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@sokkastyles
I got a very niche question. Letâs say hypothetical Zuko and Katara got married and he essentially âadoptsâ Bumi, Kya and Tenzin. Would they get titles or like whatâs the situation with that I guess not but also Iâm not sure? What the fandomâs opinion on this?ďżź
I think they would not automatically become princes and princesses but he could declare them as such.
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It wouldn't work for a number of reasons but there is potentially a really funny Zutara fanfic in the idea of Katara-as-the-Painted-Lady asking her mysterious new ally and vigilante partner the Blue Spirit for help finding the enterence to the Library. Zuko agrees because he thinks it'll give him a good chance to snatch Aang (or so he tells himself) he ends up going into the Library too for... reasons. There he talks to Roku, learns about his bloodline, Sozin's Comet, and that his father really is THAT CRAZY. And that (plus other things) is enough to convince Zuko to disavow his father completely and join the Team Avatar. Unfortunately, his mask gets knocked off while they're all trying to escape but at that point they have a giant owl trying to eat them so they agree to table the discussion of Zuko's new moral alignment.
They also have to deal with Zuko yelling at the giant owl who is trying to eat them because he's trying to dress it down for not taking a moral stance in the war like wow people are DYING what do you MEAN? And the gaang is like well I guess he really does have good in him after all. No, Zuko that's too much good, you're going to die.
I feel like TSR would have had the exact same result without Aang's intervention. I don't think Aang's "advice" for Katara had any influence at all on her decision to not kill Yon Rha.
It just showed us that Zuko understood Katara's needs better than Aang and that Aang didn't trust her to make the right choice.
Exacty! She didn't choose not to kill Yon Rah because she forgave him, or saw the sanctity of his life, or whatever nonsense Aang was peddling. She chose not to forgive him because he was pathetic. Had he made any move towards defending himself, that would have been the end of Yon Rah. She says it, out loud, in the end that Aang was wrong about what she needed, and she was right. She didn't need to kill Yon Rah, or forgive him. What she needed was to confront him- confront her biggest trauma and realize she was stronger than it. Just like Zuko needed to confront Ozai. Aang wouldn't understand that, though, because Aang has never actually had to confront any of his trauma. Any time he got close, the narrative shielded him from the weight of it.
I think the biggest change if Aang had been just somewhere offscreen with Toph during the episode is that Katara would be less pissed off about the whole thing, and would be less angry, less likely to commit violence because now no one is pushing forgiveness on her and making her feel like she isn't being understood (she straight up told Aang he didn't understand, it doesn't matter if you think Aang does, Katara does not feel understood), and then when she got back, she still would not have killed or forgiven, but she'd be less sad and confused and more confident that she'd made the right decision because she doesn't have to face Aang judging her anymore. That's a net positive.
my headcanon for Aang being an uncle to Zutara's steambabies is that he'd draw arrows on the baby to be funny (and it is funny) and then play around with them pretending to make them fly around and airbend with swooshy sound effects and subsequently get himself banned from babysitting alone bc he accidentally used ink that takes days to wash off so Fire Lord Zuko and Fire Lady Katara had to act serious and diplomatic while carrying around their baby with airbender tattoos drawn on their head, AND they were posing for a family portrait the next day.
Decades later some historian uncovers this portrait and is like "hm, we know firelord Zuko and fire lady Katara were friends with Avatar Aang, but who knew that Avatar Aang was in fact a baby?"
Hi,
Hope you are doing well.
Regarding the Taga subplot, with Aang wanting to reconnect with the guy because he was an "airbender" (I know he is lying as per the leaks), I had a query.
The idea that Aang finds out about surviving Air Nomads made me think, how would they react to his presence? Would they be happy that he survived or would they be antagonistic to him because to them Aang had abandoned them to the Firebenders attack, even if it was not his intent.
I would like your thoughts on this.
From what I remember from the movie, Taga isn't lying about being an airbender, it's just that he isn't a true one in the sense that he was not born with the ability. This doesn't seem to matter at all to Aang, oddly. Especially considering that his alleged connection with Taga was supposed to be about his culture and people, not just airbending. And also considering Aang's previous characterizations when he had repeatedly seen people who he thought were like his. He was initially resentful of Teo and his friends, for example, and dismissive of the nomads in the Cave of Two Lovers episode when he found out they weren't Air Nomads. He was also initially uncomfortable with the Air Acolytes. It's strange that he becomes so accepting of Taga so quickly.
