Jorights

I get how dramatically they have simplified and dumbed down Marius and Armands story in the show but even when reading that book, i had to stop MULTIPLE times and process what the fuck i had just read. Actions speak a whole lot louder than words.

Armand was in fact groomed, s3xually abused and exploited by Marius idgaf what Marius tried to explain it as.. and making Armand look like the villain for keeping kids in cages to kill them (which is horrendous of course) but not acknowledging Marius’ outright pedophilia, is absolutely insane and it really shows the lack of media literacy.

Punishment and worship

2/4

the thing I hate about this fandom is that one of the most problematic things you can say is that you don’t like/are disgusted by Armand and Marius’ relationship because it is pedophilia and the prime example of what grooming does to a CHILD. Armand was already broken before Marius, him seeing Marius as his ‘saviour’ was inevitable. In his eyes, Marius wasn’t doing exactly what the brothel abusers were doing and he was lathering him in luxuries and loving him so it was love. OF COURSE HE WOULD THINK THAT HE WAS A CHILD WHO KNEW NO BETTER..

This isn’t to say “Armand had no idea what he was doing and he didn’t love Marius” no he did. That’s the point. He was vulnerable enough to fall into that trap ‘willingly’. He was in love with Marius. He did tease Marius and have breakdowns when he left him. Yet this is all a result of successful grooming.

No child without any horrific previous trauma would endure this willingly. Especially at the ages he was. They would see fault in it.

Also don’t even give me that “Armand abused Marius too, he’s not an innocent angel” because that is falling for the exact trap Armand fell for. Mutual abuse is not a thing. Armand was 13-15 (we’re not fully sure) when Marius ‘saved’ him and Marius was physically in his 30s if I can remember rightly. Armand didn’t abuse him, his actions were a direct result of previous years and Marius himself.

Armand isn’t an angel, again that the POINTTT, but the brothel, Marius and the cult are all the reasons for his behaviour. Again, repeating the behaviours of your abusers is extremely common in grooming victims, hurt people hurt people ykkk..

I digress..

Strongly disliking or feeling uncomfortable with Marius and Armands relationship is a completely valid opinion. This fandom prides itself on putting the show fans in their place when it comes to hating on various ships and characters, yet as soon as a fellow book fan expresses their completely justified hatred of Armands abusers, they’re slammed for ‘making stuff up about Marius’ or ‘seeing the relationship in the wrong way’ or even ‘infantilising and glorifying Armand’. You’re allowed to ship what you want! But gaslighting and attacking others for not agreeing with you, and actively denying the behaviours that they don’t agree with is just plain stupid and hypocritical.

Marius is also confirmed as 40. If you're going to speak on a subject, get your facts right and stop misconstruing things to see a narrative that isn't there.

It's not gaslighting to tell you what the author wrote and how she intended the story to be. It is gaslighting to tell people who enjoy the story as it was written (an erotic, age-gap, dubious, monsterfucker bdsm fantasy) that they are pedophiles or support pedophilia or endorse child abuse, all of which have been claimed to Marimand shippers, and which you yourself have insinuated to me personally.

I didn’t however, say straight up that you yourself support child abuse of any sort??

Honestly, again as I’ve said multiple times before, Idgaf what you ship or spend your time larping about. If you want to ship Marius and Armand, you do that.

My issue is that it now seems taboo to have any critiques about disturbing ships/characters such as the ones you love so much.. you are slamming me for critiquing it or “cherry-picking”, also implying that I’m basing my knowledge on the show dynamic, which I haven’t once said, yet I haven’t once told anyone not to do certain things or ship certain ships, I’ve simply expressed my opinion (a blunt one at that but nevertheless my opinion). If that pisses you off so much, take your frustration somewhere else, maybe get yourself a little diary instead of snapping at people online who didn’t see certain ships in such a positive light (an extremely common and justified reaction to Armand and Marius btw)

"People are refusing to read the text as intended, refusing to educate themselves, and are riding a knee jerk reaction to something that upsets them."

I dont cate how romantic Anne Rice made pedophilia, child trafficking and rape in general sound or look. Marimand weren't in a real consensual BDSM relationship because a child can never consent to an adult.

I understand why fans see it as something romantic and erotic. It's because Armand made it sound that way, because prior to Marius he hadn't really felt kindness and love they way Marius conditioned him to feel. An almost 2000 year old vampire groomed and later on abused a traumatized child for a whole decade. Armand was in love with his master/father, there is no denying that but he was also afraid. Very subconsciously book!Armand knew that this whole thing between them was wrong but he couldn't leave, who will love him and cradle him the way Marius did?

