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@kayuripax i ended up having so many thoughts abt this that i felt it best to just. make a whole separate post SNKSKNSK thoughts that are. so largely irrelevant and mostly just me screaming into a void abt how i canāt imagine things outside of canon. thoughts that you did not ask for, and actually no one asked for! and what my thoughts boil down to, tl;dr i love reading Other peoplesā work in this lane bc Hell Yeah but i canāt write it myself bc im a stick in the mud for canon
as usual w/ these kinds of posts its all my Opinions and i dont work for r* etc etc
i love reading fics in this vein. i love reading fics where the three of them are a delightful lil polyam moment, i love when authors play in that space bc i Wish hosea matthews had gotten what he wanted. i wish he had his cake and ate it too. but to me, i think dutch is actually the problem hereāi just canāt picture dutch being willing to play in that space At All. romantically, sexually (and this is not to say the man wouldnāt be down for a threesome, even a threesome with hosea and another woman, i just dont think heād be down with bessie, and ill get into that), the whole nine yards.
i dont think dutch gets jealous, bc why would he? hoseaās his man. but thats the key: hosea is His man. dutch tends to have this possessiveness over certain people, and he downplays the importance of other people in their lives.* we see it the morning after the gala, when dutch picks up arthurās letter from mary, and carelessly tosses it to the side. we see it when hosea brings up bessie on the way to go fishing, and says that it feels like he had bessie a lifetime ago, and dutch petulantly says that it Was a lifetime ago. the tone is so important there, because heās not agreeing with a fondness, or an understandingāheās agreeing with the tone of someone whoās absolutely fuckin Sick of it. heās tired of talking about bessie, sheās not relevant, and heās not letting her cast a shadow on His day with His boys.
dutch has a possessiveness over certain people, and bessieās already taken His man away from him. she takes up his time, she takes up his love, she takes him right out of the criminal life and away from dutchās side. i would bet that none of this is Really trueāim sure hosea still spent plenty of time with dutch, still planned and robbed and thieved together, hosea could never ever have a lack of love for dutch, and hosea trying to get out of the criminal life had to be at least partially his own choice, and of his own willābut i would also bet that this is how dutch perceives it. thus, i dont think hed have any interest at all in spending time with her, least of all time that heād rather be spending with hosea and Not the woman who lured him away. i think heād rather have the opportunity to pull hosea Away from her, rather than include her in any capacity.
now, this is where my cracks as a writer start to show. i Suck at characterization, or at least, i feel like i do. itās so hard for me to keep characters correct, keep them in tone and make them workāthis is why iām so married to canon, and if i canāt slot it into canon, i donāt write it. i Need that spinal cord to hold me up. i canāt do AUs, i canāt do what-ifs, i Need to have some sort of support from the work itself to help me stand, like a crutch, which sucks! bc i LOVE the idea of bessie/hosea/dutch polycule. i LOVE it, and iāve read several fics and seen so much gorgeous art that i just love, in my heart of hearts i really do wish that hosea couldāve happily had them both, and i think he did, to an extentāi just dont think dutch and bessie had each other.** its literally on me as a writer for not being able to explore ideas outside of whatās been presented to us.
if thereād been even One hint that dutch liked bessie at all, or if he didnāt show a pattern of distaste for his boysā partnersā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦.inhales. exhales. this turned out to be way too long for a writing prompt and im Very sorry for that š š š
*i would love to know how molly (and grimshaw, and annabelle) fell into the gang, bc i have a feeling it was probably somehow in this lane. i imagine molly as a sort of rose dewitt bukater, desperate to get out from under the family thumb, and then somehow a handsome man who hates the rich and lives free and wild crosses her pathāhow many times do you think he made degrading comments about her wealthy, aristocratic family? how many times do you think he shat on them and the way they live versus how He lives, which is the true and correct way? by the time we step into arthurās shoes, sheās all but entirely isolated from the rest of the gang as wellādo you think that was intentional on dutchās behalf? hmā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦ā¦..