I think that the question of how surviving Air Nomads would react to Aang is an interesting one. I think it would be mixed, like the way the EK people reacted to Aang. Some would see him as a symbol of hope, and some would probably resent him for surviving when they themselves had to watch their people be persecuted and live in hiding for a hundred years. It would be interesting to see how Aang as a character would have to square his unwillingness to bend his cultural rules with descendents of his people who had assimilated with the EK (or even the FN) for survival.
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The fights will absolutely be more entertaining than the movie, but zutara antis still won't win.
It really doesn't matter what people want to use to justify Aang yelling at Katara in the movie, because the creators could have written whatever they wanted to justify him treating her that way. The fact that they didn't bother and it comes across as poorly justified is a testament to how much this movie does not care about Katara.
I couldn't help myself. đ I imagine adult Zuko is better at communicating...sort of.
zutara this kataang that has nobody ever considered zutaraang
No one. You are the very first. The only one. The most specialist snowflake.
Guess whoâs scar is pointed away from us the vast majority of this episode especially during all Kataraâs story beats.
I don't really ascribe to the "scarred side = bad choice" thing because Zuko's scar is not something that makes him bad or monstrous. I prefer to think of it as when Zuko's scar is in focus, it means he's dwelling / acting on his trauma. In The Southern Raiders, he acts mostly on behalf of Katara.
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Aangâs turmoil at the end of Book 3 about whether to kill Ozai is a nothingburger of a plot for multiple reasons, but something that I realized that hasnât been discussed as much is how villains are dealt with in Legend of Korra in comparison. Korra, unlike Aang, doesnât seem to have any qualms with using violence as a means to an end (at least earlier on in her story). Sheâs not an Air Nomad, and as such doesnât have the same beliefs of âall life is sacredâ and pacifism.
Despite this, however, Korra manages to defeat 3/4 villains without having to kill them. Even with Unalaq/Vaatu, whom she had to effectively obliterate, she shows regret and apologizes to Desna and Eska for having done so. Given that Unalaq physically/spiritually violated her and wiped out her connection to her past lives, I personally wouldnât blame her if she felt no regret to what she had to do. She also gains insight from each of the villains (see her conversation with Toph), in terms of where they went wrong in terms of their ideologies.
Itâs so clear that the writers sprung Aangâs moral conundrum at the last moment in the writing process. Obviously thereâs no justifying what Ozai or his forefathers were doing with colonization or genocide. But if Aang is this so-called kind and insightful person, I would expect some sort of reflection on what taking Ozaiâs bending means for both Ozai and himself. Did Aang technically spiritually violate Ozai for doing what he did? Would it have been better if he killed Ozai? Aang is the kind of character that consistently shies away from seemingly destructive forms of power (like the Avatar state, firebending), so how is taking someoneâs bending away permanently any different?
LOK as a show has itâs own slew of problems, donât get me wrong, but I appreciate that Korra is forced to confront other peoplesâ belief systems and reflect on how those work in tandem with hers. For Aang though, itâs his way or the highway.
âHow can anyone not like Aang?â
Simple, really. I just donât like how his self-righteousness, preachy attitude and sense of entitlement towards Katara didnât face proper consequences.
No one is immune from being disliked, so F off with that facetious nonsense!
When I first got into the fandom I saw a lot of people complaining about Aang being hated and I had the same attitude of "how could anyone not like Aang?"
Then I realized that what they meant by Aang hate was not shipping him with Katara, not thinking he was right in The Southern Raiders, not liking the resolution to the Ozai problem, and shipping Katara with Zuko.
how do you describe the parallels between zutara and omashu? I'd love to read your opinion about why the cave of two lovers is pro zutara and the link to omashu. I've always loved your interpretations and metas, you know how to write and make a point. I think lack of critical reading has doomed the fandom, especially with the new wave of fans that lack the understanding of deep parallelism in atla and are just here to ship
I struggled with how to answer this because there have already been so many metas about how the cave of two lovers mirrors zutara, so instead of rehashing those points, I'm going to try to give a different perspective on it.
I think it's incredibly silly that zutara is regarded by antis as an oppressive ship when we have canon examples of this type of romance being idolized in story.
Granted that we don't know why Oma and Shu's villages were fighting, but I don't think it was over the last banana at the grocery store. Shu is said to have been killed in battle, so he was definitely involved in the war in some capacity. He wasn't a civilian.
