Where people who are twerps go

I have been saying this for years now, as ya’ll know. Being a scientist, I sorta have to.

Which means you had to hop in, uninformed, and express yourself without understanding what was being talked about.

If you had comprehended it, you might have noticed the many citations and references it makes.

Even better, you state that you disagree with the science, and rather than tackle it, decide to strawman the article and attempt a half assed reversal.

Not realizing that in disagreeing with the science and repeating a known falsehood that you are being dishonest.

Cheer up, though – turns out I thought better of you than you deserved. You see, I thought it was only one of the two things.

Turns out it was both. You are dishonest and incompetent.

i don’t disagree with the science because this isn’t science, it’s a popular article illustrating someone’s opinion on the science. the science seems to be all right from what i can see, i just disagree with the conclusions the author draws in the article.

but even if i were, disagreeing with science isn’t being dishonest, hon - or would you tell me copernicus was dishonest when he said the earth wasn’t, after all, the center of the universe? would you say that rutherford was lying when he overturned the thomson atom model or that lavoisier was the same when he defeated the phlogiston theory of combustion? don’t you realize that this is how science is done - by challenging the old theories?

once you have an actual scientific issue to debate within an actual scientific framework - complete with all the necessary evidence backed up by your own rigorously tested fieldwork - you can come back and try again, sweet. until then, how about you stop acting like popular opinions are time-honored empirical truths and get a real education in biology. maybe you’d like some help from my mother, the doctor with a forty-year career and an m.d. from stanford?

You did not read the references and citations. That transparent lie and interestingly structured straw man is neither valid nor decent.

That you think my side has lost is also hilarious. Shows me much about your thinking. Reminds me of the kids I used to teach in my younger days.

Intellectual dishonesty is still being dishonest. For over 20 years the science in the fields has shown the opposite of your statement, and you keep arguing in defense of a falsehood as if you have a leg to stand on.

You don’t. Ya’ll want to pretend it, but ya don’t.

Then again, you see it as a side. So in your mind, this is some sort of larger battle, with ideology instead of facts.

I don’t.

I see it as ignorance and folly on your part.

But then, I deal with this stuff for a living.

for the last time, it’s Y'ALL.

A comeback requires something worth giving a comeback for.

You haven't offered such.

As a note, you are the one who whined to me.

The rest is you being laughed at. For being ignorant, incompetent, and dishonest.

Also, y'all, ya'll, and four other forms are all valid. Depends on the regional variant.

I have been saying this for years now, as ya’ll know. Being a scientist, I sorta have to.

Which means you had to hop in, uninformed, and express yourself without understanding what was being talked about.

If you had comprehended it, you might have noticed the many citations and references it makes.

Even better, you state that you disagree with the science, and rather than tackle it, decide to strawman the article and attempt a half assed reversal.

Not realizing that in disagreeing with the science and repeating a known falsehood that you are being dishonest.

Cheer up, though – turns out I thought better of you than you deserved. You see, I thought it was only one of the two things.

Turns out it was both. You are dishonest and incompetent.

i don’t disagree with the science because this isn’t science, it’s a popular article illustrating someone’s opinion on the science. the science seems to be all right from what i can see, i just disagree with the conclusions the author draws in the article.

but even if i were, disagreeing with science isn’t being dishonest, hon - or would you tell me copernicus was dishonest when he said the earth wasn’t, after all, the center of the universe? would you say that rutherford was lying when he overturned the thomson atom model or that lavoisier was the same when he defeated the phlogiston theory of combustion? don’t you realize that this is how science is done - by challenging the old theories?

once you have an actual scientific issue to debate within an actual scientific framework - complete with all the necessary evidence backed up by your own rigorously tested fieldwork - you can come back and try again, sweet. until then, how about you stop acting like popular opinions are time-honored empirical truths and get a real education in biology. maybe you’d like some help from my mother, the doctor with a forty-year career and an m.d. from stanford?

You did not read the references and citations. That transparent lie and interestingly structured straw man is neither valid nor decent.

That you think my side has lost is also hilarious. Shows me much about your thinking. Reminds me of the kids I used to teach in my younger days.

Intellectual dishonesty is still being dishonest. For over 20 years the science in the fields has shown the opposite of your statement, and you keep arguing in defense of a falsehood as if you have a leg to stand on.

You don't. Ya'll want to pretend it, but ya don't.

Then again, you see it as a side. So in your mind, this is some sort of larger battle, with ideology instead of facts.

I don't.

I see it as ignorance and folly on your part.

But then, I deal with this stuff for a living.

I have been saying this for years now, as ya’ll know. Being a scientist, I sorta have to.

Which means you had to hop in, uninformed, and express yourself without understanding what was being talked about.

