franforfantasy

the dps novel has been a point of contention in this fandom for many, many years because it’s ass. so I want to get out of the way why most people don’t understand why this novel is so bad. consider this my official statement about the dps novel.

first of all, film novelizations were initially made because (before renting and streaming) it was the only way to experience movies outside of cinemas. [source] it’s a rather outdated medium because of aforementioned renting and streaming (and also the internet now exists) but they’re still around if you look hard enough. how do they get made, you may ask. and i need everyone to listen up when i say this:

typically, film novelizations are early drafts of the script. the person whose name ends up on the novelizations are using that draft and essentially converting the script into a prose format. that means n.h. kleinbaum is not responsible for the words in the dps novel; tom schulman is. also, it's standard that people who write film novelizations don't watch the film beforehand, so they don't have the benefit of watching the actors perform the script.

[source]

(it grinds my fucking gears when people cite n.h. kleinbaum with quotes from dps because she did not write dps. do not cite n.h. kleinbaum when quoting from the dps novel, those are more likely than not tom schulman’s words. in any case, the only medium of dps that matters in the film, so just quote tom schulman as the writer, or peter weir as the director. that’s how citations work. did none of you go to sixth grade english.)

now, from the other film novelizations i’ve read, the dps novel is particularly unimaginative. if you read it, there isn’t much inner story (thoughts, feelings). it is solely what the characters say and the way they move. that’s why when I say it’s just a script in prose format, i mean it. what’s in a script? dialogue and actions. absolutely no thoughts, inner monologue, nothing. it’s like the first rule of screenwriting.

so this may answer some of the questions of “why is the dps book so bad?” and it’s because it’s probably the first draft mr schulman wrote of the script, of course it sucks. especially because his final script didn’t even get the Peter Weir Treatment yet. some of the best scenes in the film are the work of peter weir, not schulman. (originally, after the boys find out about neil, todd goes into the bathroom to vom and they just like cry about it. on the day, it had snowed and weir decided to bring the boys outside and do the scene there. [source] the Poetry! I’m being chased by Walt Whitman scene was added by weir (at least it's not in the original script). There are a million and one examples of this.) it’s also why knox is straight up a sexual predator in the book and not in the film. it’s more difficult to get away with sa than with being a weird stalker who has clearly never interacted with a girl before.

returning to the point about the novel writer usually not watching the film before writing the novelization: everyone in fandom comes to some agreement that neil and todd had bigger feelings for each other than they ever properly expressed. outside of fandom, it's more or less debatable whether they were in love or into each other or whatever. nevertheless, the conversation about their relationship is there. a lot of that is not in the script. and it's definitely not in the book. if anything, neil and todd don’t seem to like each other that much in the book. because it's ethan and rsl's performance that makes it GAY.

i wrote an essay for grad school applications about this novel, in which i got into agonizing detail about its failure (it is not perfect, i'm not a great essay writer) and i would like to include a statement from my concluding paragraph:

“The version of Dead Poets Society sans Weir reveals two tired and fed-up teenagers who take their frustrations out on each other instead of properly confiding. It may be a more realistic representation of how young men express their feelings, but it makes the main characters unlikable. When Weir, Hawke, and Leonard stepped in, they made Neil and Todd softer, more in tune with their emotions.”

i have a bit of a call to action here about the book: we need to shut up about it. it’s in no way an extension of the film and if anything, worsens the story. when we talk about dps, we should talk about the film and the script. that was the medium schulman intended. besides, most things people like about the book (however little they may be) are IN schulman’s script and were taken out by weir. in any case, a film novelization this poorly written doesn’t need to come up in conversation about one of the greatest films ever made. (imagine having never seen dps and instead you read the novel…)

if you’re curious, here is a list of differences between tom schulman’s revised script and the edited weir-ified one. i am aware that this website is awful to look at. all i can offer is that you read it in toggle reader view. you can read the revised draft and final draft here. i refer to this as the final script. i believe ad-libs have been added in. at this point, i think the only people who have the true final drafts are the actors so…

in sum, the dps novel is trash and we should put it in the trash <3 i don’t want to see any of you silly little children talking about the novel ever again. it is not a relevant piece of media in this fandom anymore. at this point, it’s scratch paper to me.

also if anyone says they’re the leading expert on dps, just know that they are lying. i am the leading expert on dps. i have gone to bed with dps. i know its ins and outs, its crevices, its scars, its stretch marks, its sun spots.

i'll cite my fuckin sources:

Alter, A. (2015, January 5). Popular TV series and movies maintain relevance as novels. The New York Times. Retrieved August 21, 2022, from https://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/05/business/media/popular-tv-series-and-movies-maintain-relevance-as-novels.html 

Borrelli, C. (2020, March 30). Movie novels are still around, and they aren't all trash - just ask the Chicagoans who wrote them. Chicago Tribune. Retrieved August 20, 2022, from https://www.chicagotribune.com/entertainment/ct-ent-novels-from-movies-star-wars-20200330-a3dximjbujhi7pjccspxmnft6u-story.html

Rance, M. (Producer) (2006). Dead Poets: A Look Back [Video File]. Retrieved from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zm8Byw52dQ

Schulman, T. “Dead Poets Society” Film Script, 1989.

the links to the comparison and old script are from the Welton Library website - i have no idea who runs this site and couldn't find their name but they are doing god's work (but if they're reading this, please for the love of god fix the red and yellow)

"Your eyes on me were as eyes that rove / Over tedious riddles of years ago;"

"And some words played between us to and fro / On which lost the more by our love."

