yāknow Iām so bummed that this thing has to stop because I just-ā And I said āChris, did you call them?ā And he goes āWell, not yetā¦ā And Iām like, āDo me a favour. When you hang up with me, call them and tell them.ā He goes āYeah, yeah, yeah, yeahā¦ā
So, calls me the next day and goes, same thing: āIām just so bummed that, you knowā¦ā I said āChris, did you call them?!ā And he goes [imitating Chrisā voice] āYouāre not getting it, are you?ā [laughs] And I said āGetting what?!ā And he goes āI want you to step in for me and do this, and I want it to happen.ā And I said āNo, I did not āget thatā.ā
Because, to be honest with you, as many ways as Iāve ended up in Yesāwhich are unique, I mean Iām playing shaker in the Talk tour at some points, yāknowāI never expected to replace Chris Squire, was never, everā¦Chris was gonna be the last man standing, like Keith Richards, you know what I mean?
Billy: It never occurred to me!
Dan: Soā¦howād you digest that?
Billy: Well that kind of blew my mind for a minute and it was pretty emotional and, yāknow, I was-I kind of lost it a little bit yāknow? Iām hearing my hero asking me to do this which isā¦an amazing honour, but by the same token, why is he asking me? Because heās in some deep, deep trouble here, yāknow? It was justā¦it was reality on a level that I wasnāt used to and it was hard.
Dan: Was itā¦was it unexpected? I mean, obviously, for probably obvious reasons it was welcome, but at the same time, was it as much of a burden to fill that role and look up to expectations and just all the things I donāt even need to say, you know what I mean?
Billy: Intimidating as hell, you know what I mean? On face. Butā¦there was no way I was gonna deny him this wish.
Billy: So I said āYeah, I will do this, but, thereāsā¦but I need you to go out and make a statement that we are going to do this, and I need you to tell people youāre going to come back. Because you are going to come back, okay? So Iām standing in for you but Iām not replacing you.ā And he said āYeah, I will do that, I will do that.ā So he put out a press statement that went out to the public and it said something to that effect.
So now Iām rehearsing and Iām at home and heās calling me every day, āHowās it going?ā Iām like āItās weird, but itās good, how are you?ā [laughs] You know what I mean? Like āAre you okay?ā
āYeah yeah, Iām dealing with the treatmentā and this thing and the other and heās like āDo you need anything?ā And I said āNot reallyā¦yāknow thereās something thatās kind of on my mind I wanted to run by you,ā I said, āChris, Iāve never played a Rickenbacker. Itās just never been my thing ergonomically.ā He goes, [imitating Chrisā voice] āDonāt even consider it, that would be ridiculous if you did that!ā Like āDonāt even worry about it, you have your own thing. Thatās why I want you to do this, you have your own thing. So, play the instruments you want to,ā And I was like āGreatā, because I knew that was gonna be coming at me right out of the gate: āWhy isnāt he playing a Rick?ā
Billy: āSo if I have your [Chrisā] personal endorsement on me being without it and itās okay, then I feel better about things already.ā
So I start rehearsing, and as Iām at homeāand this is a real compressed period of time, it isnāt a lot of timeāhe keeps calling, and thenā¦conversations are turning to, like, āIām not gonna make it.ā
Billy: And I said, āYāknow, Chris, I donātā¦really wanna hear this. Donāt give up this fight. Iāve known people whoāve survived this, you are going to make it.ā He says āNo, no, I donāt think Iām gonna make it,ā And I was like, āThis is hard to hear and I donāt wanna hear it, just keep yourself positive,ā and we talk about anything else, and so the next day he says āIām telling you Iām not gonna make it, and I need you to accept that, and I need you to hear something.ā And Iām like āWhatās that?ā And heās like,
āI want Yes to continue.
I want you to go for it.ā
And there were other things said that were kinda personal, you get the jist of what Iām saying.
Billy: Which was mind-blowing again, because in this moment of extreme griefāand Iām sure, terror in his heart because, I mean, heās facing what heās facingāheās still thinking about Yes and, yāknow this idea of Yes and he was all about that and wanted it to continue. How many icons pass the keys over to someone else and say ākeep this car going,ā you know that I mean?
It was just an intense period, and I was trying to process as it best I could and sort of maintainā¦heās like āPromise me youāre gonna keep doing thisā and I said, āYes, I promise you, but you are coming backā¦like I promise you if it makes you feel better but youāre coming back,ā you know what I mean?