If you had comprehended it, you might have noticed the many citations and references it makes.

Even better, you state that you disagree with the science, and rather than tackle it, decide to strawman the article and attempt a half assed reversal.

Not realizing that in disagreeing with the science and repeating a known falsehood that you are being dishonest.

Cheer up, though -- turns out I thought better of you than you deserved. You see, I thought it was only one of the two things.

Turns out it was both. You are dishonest and incompetent.

Everytime I posted something remotely pro-feminist, I would get all kinds of misogynistic harassment and horrible threats via anonymous. I’ve got a folder of screenshots showing how misogynistic these monsters are.

Yes. They are monsters. They behave positively sociopathic towards pro-feminist women.

They target women who speak out about gender inequality.

Sure when I stay silent on these issues, I do not get MRA harassment. Which is the point. To silence.

There’s a huge fucking difference between men harassing pro-feminist women and stalking them, sending them rape and death threats accompanied with misogynistic slurs.

And these are misogynistic men being predators using misogynistic slurs to silence women.

Men are called ‘bitch/pussy’ when they are not acting manly enough or showing weakness etc. Literally being called a woman/feminine is the worst insult for men. That’s not misandry.

Just because you choose to ignore it doesn’t mean it isn’t there.

Men are called ‘bitch/pussy’ when they are not acting manly enough or showing weakness etc. Literally being called a woman/feminine is the worst insult for men.

Men are 99.999% of American combat deaths and casualties

Men are at least 97% of the deaths since the first Gulf War

“The numbers of wounded women and female amputees, meanwhile, are considerably less than their male counterparts–at least 378 wounded versus 17,490; 11 amputees versus over 400–but they are historic for modern day warfare.”

A Pentagon study published in March on the mental health of soldiers returning from deployment to Iraq and Afghanistan found that more than one- third of U.S. soldiers received psychological counseling. A statistic buried in the study: 23.6 percent of women reported a mental health concern compared with 18.6 percent of men.

http://thewall-usa.com/information.asp

http://thewall-usa.com/women.asp

http://www.cwc.lsu.edu/other/stats/warcost.htm

http://www.icasualties.org/oif/female.aspx

http://www.defenselink.mil/news/casualty.pdf

http://www.hatsrcool.com/Americas-Major-Wars.html

http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm/dyn/aid/2755/context/archive

http://www.womensenews.org/article.cfm/dyn/aid/2755/context/archive

currently, women are not even required by law to register for selective service, but even mentally challenged and physically disabled men are, in addition to all the healthy ones)

In contrast, women get every veteran’s benefit a man does, yet comprise less than 3% of combat deaths or casualties and a woman makes the cover of Time magazine (person of the year/2003 standing in front of two men.

Men have it rough in the workplace

Men are 93% of industrial deaths and accident (NIOSH)

Even though murder is the leading workplace cause of death for women, a statistic often used by gender feminists, that number is only a percentage of the 6% of workplace deaths that women comprise.  In other words, a fraction of a small fraction.

Men die more often from unnatural causes than women

Men are:    76% of homicide victims – DOJ    80% of Suicide victims – CDC

Also: Suicide ranks 11th among causes of death in the US, with 30,622 completed suicides in 2001. It is the 3rd leading cause of death among people 15 to 24 yr. Men ≥ 75 yr have the highest rate of death by suicide. Among all age groups, male deaths by suicide outnumber female deaths by 4:1.”

“The other most common suicide victims are divorced and/or estranged fathers like Derrick Miller. In fact, a divorced father is ten times more likely to commit suicide than a divorced mother, and three times more likely to commit suicide than a married father. ~Suicide took the lives of 30,622 people in 2001 (CDC 2004). ~Suicide is the eighth leading cause of death for all U.S. men (Anderson and Smith 2003). ~24,672 suicide deaths reported among men in 2001 ~24,672 / 30,622 = .8056952 ~In other words, over 80% of all suicide deaths were male.

Of the top fifteen leading causes of death, men lead in 12 categories, are tied in two and trail in one.  Even though more women die of heart disease each year, men die of heart disease many years earlier.

http://www.merck.com/mmpe/sec15/ch205/ch205a.html

http://www.glennsacks.com/distraught_fathers_courthouse.htm

http://www.cdc.gov/ncipc/factsheets/suifacts.htm

http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/hestat/finaldeaths03_tables.pdf

http://www.sentencingproject.org/Admin/Documents/publications/inc_factsaboutprisons.pdf

Men are the overwhelming majority of rape victims

Male rape has been called “The most closely guarded secret of American prisons.” (Weiss and Friar 1974) There are estimated to be over 300,000 male rapes per year in American prisons and jails.

Meanwhile A United Nations statistical report compiled from government sources showed that more than 250,000 cases of male-female rape or attempted rape were recorded by police annually. The reported data covered 65 countries.

