#grimm!summer

So over the last few months I’ve seen a bit of discussion and theorizing on the prospect of Grimm!Summer actually being a red-herring for an even bigger reveal, such as Summer having actually joined Salem and is working with her entirely willingly. With what seems to be a decent chunk of this idea borne out of the idea that Ruby just straight up figuring out the Grimm!Summer twist in Volume 8 feeling like an ‘obvious’ setup for a fakeout.

The thing is (and this is rather ironic given that I was pushing the idea of Grimm!Summer being a red-herring pre-Volume 9), I think we’re not only getting Grimm-Hybrid Summer, but also that Ruby’s big ‘That’s what happened to Mom…’ theory in Volume 8 is actually basically LEGIT. And furthermore, that the writers have actually kind of ‘locked in’ Grimm!Summer to the point that doing some kind of fake-out would significantly undermine and even outright contradict some major plot points in Volume 8.

But to begin, let’s talk about “That’s what happened to Mom…”

The thing is, I totally get why some people might be suspicious of a fake-out here. After all, the main character essentially piecing together what is clearly a massive twist BEFORE the big reveal is something we very much DON’T normally see. This is basically Luke Skywalker walking out of the Dagobah cave in Episode V, sitting down next to Yoda with an absolutely HAUNTED look and straight up stating: “Vader is my father, isn’t he?”

But when has RWBY ever done things NORMAL with fantasy tropes? And Ruby in particular has always been a very ATYPICAL protagonist. So I’d say RWBY’s heroine piecing together a major reveal ahead of time would actually be rather appropriate.

Furthermore, I think what we see play out in this scene is actually very important to one of RWBY’s major overriding narratives: The counterpoint to the repeated use of Unreliable Narrators. With how much RWBY has made use of this trope, that naturally raises the question ‘How can we/the characters be sure of ANYTHING?’ And I think we’re seeing the answer here:

The characters have to piece the answers together themselves.

Ruby finding out that her mother was taken by Salem and turned into a horrific grimm hybrid monstrosity is very much NOT a case of the Unreliable Narrator. Nobody TOLD Ruby this information, she simply figured it out herself.

First, Ruby learned from Tyrian back in Volume 4 that Salem specifically wants her alive.

Then in Volume 6, Ruby learned from Maria that Salem used to simply have Silver Eyed Warriors hunted down and killed. Meaning that something must have changed between Maria’s time and now.

Then in Volume 7, Ruby learned that her mother apparently MET Salem on that fateful final mission of hers.

Finally in Volume 8, Ruby sees this horrifying, monstrous Grimm Hybrid that Salem has created… with a Silver Eyed Warrior inside it.

And with that, the pieces fall into place:

As Ruby herself puts it: “Salem used to kill people with Silver Eyes, like Maria. But she’s always wanted ME alive. But why would that change unless… When she met Mom, she learned she could do something new.”

This isn’t even the first time the show has done something like this. Back in Volume 6, Maria’s and Ruby’s theory that the Silver Eyes originate from or are otherwise connected to the God of Light is NOT something they are ‘told’ but rather something they infer based on observations made during Jinn’s vision.

Given how much RWBY has made use of Unreliable Narrators, I think it’s actually only natural that the information our heroines come across and piece together themselves would be the far more legit answers.

Obviously it might not be the whole story, but it is at least the START of it.

Next let’s talk about Grimm!Summer herself and why I think Summer turning out to have joined and is serving Salem entirely willingly… doesn’t really WORK with everything that’s been set up so far.

The thing is, the big Hound reveal in Volume 8 essentially ‘locks-in’ Summer being the ‘Patient Zero’ of Salem’s whole Grimm Hybrid project. Again, as Ruby herself laid out; Salem used to kill people with Silver Eyes. But now she seems to want them, like Ruby, alive. And it turns out she actually met Summer Rose in the meantime. And now Salem is making horrific Grimm Hybrids using Silver Eyes Warriors. Ergo, meeting Summer is when Salem ‘learned she could do something new’.

So if Grimm!Summer turns out to be a red-herring… then WHERE did the Hybrids come from? Are we supposed to find out that ‘Oh, it wasn’t actually Summer, but rather thanks to some OTHER Silver Eyed Warrior who also just so happened to fight Salem that she learned she could start making Grimm Hybrids’?

Because I don’t think I need to explain why that would be an EXTREMELY UNSATISFYING as a twist. In the ‘red-herring that exists ONLY to be a red-herring’ kind of way.

And with Grimm!Summer as the starting point of Salem’s Hybrids essentially locked-in, I think that kills any possibility that Summer has joined and is working with Salem willingly. After all, I think it’s hard to imagine Summer working with/for Salem fully willingly if she’s also spent years as effectively the Patient Zero for Salem’s twisted hybrid experiments. As I’ve stated elsewhere, I think Summer’s mental state at this point is that she’s ‘willingly’ working for Salem, but only because she’s been so psychologically BROKEN by everything she’s been put through.

