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Coming on here to say: Why does no one here know or talk about Qing Gu ć č, "Love Poison" by He Yu čˇç because I just discovered it last night from scrolling through MaoEr and I'M OBSESSED (just like the ML with the MC đ)
In short, it's a yandere danmei, with a vibe similar to Midsommar. But instead of a cult in Sweden, we have a reclusive Miao clan in the mountains. The MC and his friends are here for a uni research project, and the ML falls in love at first sight with the MC. When they leave, their truck "accidentally" broke down and they had to stay with the ML, who also happen to be the leader of their hideaway village.
The Miao people have been historically thought to know how to cast "gu", which is sort of like poison magic, using natural toxins from insects and plants. It's been said that some Miao women are exceptional at casting gu, and will entrap men they fancy in "love poison." That's the setting we're walking into and it is DELICIOUS!!
I love TGCF and it's one of my favourite stories, but I have a huge thing for very toxic, dark, obsessive romances â most of the time, they're queer. (My favourite show is NBC Hannibal (.â á´ â.)) Usually, I gravitate towards psychological horror, body horror, gore â but still with a happy ending. So this story is right up my alley, even though I'm only on episode four. The production of the audiodrama is also top notch!! The art is beautiful and the songs will entrap you like gu.
I'm considering this for a future translation project because NO ONE TALKS ABOUT IT đ
Anyways, just came on to yell about it for a bit. I wonder if anyone here is also into the same stuff I am hehe
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The Price of Redemption: Penance, Pity, and the Ethics of the "Crematorium" Romance
(A Short case Study using The Husky and His White Cat Shizun (2HA)
Disclaimer : I Am not bashing The Husky and His White Cat Shizun (2HA) Novels, merely using it to explore a Danmei Trope, I actually enjoy the novels
The "crematorium" trope in fiction where a protagonist commits heinous acts against a love interest only to spend the latter half of the story in a state of agonizing repentance poses a profound ethical dilemma. At the heart of this genre lies the seminal work The Husky and His White Cat Shizun (2HA). The novel forces readers to grapple with two uncomfortable questions: Can suffering truly pay for the violation of bodily autonomy? And is it ever "right" to root for a couple built on a history of abuse?
The Weight of the Sin: Non-Consensual Acts in 2HA
To understand if forgiveness is possible, one must first look at the gravity of the offense. In 2HA, the protagonist Mo Ran (as the emperor Taxian-Jun) does not just mistreat his teacher, Chu Wanning; he systematically breaks him.
The scenes in the "Wushan Palace" of the first life are not merely "dark romance"; they are depictions of prolonged captivity and sexual violence. Taxian-Jun uses Chu Wanning as a tool for spite, explicitly stating that he keeps him alive only to torment him. When a character undergoes such total dehumanization, the narrative scales are tipped so far into the negative that many readers find the "debt" impossible to settle, regardless of the perpetrator's later change of heart.
The Logic of the "Crematorium": Suffering as Currency
The argument for forgiveness in 2HA relies on the "Redemption through Suffering" arc. Author Meatbun Doesn't Eat Meat utilizes several narrative devices to bridge the gap between monster and hero
The "Two Lives" Partition By reincarnating Mo Ran, the story creates a psychological distance. The "young" Mo Ran of the second life is often presented as a separate entity from the "mad" Taxian-Jun, allowing the reader to sympathize with his horror at his own past actions.
The Flower of Eternal Night: The revelation that Mo Ranâs cruelty was exacerbated by a magical curse (the Eight-Sufferings Long-Hatred Flower) complicates the concept of agency. If his "evil" was a form of induced insanity, the burden of guilt shifts slightly from his soul to his circumstances.
Extreme Penance: Mo Ranâs suffering in the second life is physical, spiritual, and psychological. From kneeling in the snow to literally giving up his life (and soul) to save others, the story posits that if a character suffers more than their victim did, a balance might be restored.
Rooting for the Victim's Choice
The controversy of rooting for the "Abuser/Victim" pairing often ignores the agency of the victim. In 2HA, Chu Wanning is not a passive casualty. As the truth of the two lifetimes unfolds, the narrative shifts from "Mo Ran deserves happiness" to "Chu Wanning deserves the love he has always craved."