According to the 2009 United States National Crime Victimization Survey estimates, only 55% of rapes and sexual assaults were reported to law enforcement officials. When a male is raped, less than 10% are believed to be reported. Female-male and female-female rape are ignored altogether in this survey.

http://www.loompanics.com/Articles/RapeInPrison.html

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap_percap-crime-rapes-per-capita

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Crime_Victimization_Survey

Other facts regarding men and rape:

2.1% of men reported forced vaginal sex compared to 1.6% of women in a relationship in the previous year. From: Predictors of Sexual Coersion.

94% of sexually abused youth in correctional facilities reported being abused by female staff. From: Sexual Victimization in Juvenile Facilities, 2008-09.

Among inmates reporting staff sexual misconduct, ~ 65% reported a female aggressor. From: Sexual Victimization in Prisons and Jails Reported by Inmates, 2008-09.

50% of homeless youth reported being sexually abused by a female. From: It’s Not What You Think: Sexually Exploited Youth in British Columbia

http://pubpages.unh.edu/~mas2/ID45-PR45.pdf

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/svjfry09.pdf

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/svpjri0809.pdf

http://www.nursing.ubc.ca/PDFs/ItsNotWhatYouThink.pdf

Men get screwed over in divorce and custody courts

A woman is the party filing for divorce in about 66% of divorce cases. “How often was it that many more of women wanted the divorce more than the men? 2/3. The same as the amount responsible for divorce filings. And yet another study of divorced couples found that the majority of divorced wives and husbands both agreed it was the wife who wanted out.”

Women receive custody in about 84% of child custody cases. In the spring of 2002, an estimated 13.4 million parents had custody of 21.5 million children under 21 years of age whose other parent lived somewhere else. About 5 of every 6 custodial parents were mothers (84.4 percent) and 1in 6 were fathers (15.6 percent), proportions statistically unchanged since 1994

http://www.pobronson.com/blog/2006/07/will-this-marriage-last-who-wants-out.html

http://www.census.gov/prod/2003pubs/p60-225.pdf

According to Los Angeles divorce consultant Jayne Major: “Divorced men are often devastated by the loss of their children. It’s a little known fact that in the United States men initiate only a small number of the divorces involving children. Most of the men I deal with never saw their divorces coming, and they are often treated very unfairly by the family courts.’”

Paternity fraud is rampant in the U.S. 30% of those named as fathers who test for paternity find they are not the biological father.

Not only is all this imbalance around marriage and children unfair to men, we must also consider that the damaged inflicted on fatherless children is staggering:    63% of youth suicides are from fatherless homes (US Dept. Of Health/Census) – 5 times the average.    90% of all homeless and runaway children are from fatherless homes – 32 times the average.    85% of all children who show behavior disorders come from fatherless homes – 20 times the average. (Center for Disease Control)    80% of rapists with anger problems come from fatherless homes –14 times the average. (Justice & Behavior, Vol 14, p. 403-26)    71% of all high school dropouts come from fatherless homes – 9 times the average. (National Principals Association Report)    75% of all adolescent patients in chemical abuse centers come from fatherless homes – 10 times the average. (Rainbows for All God’s Children)    70% of youths in state-operated institutions come from fatherless homes – 9 times the average. (U.S. Dept. of Justice, Sept. 1988)    85% of all youths in prison come from fatherless homes – 20 times the average. (Fulton Co. Georgia, Texas Dept. of Correction)

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=48871xo

http://fallenfathers.blogspot.com/2007/03/children-without-fathers-statistics.html

Men are often screwed over in the Justice System as well.

There is blatant anti-male discrimination in the criminal justice system and the sentencing disparity between men and women exceeds that between whites and any other minority.

Avg sentences for crime by gender: Female – 18.51 months Male – 51.52 months

“Judge bashes Probation Department for gender bias in favor of leniency for girls”

The 2006 United States’ rate of incarceration of 751 inmates per 100,000 population is the highest reported rate in the world, well ahead of the Russian rate of 628 per 100,000. 93% of the prison population is male with over 60% having no High School education.   America has now passed Russia as the country that has the largest percentage of its population incarcerated, yet we still claim to be the freest country on earth. The number of persons on probation and parole has been growing dramatically along with institutional populations. There are now 7.2 million Americans incarcerated or on probation or parole, an increase of more than 290 percent since 1980.

The problem of sentencing disparities is compounded by an epidemic of false accusations: 205 (and growing) wrongly convicted people have been exonerated by DNA evidence since the beginning of the Innocence Project. 204 of the wrongly convicted were men. Most of them were falsely imprisoned for rape.

