This account exists solely for my DC Comics (mainly Batman) fixation, my love of the TV show Danny Phantom, and sometimes the DPxDC fandom. (I will tag each one appropriately. Just mute the tags detective comics comics, Danny phantom, or dpxdc if you don't want to see certain things from me).
I am not the headcanon police. I like to clear up misinformation because it spreads like wildfire and I am aware most fans don't have easy access to the source material. I didnât grow up with comic book money and streaming services are predatory cost-wise. If you have the information and like to enjoy your headcanons contrary to the source material, even if I say they aggravate me specifically, that's cool. You do you, boo. (Unless a Gothamite is calling pork roll Taylor Ham. You are not allowed this one /mostly joking and seething in exaggerated Central & South Jersey rage)
Sometimes I will be brave enough to post on Ao3: Spectral_phases
Sometimes I will even be brave enough to post on Reddit: u/Spectral_phases
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The Batkids favorite hero is Batman but they won't let him know even if it means their death. They just say any random hero's name when someone asks them who their favorite is. It might have been true when they were young but now? The favorite is obvious and everyone know Everyone except Bruce.
Bruce: That's why you're his favorite.
Clark, wide-eyed: When he was ten!
Clark: so Supermanâs still your favorite?
Dick, who told Bruce last week heâd die for him and then crashed out and cried so hard when Bruce hugged him he had to lie down: yeah, what makes you say that?
An Analysis of Duke Thomas in Wayne Family Adventures
I've been seeing a lot of posts and comments recently concerning Duke Thomas in WFA. I know WFA discourse has been done to death, but these comments were about how they'd only read WFA, felt Duke lacked a personality, his powers weren't distinctive, etc. Out of the main WFA characters, I think Duke has the least-read comics and the least understood canon history. This post is going to dissect WFA!Duke, compare it with canon!Duke, and address whether WFA is a fair representation of Duke or not.
This is not a WFA hate post. A lot of comics readers love WFA and vice versa, and I'm not going to dictate what people should like or dislike. Check out this post I made yesterday about the origins of WFA, which really aren't ill-intentioned. However, judging by the comments/posts I've seen, a lot of people don't know the difference between WFA!Duke and canon!Duke. This post exists to clarify those discrepancies and hopefully encourage more people to read Duke's comics.
The Positives
Let's cover the pros of WFA!Duke first! The sheer fact that he's one of the main characters and present throughout is amazing, allowing more people to learn and get interested in Duke. Since he doesn't have his own ongoing, WFA is about the only place to get consistent Duke content.
Plus look at how cute he is:
His presence also means we get fun interactions with other characters that Duke doesn't get to interact with in canon, such as Steph and Dick. As a diehard Duke-is-Dick's-successor believer, I appreciate any page-time they get together, even if it's not substantial.
Also, WFA season 3 confirmed that Duke can turn invisible without his suit, which is just fun!
Framing
Duke is introduced in the very first episode, and in some ways is the framing device for the entire webtoon. He is "Gotham's Newest Vigilante," learning about the family and the manor.
Many episodes of WFA have Duke asking a question that the others respond to. You can see this in Episode 2 ("The Last Cookie," he asks about their tradition), Episode 7 ("Vigilante Bingo"), Episode 30 ("Driving Lessons"), Episode 39 ("Secret Identity"), all the way to one of the latest minisodes (Mini Episode 3 - Super Friends).
This framing is not completely incorrect, since Duke is the newest addition to the family. The problem with this framing, though, is that Duke's personality and problems are never the focus - in these episodes we learn a lot about the other Batfam, and nothing about Duke.
Take "Vigilante Bingo". We learn so much canon stuff about Dick, Jay, Tim, and Cass, including who's died/come back (Cass and Tim chime in here, which is not very well known in fanon). However, because Duke is the one asking the question, he doesn't get to participate in the answers. This framing makes WFA-only readers learn shockingly little about Duke's prior activities, and they only cover his backstory in episode 76.
Personality
Because of his perpetual outsider status, WFA!Duke's most prominent traits are confusion, timidity, and insecurity.