And the story specifically tells us that after Shu's death, Oma could have destroyed them all out of grief. But instead, she chose peace and forgiveness. She who had loved her enemy.
It's very hard to miss the parallels here. I've heard people say that Bryke did not want zutara because they were against romanticizing that type of relationship, but not only is that blatantly false, but they already did do that, with a story in an episode about love shining through the darkness.
Also no one can convince me that the choice to make the place where Katara and Zuko connect be a cave full of glowing crystals was not supposed to be a deliberate parallel. You can't convince me that at least one writer in that room was not like "hey - "
the convo you had with the other guy re: katara's culture and also being a victim of genocide sounds like "well i had this bad thing happen to me and its worse than the bad thing that happened to you"--which, shame
Yeah, I mean. I addressed the "it's not just about bending, it's about a lack of community" thing, and how insulting that is to Katara because Aang never considers his wife and children a part of his community, but the other issue is that it's fucking insulting to Katara to claim that because not EVERYONE in her community is dead, it means that Aang gets to yell at her about how she doesn't understand.
Especially since what Aang goes through with trusting Taga despite his better judgment is actually something Katara went through almost exactly with Hama in the show.
Also, if it's not about bending, why was Aang so fucking desperate to find the staff that would give people airbending? Given Aang's other characterization, I should think he would be opposed to giving some random people airbending that were not born to it and didn't experience airbending culture like he had. He was deeply insulted by the refugees using the air temple and initially insulted by the acolytes until he decided that it was nice to have a fan club.
Also like, what prompted Aang to say Katara didn't understand was that they all almost died. No amount of "understanding" is going to change that fact. Aang only said this to Katara because he did not want to admit that what he was doing was reckless and dangerous, not because he actually felt that Katara didn't understand. He sure does rely a lot on Katara's emotional understanding when it's convenient for him, after all.
Out of all the cast, Katara is the most understanding and the one closest to actually understanding what Aang went through. She should not have to be the only one left for that to be valid. And she's also the mother of his fucking children. Whenever I talk about this I get some bullshit about how Aang had to favor Tenzin because Tenzin is the only one who carries this burden, but Tenzin had two older siblings! It's not about bending, you say? Then why couldn't Aang's dark-skinned, non airbending children carry on that legacy? We all know why.
great blog! how would you have ended the "what should Aang do with Ozai" part of the ending? I felt like energy bending was such a cop out but I am not sure if killing would have been right either. Maybe a Disney death like falling off a cliff?
Aang didn't need to kill Ozai. Frankly, don't think it would have been earned, even if Aang didn't have an issue killing him. Aang vs Ozai didn't have any real weight behind it. It was the first time they'd even met, and neither of them had more than an abstract idea of who the other was. Sokka, Toph and Suki's battle was more emotionally fraught, because the crux was them getting each other through the ordeal alive. Zuko and Katara vs Azula was more emotionally heavy because Zuko was facing down his trauma, and then Katara was fighting to keep Zuko alive. The stakes of Aang's battle with Ozai were, ironically, the lowest, narratively, so Aang killing Ozai wouldn't feel like anything.
That said, Ozai should have died. Even without his bending, he is too dangerous to be left alive, which even those horrendous comics illustrate. My ideal ending is Ozai standing trial in front of a global tribunal and being executed for war crimes, but a Disney death would be a good dramatic end for him, too, though. Something ironic, like trying to blast Aang with a fire ball but accidentally dropping a boulder on his own head instead. The...ah...casket would be closed, of course.
In either case, Aang would still have to face the fact that the world is actively celebrating Ozai's death, and that there are very few who would agree that it would have been better to leave him alive. In the case of the trial, he would have been the only one campaigning for a life sentence for Ozai instead. I could see him going to Zuko and Iroh to intercede, only to be shocked by Zuko getting angry at him for suggesting it, and Iroh only giving him a disappointed sigh and a line or two of wisdom about "the needs of the many vs the needs of the few...or the one" (obviously a bit less plagiarizey).
If Ozai accidentally caused his own death during their battle, Aang would have to deal with not only people celebrating his death, but them praising Aang because they think he did it (because of the boulder thing. A firebender accidentally killed himself with earth? Sure Jan...đđ). The amount of people who really believe that Aang outright killed Ozai becomes problematic when he tries to start his Air Acolyte cult and one of the main tenants is the sanctity of all life. His cultists will still follow him to the ends of the earth, but his critics will not let the Ozai thing die (đđŤ ), thus the world is exposed to Aang's hypocrisy, though ironically, in an instance of him not being a hypocrite. Still, if it gets the world to look at Aang with a bit more scrutiny...đ¤ˇđžââď¸
I think the show itself could have done the Disney death without any more comment because that stuff happens all the time in these kinds of shows, but the idea of Aang having to deal with the fallout like you describe is actually really interesting, and I would love to see a fic of this (with eventual zutara, of course).