As we saw in the Duke Lacrosse rape case  fiasco, false accusers are rarely prosecuted and when they are it is only as a misdemeanor (at most), while rape itself is vigorously prosecuted as a felony. The Duke false accuser, Crystal Gayle Mangum went on to commit assault, arson and finally murder before authorities made a good faith intervention. One attorney speaking at premiere for the movie, After Innocence, estimates that there are between 20,000 and 100,000 wrongly convicted still in prison. Valid research puts the estimated false rape reporting rate at 41%

http://ncfm.org/2011/04/issues/criminal-sentencing/

http://www.terry.uga.edu/~mustard/sentencing.pdf

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010-12-01/news/27082827_1_gender-bias-probation-officers-probation-department

http://www.sentencingproject.org/

http://www.innocenceproject.org/

http://falserapesociety.blogspot.com/p/prevalence-of-false-rape-claims.html

Capital Punishments Target Men Almost Exclusively

Since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976, there have been over 1,200 executions in the United States. Eleven of them, or less than 1%, were women. This stands in stark contrast considering women commit, by DOJ estimates, 10% of all murders, are involved in 35% of all domestic homicides (are involved often means they get other people to kill for them) and nearly 30% of murders where the victim was another family member.

Other:

We hear a lot about the historical oppression of women’s voting rights, but few if any women who were born in the 20th century were every without the right to vote in their lifetime, upon reaching legal voting age.  On the other hand, around 2400 hundred California men (42% of CA men killed in Vietnam) gave their life for their country without being allowed by their country to vote.  The exact number is 2,381.  Four of the twelve Iwo Jimo flag raisers died for their country without their country ever allowing them the right to vote.

“The youngest Vietnam KIA is believed to be Dan Bullock USMC, at 15 years old. At least 5 men killed in Vietnam were 16 years old. At least 12 men killed in Vietnam were 17 years old. There are 120 persons who listed foreign countries as their home of record. At least 25,000 of those killed were 20 years old or younger. The oldest man killed was 62 years old.” If you do a full count on all the men in the 20th century who died for their country without being allowed to vote the numbers will be staggering. In America there are over 270 women’s commissions, but only one for men in New Hampshire. There are over 700 Women’s Studies programs on colleges and universities throughout the United States teaching thousands or tens of thousands of classes from the gender feminist perspective, but not one program or class, teaching men’s studies from the masculist perspective. Men are fully half of the victims  of domestic violence (26% of intimate partner homicides), yet are denied service at most tax payer funded domestic violence shelters. The CDC reports that in cases of non-reciprocal intimate partner violence (one directional) that women are more than twice as likely to be the aggressor. The report cites that women comprise 70% of perpetrators, men 29%. In the largest collection of studies on intimate partner violence known, Martin Fiebert of the California State University, Longbeach offers the following: SUMMARY:  This bibliography examines 286 scholarly investigations: 221 empirical studies and 65 reviews and/or analyses, which demonstrate that women are as physically aggressive, or more aggressive, than men in their relationships with their spouses or male partners.  The aggregate sample size in the reviewed studies exceeds 371,600.

In another study the CDC lists male victims of domestic violence at more than 34%, but men injured in Iraq (and all other men) are by law in California excluded from domestic violence shelter services. Only one shelter in Lancaster, CA accepts men and it has been extensively harassed for doing so. That harassment is a systemic problem with origins that emanate from academe. Dr. Murray Straus, an internationally recognized expert on intimate partner violence published the following paper outlining the various ways that feminist ideologues suppress data and research on IPV that demonstrates gender symmetry in its incidence.

Men are subject to extreme discrimination in healthcare. Men today die on average 6 years sooner than women.  In 1920 the variance was one year.  The death rates for prostate and breast cancer are similar, but because men die of other things more frequently-accidents ,war, heart disease etc., there are fewer men left to die of prostate cancer.  This is akin to saying people from a nation like Zimbabwe are immune to Alzheimer’s- but in fact they die of other things before they can get old enough to contract Alzheimer’s. To date, there are numerous federal offices on women’s health, and not a single one for men. Also, the lion’s share of gender specific medical research is done on behalf of women. Men and boys are suffering decline in the educational system. Department of Education graph: Boys are facing a significantly harder time in early education than girls. Yet girls, from primary education through college still benefit from many more special programs designed to help them gain “equality” with males.

http://www.mensnewsdaily.com/archive/a-b/blumhorst/2005/blumhorst052805.htm

http://www.thewall-usa.com/names.asp

http://www.csulb.edu/~mfiebert/assault.htm

http://pubpages.unh.edu/~mas2/V74-gender-symmetry-with-gramham-Kevan-Method%208-.pdf

http://aspe.hhs.gov/hsp/08/boys/factsheets/ed/index.shtml

Some info on the wage gap

The wage gap myth based on the “comparable worth” paradigm:

While men make more money than women on average, women control and spend vastly more money than men.

