#lillybug

Could you please introduce yourself to everyone? Name (real or online, whatever you prefer), pronouns, role on the Echo Project, current and/or past occupation, etc.

L: Hi there! My name is Lilly, my pronouns are she/they as well! I'm a musician for the Echo Project and I work full time as a barista outside of the online world.

A: Hello! I am Abyuse/Salem/Cervines. My pronouns are he/him. I worked on the soundtrack for Echo, made a few songs for A Role To Play, and beyond that I don’t do a whole lot.

How did you come to learn about the Echo visual novel?

L: One of my friends had recommended Adastra to me at first, so I played it and then checked out Echo and like, instantly fell in love with it.

A: Back in high school I happened upon Blackgate by chance. I followed it for a bit and was enamored with the idea of a visual novel (which was new to me). Echo was one of the side projects advertised on the Blackgate Patreon, so after a while, I checked it out and the rest is history.

Did the team give you any specific keywords or directions while making the tracks? You can be as specific as you would like.

L: Not exactly, because I had made both of my songs for Echo before I was even a part of the team haha. When I posted my WIP song called echo (Carl's route's ending) McSkinny then reached out to me asking to use it in game, to which I completely obliged!

A: When I was first approached with the idea of working on some music for Echo, the main descriptor that was given to me was something like “Southwestern gothic”. I know the use of guitars was emphasized as being quintessential, so I made sure to incorporate that. My first attempt at making something in that vein is the last bonus track on the Echo soundtrack. It was sort of a feeler for that kind of sound, because it wasn’t something I had done before.

For Backstage I and II, the image painted to me was essentially that of The Smoke Room before I knew what The Smoke Room was, that being a sleazy club with a perpetual haze of dust in the air, slightly sultry but muffled music playing the background, an old CRT up in the corner of the room. Also something about wood walls, I think? Maybe not. I may have added that myself.

And then for the main theme remix, it was like “hey the main theme, but make it evil.” Which was actually a bit harder than I thought it would be, it took about three full iterations before I found one I liked.

Honestly though, stuff like when your arms were around me v2, Theme for a Lonely Wolf, Shiver, and Good Morning were all things I made not because of a request, but because of personal interest. A lot of my music tends to be darker in nature, so as I grew as an artist, I ended up making things that fit Echo pretty well.

With the team's directions (if any), how were you able to get that perfect 'feel' for the music? Did you have your own inspirations and other resources to draw from?

L: I didn't exactly get any input from the team when making my tracks, but I tried to capture the atmosphere of the game the best that I could. My song blurry was pretty much written from Leo's point of view and that was the idea I had going into the track, so I guess it just worked out decently.

A: I was such a big fan of Echo that I felt that I knew, more or less, what would and would not fit the VN in terms of sound. That’s not to say I didn’t have inspiration, because my entire catalogue is heavily inspired. When it comes to sounds that fit the Echo aesthetic, I listened to a lot of music that I thought would fit. I’ll list a few but I couldn’t recount everything that inspired me if I tried.

Something I always tried to keep in mind when I made music for it was that it was not meant to be the main attraction, but serve as an effective backdrop for the writing and help to immerse the reader more into what was going on in the VN.

Could you go more in-depth to how your songs were made? This could be anything from the writing/making-of process, software and equipment used, whatever you interpret the question as.

L: So for blurry it was the first time I was using my new microphone I had just gotten, so the vocals on the song weren't exactly the most well made, but in a sense I feel like that worked even better for the song. It makes the song feel sort of jumbled, like it's a window into an afterthought into Leo's head, of him just wishing for something that could never really come in the end. echo was honestly more of an experiment than anything because it was my first time trying to figure out the DAW Ableton. I've been using FL Studio my whole career, but I liked the end result, so on a whim I just sort of posted the track in the Echo fan art channel (in the Discord).

A: It is no secret that I use FL Studio for everything, but something that is a definite secret (until now) is that I know next to nothing about the intricacies of music theory or instrumental work. I took piano lessons for the duration of my junior high and high school years, but none of that stuck with me. I have a 49 key MIDI keyboard, but it is collecting dust across the room for me. 

Pretty much every single melody I make is drag and drop, which means it probably takes longer for me to write music than others, but it has never bothered me to the point of wanting to learn (that and I'm extremely stubborn). 

