Hi, I hope you're doing well and staying healthy. I've read your post about how Elizabeth attacking ciel is sexism. What about Sebastian getting bully by Frances? Frances is a noblewoman grabbing a servant's hair in front of other people. And fans (including me) are like: oh! What a lioness! Even the devil himself is terrified of her! what if it was the other way around? The idea of a nobleman grabbing a governess's hair calling her nasty and indecent makes me uncomfortable and even angry.
ăResponse to post: Sexism against men and Kuro Sexist jokesă
Iâm doing well, thank you very much. I hope you too ^^
Your question is a very good one, and it really had me thinking for a while! I myself admittedly do laugh very hard at Sebastian getting a hard time from Frances. But indeed, like you said, it is still bullying, and bullying is bad. In this post-feminist era, we have been so trained to see women bullying men as âfunnyâ or âempoweringâ, but women getting bullied as unambiguously bad instinctively, that sometimes we forget to check our double standards.
Feelings are feelings, we canât help what we feel. But how come then that to many of us, Frances bullying Sebas is so funny, but Lizzie almost murdering O!Ciel and Nina bullying men not? This post is merely an attempt to explain this feeling for myself too, but hopefully we can all reach SOME explanation together as well???
Let us first look at in what ways Frances has been making Sebastianâs life hard. From all the interactions we have of these two so far, her main points of criticism seem to be his hair and his lack of professionalism.
Sebastianâs hair is something weâve gotten quite used to now after more than14 years. In Sebastianâs time however, his hair really would have been the height of impropriety for his profession.
Just like I translated O!Cielâs looks to 2020 standards, I quickly translated Sebasâ hair to 2020 standards as well. Very clean, innit?! Very professional, innit?!
Even without the translation however, if we look at the worst of wigs from the Kuromyus, we can also see how Sebastianâs hair would be atrocious in any formal setting. Look past the fact that these actors are supposed to represent a drawn character. Just imagine being in a fancy restaurant and encountering a dead-spider feather duster on your waiterâs head.... erm....???
Something that is objectively bad on Francesâ end however, is that chapter 14 is not the first time that Frances has seen his âslovenly hairâ. If his hair really is so unacceptable, as an authority figure Frances has the right to say something about it. However, as it seems, until this point she has never communicated at all (no, âhintingâ is not the same as communicating), so Sebas had no way of knowing what he âdid wrongâ. She immediately grabbed for Sebastianâs hair without mercy, probably because her crept up frustration got the better of her. This is indeed entirely too harsh for a first time call-out, and entirely on Frances.
Much later in the story Frances criticises and touches Sebastianâs hair again, and this time in public while he was infiltrating as a teacher. Here Frances is even publically humiliating Sebastian in front of his students and other high ranking guests.
Especially when you keep in mind that Frances is a noblewoman and Sebas a mere servant, Frances is indeed abusing her power against a servant who cannot strike back at all.
This is indeed power play. However, though it does not justify anything, in the very least her criticism does have ground; Sebasâ hair is by all measures inadequate for any professional setting. Just be nicer about it, Frances.
Now, let us look at the other reason Frances disapproves of Sebas. Sebastian is a very competent butler according to most people. To Frances however, this claim is empty. When she arrives, parts of the estate have been destroyed and something very literally exploded in her presence.
Even though Sebas is not the person actively causing the explosion or the destruction, as the senior servant of the household, it is literally his job to manage the other servants. So yes, here too, the fact that things can be destroyed in the household because he either hired inadequate staff or because he mismanages his household, DOES INDEED prove he fails at his job. As the aunt of O!Ciel who cares about her nephew AND her paternal home, Frances is in her right to be concerned and call Sebastian out for NOT doing his job.