Women as an economically disadvantaged group is a myth that negatively affects men. Not too long ago, legendary adman David Ogilvy chided his peers for talking down to women. He berated those who ignored women or discounted them, misconstruing men’s higher paychecks to mean greater spending clout. And he was right. According to the Bureau of Economic Analysis, women–who comprise just over 51 percent of the U.S. population, making them the largest consumer segment in the country–control six trillion dollars in buying power annually. Statistics show that: Women make 88 percent of all U.S. retail purchases. Some experts even predict that, by 2020, women will control most of the money in America. Women control 88 percent of all purchases. Women handle 75 percent of family finances. 43 percent of those with assets over $500,000 are women. Women influence two out of every three of the 3 trillion dollars spent in the U.S. each year! From the Sisters4Sisters Yellow Pages:    Women are starting businesses at twice the rate of men.    One out of every 11 American women owns her own business.    Currently there are over 10.6 million women-owned businesses employing 19.1 million people and generating $2.5 trillion in sales.    Women make or influence over 85% of all purchasing decisions.    In 2010, women have the majority of wealth in America. Men pay the majority of social security taxes and are outlived by six years by women, but the government makes no fair adjustment to how those funds are distributed. In summary, men experience systematic discrimination in parenting, domestic violence policies, education, criminal sentencing, paternity, forced labor, military conscription, public health policies, genital integrity, false accusations, reproductive rights, portrayal by the media and in the coverage of their issues by the news media. Misandry is often expressed through racism. From Scottsboro An American Tragedy. “The protection of white womanhood, it might be the pivot around all Southern culture. Of the 5,000 people who were lynched from 1880 to 1940, most were black men accused of raping or sexually assaulting white women.” – Robin Kelly, Historian From American Man “In 1931, two white women stepped from a boxcar in Paint Rock, Alabama to make a shocking accusation: they had been raped by nine black teenagers on the train.” … ”- a poor white woman whose lie lends her respectability…” PBS Home Video Scottsboro An American Tragedy The case that sparked the civil rights movement As we have seen with the “war on drugs,” legislation like VAWA, primary aggressor laws, mandatory arrest laws and the like have a disproportionately negative effect on minorities and other low income populations.

Or the differences in healthcare for men and women in Obamacare program

Young men will be the biggest losers in the transition to Obamacare. Reports estimate that males as a whole will see:    11% increase in insurance premiums compared to 9% drop in females    Men under 40 will face 18% - 31% insurance hikes compared to females under 40 13% to 19% decrease    Young men ages 25-36 will could face insurance premiums of 50% or more compared to young females 25-29 who will see 4% increase

The wage gap myth based on the “comparable worth” paradigm:

http://mensnewsdaily.com/2007/04/23/gender-feminist-wage-gap-myth-appears-to-be-growing-legs-part-ii/

http://www.amazon.com/Pocketbook-Power-Hearts-Coveted-Consumer/dp/0071418601/sr=1-1/qid=1167804358/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-6478055-3977644?ie=UTF8&s=books

http://ncfm.org/libraryfiles/Children/DV/AAVRmandatArrestVAWA.pdf

http://blogs.the-american-interest.com/wrm/2013/05/14/obamacare-kicks-young-men-while-theyre-down/

http://www.ahip.org/MillimanReportACA2013/

http://www.ahip.org/Workarea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=2147491347

http://money.cnn.com/2013/05/14/news/economy/obamacare-premiums/index.html?iid=HP_LN

Feminists don’t give a shit about anything I’ve read.

If men aren’t Feminists, they’re scum. Hell, if men ARE Feminists, often time they’re told by RadFems to fuck off anyway. If women aren’t Feminists, they “don’t love themselves” or suffer from “internalized misogyny.” Feminism only gives a shit about advancing their dogma, and other Feminists. I’ve yet to see any way, shape, or form they’ve demonstrated otherwise.

Special Thanks to Alicia for retaining information here. I can expand with something entirely original if you like, to elaborate on why I despise the current incarnation of Feminism and several of it’s backwards ideals

Source: imaginary-fool

Okay this is the logical fallacy of overloaded response. It’s a tactic meant to overwhelm the opposition because they cannot possibly respond to all of this and they back down.

I cannot address all of these sources and arguments. It would take hours.

An I was a feminist.

I have had multiple feminist in my REAL OFFLINE LIFE tell me I can’t be abused or tell me it didn’t matter. Now these weren’t random feminist of the  street mind you. These were people I was close with. These were people I TRUSTED an LOOKED UP TO.