Marimand is the perfect text book abusive relationship of "yeah he abused me and raped me but there were times where we were good."

I think I’ve mentioned it before in a previous post that yes he felt safe in Venice because at that time where else would he have that stability?

BUT because Armand was a child who didn’t know better and doesn’t have a clear understanding of what a healthy relationship is and saw everything through rose colored glasses, that doesn’t mean that it’s morally right.

the thing I hate about this fandom is that one of the most problematic things you can say is that you don’t like/are disgusted by Armand and Marius’ relationship because it is pedophilia and the prime example of what grooming does to a CHILD. Armand was already broken before Marius, him seeing Marius as his ‘saviour’ was inevitable. In his eyes, Marius wasn’t doing exactly what the brothel abusers were doing and he was lathering him in luxuries and loving him so it was love. OF COURSE HE WOULD THINK THAT HE WAS A CHILD WHO KNEW NO BETTER..

This isn’t to say “Armand had no idea what he was doing and he didn’t love Marius” no he did. That’s the point. He was vulnerable enough to fall into that trap ‘willingly’. He was in love with Marius. He did tease Marius and have breakdowns when he left him. Yet this is all a result of successful grooming.

No child without any horrific previous trauma would endure this willingly. Especially at the ages he was. They would see fault in it.

Also don’t even give me that “Armand abused Marius too, he’s not an innocent angel” because that is falling for the exact trap Armand fell for. Mutual abuse is not a thing. Armand was 13-15 (we’re not fully sure) when Marius ‘saved’ him and Marius was physically in his 30s if I can remember rightly. Armand didn’t abuse him, his actions were a direct result of previous years and Marius himself.

Armand isn’t an angel, again that the POINTTT, but the brothel, Marius and the cult are all the reasons for his behaviour. Again, repeating the behaviours of your abusers is extremely common in grooming victims, hurt people hurt people ykkk..

I digress..

Strongly disliking or feeling uncomfortable with Marius and Armands relationship is a completely valid opinion. This fandom prides itself on putting the show fans in their place when it comes to hating on various ships and characters, yet as soon as a fellow book fan expresses their completely justified hatred of Armands abusers, they’re slammed for ‘making stuff up about Marius’ or ‘seeing the relationship in the wrong way’ or even ‘infantilising and glorifying Armand’. You’re allowed to ship what you want! But gaslighting and attacking others for not agreeing with you, and actively denying the behaviours that they don’t agree with is just plain stupid and hypocritical.

Marius is also confirmed as 40. If you're going to speak on a subject, get your facts right and stop misconstruing things to see a narrative that isn't there.

It's not gaslighting to tell you what the author wrote and how she intended the story to be. It is gaslighting to tell people who enjoy the story as it was written (an erotic, age-gap, dubious, monsterfucker bdsm fantasy) that they are pedophiles or support pedophilia or endorse child abuse, all of which have been claimed to Marimand shippers, and which you yourself have insinuated to me personally.

I didn’t however, say straight up that you yourself support child abuse of any sort??

Honestly, again as I’ve said multiple times before, Idgaf what you ship or spend your time larping about. If you want to ship Marius and Armand, you do that.

My issue is that it now seems taboo to have any critiques about disturbing ships/characters such as the ones you love so much.. you are slamming me for critiquing it or “cherry-picking”, also implying that I’m basing my knowledge on the show dynamic, which I haven’t once said, yet I haven’t once told anyone not to do certain things or ship certain ships, I’ve simply expressed my opinion (a blunt one at that but nevertheless my opinion). If that pisses you off so much, take your frustration somewhere else, maybe get yourself a little diary instead of snapping at people online who didn’t see certain ships in such a positive light (an extremely common and justified reaction to Armand and Marius btw)

"People are refusing to read the text as intended, refusing to educate themselves, and are riding a knee jerk reaction to something that upsets them."

I dont care how romantic Anne Rice made pedophilia, child trafficking and rape in general sound or look. Marimand weren't in a real consensual BDSM relationship because a child can never consent to an adult.

I understand why fans see it as something romantic and erotic. It's because Armand made it sound that way, because prior to Marius he hadn't really felt kindness and love they way Marius conditioned him to feel. An almost 2000 year old vampire groomed and later on abused a traumatized child for a whole decade. Armand was in love with his master/father, there is no denying that but he was also afraid. Very subconsciously book!Armand knew that this whole thing between them was wrong but he couldn't leave, who will love him and cradle him the way Marius did?

Marimand is the perfect text book abusive relationship of "yeah he abused me and raped me but there were times where we were good."

Commission of 'Toronto: I choose you' by DarcyMolloy on ao3🌹

codependent 🐰🦊