Chu Wanningâs eventual forgiveness of Mo Ran is framed as an act of immense strength rather than weakness. He chooses to see the soul beneath the scars. For many readers, rooting for the couple is not about condoning the abuse; it is about supporting the victimâs right to find a version of peace that only they can define. However, this remains a point of contention: does "happily ever after" in such a context romanticize the idea that abuse is just a hurdle to be cleared on the way to true love?
Conclusion: A Personal Moral Boundary
Whether we should forgive characters like Mo Ran depends on our view of restorative justice versus retributive justice. If one believes that certain acts like non-con are "unforgivable" by their very nature, then no amount of "crematorium" suffering can balance the scales.
However, The Husky and His White Cat Shizun suggests that in the realm of fiction, forgiveness is not a statement of "it was okay," but rather a recognition of "you have become someone else." We root for them not because the abuse was earned, but because the story convinces us that both the broken teacher and the reformed monster have bled enough to deserve a moment of stillness.
So whenever I browse XHS, occasionally I come across posts of CN jiejies cheekily comparing To My Shore/Four Faced Buddha to Shui Qian Cheng's 188 series. This makes sense, TMS does read like a distilled version of the 188 novels. I don't mind these comparisons, because they're true and also TMS manages to carve out its own identity, but I can't help wonder if that's why I probably won't be as attached to it as some of my favourite 188 novels.
The 188 series has managed to produce some of my favourite characters in BL ever, one of them being Li Shuo from Winner Takes All. Li Shuo as a character is basically if You Shulang was more well adjusted, had basically no trauma and no internalised homophobia because Li Shuo grew up in the US with a wealthy family. In my opinion, his relationship with his scum gong has the most parallels to Fan Xiao/You Shulang, though funnily enough Zhao Jinxin does call Li Shuo "Uncle" which Fan Xiao sneers at when hearing Lu Zhen say it so I wonder if that was a slight jab haha.
Anyway, the reason why I like Winner Takes All more may be due to bias. I read it first after all. But I also think it's because I bought the wife chasing crematorium arc more there than in TMS. I've not read all of Four Faced Buddha, but in the drama, the pacing does start to get rushed towards the end, and I found that the show's focus started to feel all over the place. What I liked about Winner Takes All is that the story never shifts its focus away from the main couple. It does introduce possible love rivals for Jinxin to get jealous over, but I feel like a) they were more evenly distributed throughout the novel, b) Li Shuo is openly gay, so it makes more sense to me he'd have more exes/suitors who'd approach him and c) they added to Jinxin's arc. His main character flaw is that he was a rake who never took his relationship with Li Shuo seriously (even though he was already in love with him) until it was too late, and this was his "punishment".
And I guess that's part of my disconnect with TMS to some extent. Because it feels so derivative of the 188 series, whether intentionally or not, some of these puzzle pieces don't connect: Fan Xiao is if you combined disparate elements of Shao Qun, Luo Yi and Zhao Jinxin. Shao Qun and Zhao Jinxin were playboys, so part of their chase was dealing with other suitors coveting their shou as punishment. In contrast, Luo Yi was a virgin before getting together with his shou, so the novel only gave him one love rival who obstructed him in more ways that just romantically. You see what I mean? While Fan Xiao is his own character overall, some of the writing decisions TMS's author makes seem like they were made because well, they worked in other novels so let's add them here.
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I'll admit that the second half of To My Shore isn't as strong as the first half. But man, that build up to episode 8. It made me feel things I've never felt. I wouldn't mind rewatching those 8 eps over and over again.
I have been trying to analyze why I fucking love this show in particular.
I do think Xaoi Fan is a more realistic depiction of an abuser. There is further examination of why he is still likable to me when Iâve hated other love interests who have done far less. I mean ignoring the ending where he does shift his behavior drastically.
But also the show calls it out so clearly.
In another universe/show Fan Xiaoâs gesture would be seen as romantic. Look how in love he is and how much effort he is putting in to win Shulang back. I feel myself getting pulled in when Fan gave the speech in the trauma box. After episode 14 I said I can't believe I'm rooting for him?
Shulang sees right through it. How could you insult me like this? What have I done to you. And it is an insult to take away one's autonomy and removing someoneâs choice.
But for me the fantasy fulfillment is Shulang. Him seeing right through things and saying all the things one would want to say to someone that has hurt you. How could you do this to me when I have loved you so sincerely?