They were professors, a therapist, classmates and FRIENDS who l knew for several Year’s  while I was being abused. They saw what I was going through over and over again AND THEY DID NOTHING.  I went through Pill Popping, slitting my wrists, binge drinking to I pass the fuck out and I got very very close to chugging bleach and much worst, before I finally got out of that relationship.

Now granted, I don’t think there’s anything a feminist can tell me that will ever make me feel anywhere near as bad as felt with my ex.

HOWEVER..When I was told to my face in no uncertain terms"  I’m really sorry for what you’ve been through but BOYS DON’T SUFFER ENOUGH FOR IT TO BE AN ISSUE and we need to focus more on NOT TALKING OVER GIRLS" i was gone.

An lets say your right. IS THIS WHAT YOU TELL A VICTIM OF ABUSE AND SEXUAL ASSAULT?

I looked at this women like a big sister. An I was treated like a fucking sadistic out of a gender studies book.

I may still have friends here and there who identify as feminist, but I am never going back to the movement AN i WILL NEVER TRUST FEMINISM.  

Now you maybe be a good person but I have had too many feminist do me dirty. An that is not a generalization of feminism.

I’m not going to generalize feminism, because I don’t need to. I didn’t need the whole movement to make a bad situation worse. All I needed was a handful of feminist masquerading as close friends to look at my pain and cut me deeper.

In short I had ENOUGH!

Secondly I don’t believe in any kind of Shady tactics like that.I personally find idea to be disgusting.

My intent is not to overwhelm anybody. If that was the case then I would have wasted my time. No my intent is to not be ignored. My intent is to not be acceptable casualty.

Ok, so you and your people help men. I wish that was enough. I also wish I knew where you were when I was going through what I was going through, things might be different. And I do I mean no disrespect but part of me questions your care.

I personally don’t find the sources hard to respond to . Maybe I was feeling at the time but I read through everything I compiled and posted in almost no time at all.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Gish%20Gallop

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Gish_Gallop

but it’s being used wrong here because “ In summary, men experience systematic discrimination in parenting, domestic violence policies, education, criminal sentencing, paternity, forced labor, military conscription, public health policies, genital integrity, false accusations, reproductive rights, portrayal by the media and in the coverage of their issues by the news media.” is not a small set of bullshit arguments made only to bamboozle the audience.

There’s also argument ad verbosium (proof by intimidation), which is where an argument becomes weighed down in complexity, jargon, and obscure knowledge, that people can’t really argue against it without themselves being experts. This is more of a thing in maths and science though.

In this case it would, unintentionally, be shotgun argumentation. Arguing so many things and so many points that they simply can’t all be addressed.

Even then, that post was not bad as far as that goes. It was formatted in a way that it was relatively accessible for its length, you could go through and pick out the main subjects it was arguing followed by an argument and citations.

I think it was intended to be a thorough refutation (even if copy and pasted) of the claim that: 

“ Systems of oppression are binary. There is an oppressor class and oppressed class.”

If it is binary, and their claim is that men are oppressors and women are oppressed. Then all that needs to be provided is evidence that men also experience things that are used as evidence that women are oppressed. Which they have done.

I mean, that would just make you a nitwit.

How does a lawsuit cause a show to become a failure? What shows without any white people are successful? What discrimination law has been altered so that it is legal to discriminate against white people?

What evidence do you have of bribery to do so?

White people are not systemically oppressed.  That is fact. If you don’t believe that, well, given the other things you have said that are pure drivel, you have some pretty serious issues and need to get an education.

Which, I note, will be done heavily by white people.

I did not say that we cannot predict how society would react to such an event. I said there was not enough information from which to build a model to do so, and so anyone doing such would be a twit.

Petition to make #womenhavedicks into #transwomenhavedicks

I cant even walk alone at night cause Im a woman. I can barely walk alone during the day because Im a woman. For Christmas I got pepper spray. I have been beaten, called a slut, sexually abused since I was a child. I have had guys force their dicks down my throat and in my ass. My mom has had breast cancer TWO times and has a disorder where she loses so much blood during her period she became anemic and now theyre removing her uterus to get her pain to stop. People dont take me seriously when I say “no” and stand up for myself because Im a woman. Not even my fucking dad. Ive been catcalled, been almost kidnapped twice, been chased down the street by men because I am a woman. My parents would let my brother stay out past dark with his friends but I wasnt allowed to because even my father knows what horror lies within being a woman. My mom sells houses and anytime she shows a house to a single man she has her phone dialed to 911. Ive had to help friends cope after having abortions and miscarriages. I bleed out of my fucking vagina for a week straight, and get SHAMED for doing so. Black women are stereotyped as poor, uneducated, “single mom” and angry just for being a woman. Latina women are stereotyped for being “slutty, have kids at a young age, cheap” for being a woman. Asian women are stereotyped as “docile, childlike, frail and the dream woman to take advantage of”. These are a FEW things you will never face.