(I found all these by literally clicking on any thumbnail with Duke in it. He exhibits confusion/timidity/insecurity all the time).
The first two traits - confusion and timidity - is completely antithetical to Duke in canon. Just compare these panels from We Are Robin #6 to a panel from WFA:
Canon!Duke gets shot and thinks to himself: "how baller is that?!". WFA!Duke hears about a booby-trapped lawn and makes that face. This reaction is basically the opposite of the way WAR!Duke would react. I have legitimately no clue how anyone could read We Are Robin or The Cursed Wheel and come away with Duke being timid.
More examples of how canon!Duke acts when confronted with dangerous situations, just for fun:
From We Are Robin #2, we have Duke mouthing off to people he's just met; from Robin War, we have the iconic jumping-out-of-cop-car scene; from Robin War again, we have Duke standing up for one more battle against Damian with absolutely no hesitation.
Duke in canon is headstrong, stubborn to a fault, outspoken, and brave. These qualities just don't come through in WFA.
Insecurity
The third component of WFA!Duke's personality, insecurity, is the only one with some canon basis. Check out this panel from Batman & The Signal #1:
Here, he's struggling with his place in the family, something WFA!Duke also deals with in Episode 75 + 76 ("Worthy"). But I think WFA misconstrued where this insecurity comes from.
Duke's problem is not that he's a meta, it's that he's a meta with "powers no one understands yet". A "walking detective case," so to speak. His insecurity stems from his lack of understanding around his powers, because at this point he doesn't know about Gnomon. WFA somehow turns this into a problem with the powers itself:
This is simply not supported in canon. Duke has no problems using his powers; even in Batman & The Signal, the peak of his canon insecurities, he literally says "go, go ghost vision" (god I love him). Moreover, his powers come from his mom. Saying that Duke feels he needs to prove he's worthy "in spite of" his powers is a complete misreading of Duke's canon feelings. Which leads to my next point:
Family
"Worthy" positions Duke's powers in opposition to Bruce's approval, and though the episode ends with Duke accepting himself, it's clear throughout WFA that his biggest parental figure/source of approval is Bruce.
WFA!Duke talks and thinks about Bruce more than he does his mom and dad, which is genuinely mind-boggling. Canon!Duke talks about his parents basically every single page. It's one of the most consistent aspects of his character!
From We Are Robin #2, Batman & The Signal #1, The Cursed Wheel Part 1, and Batman: Urban Legends #19. Duke's parents are only mentioned in "Worthy" as part of his traumatic backstory, but Duke's parents aren't backstory - they're alive. By neglecting the importance of Duke's parents, WFA is ignoring a fundamental aspect of Duke's character and making him seem like just another orphan.
This panel from Episode 118 is hilarious in the context of canon!Duke waffling on about his parents 24/7. But the erasure of Duke's parents is symptomatic of another problem with WFA.
Supporting Cast
Duke's first multi-parter is Episodes 8/9/10, "Crush". In this episode, Duke asks a girl out, and then she breaks up with him.
First of all, compared to other two-parters (all of Cass', Dick's "Big Brother", Steph's "Belonging", hell even Tim's "Better and Brighter"), this two-parter is incredibly detached from Duke's character. All you learn is that he gets crushes and doesn't like break-ups, which isn't character-specific at all.
Secondly, using an OC as Duke's girlfriend is so bizarre given Duke has 1 canon love interest. Here, I googled it:
Imagine the story we could've gotten with Izzy instead; with them having canon history, this two-parter would've been a lot more impactful, and introduce We Are Robin characters to a WFA audience. I'd also like to point out the difference in how these relationships begin:
Another example of WFA introducing timidity into a scenario where canonically, Duke played it extremely cool (from We Are Robin #9).
WFA uses none of Duke's supporting cast. To be fair, Duke's supporting cast isn't well known, but isn't WFA a perfect low-stakes place to spotlight unknown characters? Harper gets appearances, and she's been neglected by canon for ages. Tim gets to have Bernard, Jason gets literally all of his Outlaws, and there's even a KonCass cameo!