He is the perfect victim. He is so smart. He catches on and doesnât let himself be tricked for long. Despite his feelings, once he knows something he acts on it and then ruthlessly cuts things off. No second guessing that this is the right choice.
He does not make choices that lead to pity or derision. He is admired for his strength and ability to continue to fight.
When he gives in itâs also for admiral reasons to protect someone else. He still loves Fan Xaio but it does not give in to it. He lets rational make his choices and sticks with his principles regarding himself and others.
For me that is probably the ultimate fantasy. Something like this happening to a âgoodâ person that has made all the right choices. There is nothing he could have done. Shulang does everything right and still looses. His actions did not determine the outcome.
I probably donât need to spell out the ways in which this might be comforting. One canât smart or right themselves out of certain situations. The unavoidable nature of pain and suffering. The unavoidable nature of hurting each other.
The other aspect of this the way we hurt our partners and are hurt in relationships that are/are perceived as unforgivable and being able to get past them because this is a part of long term relationships.
Being in relationship is having to confront the self and having to work through your traumas. Because otherwise yep you guessed it you will hurt your partners. Whether through self directed punishment or lashing out at them.
There is tragedy in Shulang connecting on their shared trauma that they have and then Fan Xiao being the one that traumatized him again.
There is something there in the regards to the show not pulling its punches that lends itself to being able to explore these themes.
Only one episode left. I'm going to miss this show
I think the thing I genuinely love about to my shore is that the love was so there. like the love was undeniably so there. it didnât save anything. it didnât fix anything. for the most part it made it worse. but by god it was glorious and bright and so so there.
I'm thinking about To My Shore again, and the traumas it gives voice to, and how perfectly complementary the main characters are.
Warning: Long winded essay below:
I have always considered the show to be operating on emotional logic, that it's more about tapping into visceral emotions than presenting people and actions in a "rational" manner. Fan Xiao and You Shulang have diametrically opposed personalities and worldviews, due to their pasts. Many have pointed out how wildly diverged their outlooks on life are in spite of both having pretty shitty childhoods. The pivotal point for Shulang was arguably when he was adopted by a kind woman, unlike Fan Xiao who had to fend for himself after his mother's death, leading to his cynical and misanthropic view of humanity. Many have also used these points in debates about the main leads' relationship, whether it's reasonable to use Fan Xiao's trauma to justify his vile behavior in the present when Shulang also went through immense suffering as a child and came out not evil.
Personally, I'm more interested in the nature of their traumas and how it informs their perspectives. The first time we learn about Fan Xiao's past is when we learn that he's a victim of the 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami. Very few pieces of art explore this disaster. One of the more well-known recent examples is the movie The Impossible, a Hollywood-ised account that focuses on a white family who were on vacation (apparently it was Tom Holland's debut live action role). It's interesting (and by that I mean frustrating) seeing discussions on whitewashing surrounding this film, which takes place in Thailand but chooses to focus on white tourists who get to leave the country at the end of the film, in that it is barely addressed and there is a kind of dismissal of the experiences of the non-white locals of the disaster. This isn't new, the suffering of those living in the Global South rarely gets treated with any nuance in Western media, there is a fundamental disinterest in our lives, even our deaths remain nothing but a statistic.
The tsunami was the first global disaster that I was made aware of at the age of 8, the sheer destruction and loss of life (casualties ranged from 200,000 to a million) were on such a scale that it was hard to grasp from where I was watching it all on a small television screen.
The fact that Fan Xiao's trauma is directly linked to this one event felt in some ways, really cathartic. He does not process this trauma in any kind of healthy way, but the fact that it is treated with gravity and weight, that it is treated with such seriousness that it has the power to destroy not only oneself, but also others. It's like tearing a bandaid off of a gaping wound, instead of letting it fester, you burn it with an open flame that can burn others. Fan Xiao chooses to externalize his trauma, in his own words, "if I'm unhappy, no one gets to be". It is raw, it is visceral, and it felt real. One thing to note is that this is a Chinese work, and I'm not sure if the author chose to write about this disaster because of personal reasons or just because Fan Xiao is half Thai. But why it still felt raw is because China is also not a stranger to mass deaths and disaster, if you look at its history.