Finally, there’s this idea that Ruby ‘figuring out the twist’ in Volume 8 somehow ‘kills the reveal’ of Summer being a Grimm Hybrid. To which I not only VEHEMENTLY disagree with, but I also think it actually MASSIVELY ratchets up the tension surrounding Summer’s fate going forward.

Thanks to essentially figuring the reveal out early, now Ruby has to LIVE with this knowledge. Now this fact of Summer not only being alive, but likely some terrible grimm monstrosity can LOOM over Ruby, Yang, Weiss and Blake, as well as Qrow, Raven, Tai and others who were close to Summer once RWBY fills them in. Going forward, this knowledge will be sitting ominously in the back of Ruby’s mind. I mean it’s pretty clear that this was one of the things weighing HEAVILY on Ruby during Volume 9.

And it gives the appearance of more Grimm Hybrid further down the line an ominous, haunting inevitability for Ruby and her family. Because now she KNOWS that one of these monstrosities isn’t just a silver-eyed warrior like her, but her MOTHER.

It’s basically Alfred Hitchcock’s ‘bomb under the table’ theorem applied to long-form storytelling.

Yeah, I have no doubt that Summer will ABSOLUTELY be ultimately saved by Ruby, Yang, Raven, etc. As in, I think it should be abundantly clear by now that RWBY is NOT the kind of show that will mercy-kill the heroines’ mother for cheap tragedy points. The same way there is no way the show will kill off a girl who has been abused, manipulated and controlled for her entire life simply because she happens to be a villain.

Like, Summer's Grimm form appears in the background wherever Salem's new headquarters is (be it Evernight or the ruins of Beacon), but we learn that said Grimm used to be Summer in the very next episode when Raven gives us the mostly true story of what went down at Evernight all those years ago?

And then when she encounters the heroes for the first time, she pretends to be as primal as the Hound they've already encountered, and only drops the facade when it's no longer advantageous for her to "play dumb" so to speak?

So to start with, I definitely agree with you on Grimm!Summer being introduced as some mysterious humanoid grimm some time before her proper reveal. As in, I imagine we’ll probably get a scene of Salem and Cinder arriving at the ruins of Beacon, and both we and Cinder being introduced to this new figure who’s been overseeing the occupation of Beacon and the search for the Vault. Likely in a way that immediately makes them/her SUPER creepy, like they ‘speak’ in this highly distorted tone similar to the Hound, but are instead actually fairly lucid and cognizant. Basically, going off RWBY’s Lord of the Ring’s allusions, I’m thinking big Nazgul vibes, and SPECIFICALLY the Witch King. And maybe other unsettling things like Salem notably NOT punishing this minion of hers for their supposed ‘failure’ to find the Vault thus far, instead giving the impression that this is in fact her most favored, and greatest servant.

As to whether we’ll get flashbacks showing Summer’s transformation before her confrontation and fight with the heroes, I think we might get something like that.

Like you said, I think the flashback we’ll likely get is Raven recounting her and Summer’s mysterious last mission and whatever battle they had with Salem. A battle which possibly ended Raven seeing Summer being thrown into one of the pools of darkness, maybe after being mortally wounded. Which is where her belief of Summer being dead comes from.

However, this ALSO confirms to Ruby what she has now long suspected about her mother’s true fate. This of course leads to Ruby and Yang (along with Weiss and Blake) revealing/explaining to Raven, Qrow and possibly Oz what happened with the Hound and what was truly inside it (remember that Team RWBY are at this point, kind of the only ones who actually KNOW about the Hound being a corrupted Silver Eyed Warrior, and it’s not like they had TIME to really explain that to Qrow or anyone else before falling into the Ever After)

This leads to our heroes basically coming to grips with and assuming that Summer is both ‘alive’ and has been twisted into some feral monster just like the Hound.

Until the actual fight with Grimm!Summer and the dramatic unmasking (likely via a silver eye blast from Ruby), which gives us the true, or rather the second-half of the reveal; that Summer is actually fairly cognizant/lucid and appears to/claims to have joined Salem willingly.

Oh we can only hope XD

Though I will admit that I do think it's rather presumptive to assume that Grimm Summer will be just another 'Hound'. Rather, I imagine (hope) that Salem's Grimm Hybrids will each have their own unique forms. With Summer herself essentially being the mythical 'Humanoid Grimm' that the fandom has been theorizing about for years now.

That being said, if Summer is in fact our equivalent to the Witch King, I could also imagine her also having a monstrous, winged form as a reference to WK's Fel Beast (or maybe she just rides an unfrozen Kevin into battle).

So we could see Summer using her giant monster form to battle Raven, and when Raven is defeated, Ruby destroys Summer's monster form with a Silver Eye blast much like how Eowyn kills the Witch King's Fel Beast. Which likewise leads to Ruby (and Yang) fighting Grimm Summer, now fully unmasked and in human form, on foot.

