#dc demon

Sorry, I disagree with that, and for me, that seems like such a pointless technically :)

But like you said, DC has pointed out Trigon is not from “The Hell” and technically isn’t a demon.

However, at the exact same time, he’s still largely considered to be a demon by DC.

Which makes sense, seeing as he’s an immortal malevolent entity that has all the bells and whistles of a demon (+ more) and lives in a dimension, that for all intents and purposes is hell or a hell-dimension.

It just seems very silly to me, to say Trigon’s technically not demon.

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I think Hell (demons) should go beyond Lucifer or I guess really, human/earth religion in the DC world. I mean, why the hell not? (ha!)

What is hell? What is a demon?

Does hell and demons only exist in relation to more western-centric religious ideas? What about other religions, on earth and otherwise?

What about all the other planets in the universe? Other dimensions?

Are demons only applicable to humans and earth?

Do other planets/dimensions have afterlives specific to their religions? Hells or heavens, or something else altogether? What about their Gods or God?

Or is that all false and there is only one “God?” The Judeo-Christian-Islamic god?

For me, that limits so many possibilities. Especially considering how wide and complicated the DC universe actually is.

Furthermore, what’s the difference between a hell-like dimension, a hell dimension or simply hell?

While I don’t see Trigon or Raven being related to Lucifer, “God,” or Hell (specifically the Hell we see other DC heroes deal with), the two 100% count as demons.

Especially, since I think that complicates the idea of what demons are and makes demons go beyond Earth and more specifically, Christianity.

Slightly related (not really), I was never fan of how in BTVS and Angel, only crosses worked against vampires and no other symbols of religion. Why was Christianity the only religion that could hurt vampires?

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Personally, I just like the idea of Raven being a full-on demon (or part-demon).

Again, her classifying as one, just expands the idea of what demons are and makes things like religion, far more confusing in the DC world (like our own).

I mean, if you know there are angels and demons, and that holy water and crosses absolutely work on demons, doesn’t that just make Christianity an objective reality?

Isn’t it more interesting, if yes that stuff can work on some demons, but not for others? That you get the very frustrating answer, of - “it depends on what kind of demon.”

I think so.

I like the idea of someone who thinks they have a solid idea of what demons are and what works on them, have all that put into question once Raven comes into the picture. Because some of those things do apply to her, but others simply don’t.

Throwing holy water on Raven will only get you one very annoyed and wet demoness. But blast some holy magic at her and you might get a different story.

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This might just be me.

But I think saying Raven isn’t a demon, creatures that are objectively evil in DC canon, kind of takes away from the fact that Raven is this kind and caring individual, who is ultimately good.

Because, if she isn’t a demon (or a "true demon" as we think of them), then her being good isn’t necessarily this revolutionary idea.

It can still be one, for sure.

But it seems like someone can easily explain Raven being good, by simply saying - children aren’t their parents. Just because Trigon is evil, doesn’t mean Raven is.

Raven being born a good person (or neutral) who has this darker side that can take over her is all well and good (I’m certainly not complaining).

But that isn’t nearly as interesting to me as the concept of Raven, because she is part-demon, was born this malevolent entity, and aside from sheer power/being Trigon’s portal, is technically no different than any other demon.

And yet, she literally rewrote her very nature, by choosing to be good. She consistently chose the harder path for herself, literally defying the universe, and made the moral waters of good and evil, all the murkier.

And maybe it wasn’t just hard-work.

Maybe Raven got lucky because she was raised on Azarath or because of all her power / soul-self (or whatever); maybe she simply had an advantage over other demons, because she had so many more opportunities to learn how to be good.

I don’t know, I just love the idea that Raven was born half-demon (full on objectively evil demon) and was fated to destroy everything – either by freeing Trigon or by destroying everything herself.

And that’s it. No surprise twist or anything, no secret fate where she was also supposed to defeat Trigon.

No. Raven (and Trigon) were supposed to be how everything ended, no ifs, ands, or buts.

Except, that didn’t happen. This young woman fought tooth and nail to be someone else, to be someone who is good and kind.

And she succeeded.

The forces of the universe, that everything else has to bend to, were challenged by this small, stubborn woman; and one of them broke, and that one wasn’t Raven.

There’s also the added beauty of free-will.

DC's Main Villain Darkseid, main thing is to completely enslave the universe and destroy free-will with the anti-life equation. And while Raven has nothing to do with Darkseid, free-will being a factor in other DC stories, puts a smile on my face.

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Sorry, anon. You didn't ask for any of this.

You sent a message sort of at the wrong time (or right time, depending on how think about it), as I was writing down my ideas/headcanons of what demons and hell are in DC, or at least how I think of them.

And while you didn’t bring up religion and earth, I was already thinking about this stuff, so that’s on me.

I just like the idea of magic and demons/angels going beyond Earth and humanity, because usually in DC, that stuff seems to stay with Earth.

You are right though.

While DC does classify Trigon as Demon, they do seem to specify (or fans in charge of the wiki specify) that since he’s not from The “Hell,” he’s simply more akin to an entity that can be called a demon, rather than an actual one

But I find that to be boring, and again, a very silly and pointless technicality.

I would personally rather DC be like - Hell, Demons, and all of that nonsense are far more complicated than what we humans or mortals can possibly understand.

In my view,

Demons are the only creatures that can not only come from hell, but can also survive and thrive there as well.

Hell is a singular dimension that is made up of billions of different hell dimensions that simultaneously overlap and never interact with one another. Some of these hells are afterlife-dimensions that are the final destination for certain mortal souls, and others go beyond such simple ideas.