In chapter 14, Sebastianâs schedule was all over the place and kept changing the plans for Frances. It is no wonder that she would be quite annoyed and doubt Sebastianâs adequateness. When you know your 13 year old nephewâs household is in the hands of somebody so apparently inadequate, anybody would probably be concerned. However annoyed though, Frances does not overstep any boundaries about this specific issue; she is simply supremely unimpressed. Fair enough?
Something that is quite interesting though, is that despite disapproving of Sebastian, Frances does also know when to compliment him when due. After Sebastian has saved Lizzieâs life without boasting, Frances recognised how the butler does indeed have some value and the correct attitude as a servant.
She says âthough you look indecent what you say is true,â and it is yet another jab at the demonâs expense. But here she is also showing that she is willing to acknowledge somebodyâs achievements, looking past appearances.
Before Frances leaves, Frances jabs at Sebas a bit again, but she really is not doing anything dickish this time. Instead of making Sebas think sheâs simply chosen him as target to be a prick towards, she concretely states why she doubts his professionalism. She mentions the smashed tea set, bare garden and burnt food; mistakes that are objectively unacceptable. Instead of yelling at him, she actually gives him constructive criticism. So here too, Frances is quite stern, but her grounds are solid.
In the Campania arc Sebas shows up again with the hair Frances disapproved of. Frances clearly wants to do something about it again because in her eyes, the butler simply wonât learn. But given the circumstances and Sebastianâs proven usefulness, Frances actually does shelve her agenda. Just like above, here too Frances shows that she is capable of acknowledging somebody despite their looks.
Later when the zombies dramatically outnumbered the living humans, Frances sends Sebas - who had come to her aid - back to her daughter and nephew. By sending Sebas back, Frances also shows that she in fact trusts this âslovenly butlerâ with the lives of two children she loves deeply. Sebastian protests, but Frances immediately replies: âdonât you trust our ability as swordsmen?â Here what Frances is functionally saying is: âI trust you with your abilities, so you can trust us back.â
In short, Frances is harsh and doing power-play against a servant, but she can shelve her agenda, and does acknowledge Sebas when due.
Contrast to Nina and Lizzie
So now we have seen how Frances bullies Sebastian, and her motivation behind all her points of harshness. As we have seen, Francesâ only points of criticisms are concrete ones; Sebastianâs lack of professionalism in looks, and his lack of professionalism in management. She goes about them too harshly, but all points are legit criticisms, and something Sebas CAN and probably SHOULD work to improve.
This is in stark contrast with the way Nina bullies her victims. As far as we have seen, none of Ninaâs victims have offended her in any way, nor does she ever give any concrete criticism. She has just decided that because men are men, they donât deserve proper treatment. Even when providing clothes for men is literally part her job, she refuses to provide the âprofessional serviceâ she is being paid for. And because she is AN EMANCIPATED LESBIAN!!!!!!! #FEMINISM, itâs FINE (!?!?!?)
Unlike with Francesâ criticism of Sebastianâs inadequate hairdo and managing, being âmenâ is not something any of these men can do anything about (except Sebas, but Nina doesnât know). Bullying is always wrong, always low. But itâs EVEN lower when you bully somebody for who they are, and not what they do wrong. What does not help is that Nina seems to only be capable of treating people nicely if they happen to be sexuality-wise compatible with her... but if you are, youâll get molested. What is wrong with you, Nina????
Yes, Frances is saying: âyou are a man, and yet your fringe is so longâ. So on the most surface level, it is a woman saying this to a man because he is a man. As we later get to know Frances a bit better though, she would be harsh to anybody who looks slovenly. She just has different hairstyles which she considers appropriate for men and women respectively. Had Sebas been a woman and his hair was the âfeminine equivalent of slovenlyâ, Frances would most likely have acted exactly the same. So in this sense, unlike with the jokes using Nina and Lizzie, it is not purely: âHaha, girl bullies boii, lol.â
Something else that is terrible is that what Nina does seems to be systemic. Logically it checks out too; it canât be that only since the past few weeks sheâs decided only women and young boys deserve her kind treatment. For all we know, Ninaâs been treating the male Phantomhive staff like this for 2-3 years. Sebastianâs comment about Nina thoroughly ignoring men again with âas alwaysâ further supports this theory.