Ooooh, yeah this is DEFINITELY going to happen at some point XD

Though sadly, I imagine we’ll have to wait until Volume 11 or 12 when our heroes return to Vale to retake Beacon.

That said, I am in full agreement that Maiden!Raven vs. Grimm!Summer is absolutely going to be one of THE biggest, most dramatic fights of the show, and certainly a payoff to ALL the setup regarding Summer, Raven and all the Rosebird hints. And that’s not even getting into how Ruby and Yang will no doubt factor into things…

It’s going to be angsty, gay and dramatic as all fuck is what I’m saying XD

And thinking about it more, I think there could be some particularly spicy implications if we consider the potential LOTR allusions of such a battle.

I’ve brought this up previously, but I’m now pretty sure that Salem’s Grimm Hybrid are RWBY’s equivalent to the Nazgul, with Summer herself being our Witch King.

Now let’s consider that at present, Raven is likely more or less the best fighter the heroes have; a seasoned, exceptional huntress on top of being an experienced maiden.

Which means that a Raven vs. Summer matchup could very well have shades of Gandalf vs. the Witch King. And when we factor in Ruby and Yang, well…

What if Raven, Ruby and Yang end up alluding in some form to Theoden, Eowyn and Merry as well?

As in, Raven battles Summer just as Gandalf battles the Witch King, is defeated and at the mercy of Summer just like Theoden, only for Ruby and Yang to jump in battle Summer and protect Raven just like Eowyn and Merry*, possibly with backup from Weiss and Blake.

As to how they might work in ‘I am no man!’, weeellll…

What if it’s not Ruby or Yang or Raven who says it… but SUMMER as part of a big unmasking reveal?

Admittedly this is complicated a bit by the fact that Raven, Ruby and Yang are all exactly the people who would have every reason to guess that this mysterious masked humanoid grimm is actually Summer. So perhaps Summer would drop that line upon revealing her identity to someone else, say Qrow or Tai or just someone disposable whom she promptly kills. Either way it would still be a textbook RWBY twist to have their version of the Witch King be a woman.

--

While TV Tropes credits this to "art evolution", I have a different theory: What if the discoloration of the veins was due to some kind of damage that took her an unnaturally long time to recover from?

Like, I dunno, a battle with a certain Silver-Eyed Warrior who's been missing for about a decade?

Oooh, yeah I’ve actually had the theory for a while that Salem going from ‘regular goth mommy’ to ‘monster goth mommy’ was due to her encounter with Summer.

(This is also why I'm thinking Summer being saved would mean Penny coming back for Round 3, or vice versa, given Penny's aforementioned thematic parallels with the Grimmified SEW's. If a dignified death is the closest to a happy ending Penny will ever achieve, then they'll have no choice but to mercy kill Summer. It's just a matter of whether Penny's return or Summer's rescue would come first.)

On somewhat a related note (given how my last two asks were combined), I'm also thinking Cinder's ascension would mark a good point to close out the penultimate Volume on, that way the Final Volume would have time to develop her next incarnation alongside Team RWBY, since they'd kind of have to flesh out her new identity.

Regarding Summer, I think the assumption that you’re making is that Grimm!Summer is going to be just like the Hound. And I really doubt that’s what we’re going to see.

Largely because I think Grimm!Summer simply being a raving, mindless monster would not be nearly as interesting, nor hit nearly as hard emotionally, as if she was fully cognizant.

As I’ve gone into in other posts, I think Summer is in fact fully cognizant and self-aware after having essentially become the SAME kind of Light/Dark hybrid that Salem is after a dip in the darkness pools. Though at the same time completely psychologically broken by Salem into being her willing follower. And that the Hound, the other hybrids and even Cinder herself have been part of Salem’s research and experiments into trying to replicate what happened to Summer, and herself.

Again, I think this would hit WAY harder than Summer just being a mindless monster. I mean just imagine Ruby, Yang, Raven, Qrow, etc. expecting a Grimm!Summer to be some raving monster just like the Hound… only for some mysterious armored humanoid grimm to unmask herself to reveal Summer, who ISN’T mindless and straight up says she’s serving Salem WILLINGLY.

For one, this allows Grimm!Summer to be an actual CHARACTER instead of just a big scary monster. It lets Summer be an actual VILLAIN who can have conversations and debates with Ruby, Yang and the rest of her family, rather than just spouting creepy disjointed phrases.

Most importantly, it allows Summer to be a proper antagonist and foil to RUBY. An actual character to properly represent and embody Ruby’s self-destructive hero-complex taken to its inevitable conclusion. A way for Ruby to confront and battle, both physically AND ideologically, this part of herself she struggles so much with.

Finally, it allows Summer to be saved not through esoteric magic, but through Ruby and Yang and Raven and the rest of her family getting through all the pain and trauma she’s suffered and convincing Summer to come back to them. And for Ruby in particular, to save who essentially represent a broken version of herself.

Which in turn, going back to your point, means that Summer is actually fully cognizant and able to attempt ascension herself.