Transwomen force gender stereotypes- thats the only reason you call yourself a woman. You like pink. You like makeup. You like feeling pretty. Great. Good for you. Dressing like a woman does not make you a woman. No woman likes getting made fun of for taking “so long” to get ready just because we cant leave our houses and go in public without looking feminine, otherwise men belittle us, people make fun of us, we get told OUR natural beauty isnt good enough. If a woman doesnt wear makeup and a feminine outfit to a job interview they are far less able to get the job because they are “uninviting, unprofessional”.

Fuck this #womenhavedicks thing. Women have vaginas. Transwomen have dicks. Its not that complicated to call yourself a transwoman.

Dont take our only identity besides the WONDERFUL “slut, ho, bitch, cum dumpster, femenazi, doll, cunt, little girl” and use it for yourself. Im proud to be a LOVELY, BLEEDING, FEMINIST, HARD WORKING WOMAN. And if you have a dick and call yourself a woman for wearing dresses and painting your nails- fuck that. Im a woman with no makeup on, wearing mens pants, nails bit- not painted or long, in an oversized mens hoodie. I shaved my head once and still was a beautiful woman. And Im a wonderful fucking woman without the pressure of YOUR stereotypes, thanks. #transwomenhavedicks #transwomenhavedicks #transwomenhavedicks #womenhavevaginas #womenhavevaginas #womenhavevaginas #VAGINAMATTERS

But you don't know that because you are a raging fucking transphobe who doesn't know shit about trans people.

Some women have dicks.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

It appears I’ve been blocked from responding directly to @lesbophobia-receipts so here’s a link to the post. 

First of all I don’t “put up with being misgendered” I ~gender myself as I want to, don’t I have the right to do that? Plus, male and female are sex, NOT GENDER. 

“What are you getting out of this? a chance to shit on trans women?” I’m not doing this for myself lmao. I’m doing this for all the gay males and lesbian females who’re being attacked and harassed and shamed and coerced into relationships with the opposite sex. I don’t want fellow trans people ending up in relationships that have no chance of working out (as I have been)

“Take anything the TERFs throw at me?” Idk what you mean, I’ve come to my own conclusions based on my own experiences and understanding of things. I’m not a leftist man because I’m female, not a man.

I’m not attacking anyone with misogyny, my OP doesn’t mention males or females, just that everyone is entitled to their own sexuality. And in case you haven’t noticed it’s female lesbians who’re most often attacked and sent rape threats/death threats/suicide baited for saying they won’t sate transwomen; THEY are deemed acceptable targets of misogyny since they refuse to submit to the sexual whims of males. 

If someone is attracted to a trans person and they find out they’re trans and changes their mind 1) what makes you think they wouldn’t have changed their mind anyway? 2) isn’t everyone entitled to change their mind about sex at any time? 3) haven’t both parties escaped a potentially awkward/messed up sexual situation considering both of them wouldn’t have been into it? 4) it’s not about being trans, it’s about the person’s anatomy/body lol

Here is why: you make a presumption without evidence and assert it as factual.

More specifically, you do not, exactly, know why they say that they are not into you without more information that is not available.

Statistically speaking, the reason they will not be into you based on your info will be based on the knowledge of your being a trans person.

That also has nothing to do with their sexual orientation, though you are correct that it is part of their sexuality.

Not liking penis, for example, is not a sexual orientation. However, pointing that out as a fact will often make people who are transphobic think that you are saying something about their personal sexuality -- their sexual preferences, or, more commonly, their sexual orientation.

Here is a fact: trans men are men. Gay men who are not attracted to trans men because they are trans is extremely common, and is also transphobic as all fuck.

That doesn't change that they are not attracted to trans men. It merely points out that the basis for their lack of attraction is, itself, transphobic.

Straight men who are not attracted to trans women because they are trans is the same way.

Same for lesbian women, and so forth, and so on, etc etc.

Yet if a trans woman is attracted to women, she is gay. And she is frequently informed she cannot be such, and informed of many things that are bad about her as a result of her sexuality.

So, while you say that you won't tolerate gay and lesbian people being picked on for their sexuality, you certainly are engaging In Support of that very thing through your fallacious argument.

Which places you in a rather foolish position.

Your questions don't change the fact that not being attracted to someone as a result of their being trans is transphobic.

Being attracted to trans people happens not because they are trans in most circumstances, but because attraction isn't about what someone is, but who they are and how they are, generally speaking.

So your first question is absurd, as for them to change their mind, they already had to be attracted to a trans person.

As the only thing that changed was a piece of information, that piece of information is the cause.