You would think that developing a misanthropic worldview would make more sense for You Shulang, whose trauma was purely man made. From the failures of the child welfare system, to institutional abuse, to homophobia, almost all of You Shulang's suffering is caused by other humans, even his adopted mother's death. But paradoxically, I think that makes it "easier" for him to process; his suffering, no matter how traumatic can be traced back and made sense of, unlike Fan Xiao, who lost everything (the only person who unconditionally loved him) in a way that is outside of human control. It also weirdly makes sense that Fan Xiao is the religious one, when faced with such uncertainty, it's normal for people to look to a higher power to make sense of it all.
The One Child Policy, which was only abolished about 10 years ago, might just be one of the most controversial projects of human social engineering in recent history. Thousands of women were forcibly sterilized and have abortions, most of them in rural areas where families are more likely to have more children. It also greatly increased the number of abandoned infants, and even lead to international adoption being made into a whole industry (according to some sources about 100,000 and more Chinese children, many of them girls, were adopted by foreign families).
Knowing this context, it's easy to see Shulang's backstory being informed by this history, a system that has utterly changed the fabric of family structures and thousands if not millions of lives. In many ways it has also failed its most vulnerable people, particularly women and children. The original novel takes place in China and the working class woman who tried to commit suicide with her baby in the first episode is also a minor commentary on the healthcare system.
With all that said, I don't think any kind of suffering needs to have a "point". Fan Xiao's trauma is also not 100% natural, he also lived in an abusive environment. In a way all suffering is kind of senseless, even when it's man-made. But I think what To My Shore does so well in highlighting is the realness of that suffering, that it can't be dismissed or ignored, and it needs to be felt.
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TO MY SHORE EP 13: NOT ME FORGIVING FAN XIAO IN ONE (1) EPISODE LOL
I have zero backbone. None. Iâm spiritually weak. I might be colorblind and Iâm morally compromised. HOW did I fold this fast?
Because tell me why ONE (1) episode was enough for me to go from âlock this man up foreverâ to âoh no⌠he looks sad đĽşâ.
I knew, intellectually, that the âoptimisation projectâ was Fan Xiaoâs way of trying to pull Shulang out of the abyss - obviously dressed up as manipulation, control, and emotional terrorism, because of course thatâs how Fan Xiao operates. But even so⌠I could already feel the redemption arc creeping in.
And then he just⌠gives everything back: Shulangâs career. His purpose. His connection to medicine. That sweet little kid to fulfill his life. And finally - his freedom.
Hereâs the thing: Iâm not over what Fan Xiao did. Not really. He put Shulang through hell simply because Shulang was good - genuinely kind, principled, steady. Everything Fan Xiao has never been and never believed could exist. And thatâs exactly why he tried to break him.
Fan Xiao is deeply, catastrophically broken. He doesnât know how to build - only how to ruin, control, and drag others down to the depth he lives in. Until Shulang.
Until this annoyingly kind, impossibly strong, painfully rational man walked into his life and became his anchor. His moral compass. His safe place. His proof that something pure could exist without being fake.
Fan Xiao loved him and hated him in equal measure. He wanted to possess him, destroy him, and be saved by him all at once. And when he finally understood that keeping Shulang meant killing him - slowly, completely - he did the one truly selfless thing heâs ever done.
He let him go.
And he didnât just let him go quietly - he burned his own world down in the process. Took his own family with him. Stripped himself of power, control, status. Reduced himself to nothing.
And THEN - as if that wasnât enough emotional violence - we get this version of Fan Xiao: broke, humbled, working as a server and a sales rep, soft-spoken, smiling gently, wearing the STUPIDEST LITTLE MAN BUN I HAVE EVER SEEN.
WHY is he like this now? WHY does he look so⌠small? So harmless? So heartbreakingly human?
I hate this. I hate that itâs working.
Because yes - in real life? Absolutely not. Jail. Therapy. Restraining order. No notes.
But in Cdramaland? I fear I am already forgiving him. I fear I am weak.
So many people confused at where To My Shore is gonna go, how it could possibly have a happy ending, and like babes just read Tokyo Babylon and then X (the Seisub parts, aka the good parts), you'll find your answer. TMS is just a fix it fic for that. What Fan Xiao is about to do is just what Seishiro did, without all the dying. This is why knowing your Yaoi ancient texts is important.
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