"The smile on your mouth was the deadest thing / Alive enough to have strength to die;"

"And a grin of bitterness swept thereby / Like an ominous bird a-wing…."

"Since then, keen lessons that love deceives,"

"And wrings with wrong, have shaped to me"

"Your face, and the God curst sun, and a tree,"

"And a pond edged with grayish leaves."

"Your eyes on me were as eyes that rove / Over tedious riddles of years ago;"

"And some words played between us to and fro / On which lost the more by our love."

"The smile on your mouth was the deadest thing / Alive enough to have strength to die;"

"And a grin of bitterness swept thereby / Like an ominous bird a-wing…."

"Since then, keen lessons that love deceives,"

"And wrings with wrong, have shaped to me"

"Your face, and the God curst sun, and a tree,"

"And a pond edged with grayish leaves."

(This is an older ask than my last one and I'm not sure if its the same anon so I'll assume its not lolol)

Hiiii. Okay *sigh* the rumors are true. I am not entirely fond of Knox. And unlike most people, I don't possess a "fanon" version in my mind. He just is what he is. (tw: controversial but I fear that's a given)

In theory, yes, it's obvious why I don't like him. I mean, he took advantage of Chris despite her relationship status (which shouldn't have mattered anyway). And yes thats the gist of why I don't like him.

But actually the deeper and more nuanced reasoning in my mind is that he's just inherently selfish and ignorant. (Let's get this off the table—I'm aware hes a teenager and his mind isn't fully developed, I'm basing this off of the other characters ability to deny such choices. Aka: it cannot be blamed on the period). My issue with the whole Chris thing (and even, hey, the footnote of "Yeah Neil just tell him off" etc.) is that he just assumes privilege. He just assumes he can walk through life getting what he wants because he wants it.

Obviously all the boys have instances of misinterpreting the carpe diem sentiment. Its the structure of the narrative and simply the foundation of their arcs. But Knox never actually learns anything. He blatantly ignores any opposition because he simply wants it. He wants to date Chris so he will (is the mindset). And uhm. I don't appreciate that mindset.

Now many might argue that he claimed he would leave her alone after the play if she went with him. Which like, okay—that would be fine except for the fact that she had told him multiple times to leave her alone and he ignored her (even after kissing her while unconscious... thinking a poem and apology will fix it) and its just like... no aspect of this is taking into account what she wants. He's simply acting based on what he wants. And that alone is distasteful to me. +++ and I also feel I need to mention that not for one second did he think about how this presentation would make Chris feel. I mean, she was humiliated. Sure, maybe there's some carpe diem in reading a poem like that, but doing it in such a manner that's for everyone to hear (when she's meant to be dating someone else??) I just can't get over that, because if it were me, I'd never hate a boy more.

I've had people argue that I judge him too harshly when there's the likes of Charlie making the mistakes he did or even anyone else. And it's like, sure, the other poets made mistakes too, but they learned from them, and oftentimes (with a few exceptions) didn't continue to "manipulate" (i say loosely) or impact others in the long run. I also just don't appreciate that argument because every circumstance was different and its like comparing apples to oranges. So if anyone would like to discuss other instances, I would be happy to do so without associating Knox's character.

The unfortunate part is, I think he had potential. I just dont agree with his lack of arc and the insane center of his narrative (being Chris rather than the poets/class/etc.) because he has room to grow elsewhere. I always thought his and Todd's friendship for example, was something that had so much room to expand upon, only it fell flat in the interest of his main plotline.

Hello hello, yes it's true. I knew this would come up eventually 😭

So, like with anything else, allow me to explain!!

I don't think it's an abrupt thing by any means, more like a slow fadeout over time. It's evident that Charlie was skeptical of the whole Chris endeavor to begin with, (ie. the phone call scene/"Knoxious, you need to calm down") and while it's more evident in the book, it's definitely there. Not to mention this is all without any of the poets knowing what went down at the party, which, out of everyone I feel like Charlie would be the least likely to let that one slide.

And this is gonna be controversial when I say this—but I don't actually think Charlie and Knox are insanely close. I mean, they're as close as anyone else in the group I suppose, and naturally they've known each other for a long time, but compared to Charlie's friendship with Neil or even Meeks, it just doesn't seem as deep-rooted in my humble opinion. So after Neil's death and Charlie's expulsion, I think that friendship won't really stand so strongly.

