Getting some new followers recently so I'm gonna make a pinned post
my masterpost of transmasc theory
it/its pronouns, no they/them
Late twenties
Not from the USA
Will very occasionally post NSFW (mostly art or artistic NSFW, no actual porn), follow at own risk
I'm bad at tagging most things, sorry in advance but I try my best and if you'd like something specific tagged please let me know.
I am autistic and have ADHD. Please do not tone police me or ascribe intentions to my words that aren't there. Sometimes I'm quite verbose and if this is an accessibility issue let me know and I will try to be more concise or use more plain/simple language.
This used to be an aesthetic side blog but now I mainly use it to vent and add my 2 cents on topics that I feel I can personally speak on due to my own experiences, mostly anti-transmasculinity, transandrophobia, and other transmasc issues.
As an addendum to this: I'm fucking exhausted from trying to have good faith discussions with people who refuse to listen and refuse to try to understand, and will paint me as aggressive or condescending for straightforward explanations and questions. I'm no longer engaging in these discussions in any serious manner. If you see me posting in the tags or in someone's replies it's because I'm fed up with this shit. A while ago I said transmascs have got to get meaner so I am. Fuck transphobes.
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If I were to stop being a man, and detransition and occupy the role of a cis woman, and therefore stop being a target of transphobia, then being a man is what makes me open to oppression, and am therefore oppressed for being a man.
Everyone go read Alexander Avila's latest Substack article NOW!!!!!!
There are not just masculine or feminine genders but also trans and cis genders. To be trans-gender is to be conscious of multiple forms of gendered becomings and belongings. Belonging to gendered categories is just as important as the process of coming to and coming from them. Trans-gender solidarity is not just a claim about the right to belong to a category, but a claim about how we unbelong to categories, how we create free access to the technologies that define these categories, how we affirm the agency to re-define these categories, and how we can enable each other to become more of ourselves.
In order to fully engage in conversations related to anti transmasculine bias and or transandrophobia you truly have to step away from a state of mind in which transmisogny and transandrophobia each have one to one parallels. In fact you should refrain from considering it's relation to transmisogyny at all at first. You should be fully present and open to understanding transmasculine and trans male perspectives in their entirety.
There can be a lot of similarities in experience between transfeminine and transmasculine individuals, trans men and trans women. But the goal of discussing anti transmasculine bias has no agenda outside of better understanding the oppression and experiences of transmasculine and trans male individuals.
Discussions of terminology are, at the end of the day, semantics you should be able to step away from in order to maintain an awareness of the experiences discussed under them to ensure they are not lost. If you are stuck on the terminology, arguing a perfect solution that doesn't exist, it will eventually come across as a blatant refusal to understand the pain of another.
There are layers and layers of discourse in this discussion of transmasc/trans male oppression but when you peel them all back you see a person who is in pain, who is suffering, will you allow them the space to be heard?
Arguing that another's pain is better worth your support is not support for that person, for those people. It is a cruelty towards the harmed you are lecturing.
Honestly I'm not interested in discussing this because you're the type of person who spends time typing out essays about this so I have a feeling it will be a waste of my (disabled, chronically fatigued) energy and it seems you're not going to actually accept any input and change your mind about things you've gotten completely wrong, especially because it's pretty clear you didn't do your due diligence with research in the first place.
But my gripe is this:
You have one source from a transmasc person about transmasc experiences here. The rest of the post you've pulled from your individual experience - which is valid in thinkpieces, but I'm not going to take that seriously as a theoretical contribution, along with the rest of your incorrect claims as someone who has been discussing transandrophobia & ATM theories for years and has done the research and work.
You need to be reading more about what we're saying, and you need to be reading the theory, works, and frameworks we are basing our theories and frameworks off.
I have a masterpost linked in my pinned if you're actually interested in doing better research. Outside of that, I'm not interested in discussing your incorrect assumptions that any amount of research would have immediately corrected.
I appreciate you naming the actual critique underneath this, that's helpful. You're right that this is a personal opinion piece, not a research paper, and I said that explicitly in the post itself, it was never presented as a theoretical contribution to transandrophobia/ATM discourse. I engaged with St. Dionysus's original definition directly and with Serano's transmisogyny framework, and the rest is lived experience, which I think has value in this conversation even if it's not the same as years of theoretical work. If you'd like to share your masterpost link (as I am disabled and out of spoons), I'm genuinely happy to read more, but I'm not going to pretend my piece was something it never claimed to be.