There's a reason why the top comment on every single one of the Crushed eps doesn't even mention Duke.
Shouldn't Duke-centric episodes have comments about Duke? The story is so vague and widely applicable that there's nothing about Duke to comment on, so the spotlight is shifted onto the other Batfam members. If the story had included Duke's supporting cast, think about how much more we could've learned about Duke himself.
Side note: why on Earth is Luke Fox Duke's go-to mentor? They have next to no canon interactions, and while having a Black mentor is something Duke probably needs, he already has one. Batman and The Outsiders sets up the Duke and Black Lightning relationship really nicely. Not to mention in "Worthy," Duke's problem is about having powers, which makes Luke Fox's inclusion (as a non-meta) baffling. Black Lightning would've been perfect!
Conclusion + Wishlist
This is the top comment on Episode 76. I think I've demonstrated how untrue this is, because WFA!Duke doesn't even touch the worst of canon!Duke. WFA!Duke has next to no defining characteristics, which contributes to him being the 'boring' or 'sane' one. To any WFA-only readers, please don't think this is representative of Duke as a whole; reading even just the first issue of We Are Robin shows how interesting and full of personality he really is.
It's disappointing because WFA is a lot of people's only exposure to the Batfam, and portraying Duke like this has only caused them to misinterpret his character. However, there has been improvement - they're beginning to mention his backstory a lot more, which means they've read some of his comics. I still believe they can turn it around!
Here's some improvements they could make, along with some things I want expanded upon:
Stop using Duke as the outsider/newbie character. It's been over 100 eps, he doesn't need that anymore!
Mention his supporting cast, or at the very least mention his parents more
Expand on his canon relationships with Damian, Cass, and Jason, they deserve to be close!
Use his detective abilities/affinity for puzzles
Mention his dislike of heights
Involve him in more shenanigans
I don't have FastPass but please bring Duke back into the fold of S3!!
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[Image ID: A very confused, and slightly horrified looking Danny Phantom holds the Little Baby Man version of himself that is hugging his hand and purring. /. End ID]
So here's a fun thought: Consider a situation in which LBM is NOT, in fact, a tiny Danny, but a mimic blob ghost that has adopted his image as a form of Batesian self defense. Then imagine Danny's reaction to seeing some fucked up little uncanny valley cat version of himself with zero warning or context.
Per Wikipedia: "Batesian mimicry is a form of mimicry where a harmless species has evolved to imitate the warning signals of a harmful species directed at a predator of them both."
A Non-Exhaustive Guide to Future and Alternative Swearing in DC Comics.
Legionnaires #23 Swears curtesy of the Legionnaire's resident potty mouth Querl Dox aka Brainiac 5.
Being that DC spans many different periods in time there are many different curses and swears that have been used with varying degrees of frequency among multiple characters.
Bart Allen and other time displaced characters are some of those in the modern timestream that use some of the following in place of English swears. Otherwise the bulk of these words are used in comics such Legion of Super-Heroes and sometimes in comics that take place off-world.
To note, most of these swear words are supposed to be taken directly from Interlac, the universal language spoken by everyone in the 31st century as a unifying interstellar language.
Interlac is a language that is many thousands of years old by the 31st century, and the same Interlac language exists in the 21st century as well. There are some references that the language does shift over the thousand years of time passage, but it is still recognizable between speakers.
Without further elaboration here is a non-exhaustive list of the most common swears, their approximate meaning, and general time/place/characters they are used in/by.
Grife
Meaning: Fuck/Shit.
An intense swear used as an expletive for surprise or frustration. Sometimes used as "fucking" where -ing is attached to the end.
Used commonly in the 31st century and by Bart Allen in the 21st century.
Sprock
Meaning: Also Fuck/Shit.
An intense swear used as an expletive for surprise or frustration. Sometimes used as "fucking" where -ing is attached to the end. Is generally interchangeable with grife. Sometimes, both grife and sprock are combined to create compound swears such as "gee-sprocking-rife" courtesy of Brainiac 5.