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unfortunately I think the divide within the og atla creative team regarding zutara during the show's development led to the funniest possible outcome .
cause on one hand, since zuko and katara's relationship never explicitly turns romantic, I think it spared their dynamic from the weird pitfalls that the writing suffered from when it came to the canon romances. and what we do get from the canon zk dynamic is a really compelling and cohesive narrative arc: enemies -> resentful co-captives -> empathizing co-captives -> ...mayyyybeee allies? -> ENEMIES 2.0 -> "Mr. Sorry For Betraying You" & "Ms. No Worries I'll Just Kill You Next Time :)" -> Southern Raiders "I fear only one person has ever understood me and I hate the guy" + "the guy" accomplices -> brief spy interlude -> Friends <3 -> synergetic teammates -> Co-Usurpers -> literally laid his life down for her
...but on the other hand, because the creative team was so divided during this time, it wasn't enough to just let things lie or whatever, so somewhere in between the "friends / synergetic teammates" bit and "co-usurpers" bit of their relationship development, the show takes not one, but two distinct moments to turn to the viewers and say "zutara shippers you are dumb and stupid and delusional btw" cause the creators had a complex over the fact that young girls in 2007 preferred zutara. And then right after that zuko goes and throws himself in front of lightning for katara. lol. lmao, even.
Iâm gonna be so real I forgot about that Zutara vs. Katanga think piece I was gonna write đ
But, hey, I can get this off my chest right now with all of the nonsense and discourse the NATLA is getting because of people saying apparently âtheyâre ruining the show by trying to make Zutara happenâ which is funny because itâs likeâŚwhy are their bad writing choices automatically related to Zutara, some of which, actually most of which really having nothing to do with Zutara at all really.
Also itâs hypocritical, given that with the OG ATLA, as perfect as it is as a kids show, or as close to perfect as it is, the only thing that most people genuinely believed dragged it downâŚwas the way they wrote the romance in the show, one of the romances in question being Kataang. Iâm saying this because before I even watched ATLA, I watched a lot of video essays on it, and it was rare for the romance to be bought up because itâs such an afterthought in terms of the writing of the show. Itâs only bought up when they bring up the shipping wars because thatâs the only time theyâd acknowledge the writing of the romance in particular.
But right now, if Iâll say it; YES, I ship Zutara, NO I donât ship Kataang. There are personal reasons for that, most of which arenât related to 1) Zuko being hot or 2) me wanting to self project onto Katara, , 3) Aang being too unattractive for me to ship him with Katara, or 4) Because Iâve got a colonizer/raceplay fetish
The fact Zutara shippers always are assumed to only like the ship for such shallow reasons (which is misogynistic btw but thatâs a paper for another day) which is fascinating because narratively speaking, Kataang is technically shallower in terms of its canonical writing. A lot of Kataangâs dynamic is essentially just the two of them place each other on pedestalâs with Aangâs crush, and Katara having high hopes for him because heâs the Avatar. Additionally, neither of these perceptions of one another ever get challenged. Aang chose comics energy over Katara, sure, but Katara never finds out about this and we never see her reaction, which would probably be negative because Katara would NEVER want to the world to be sacrificed for her. Katara never stops having such high expectations for Aang specifically because heâs the Avatar, hence why the pressure and burdens remain entirely on him.
Even Bryke described it as a babysitter crush type deal, so that aspect doesnât add much more depth to the ship, if anything, it takes away more because it narrows it down to such a shallow âboy attracted to girl whoâs more mature than himâ type of deal. As for the argument of âAang helps Katara feel like a kid againâ, that aspect isnât built upon aside from the first episode with the penguin sledding. Then after that, sheâs back to being in the motherly role, and itâs crazy to me.
TLDR; I just think assuming Zutara shippers like the ship for such shallow reasons is hypocritical when Kataang itself is written lacking a lot of depth and therefore, shallow, in itself. Thereâs nothing wrong with liking ships that are simple or lessâŚânarratively deepâ or symbolic in a sense. I just think itâs hypocritical.