That's exactly correct. Why type out an opinion piece based on a singular tumblr post and a very outdated (as said so by the author herself) work about transmisogyny (notably not transmasc experiences) then, if you aren't aiming to contribute to anything? Like I said, you'd know your assumptions are baseless if you actually took the time to research this topic at all. Which, sure, you don't need to do to just post your uneducated opinion - this is the internet after all - but all that does is make it easier for people to dismiss you. You're even dismissing yourself.
I actually don't have the spoons to relink the post to you, especially since I'm on mobile and its not as simple as opening a new tab. You can click on my URL and it is linked right in my pinned post at the top of my blog. It's as much effort as going through your notifications to respond to me, so I'm sure you can handle it.
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Honestly I'm not interested in discussing this because you're the type of person who spends time typing out essays about this so I have a feeling it will be a waste of my (disabled, chronically fatigued) energy and it seems you're not going to actually accept any input and change your mind about things you've gotten completely wrong, especially because it's pretty clear you didn't do your due diligence with research in the first place.
But my gripe is this:
You have one source from a transmasc person about transmasc experiences here. The rest of the post you've pulled from your individual experience - which is valid in thinkpieces, but I'm not going to take that seriously as a theoretical contribution, along with the rest of your incorrect claims as someone who has been discussing transandrophobia & ATM theories for years and has done the research and work.
You need to be reading more about what we're saying, and you need to be reading the theory, works, and frameworks we are basing our theories and frameworks off.
I have a masterpost linked in my pinned if you're actually interested in doing better research. Outside of that, I'm not interested in discussing your incorrect assumptions that any amount of research would have immediately corrected.
The realization that a lot of these people who claim to be super informed on feminism and feminist theory probably don't even actually know what white feminism is and think that it's just identifying someone as a feminist who is white is kinda rocking me a bit.
Maybe I'm xkcd 2501, but I feel like if you're gonna claim to know feminist theory, ideology, or practice in any robust sense you kind of have know what white feminism is. It just feels like such a foundational building block to understanding and engaging with modern feminist critique.
I've been thinking about the whole "people who claim to be informed despite clearly displaying that they're nowhere near as informed as they say they are" thing a lot lately (on a variety of topics tbh. it's kinda everywhere). I think it's a few different groups with subtly different mindsets (+ overlap) who do this, some of whom are flat out lying and some of whom genuinely think they're well-informed (when they're not).
ramble alert uhhh it got long whoops. I guess I had more to say than I thought I did
we live in a very dominance-based world that values hierarchy, and arguments are one of the socially accepted avenues to do that through. having the "right"/correct opinions is a form of social capital and status for people. they feel like it gives them authority, hence why online arguments seem to cling to other forms of hierarchy in order to try to establish a sense of authority for themselves (and thereby assert dominance above the other person they're arguing with). I don't think it's fair to say that they're completely disinterested in intellectual debate or education or learning (you can still have multiple motivations lol), but that's certainly not the main focus in a lot of these online discourses (or so it seems).
so I think people will engage with subject matters in a way that makes them feel self-important, or equips them with some sorta authority. academics are still somewhat respected, if for no other reason than accepting that a person who has done a shit ton of reading and learning about a subject probably knows it pretty well (though sometimes people will fight you on this, too). so there's an incentive to kinda....... cosplay doing that work, in order to bolster your own perceived credibility in your arguments. sometimes because people find it boosts their ego to think of themselves as an Intellectual™ (or at least feel like they are one) by engaging with more advanced topics and theories, and sometimes because they just want to exert control over people and that's an "easy" way to do so.
anyone can lie on the internet. the main people who can really tell if somebody's bullshitting tend to be actual academics themselves, and there are proportionally few in comparison to the amount of people online. and even then, we can still be dead wrong about it. a lot of people can lie very convincingly. the only thing I've found that seems to be more common amongst academics (at least around these here parts of the wild wild internet) is a type of general humility and tolerance for ambiguity/uncertainty (I think there is a humbling that happens in higher ed that not many people are subjected to otherwise lol, and I'm not even trying to romanticize that because it is incredibly lonely and isolating and you rarely have any true support for it or warning beforehand). and ofc that's not a guarantee. there are academics who are reactionary, insecure assholes, too. but yknow. broad overall trends. being forced to advocate for the good aspects of something you disagree with and admit what somebody gets right even if they're wrong in other regards.