Which brings me to my next point, where Ginny comes in. Now there's the obvious; Knox seeing her as plain/overlooking her entirely/seemingly saying something to Charlie about it off-screen given Charlie's line of "Knox is crazy, she's beautiful" in the screenplay... But my main point here is actually the other end of it which is the simple fact that Ginny was never impressed by Knox to begin with. It's more subtle I suppose, but at least for me, watching/reading any scene where they were in the same room, Ginny seemed very inclined to her eye-rolls. I mean, I think she caught on to the whole Chris thing right away, and kind of was like "really??" you know? He was super obvious about it, and I think Ginny is more likely to pick up on that stuff than most anyway.

I also don't believe Ginny and Chris to be really good friends or anything to begin with anyway. (I have a post about this so I won't get way into it here, just know that Ginny dishes out judgement on both ends in my eyes.)

The next and potentially most burning aspect of all of this is just... the party. I mean, Charlie would find out at some point, right? I mean he's gonna be around both Ginny and Chet quite a bit so the cat's gonna come out of the bag. And like I said earlier, I don't think this would impress him, not in the slightest. I'm not sure it would be a big huge deal, like there wouldn't be some big confrontation or anything, but it would certainly come by as disappointing wouldn't you say? Especially given the contrast of how Charlie approached Ginny vs how Knox approached Chris (which by god that comparison post is WAY overdue). But it's even down to Charlie twisting a line from Knox's poem when he first met Ginny, the writing is on the wall people.

So I think that would be the start of it; the party incident, Neil's death, Charlie's expulsion, his general character arc/simple devotion for Ginny—and ultimately?? I just think Knox would drift away on his own regardless. It's a hot take I suppose, but I see him and Chris getting married young, doing the whole 'she takes care of the kids at home/he exhausts himself at work', and after the honeymoon phase, I think they end up resenting each other. But, okay, even if by some miracle they didn't, all Knox ever prioritized was getting her anyway. I don't think it would be unreasonable to assume his adult life would be the same, maybe just with work added onto it. I think if anyone were to separate themselves from the group, it would be them. A relationship that starts poorly usually continues poorly, and that's all there is to it.

And just for the record (as a footnote), I don't think Chet is this horrible human being. Which, honestly from what I've seen most of the fanbase doesn't think so either anyway, but I figure it's worth mentioning. Sure maybe he has a complicated relationship with his sister, and maybe he's a little spoiled, ANDD his preppy party boy persona coupled with shallow/selfish teenage tendencies are definitely worth noting. But I do think he grows out of it, and if anything, I think the whole Chris thing pushed some of that to begin with. He'll come back to Ginny, and when he does, it's evident their relationship, and by relation, Charlie's, will make more sense than anything having to do with Chris or Knox (even if it takes a little while to get there).

okay so her name is rosa and she's a very italian woman from new jersey

she has a big big family and multiple (protective) older brothers

she and chet first met in college (in my mind he went to osu because...football. and she went because she wanted to get away from home)

rosa actually had a boyfriend at the time, she just happened to bump into chet every so often/they eventually became casual friends (and obviously he fell first).

she wasn't all that impressed with him at first, considering she very much was not about the frat life, which he was yet to fully grow out of.

she really started caring about him come junior year, considering he'd cleaned up quite a bit during the summer, and her boyfriend was starting to lose her (there's a backstory on this).

before they even officially got together her brothers essentially claimed him and bought him a drink (mostly bc they hated her ex bf).

after college chet follows her back to jersey, where he gets his own place separate from her for now (bc catholic values ofc) and she gets a job as a secretary at a law firm while she lives at home.

obviously as soon as she meets charlie and ginny she LOVES them and thinks they're the cutest couple she's ever seen in her life. down the line the four of them all end up pretty close. (chet and charlie take awhile but they come around).

yes she's the cool aunt

rosa has a little brown cairn terrier dog she gets after graduating (her name is mina and she takes her everywhere she goes) and yes chet has to carry her alot of the time, often so that rosa can shop or talk with her hands.

she dresses business casual which is honestly a stark contrast from her loud personality.

chet tries his best to learn some italian for her, considering she still speaks it quite often and tends to go on tangents sometimes when she's frustrated.

they eventually have two kids (and yes ones a girl bc chet has to be a girl dad)

anyway yeah that's the gist for now, honestly i'm way too invested at this point. she was only meant to be a minor character but i'm thinking we'll start bringing her up more in post-canon material!!

also to add

She is a GREAT sales person, can and will sell anything.

Her family owns a car dealership/shop

She and Meeks are Italian besties

✨ginny danburry's wardrobe✨

basically i'm going to break it down chronologically by era, while also going through each type of clothing and the evolution of style over time. (keeping in mind this is entirely based on my convoluted universe of fics and not at all concrete, merely based on context and interpretation) but with that out of the way let's get into it shall we?