**and this isnāt even to say i dont think dutch was cordial with bessie. i think he definitely was. heās a man very set in his gender roles, and we know he appreciates a talented and quickwitted woman. i think he liked bessie, and probably liked her quite a bitāi just dont think he liked how bessie played into his and hoseaās relationship.
and as a secret little ps at the bottom, if anyoneās still hereā¦i Do think thereās merit in a fic where hosea and dutch are sneaking around behind the campās back, and dutch is aware that bessie knows theyre doing it, maybe even watching but hosea is completely unawareā¦hm hm hm hm hm hm hm hm hm
im literally that guy that's in every town in rdr2 who's standing on some street corner preaching abt some bullshit no one cares abt at the top of his lungs
"oh remove the weight of the world from your shoulders for a minute arthur" is such an underrated dutch line we don't talk enough about oh remove the weight of the world from your shoulders for a minute arthur
this whole mission honestly. this whole mission is so defining for dutch just...as a character. he's careless, he's self-centered, and above all he doesnt give a damn abt any casualties whoever they may be. he's reckless and hes dangerous. and he enjoys it tooāhe gets a kick out of violence (we see it so many times: dutch laughing through the valentine shootout at the end of ch2, dutch actually saying out loud with his whole chest "this is kind of fun" as guarma is getting bombed to hell, and more), he gets a thrill out of putting his life (and others' lives!) on the line and it's even better when he pulls it off in the end. it makes the stakes higher, makes his ego bigger, his hunger for that thrill even more voracious and without someone ahem ahem to reign him in and talk him down to sensibility, he's a dog off its leash running fucking stupid
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"oh remove the weight of the world from your shoulders for a minute arthur" is such an underrated dutch line we don't talk enough about oh remove the weight of the world from your shoulders for a minute arthur
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HELLO THANK YOU and lemme just be the first to say
TILLY FUCKING JACKSON š£ļø š£ļø š£ļø š£ļø š£ļø
when i found out (through a random camp interaction btw, im pretty sure) that tilly had nearly the same upbringing as john and arthurālost her parents young, fell into trouble, brought into the gang, taught to read and write and survive by dutchāit genuinely made me so mad. bc why isnāt she more important?? why isnāt she more relevant?? minus the One mission centered on her, the stagecoach robbery she can join in on (which she does Nothing in), and one dominoes cutscene, shes basically shoved to the background.
i think theres so much potential in her, in her character, that we see brief glimpses ofāwe know shes tough, we know shes ruthless, and we know she cares deeply about her family. if you keep an eye on her in camp, sheās almost always in jackās radius if abigail isnāt, as though sheās watching over him as an auntie. she speaks on how much she loves dutch, and when he gets back to the gang at the beginning of ch6 and asks for coffee, sheās quick to jump up and get it for him. she stays til the end, just like arthur and john, because she cares about everyone in the gang, especially dutch. i wouldāve KILLED for more cutscenes or even just camp interactions with her and dutch and hosea honestly. her playing dominoes with hosea. her debating ethics and morals with dutch. one of them practicing shooting with her. anything.
arthur and john both have crazy intricate narratives showing them both growing as people, why couldnāt tilly have been in on that?? we see arthur lean more towards hoseaās temperament, and john towards dutchāsāi think it wouldāve been really interesting to see tilly be straight down the middle. a level head, a critical thinker, a clever girl who doesnāt shy away from violence, even if itās not the first or best choice. she couldāve been the best of them.
For that ask game, as a certified horse girl (genderneutral) I gotta ask about your horse choices-
SNSKSNSJS so im actually insane and i Have to theme my horses for every playthrough. they also always have to be girls
i think it was 2demondogs on ao3 who noted that nearly all of us follow the naming conventions of the characters' current horses to name other ones (in a positive way, like naming pre-canon horses the duchess or copper penny) and i stick to arthur's naming conventions for my horses. mythological names, names of legends, usually tailored to whatever kind of playthrough im doing.
i have 3 ways i play through a whole round of rdr2 story mode (as im sure most people do) which is:
1. high honor beginning to end
2. low honor beginning to end
3. low honor start, high honor end (this one's my favorite)
if im doing option 1, there's a beautiful all black horse with crazy good stats that you can buy in saint denisāit's dummy expensive, but it looks nearly complete opposite of the count, and i like that symbolism quite a bit. last playthrough i think i named this horse epona, mostly bc its the celtic goddess of horses and protection but also...yanno.
option 2, i go get the white arabian from the mountains. it's the closest in match and stats to the count, and i like the symbolism of death riding in on a white horse...next to his mentor, father, and downfall, of course. i usually name this one after some kind of royalty, again to match the countāi think i went with jezebel on my last playthrough LMAO
option 3, yanno when you're riding around on the map and you can find a man who gets his head kicked in by a brown palamino with a white mane? that's my horse. that's my HORSE. that's my favorite horse in the whole gameājust like arthur, she starts as a wild and untameable murderer, and slowly turns into a heroine herself. i almost always name her anne bonny after the pirateāan objectively horrible person who has become more legend and myth than pirate.
other than these horses, i love that big one with the skunk stripes. i name it mephitidae. which means skunk.
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