Then, I didnāt really get any more phone calls for about three days or soā¦four days. And I knew something had taken a turn. Andā¦on this cloudy Sunday morning I get up and go take a walk out in the back of my place where I lived at the time; I had this wide open desert space behind me and weād go out there and take a walk. Itās like six in the morning, Iām watching the sun come up. Come back, grab my bass to start playing some of the Yes stuff weāre about to go out and do REALLY quickly after, yāknow, a week or two or whatever it was, and I open my email to check things and I just see a message from the management that says āChrisā. And I knew what it was. And I sat there and, yāknowā¦
So after a time I opened it, and, yāknow, life is the way it is and we lose people. So, from that moment forward, I just took it as a personalā¦[pause] like, mission to keep this thing going. Andā¦it bothers me when I hear people tell me to stop. It makes me more defiant and dig my heels in and want to keep it going. And I think itās known out there, in the community, that thatās how I am and thatās how I react. Yāknow, I donāt interact with the people in Facebook when they start getting into tangles about this, that and the other, but when I see it and itās coming directly at me or I see someone saying āThey shouldāve stopped when Chris Squire died,ā it pisses me off because of what I just told you. It was in Chrisā heart. And thatās why I understand that and kind of give them a little room, but if they carry on I have toāsometimes I just go in and explain to them what the reality of the situation is. So here we are.
Dan: Iām hoping that thereās people like that out there that will see this and can learn a little bit more and be a little more sensitive and understanding, yāknow? Whether they like it or not, they can have a different perspective of it. And to me I think thatās important. Yāknow thereās people out there that say āYes isnāt Yes without Patrick Morazā thereās everybody. Thereās every fucking story, every perspective we could possibly imagine, and Iām hoping that your story of what really happened and how it happened will kind of enlighten some people and also get them to lighten up.
Billy: And my theory too is that those who believe in Yes want it to go forward. And those are the people Iām doing it for and those are the people Chris was talking about doing it for.
Dan: And youāre doing a great job, by the way. You have in all these different roles, and I'm not kissing ass! How many times did I tell you since 1998 when we first met how much I just LOVED Fortune Seller, and the production on that whole albumāyou know I've been on your ass about that stuff for, how long has it been, 30 years or whatever? What year is this? I don't even know anymore...
Billy: Well, I mean I'm doing the best I can. I-I feel better about the work that I'm doing now. I was...when I did that first tour after Chris passed and we were playing live it was very difficult, y'know? Going out there and playing and looking out at an audience that I knew was looking at an absence and a change, and it was likeā¦yāknow I said to the band āIf this doesnāt work this is all gonna be my fault,ā [laughs] āso Iām gonna do the best I can here and try to make this work.ā Andā¦and I think the fans, yāknow, were such an important component of me wanting to carry on, and also giving me that strength to find that defiance and keep the band going, yāknow? Because of their warmth and the way they embraced me, but I also think that comes from the fact that I wasnāt a stranger to a lot of these people, and they also knew my relationship with Chris and Yes and Conspiracy, Arc of Life, so it kind of made sense to a lot of people. But the fans definitely made it easier.
And uhā¦that first tour was really rough, things got a little bit easier after that, but now thereās a lot of time thatās passed and Iāve gotten more comfortable in the roleā¦Iāve played actually as the bass player of Yes on a studio album and Iām working on another oneā¦so my imprint is kind is embedded into the legacy in that way. Yāknowā¦we go forward and I have to go forward being me but honouring Chris as best I can, which is what I try to do every time I play one of his things, yāknow? And I will play various things of his that have me laughing on stage ācause I remember how he would laugh when he would play it, and then thereās other moment that Iāll play a particular passageā¦and out of the blue it just strikes me and I just have to put my head down ācause Iām justā¦totally sad about the fact that heās not here because this is such a beautiful thing he wrote here and he should be playing it, yāknow? So, life is not fair in that way; I mean I lost my brother in November of ā19 andā¦yāknow, he died way too young, and so did Chris, andā¦these things are just part of life and they give you the wisdom and hopefully the strength to move forward, yāknow?
Dan: Thanks for sharing all that.
Billy: Itās almost eight years later now that Iāve been doing this which is shocking, butā¦
Dan: Most fans donāt even last eight years! [laughs]
Billy: I know! Yeah, unfortunately the last three have been completely stolen by this whole Covid thing but, yāknow, the time card is still being punched! [laughs]