Used commonly in the 31st century by all Legionnaires. Has made its way into other media such as the CW's Supergirl.
Nass/Nass-Head
Meaning: Shit/Ass
An expletive used often as an insult or as as a common crass intensifier. Most commonly used as "nass-head" in place of "shit-head" or "We're going to kick nass!" or "We're stepping in nass."
Used in the 31st century.
Scroach
Meaning: Bastard/Fucker
A derogatory uncommon/rare insult directed at someone. "That person is such a sprocking scroach I want to beat the nass out of them."
Used by a future version of Bart Allen in the Impulse comics during the Dark Tomorrow story arc. As far as I know, it is exclusive to the Impulse comics.
Grokk/Grok
Meaning: Shit/Fuck/Damn
An expletive used in surprise or frustration, much like sprock or grife.
This swear is used more commonly in 21st century interlac in comics like L.E.G.I.O.N. or comics that take place off of Earth. This swear has made it into other media as an Easter Egg such as in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.
Bart Allenâs Characterization, as per his CREATOR. | Dare I say, the Bart Allen post, to end all Bart Allen posts? |
Bart Allen is a character that is so often badly characterized that most people out there have no idea what heâs like. Heâs constantly characterized as essentially a 7-year-old, and was even believed by some fans to be only 10-years-old to 12-years-old when his solo started. This is not the case, as while he arrived as a 12-year-old at the very beginning of his first appearance, his struggle was that he aged rapidly, meaning that by the end of that fiasco, his age settled at the age of 15-years-old.
This isnât even close to the only misconception about Mister Bartholomew Henry Allen the second. As due to later writers consistently infantilizing this once magnificent representation of a teenager with ADHD, that had fun dynamics as a fish out of water, his original personality is something that many Bart Allen fans wish would come back from the war once again. It was what allowed Bart to be an initially popular character, that had a decently lasting solo series, that was eventually slowly killed by bad characterization and infantilization.
Heck, itâs hard to begin to know where to start since thereâs so many misconceptions about what was intended by his creator. Iâm going to do my best, though, as I am one of those many that wish for Bartâs original characterization to come back. Heâs not a hyper little boy as people think (Again, he was never 10-years-old. They just didnât care to draw him properly when he returned. And his return panel is so widely shared these days). Heâs actually the most teenagery teenager thatâs ever existed.
So Iâm going to start with the first issue of his solo series and go from there. Iâm using the first ten issues of his solo as my line of research, since by then his characterization is readily fleshed out, and you can understand a lot of his true depth.
Also, this is going to be super long, but if you want to know Bartâs character like a pro-Bart-Allen-Er (?) this is the post for you.
What makes Bart unique, and whatâs Bart like at school?
Im DYING to hear what you have time to say about Tim bring atheist
Okay so this is partly answering a longer ask I'm currently working on about each character's religion in canon, but let me just say this: DC Comics pretending like any hero is actually atheist cracks me up because it's an unbearably stupid concept in a world where mulitple pantheons of gods literally exist, the Spectre is God's Chosen, and Heaven and Hell are both tangible places multiple heroes have been. They might not believe in YOUR* god, but I find it extremely difficult to believe they don't believe in A god (or gods).
*generic you, encompassing any given religion and/or interpretation of the divine
I specifically want to inspect Fabian Nicieza's brain while he was writing Tim's Judgement on Gotham tie-in issue, because one of his best friends is Zeus's daughter, he semi-regularly works with Azrael, and he's good friends with Helena Bertinelli...but he doesn't believe in a god or understand the concept of Catholic Suffering?
My mom was a little religious, my dad not at all. So when she was killed--and my dad was left in a coma--I didn't have a strong foundation of faith to turn to. By the time my father was killed--then so many of my friends--all I had left to turn to was anger. It was easier than believing in a God who had let that happen. But anger sovled little and when the world was in crisis...I prayed. I heard only silence. So I confessed my sins...and realized I had none. How could someone who tried so hard to be good--did so much for so many people--be asked to endure so much? -Red Robin (2009) #22
Nicieza had not read the Book of Job in several years (if he ever had) when he wrote that issue, I'll tell you that much. If he had, we might be having a very different conversation about Tim Drake's religious belief system right now.
