#antbee17

I saw a meltdown from someone who is now saying that "If Rey is weak and can't control the force properly without Kylo, SW and Disney is anti-feminist" and also said "This is probably a vendetta to keep Kylo alive because without him she would be useless. What is the point of making a force-user character like this? She is worthless. She has to rely on a man to gain excess to her power! I bet she'll have to ask permission like a obedient wife." What the actual F? This is not how the force works!

OKAY lol, so here’s the deal. Rant incoming, and not directed at you, Nonnie. Just general tone of rantiness:

Some people are just going to have to come to terms with the fact that Ben and Rey are are their strongest when they work together. Because, guess what? Kylo is having a hard time dealing with this shit too and, as we get more information during the lead up to the movies, I bet you he’s been having a hard time controlling his Force powers as well. As someone pointed out (maybe the following thread? i can’t find the damn comment), Kylo only fixes Hux’s collar after reaching towards him with what looks like a typical, Kylo going to Force choke you power, only for him to reach out and fix his collar instead. Yeah, of course it’s ship bait, but I also think that it’s more than that. I think he’s having the same struggles connecting with the Force as Rey.

The Force is fucking PISSED at these two. Here it brought them together, showed them how great they are as a team and how well they can protect/work together, and then they fucked it all up (because we’re at the midpoint in a three movie series and they had to). SO YEAH. If it’s not working for one, it’s not working for the other. Once they realize that they need to work together, like the Force has been showing them since TFA (hell, it even kept Rey and Kylo separated with the literal planet splitting between them so they couldn’t fight anymore), they will be unstoppable. They are literally each other’s equal in the Force.

“Darkness rises and Light to meet it.” WE KNOW THIS. The movie shows us this!

She’s conflicted and having a hard time centering her thoughts because she’s thinking about Ben and the burdens that are on her shoulders. She’s a GD symbol and that’s got to be hard to deal with without having a thing for the literal Supreme Leader of the galaxy. If she didn’t care about him (and if they didn’t have a fucking Force bond), this wouldn’t be an issue. But it is an issue because she cares about him. A lot! He disappointed her, and she disappointed him (not getting into the who’s right in that scenario because it’s irrelevant. Fact of the matter is, they both feel betrayed). Also, is she keeping that a secret? Who knows that she went to the Supremacy to save him? Aside from maybe Leia? Because that’s a pretty big fucking secret to have on your shoulders too.

She doesn’t need to ask his permission, she needs to understand that the conflict within her is coming as a result of her feelings for him and her own inabilty to reconcilate and accept her own dark side. Just like he needs to come to terms with and accept the light side in him. I really think that we’re going beyond good and evil with this. Might not be gray jedi (I know Pablo hates that term lol), but something new, something that is purely Force. OH and you know who agrees with me?

Luke fucking Skywalker:

“Using the Force is all about finding balance. And some Force users, particularly Force-sensitive children--known by the Jedi as younglings--are able to tap into its energy without an obvious alignment to either side. The Force simply flows through them in its purest form. Based on the constant struggles I’ve witnessed between the light and the dark sides of the Force, perhaps their innate neutrality can teach us all a valuable lesson.”

This is a Force issue, it’s a relationship issue, and it’s something they’re going to have to work through if they’re ever going to be able to resolve what’s between them. And think about it, when I’m upset with someone I care about, it impacts my ability to be able to do my work, absolutely it does.

Does that make it sexist? Fucking no. It means I care for them and I need to figure out how to solve the problem! I either need to talk to them and sort my shit out, or take a deep breath and find my center. Just like they need to find their center in the Force, but you know what helps? Having a friend or someone who understands there with you to help along the way. To help you understand the experiences you might have otherwise not understood.

The Force is there, it’s always there, and Rey’s had a hard time balancing herself for a while (remember the whole meditation thing with Luke). She needs help. She herself has said she needs help. There’s a power that inside her that she doesn’t understand and she needs to learn how to wield it. And guess who’s been set up to be her teacher (in one way or another) since TFA? Kylo fucking Ren. She goes to dark the same way he can’t keep himself from being attracted by the light.

THEY BALANCE EACH OTHER. And it’s okay! Her powers aren’t being taken from her, but her ability to access them is hampered by her own emotional state. Once she finds her center, her ability to use the Force properly will be just fine (because I think people forget that it takes a lot of mental control to be able to use the Force properly--hell, even Luke struggles with it on Hoth! Remember who helps him there? Obi-Wan’s Force ghost! Guess that’s sexist????).

Hell, I think she’s finding her center in the trailer when she backflips over Kylo’s TIE.

So much discourse comes from people’s headcanons not being validated and I certainly know that some of mine won’t be, but a lot of this angst is because people have been willfully ignoring what the story has been telling them all along.

Heteronormative? Sure, you could make a case for that, and this series as a whole needs to do better wrt representation across the board. Not feminist? How is saying that the only way a woman can be strong is if she only ever relies on herself any more feminist? I’m tired of this fucking narrative where women heroes aren’t allowed to have the same flaws, fuckups, weaknesses, you know, just generally be an interesting character, like their male counterparts. It’s bullshit. Women are multifaceted. They’re allowed to have flaws. They’re allowed to ask for help. They’re allowed to need other people. This shit carries over into IRL and I fucking hate it. Women do not have to be perfect. Not in life and certainly not in fucking fiction. YOU CAN BE A GREAT HERO AND STILL HAVE FLAWS. You can be a hero and not go it alone. You can be a hero and still fail.