With Frances in contrast, in chapter 14 (so barely a year ago in story time), Sebas seemed to have no clue whatsoever about Francesâ terrors. Sebas announced Francesâ arrival to his master and is very calm about it. It was not until O!Ciel alerted Sebas about his aunt that anybody even guessed what hurricane was headed for them. As such, we can safely conclude that Sebas had only been subjected to Francesâ criticism a couple of times, unlike having had to bear with Nina for years.
Yes, Frances still should have communicated, but I already addressed the details above. Still, the point remains that even though Frances is overstepping boundaries and abusing her power, her criticisms are at least not empty.
Lizzie too just like Nina, had zero grounds for showing that much aggression. She did not give anybody the benefit of the doubt, did not communicate, or even so much as give O!Ciel any chance to explain the situation. So far O!Ciel has given Lizzie no reason to think heâd cheat on her, and yet she hurled so much aggression at him Sebas had to intervene.
Still, Lizzie is marginally better than Nina because she is not systemically bullying O!Ciel. It is a one time event. However, this one makes me more annoyed with Yana because it means that even Yana had to use this stale, stale trope of âLOVE TRIANGLE COMEDYYYYâ. Have I ever mentioned how MUCH I hate love triangles and jealousy???
Feeling wise, the most important reason for why Sebas being bullied by Frances is funny is probably because of who Sebas is. Sebas is otherwise an all-powerful demon, but to see him inventing colours to shit at Frances - a human Sebas could crush between his fingertips like a cookie - is just hilarious. Had Sebas been a human though, I would not have laughed so hard personally.
Rationally however, Frances is doing power play against a servant who cannot talk back, so it is still bullying, and bullying is inexcusable.The only bit of ârightâ Frances has is that she does not seem to be systemically bullying Sebastian, and that her criticisms have some ground.
So if Nina and Lizzieâs behaviours played for jokes are like... a -7 and -9 respectively, Francesâ at least scores a -2 for me?
(Yes, as weâre talking about bullying anyway, I just have to make a jab at Vincent.)
Something not really related to why âFrances:Badâ, âNina-Lizzie:Worseâ, but I do wish to mention is Yanaâs improved drawing skills. I have no proof, but I think it MIGHT have been where this Frances-joke originated.
Yanaâs time in the more traditional mindset of manga-worldview really showed, especially at the far beginning. Besides, she was still in the process of finding a way to draw handsome men. In the more traditional mindset of the early 2000s, handsome men were just not supposed to have slicked back hair - âthat was reserved for old men and nasty dudes!!â Yanaâs discomfort with drawing handsome men with slicked back hair was clearly visible in Sebastianâs early appearances, and making the ââhair, back!!! says old-fashioned ladyâ was potentially even a way of Yana to laugh at herself.
I donât know who else is old like me and grew up with 80s to early 00s manga, but at the time, hair for handsome men was a BIG deal. In that world âslicked back hairâ just carried a certain laughability about it; a ârule of not-coolâ. To me at least at the time this âlaughabilityâ really resonated with me, and Yana probably also trusted this same âunspoken ruleâ to resonate with her audiences.
Much later though, Yana clearly grew more comfortable and maybe even fond of slicked back hairstyles as she confidently chose to portray Sebas as âappealingâ while wearing his hair in the style Yana previously disliked.
Again, I have no proof, but I canât help but think that if Kuro had started 10 years later, the running gag revolving Frances might look altogether different.
What do you guys think? ^^ Cheers, and stay healthy!
Character analysis Nina Hopkins
Character analysis Vincent Phantomhive
Sexism against men and Kuroâs sexist jokes
MASTERPOST Gender in Kuroshitsuji
MASTERPOST Analyses & Info