My larger beef with DC is that their writers continually impose their own incredibly limited, biased, and Western Christian-centric religious views onto characters in a universe where those views make no sense, and there's fewer characters that issue is more prominent with than Bruce Wayne and Tim Drake; while there's nuance to be found in the difference between belief and worship, writers often throw around atheism whenever they want to prove how "logical and intelligent" their character is. Except within the canonical constraints of the DCU...claiming to be atheist just makes them look dumb, because they're denying an objective fact of their universe.
Basically: you can be generally non-religious (or non-practicing) without being a non-believer, which is what most of the "atheists" in the DCU probably should be. Realistically, any hero a writer wants to make "atheist" should be saying something like "all these gods and divine forces in the universe and not one of them chose to help me when I was suffering? They don't deserve to be worshipped" instead of "I don't believe in god."
But that would require comic writers to actually engage in a nuanced understanding of religion (within a fantasy world or otherwise), which we know a solid 95% of them are incapable of doing. Thus: Tim Drake, "technical atheist" despite being besties with a literal demi-goddess, personally witnessing multiple resurrections, and having worked with the physical embodiment of the Abrahamic God's Wrath/Vengeance on multiple occasions.
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there will never be anything as funny as the mutual disbelief between long form and short form fic writers about each other's style.
short form writers look at people writing 100k+ fics as though this is some sort of talent given as part of a fae bargain, that the commitment required shows some sort of ungodly mental fortitude.
meanwhile long form writers look at people writing 1000 word one shots like god I would cut off my left nipple to be able to say anything concisely. i would love to play with multiple ideas. free me from the shackles of this child I have birthed. i love them but I now must take them to t-ball and doctor's appointments and they're going to destroy everything I own.
Can I ask why you hate Batman and Robin Eternal? (it was my first DC comic ever, my dad bought it for me in one of his trips even though I didnât know anything about the batfam or comics in general lmao). Itâs been so long since the last time I read it I donât even remember what it was about (I do remember enjoying it in that moment but it may have also been because it was a gift and the drawings were cool lol)
Aww, thatâs very sweet. There are certainly bits of the comic that are enjoyable. Iâm pretty sure that Iâm actually in the minority when I say that I donât care for it...but since you asked lol, there are several things about these comics that really rub me the wrong way. This is pretty negative (and way longer than Iâd planned), so be warned.Â
For starters, Dick Grayson was just...not treated well by his family members in these comics. It felt particularly brutal here specifically...I think because Dick would say very harmless things, and his familyâs responses in return were so abrupt and unreasonably harsh. Like, Dick says that heâs glad to see Batgirl, and wonders what some kids are doing dressed as Robin...