so I think there are a lot of people online who do outright lie and claim to have read things that they haven't read (and there's a whole other discussion to be had about how reading it isn't enough by itself, you also need to be able to comprehend what you're reading, and even though they may have read it...). I had that kinda jolted into my awareness a while back when a bunch of people on twitter got mad at me for using the word "privilege" in a way that they disliked, and there were all of these thinkpieces people wrote in my mentions that made it very clear to me that they hadn't read much (if anything) on the concept of privilege, but especially not any of the major baby's first introduction to white privilege 101 type stuff. I don't think any of them had heard of Peggy McIntosh. because the way I used "privilege" was...a very established definition that's used pretty commonly in academic literature, but not necessarily common colloquial discussions. there's been a lot of literature on white privilege especially that talks about how a ton of white privilege isn't solely the additive benefits white people tend to be consciously aware of, but that it's upheld through a vast network of unearned advantages and entitlements that white people are largely unaware they benefit from at all. a ton of white privilege is not simply being given extra stuff, but instead some of it is being exempted from certain types of harm. it's the privilege of being unaware of the struggles other people deal with. there is a blindspot formed there where you are ignorant/blind to what you don't have to deal with.
but, a lot of people who don't engage with that type of literature, get a very different understanding of what the word "privilege" means. in popular culture, you call people privileged for the additive benefits. things you'd have flaunted in your face. things people feel superior about. things like wealth and material possessions and white supremacist rallies. flagrant displays of one's privilege. and you very rarely get exposed to the more nuanced ways privilege is used in basically any academic sphere (which is kinda ironic because that more subtle, unconscious bias etc. aspect seems to be the focal point of a lot of the ways academia discusses privilege; you really can't engage with... nearly any academic lit talking about privilege without at some point learning this definition, it's kinda inescapable honestly).
however, the eye-opening part for me was that a lot of these people who were yelling at me... were those who claimed to be very well-read people. especially when it came to feminism and social justice. especially when it came to the struggles of Black women and intersectionality.
but... they didn't know one of the most common definitions of privilege, as discussed by nearly any piece of literature written about white privilege ever. a definition so commonplace in academic literature that it's realistically only possible for you to somehow be ignorant of this definition... if you didn't actually read any academic literature on privilege at all. so it immediately exposed that these people are liars who likely haven't read any of the theory they claim to have read. that or their reading comprehension is so piss poor that they didn't absorb any of it despite it being spelled out for them. because it was never about intellectual honesty or education or learning or any of these things, it was that they wanted to prop up their supposed knowledge of all of these theories and discussions... as a way to bolster their credibility and shut down anyone who disagreed with them.
a caveat is that I think many of these people have engaged with social media posts about these topics, maybe even for years. and they seem to unironically believe that this is just as educationally productive as reading the texts those posts were based off of. even pre-AI-geddon, people seemed to think this way. I think there are some people who truthfully do believe that they are well-versed on these discourses because they have read a lot of online amateur discussions about it and watched videos about it for a couple of months to years. so not all of them are knowingly lying about having read xyz book or learned xyz theory (even though I think some of them still are knowingly lying and just think they can bullshit well enough that nobody can tell lol... which is why they tend to have an audience + friends filled with people who similarly haven't read any of it and know very little about it, so they can't sniff out that they're full of shit because they too are fairly ignorant on the topic at hand), it's just that they think they don't need to read it because they already know plenty about it from online debates and summaries. and tbh those are probably the most frustrating to deal with because they just do not grasp how big the gap in knowledge actually is.
I've also noticed that a lot of people coming into different topics from a non-academia place seem to really struggle with finding resources for adequate background knowledge, and don't really seem to know how to acquire those for themselves anyhow. so they'll end up finding something interesting and then getting a very one-sided study plan of several articles (typically of varying popularity in the field, some of which are widely refuted and known to be kinda bullshit... but that have a really sensationalized point of interest that plays on the reader's desire to feel like they've uncovered hidden knowledge) that don't actually introduce them to the field in any real way. they just kinda. go down one rabbit hole. and all they know is the rabbit hole. there's no foundation about basic concepts of the field of interest. they can't actually engage in the discourses properly because they don't know anything except for a shit ton about some very narrow focus point. and they become convinced that this means they know all about the field of interest.
