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Entertainment Weekly: This doesn’t exactly fit, but I thought a little bit of the Amish. The Jabari have a separate, traditional culture within a modern one. But then, the Jabari don’t lack technology. Winston Duke: Yeah, they’re not against technology. They’re against Vibranium. Their society is based around Jabari wood.

EW: That’s what we see decorating M’Baku’s throne room. WD: Yeah, this is something we didn’t get to interrogate deeply in the film, but everything for them is based around this Jabari wood that comes from this sacred tree. Everything in Jabari land is made out of this sacred wood that can essentially go toe-to-toe with a Vibranium sword or a Vibranium weapon because it’s this tempered, strong, treated wood.

EW: But it has its own mythology… WD: They believe it was given to them by Hanuman, the ape god. Meanwhile, the people of Wakanda will say, “No, it’s actually the Vibranium that’s seeped into the wood. That makes it stronger.” [Laughs] You have this whole divergence of ideas. They’re quite technologically sophisticated but it’s based around wood. Meanwhile, Wakanda proper is technologically advanced based around Vibranium. That’s kind of where they get separated, but it’s still the same house.

EW: What does M’Baku really want, deep down? WD: Where’s Wakanda going? How are they going to do that? T’Chaka (John Kani) is dead. I didn’t like the direction he was taking the country and now his son is going to take the throne, all these people have been asleep letting these people take control of the country for all these years, and we’ve just been watching from the mountains being like, “This isn’t right. My people have to live, they got to survive.” Instead of him just being this ostentatious dude who’s running around in a gorilla fur costume, he’s this guy who has deep attachments and needs. You can understand, “If I was in that position, I think I would have to make a similar choice.”

EW: M’Baku is a showman. WD: He is. He’s proud and he’s big, and he is a showman. It’s the idea that if I’m going to challenge and take over this country, I’m going to do it with honor and I’m going to do it in front of everyone the right way. I’m not going to use some subversive tactic to take over the country the way other people could.

EW:He does this chant, a kind of grunt that silences people. He’s frightening, and then immediately funny. He knows how to weaponize his demeanor. WD: It’s super fun to play, and we created the entire culture. The Jabari, similar to the Dora Milaje, believe in the oneness. When he speaks, he speaks in a “we,” but he doesn’t talk as a royal “we.” When he says “we,” it’s really we, like me and my people. That means a lot to him. When he speaks of the Jabari, he speaks of them as one.