Batman and Robin Eternal #4
And Batgirl bites his head off. Or, there were times where Dick would just be hanging out in the general vicinity, and people would just take shots at him out of the blue for seemingly no reason.Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #3
It felt like he could barely breathe without someone criticizing him for it. At one point, Dick confesses that heâs feeling discouraged, and Damianâs response is to punch him in the face.Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #22
Which is a pretty good summary of the familyâs treatment of him in these comics to be honest. Just literally, lashing out at him for zero reason while he just takes it.Â
One scene in particular that really frustrated me was this one:Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #5
You know, that other time in this comic series where one of Dickâs family members punches him in the face while he, once again, takes the hit and does nothing to retaliate. Good times.Â
For context...the big bad in these comics is a villain known as âMother.â Her speciality is brainwashing. She placed several of her âchildrenâ in high-profile positions in order to enact her plans, even managing to infiltrate Spyral. In a message left for Dick, Batman specifically explains that âAnyone could be under her control, Dick. They could be people you know. People you loveâŚthey probably will beâ (Batman and Robin Eternal #1).Â
Unlike in Pre-52, Timâs background is largely a mystery. Heâs acting suspiciously. So, Dick takes it upon himself to investigate and ensure that Timâs not one of Motherâs plants.Â
On Timâs side of things, heâs upset that Dick investigated behind his back and found out where heâd secretly had his parents living for their safety. Dick unintentionally brought danger to their doorstep (though, notably, no one was actually hurt). But Timâs pissed, and punches Dick in the face.Â
Not gonna lie, this was hard to take. I mean, even if Tim was in the right in this argument (which he lowkey isnât in my eyes), that still does not make it ok for him to just punch Dick out of the blue when Dick is, as pictured above, just talking to him.Â
And the hypocrisy that Tim is displaying here is stunning. How he had previously told Dick off for keeping secrets from the family by going undercover with Spyral, when he in fact had a whole secret family tucked away in a corner. How he tells Dick off now for invading peopleâs privacy, when just earlier in this very comic he had planted surveillance devices in Stephanieâs apartment without her consent.Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #2
How Tim storms off and goes on a solo mission with Jason because Dickâs supposedly too personally invested and thus compromised, when he just got so emotionally unhinged that he lost his shit at Dick and punched him. Once again, may I just say, simply stunning.Â
But does Tim ever face any consequences for this behavior? Oh, of course not! Instead, we get Jason joking about how great it is to punch Dick in the face when he is not even fighting back.Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #7
And everyone collectively piling on to Dick and blaming him, even though he had legitimate concerns. Awesome.Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #6
Batman and Robin Eternal #7
And Dick just continues to take it. Not once does he stand up for himself. Itâs so hard to read him continually get shit on, Iâm sorry. And itâs crazy how they treat him this way, and yet still ultimately look to him for encouragement and rely on him to save the day in the end? You hate to see it.Â
I also didnât like what they did with Cass. I know, Iâm just full of complaints. But they really watered her down. With Pre52 Cass, you could actually describe facets of her personality. She was compassionate, had a very refreshing, sassy sense of humor, etc. She wasnât just...mysterious action girl who has a dark past and cries occasionally. I mean, there were moments where I could see glimpses of personality (the time she visited the ballet being the main one), but on the whole she punched people when needed, and otherwise just stood there as people talked about and around her. Essentially a prop for the story.Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #24
Another thing that makes me so uncomfortable (that I couldnât pin down until I read this post here)Â is the fact that this comics version of events makes it so that Cassâ own backstory no longer has her as the focus; itâs not about her emotional struggles and journey. By having Cass kill Harperâs mother rather than a random man, it makes the story about Harper, and about Cass gaining Harperâs forgiveness. So...more using Cass as a prop...as an element of someone elseâs story in what is supposed to be her origin!Â
Honestly, I have no idea why Cass would want to stay with the Bat-family in these comics anyway...her previous mentorship with Barbara Gordon is nonexistent. Sheâs no longer Batgirl. The two people who were once her closest friends treat her horribly.Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #3
Batman and Robin Eternal #4
As if sheâs barely a person. Once again, sooooo hard to read this. Why.Â
Yeah, I could go on forever nitpicking here. You probably got a sense of it already, but I absolutely despise how Tim is characterized here. Most of the time, heâs an ass. Jason also had pretty inconsistent characterization. And I really donât like how the whole comic treats Robin like something Batman owns and is meant to benefit from, rather than as something Dick created. I donât like how Cain was âredeemedâ in the end, and that Cass took on the name Orphan instead of Black Bat or Batgirl. Once again, how is she connected to the Bat-family exactly? And I donât like how Dickâs time as Robin is portrayed.Â
The existence of this comic...drives me insane...