I feel mean writing it out in this way, because some of this really isn't these people's fault. it also feels like I'm infantilizing people somewhat or seeing myself as above them somehow. but I don't think I'm better than anyone else; if anything, I recognize this stuff in part because I, too, was once a dumb teenager who thought they knew everything lmao. but on the other hand, there are a lot of reading guides and lists out there that these people have had plenty of access to, and you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. and some of them seem very very obstinate in their desire to remain ignorant (I think some of them are legitimately afraid of being proven wrong, so they avoid reading the actual literature because they don't want to risk the cognitive dissonance that might make them feel a need to change their beliefs).
and even still, they don't need to lie. they don't need to pretend that they've read a bunch of theory when they haven't. but that does mean being able to admit that maybe they don't know everything, and maybe they should listen to people who know more than them, and these types who seem to lie about it are doing it for the status punch of being able to use theory as some sort of thought termination machine to exert their opinions onto everyone else. it's just annoying because like. anyone who knows their shit, knows these people are full of shit and don't actually know what they're talking about. and not all of them have bad thoughts or ideas!! sometimes they bring up good points!! as is natural for any kind of theory based on people's lives and experiences!! you can still observe stuff!!! and write about that!! but oh my god they don't need to larp as an academic when they're not one. they've gotta have some humility, though, and they don't wanna do that. and, probably most obnoxious of all: they outnumber the real ones lol. so they can very easily crowd out actual discussions that are rooted in people who know the actual topic at hand. they can use mob mentality to tell themselves that they're correct, actually. which becomes a self-reinforcing cycle where they are never challenged to wonder if they should read the things they claim to read, because hey everyone is fooled into thinking they have, so clearly they're just that great of an Intellectual™ that they don't even need to read the real books in order to meaningfully contribute anything. and they get the extra brownie points of being a Good Ally to whatever groups they claim to have read all about! and since everyone else is lying, nobody will call anyone else out on their bullshit, because that could risk revealing their own bullshit.
TLDR; dunning kruger + lying = a lot of the online feminist (and political/social justice oriented) discourse nowadays. a self-made panopticon of incompetent people nodding their heads in agreement to things said by fellow duplicitous incompetent liars, always a little bit anxious.
I just wish they'd stop pretending and we could all move on from it tbh. I'm fine with having discussions with people who aren't academics! just like. have an ounce of humility!! aaaa
There are many, many people whose only understanding of manhood is through defining it by its association with power.
Whether that be through a feminist lens regarding manhood or masculinity only through the analysis of cis patriarchal hierarchy, and/or an uncritical repetition of gendered norms produced by such a system.
So what ends up happening when a transgender man explains he is disempowered, and disempowered specifically in relationship to being a man and how the ideas (just like this) attached to it effect him, the only conclusion they can come to is that he must be implying he isn't a man, that he is misgendering himself or undermining his identity, or that he is weak and failing to live up to it- or that he is lying.
The complicated marginalization of trans manhood as manhood is so radically contradictory to the patriarchal values of power which men are expected to fulfill, and so contradictory to the intensely cis-normative approach to feminism and gendered oppression, that his experiences end up in a placeless void of compounded invalidation. Although coming from the very same place.
Enough that to even have acknowledgment for his experience of gendered oppression, his identity as a man must be severed from the very context of its existence. Just transgender, just a generic, unspecific transphobia. Denying the specific modality which produced the reality of his transgender existence. Cutting his social experience into pieces, either cutting out the manhood, or cutting out the weakness.
This continues on his invisibility, furthering the doubt of the validity of his own reality. Feeding into the inevitability that his struggle will go unnoticed and uncared for, and will not receive the attention needed to help him, or to change these things.
Ironically and integrally, all of this enabling his marginalization specifically because- well because he is a man.
Because of the expectations of what it means to be a man, and how we cannot imagine his experience of a specifically marginalized manhood.