As for my writing process, it’s different for everything. I make a bunch of different stuff so with different styles of music, comes different processes for creation. For the Echo type stuff (when your arms were around me and Leo’s theme in particular), I focus in on one aspect or sound I really like, and then build outwards from that. A lot of times I start in the main section, but that turns into the intro and I rewrite the main section. I usually make a skeleton of a melody or whatever, then do all the drum and percussion work, then go back to the melodies, then tune the drums again. Mixing and mastering is a scam (read: I'm lazy) so I avoid doing that as much as I can. Then I listen to the song about 50 times and I either revise or export it and listen to it another 50 times. 

If you are able to, do you have any rejected/unpublished drafts or demos of the songs that you would like to share? 

L: Yeah sure! I can try to dig up some old drafts of blurry and such, I provided an instrumental version of it to someone who wished to cover it, so that version is probably floating around out there somewhere.

A: There are a few! I have an alternate version of Good Morning, a track for ambience that was cave-like (made with the mine in mind), Salem’s theme (which ended up not being used), and a sort of chase theme (not Chase the character but chase as a verb). HOWEVER. These are pretty much all slated to come out on my next project already (more on that later).

https://soundcloud.com/abyuse/mysterious_1-salems-theme/s-cQir4lugvFO - This is what Salem's theme was going to be. Now, I may have the timeline for this messed up, but I believe a theme for him was requested before his final placement in the story was decided, so when the decision was made to kill my precious little innocent boar, this song no longer had a place. 

This article will be updated as these are received.

Update (9/8/2024) - Unfortunately, Salem's theme has been removed from SoundCloud.

A bit more of a specific question here. There's a song that you have released officially [echo for lillybug | Main Theme (Dark) for abyuse] that uses the royalty-free music from the novel [Look Forwards for lillybug | Pepper's Theme for abyuse]. How does that work? Do you have to go through any legal things in order to publish the music with the royalty-free sections? Go through the company to make sure it's good to be put online?

L: Honestly, I didn't really go through anything or ask the company/producer, which is a pretty big oversight now that I think about it. I mean the song isn't really big enough where I feel it will cause problems? But if some do arise from it I'll surely deal with it. My best guess is that it shouldn't be a huge deal because the song was royalty free, and I believe it falls under fair use because I changed it and put a different spin on it.

A: My lawyer has advised me to refrain from answering this question.

Have you read the visual novel yet? If so, when was the last time you did so? It could be while it was still in development, or after it was completed last year.

L: I definitely have! I've gone through it many times with friends, and more recently with my girlfriend Chaia! Not exactly sure when I played it last, I believe it was after the game was completed.

A: Yes… kind of. I followed the visual novel from update to update up until the end of Leo’s route. Then, school got in the way of things and now reading anything absolutely beats my ass and I can’t focus enough to consume literature in any form. I think, in total, I have read around half of Flynn’s route, none of Jenna’s, and then all of Leo’s, Carl’s, and TJ’s (which was the most recent, for me). 

If you have read it, do you have a favorite character? Favorite moment from any route? Favorite ending?

L: It's sad to admit, but I definitely have a soft spot for Leo. I like how complex of a character he is. I think one of my favorite moments in the game was at the end of TJ's route when they're hugging by the lake and pretty much it all gets revealed, that moment packed a punch and a half.

A: Cop out answer time, I like all characters in the VN that I have encountered (except Leo) for different reasons, but I think they’re all well written. If a gun were pointed to my head, though… I think that Kudzu, Brian, and Jenna are my favorites, in descending order.

I think my favorite moment in the VN was, and it’s been a while so you’ll have to forgive my inaccuracies, was the later part in Carl’s route where it took place on a spooky college campus. I just remember liking the vibe of that section a whole lot.

My favorite ending of those that I have read is definitely TJ’s. 

If you have read it, when you got to a part where your music was used, what was your first reaction like?

L: It was so crazy! When I first played the game through I sort of imagined having a track or something in the game, so seeing it come to fruition was definitely surreal.

A: It was surreal. There’s no other way to describe it. There are still moments where it doesn’t feel like it actually happened, it's hard to believe that so many people have heard my music, whether they know it or not. 

I had always dreamt of making music for something or someone other than myself, and Echo was the first time that really happened. It felt like I was driven by something other than personal enjoyment for once, and it made making music feel a lot more rewarding, and a lot less masturbatory.

Do you have any favorite memory with a fan of Echo talking to you about your music that you would like to share?

L: Not a specific one, but it always really warms my heart to see people talking about it fondly. Sometimes I'll get a ping from the Echo Project Discord about someone asking who made blurry, and it's just really sweet to see that people enjoy the song and others I've made as well. always brings a smile to my face.