Itâs also the worst time to be doing a âDoes Batman treat his kids like child soldiers?â arc considering it is coming on the tail end of Spyral, aka that one thing that Dick did because Bruce beat the shit out of him and forced him to.Â
Nightwing #30
Looking through Batmanâs speech to Dick there...some of the things he says to Dick are so uncomfortably close to what Cain says to Cass. Really horrible parallel there. Why DC.Â
I really donât know why Dick was so certain that Bruce didnât do something shady with Mother, as was implied throughout the comic, when Bruce had pulled the Spyral crap fairly recently. Idk why they didnât play into that side of things. Like, the fact that this arc ends with Dick comforting Batman about them not being child soldiers:Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #26
Instead of Batman stepping up to reaffirm to Dick that he was a good partner and a trusted ally when he spent the whole comic being insulted by his family and being told this stuff by his enemies (and flashback!Batman):Â
Batman and Robin Eternal #8
Batman and Robin Eternal #12
Just sucks. I mean, Dick had just recently sacrificed everything (his family, his friends, his life, his identity, everything) to do as Batman wanted and go undercover, only to hear this over and over? To hear that none of it was enough? That he could never be enough? And Dick never gets reassurance that this isnât true. This comic is just agonizing in so many ways.Â
Obviously, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and I am not criticizing this to be a killjoy? Just venting. If you enjoy these comics, you are free to continue to do you. But I am never going to like them. And when I see people championing these books as the best the Bat-fam has to offer...oof is that hard to hear lmao! Surely we can do better than all this.Â
"character deserved better" (but they were never going to get it that's the stuff great tragedies are made of) vs "character deserved better" (but the writers really blew it)
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The manor hasn't ever been drawn consistently in the comics, and every version shown in the movies is a different building in England/Scotland (we once got as close as a Jacobean-style mansion from New York), but if we try hard and believe in our squinting ability really really well, Crocker Mansion looks at least a little bit like this blueprint of Wayne Manor with Batcave. Crocker Mansion is also listed as Gothic Revival built in the early 1900s and Wayne Manor was built in the late 1800s, and, most importantly, it has 21 bedrooms (okay, most importantly it's from New Jersey like Gotham City) so I'm sold on it being visual inspo for Wayne Manor.
But like, these are also all Wayne Manor in the comics, so if we all agreed on Crocker Mansion at least we'd be somewhere lol
And we'd at least be in the right area geographically compared to the movies:
(The Braes, Glen Cove, New York; Mentmore Towers, Buckinghamshire, England; Wollaton Hall, Nottingham, England; Hartwood Hospital, Glasgow, Scotland)
I also found some more pics from when Crocker Mansion was for sale that need to be included for reference:
It's just perfect. I will be using this forever going forward. Thank you so much for this find.
Here is your monthly reminder that Amity Park is a city not a small town
They have a large town hall, a water park, a zoo, a ski run in the winter, from what I remember, enough open, unclaimed land to put a circus/fair on, and a medium-sized mall. We could have other high schools that we the viewers never learned about because they were not plot important. There is at least 4 public parks and also the zoo has enough funding to hold and house a heavily endangered species
It looks like the plot centers around a suburb of the larger city that is amity park
It's a smaller city, but it's definitely a city, likely a city that's on the outskirts of a larger city. For my own frame of reference, as a Jersey girlâ˘, I see it as closer to something like New Brunswick, NJ, a city with a population of approx. 55,000 people and a size of 5.75 sq. mi, though I think Amity Park is just slightly larger, but that reference gives me a better vibe for Amity Park overall compared to other cities I'm familiar with.
For example, Amity Park has got a relatively smaller urban center with a few skyrises, but it's mostly just suburbs as seen in these shots:
Not that the urban center isn't well developed, just that the city is more sprawling than really tall/built up with lots of shorter buildings in the more metro areas of the city and many open lots/parking for individual businesses throughout.
It's got a big zoo, a big park, at least Casper Highschool, an observatory, two large theaters (Googolplex Cinemas and Marmel's Multiplex 22. I think they're supposed to be the same thing but let's just say they aren't), a few factories (Molasses factory and a mattress factory (though that might just be a store)), a penitentiary, a large two or three-story mall, a museum, an abandoned hospital (implying there is a newer one?), a mansion for the mayor, the fair grounds by the train tracks, an amusement park on the water, and a waterfront large enough for a docks/warehouse situation (likely around the river that sits between Amity Park and Elmerton, though I think, given the size of the ship docked in Amity Park, it has to be on the shore of the Great Lakes).