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Telling passing trans men to their faces that they look like they would hate crime you is so weird because like… obviously they don’t or you wouldn’t say that to him? I would never go up to a homophobic cis guy and tell him he looks like he would beat the shit out of me if I kissed his daughter. The joke that trans men who pass are threatening is so insidious because if you actually thought he was a threat you wouldn’t be able to talk to him like that, so it’s really just a not-so-subtle way of saying “the way you look makes me uncomfortable, you don’t belong here”
It does feel like a bit of a self tell if someone is like "ugh i tried understanding those bitchy cuntboys I mean transandrobros but they just kept harassing me" like. I've never seen a single proponent of transandrophobia theory shit on someone asking something in good faith. I have seen countless people, including myself, get fed up with people telling us about our own experiences and that our own understanding of ourselves and lives is incorrect, though. So I do always wonder which it is.
Oh, so you agree that there are extremely strict gender standards upheld against people, that are distressing not just because of gender incongruence but because they're actively traumatizing?
And you agree that standards of masculinity can be harmful, regardless of gender incongruence? That people can be punished harshly for not living up to those standards?
Gee. Wouldn't it crazy if there was another group of people held to traumatizing standards of the gender they were assigned at birth, only to transition and be punished for not living up to the standards of masculinity?
Wouldn't it be even more fucked up if when they talk about their experiences, they're silenced and told they're actually privileged for their identity?
There's a problem with this post. You've not actually provided any evidence that OOP believes that trans men and nonbinary people are privileged or whatever the heck. With that lack of evidence or context, it looks like you're just getting mad at a random woman for posting about the transfeminine experience while literally not even mentioning anyone else. And if it's true that OOP hasn't said anything to implicate trans men and nonbinary people, it's extremely strange of you that you jumped to mocking when seeing someone talk about transmisogyny! And by "strange" I mean "bigoted".
I did not provide context for OP specifically because
1.) Shey is a well known blogger in this space
2.) I was addressing a more general belief within this space
You only have to scroll shey's blog, but shey believes that trans men and AFAB nonbinary people have TME privilege and posts about it regularly.
I'm criticizing this post not because I think shey is wrong (socially enforced manhood is absolutely traumatizing)! But because I think shey, and other self-proclaimed transfeminists, are hypocritical for talking about how traumatizing socially-enforced manhood is, while also claiming that TME trans people are privileged for not experiencing it (despite the fact that they experience socially-enforced womanhood, which is also traumatizing).
A cis women's right to comfort should not be more valued then a trans man's right to medical care.
A cis women's right to comfort should not be more valued then a trans man's right for safe housing.
A cis women's right to comfort should not be more valued then a trans man's acsess to SA recovery recourses.
A queer person's right to comfort should not be more valued then a trans man's right to take space in their community.
A queer person's right to comfort should not be more valued that a trans man's acsess to queer recourses.
A queer persons right to comfort should not be move valued than a trans man's right to hrt, srs, or medical transition.
I do not care if cis women and some other queer people are uncomfortable with "passing" trans men being at the gynecologist, at the planned parenthood, at the homeless shelter, at the SA survivor meeting, at the trans pride event, at the queer resource center, or with us just existing. Trans men's right to exist and to be treated like human beings should not be disrespected or disregarded becouse some of you think testosterone or facial hair or butchness or masculinity or phalloplasty somehow gives you cooties.
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If you believe trans men are "only" seen as confused girls then you are, more likely than not, willfully ignoring the transmasculine experience. Trans men and mascs have been talking for years and years about how there is more to it than that.
First, there's the ignorance about what being treated as a "confused girl" means. It means being infantilized, it means being institutionalized, it means having your body autonomy stripped from you, it means being put in your place through rape and abuse, it means being property, it means forced to become a wife and mother. Thats what happens when you're a "confused girl".
Second, the "confused girl" stereotype dwindles the more masculine a trans man/masc becomes. Then he's dangerous. He's a predator; here to steal your daughters away to become hysterical, defective, unfuckable things like himself. He's going to take her fertility, her beauty, her ability to contribute to "proper" society. He's invading women's spaces. He's tricking straight women into being lesbians and gay men into being straight. He is past the point of no return; he can no longer be "fixed"; he must be killed.
To ignore these; to assert that trans men and mascs are "only" seen as confused girls, are never seen as predators, is contributing to systemic transmasculine erasure. Do better.
"Traditional and oppositional sexism work hand in hand to ensure...that only those born male will be seen as authentically masculine."
wow it seems like julia serano is saying that trans men aren't actually equivalent to cis men when it comes to accessing patriarchal power. like they're not seen as authentically masculine despite being male. crazy if true.
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