A: I try to avoid extended conversations when possible so I don’t think I've really allowed myself to talk to pretty much anyone about my music. I did talk to shyno about my production but my answers were so immediately off the rails that I think that only reaffirmed that I don’t like talking. I like it when people enjoy my music though, it makes me smile.

Do you have any favorite memory while making your tracks? Discussions with the rest of the team, some 'lightbulb moment', anything that comes to mind.

L: I'd definitely have to say getting a message from McSkinny about putting echo, and blurry later on, in the game. It was such a sort of surreal moment to me, because I had sort of imagined it happening before, and then it really did happen!

A: Leo’s theme. It’s a bit of an interesting story. when your arms were around me is a pain point for me, I hate that song and I hate hearing it (it's not to say I wish it didn’t exist or whatever, I'm glad people like it. My producer ears just cannot stand it anymore). So, Theme for a Lonely Wolf was made because I was so frustrated with that song existing that I wanted to make something in the same vein, but better. I was not prompted to make this by McSkinny, nor was it made with any intention to be Leo’s theme. I just made it out of spite, and the end product ended up being one of the songs I am most proud of, out of everything I made for Echo. I sent it to McSkinny, he said he wanted to use it, I made a reprise because I wanted to try that out, and then next thing I know, it’s Leo’s theme. I don’t think I could have picked a better choice in terms of usage. As much as I personally dislike Leo, he’s one of the most prominent and polarizing characters of the visual novel, and since I was so proud of that song, I am happy it was given to such a figurehead.

Another one is a track that wasn’t actually in the VN (I think), Circles. That song is not only an emotional response to the entire TJ ending, but a personal illustration of how the ending sounded. It still isn’t finished in the state it’s in, but I put so much time into it that I feel like it wasn’t fair to leave it rotting away on my hard drive.

Is there anything else related to the project that you would like to share?

L: blurry wasn't originally going to be added to the game, McSkinny talked to me about adding echo first, and then listened to blurry and wanted that in the game on a whim too.

A: I don’t think there’s much else that I know or want to share that hasn’t been shared already.

A question for Lillybug - Your track blurry is a part of your EP i'm dreaming, and not a standalone track like echo is. Was blurry originally made for Echo? Or was it a track that was already made and just picked up for the novel?

L: Sort of both? It was written about Echo from Leo's perspective (and Chase's in the outro) but it wasn't made to go in the game, McSkinny just wanted to pick it up for the game. And since the source material was written about the game, I decided to say it was written for the game, rather than sourced outwards.

A question for Abyuse - You revealed on the Bandcamp page for your Echo tracks that you had originally lost the project files to the music. Is there more insight you would like to give with that situation? Any warning to musicians to prevent it from happening to others?

A: A few years ago I wanted to upgrade my PC because it was started to get dated. I bought a really nice prebuilt that I still use to this day, but I made the fatal error of not moving any of my music making files over because I was both at a point where I wasn’t making music (Destiny 2 had me by the neck) and I thought I could just get it later. Eventually, I decided I wanted those files back, but when I dug the computer out and plugged it in, the SSD the operating system was on was nuked, somehow. I gave up for about a year, thinking that I had just lost everything. I eventually decided to try and just install Windows from a USB onto a new SSD, and that ended up working. I still lost a lot of personal stuff but I got all my music files back. All that to say, don’t be an idiot like I was and back your work up onto an external hard drive.

Final question: is there anything you'd like to say in general? To any fans of the music, or anything you want to promote, the floor is all yours.

L: I just wanted to say thank you to everyone for your kind words! It all means so much to me. I've also got an album coming out soon, so stay tuned!

A: I don’t say this enough, but a massive thank you to not only everyone who has listened to my music, but supported me through Bandcamp. It is absolutely not necessary to do so, but I appreciate it immensely. Making music has always been nothing more than a passionate hobby of mine, and I honestly don’t want it to be anything more than that for the moment. Although I have slowed down quite a bit, I promise I am still making music. My latest album is all heavily inspired by games and media that have shaped me, and it currently sits at 29 tracks, with more that I'm working on right now. 

Thank you again to McSkinny and Howly for everything, working on Echo has been not only an extremely valuable experience artistically, but has helped me build confidence in my music tenfold. Appreciate that forever.

Thank you as well for this opportunity! It is a bit stressful to answer all this stuff accurately but I feel like after re-writing every answer five times I got what I wanted to say across.

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Thanks so much to Lillybug and Abyuse once again for participating, and thank you for reading. It was so fun to learn something new about Echo, and I hope you enjoyed it too!

You can find Lillybug on Spotify and Soundcloud.

You can find Abyuse on Bandcamp and Soundcloud. You can also download his tracks for Echo here!