The only reason some people have a problem with this is because they don’t like the character that’s clearly causing her conflict right now (but he’s not the only reason she’s feeling conflict!!!!). This all comes down to their fucking hate for Kylo Ren because if she was reliant on the character they shipped her with, there wouldn’t be a gd peep right now.

Anyways, I typed this all out, debated not posting it, but I’m gonna because it took a while.

People are going to believe what they want, I’m not going to change any opinions, but they have to take a moment to ask themselves why they are willing to invest so much time in energy in a series that apparently doing everything they hate all the time? Seems like a big waste of time to me.

I love his videos and have the utmost respect for him (and I do think much of this video is his own wishes for how the movie will go, which is totally fine), I just don’t see it going down the way he’s said.

I think our interpretations on what certain areas/characters mean is different and two because I think we have a different picture for how Ben’s redemption arc will play itself out. While he sees Ben as kind of taking up this mantle to destroy Luke (again), I really see as a defeated person who’s going to have one hell of a struggle to claw himself out of the hole he’s in–I think Ben wants to do good and believes that he can do good with the power he’s inherited both from his bloodline and being the Supreme Leader, but he’s going about it in the wrong ways (therefore the ending of VIII).

I really don’t see the story focusing so much on Ben’s vengeance for Luke because I really think he came to realize how hollow that is by the ending of VIII (where he ends up alone and on his knees, separated from the one person in the galaxy that understands him). If Ben were going to be continuing on with vengeance, I think both Luke and Ben’s stories (and endings) would have been framed differently. One, I think Ben would have looked angrier at the ending with Rey (and not quite so heartbroken) and two, I also think that Luke wouldn’t have been such a mystical figure in the galaxy.

Half of the galaxy thinks that Luke Skywalker is a myth, and therefore wouldn’t give a shit about whether he’s got a great reputation throughout the galaxy or not–because they don’t even really believe that he exists. And while yes, for some people who heard the David and Goliath-like story that came out of Crait, I think that’s more to drive home the point that heroes can come from all walks of life and that all it takes is one gesture to set it all in motion–irrespective of the fact that it’s Luke. It doesn’t matter that it’s Luke, it’s that one small faction stood up against an insurmountable foe and lived to tell the tale. It could have just as easily been someone else (not for the audience, obviously, it has significance because of how much of a hero Luke is for us, but the galaxy doesn’t have that (at least, not a big portion of it).

I also think this story path (one that focuses on the past) takes agency away from the main characters and puts the focus back on the OT characters, which these movies are decidedly not trying to do (Let the past die). It would take the focus of the story and put it on Anakin and Luke, when it should be Finn, Rey, and Kylo. And, if this episode were to focus on any character relationship (insofar as the Skywalkers go and their relationships as a family), it would be the relationship with Ben and his mother (as VII was Ben and Han, VIII was Ben and Luke). And I am inclined to believe that Hux will pull some shit and be a threat to Leia, forcing Ben to make a choice concerning his mother, so I definitely see where he’s going with that idea.

I also think that the World Between Worlds is more a transitory space–something like the River Styx–something that links the past to the present, or life to death, and I don’t think it will feature heavily in EPIX. If it does, however, I agree it will be used to help Ben come to realize that he needs to move beyond his anger and believe that he’s worthy of being loved, but I think that realization will come at finally understanding his father’s sacrifice, and not by witnessing the past through Anakin and Luke’s eyes. Though I do agree that the WBW, insofar as the Emperor is concerned, is a way to cheat death, which is another reason why I think it will be used sparingly, if at all (because it opens up a whole can of bullshit if used improperly). I think the resurrection idea will primarily be metaphoric, with visual callbacks, instead of direct links RE: Anidala and Reylo.

Most of all, and I mean this for all the characters in the final movie, the journey will primarily be focused on their internal struggles, against the backdrop of the greater conflict in the galaxy. And, as he says, a need to conquer the evil within–that I totally agree on.

Much of what’s said kind of focuses too heavily on Ben (I can’t believe I’m saying that) and I don’t think would really leave enough time to give the rest of the characters the time they also need and deserve. While I love Reylo, I don’t think that Rey’s story should be centered around convincing Ben that he belongs on the good side (and I don’t think that’s what WJ is suggesting, but I just want to be clear myself). Ben honestly and truly needs to come to that conclusion on his own and, while she can help him, she also deserves to have her own story told.

But I also agree that I’d fucking scream and die in my seat if either Ben or Rey says some variation of “I’ll come back, sweetheart. I promise.” But that’s just me being a dirty ole shipper lol.

Also, this theory doesn’t really consider the fact that the Grysk are out there, being a real fucking threat to the galaxy at large. So I really think the motivation after this movie will be that there’s a big huge enemy that’s coming and people need to leave behind their bullshit (FO vs Resistance), because they’re going to have to unite under a common cause (and I think Finn will factor heavily into this).

I do love his videos and, even though there are some points I don’t agree on, I appreciate his enthusiasm and research (that and the fact that he’s quite feminist, as was George).