Transphobia is the aversion, anxiety, and/or animus regarding trans people or trans related issues, singly or in combination.

That indicates aversion, thus is transphobia.

Yes, people are able to change their mind about having sex, but we aren't talking about having sex, we are talking about attraction, which does not involve sexual intercourse.

We cannot know the answer to your third question because we havent gotten past the problem of the transphobia involved.

Think, kid.

It cannot be about the body, since we are talking about attraction. Attraction has many aspects to it, and since in the exceedingly overwhelming number of cases we are attracted to people we meet when fully clothed, we cannot know what the body is like beneath.

Unless, thanks to transphobia, one makes presumptions about the body of other people.

Keep in mind, it is unreasonable to require a trans person to tell others they are trans. It is not the defining characteristic of a person, after all.

So those people could have met, had a wonderful experience, and gone on to a happy set of experiences just as easily as your example and with just as great a hypothetical likelihood had the trans person not said anything.

You see, trans bodies can vary considerably, so it would require making an assumption based on information that is not applicable in all situations to decide that it is about body types.

So your questions, in and of themselves, demonstrate transphobia on your part. They deal with a certain false presumption and deal in a widespread and systemic anxiety about trans people and, In Specific, the bodies of trans people not being "right" or "proper" according to the already rather shitty system that classifies any body as not being pale, male, and bepenised as Other and Wrong.

Finally, a note about cynicism.

Cynicism is the refuge of the defeated. It is what people who have already lost turn to, because the mindset of cynicism holds that they have already given up and given in.

I dont expect you to understand that -- you likely meant transskeptical, given most people don't understand the difference between cynicism and skepticism -- and given your history of transphobia, I doubt you will agree.

There can be no other logical, rational basis for women’s oppression; unless you think men were just being “mean” or something.  No, it was for a very real, profit-centered reason.  Men without families and heirs could not build empires (or even working farms) and without this centralized, religiously-sanctioned consolidation of the family, the state could not have evolved.  The state then effectively empowered men to be women’s keepers until very very recently in human history.  

THIS is the origin of women’s oppression.  

So yes, women’s oppression is because of vaginas.  Also: uteri, ovaries, ovum and menstrual cycles.  That is just a fact.  This is what got us consigned to the lower class, and our vulnerability during pregnancy and childbirth is historically what kept us weak and dependent on men.  And this is how patriarchy evolved.  

To write “vaginas” (or other female body-parts necessary for baby-making) out of the history of patriarchy and the evolution of the state, is flatly incorrect.  

It is also anti-feminist, since this account effectively erases the one thing women were allowed to do, the one exception to our limitations:   birthing and raising children.  Anything women dared to do, had to be somehow connected to that.  So, the first women artists and writers were women who painted their children’s portraits; sang their kids songs or made up stories and poems for them; knitted/crocheted/sewed their clothes, created pottery for the family to eat on, etc.  Women’s creativity was harshly limited to domesticity like this, and yet, we found ways to express ourselves regardless.  It is a story of SURVIVAL.  To explain to our daughters (as Virginia Woolf did) why there is no female Shakespeare or Chaucer, is to go back to….. VAGINA.  We were only allowed to have babies and failing that, teach or take care of some other woman’s babies.  Period.  

Because yes, that is the historical reason we were oppressed.  BODIES.  VAGINAS.

I do not want to oppress trans women, but I do not want to erase the history of the SOURCE of women’s oppression.   In your comments and in the comments of certain other Tumblr trans women, I see a continuous attempt to do that.  

Why?  

It is deliberately anti-feminist and seeks to erase women’s history.

You, being a transphobe who supports denying people their human rights and engaging in violent and abusive tactics against them that add to that oppression, are too blinded by prejudice to understand that, and utterly ignore that every single argument you can make about the oppression of women applies to trans people.

We support you, sister.

AED (via tonidorsay)

This literally looks like someone ate a vat of alphabet soup and shat out a pile of words.

It is so far from coherent.

(via mymenarche)

Odd you should say that given that every single major human rights organization in the world recognizes it as quite coherent.

“Women are baby makers”

Or do you like your no true Scotsman fallacies?

Which is a fallacy of the no true Scotsman sort.

Because no matter what excuse one uses after the fact about what is meant, what was said means that women who cannot give birth, for any reason, are not women.

Then you add in the flat out lies, and it gets really pathetic.

She is trying to police womanhood, and she not only does not have that right, her doing so serves only the interests of those who oppress women.

As all policing does. Something a radical feminist would be aware of.

So look, when you try to defend what she said, instead of looking at it critically, and without bias ( which she has, as she is objectively transphobic, no matter what you might believe ), it means that she isn't doing anyone any favors, and the science of the day ignores her.

When every single major human rights org in the world recognizes trans women as women, and the scientists and medical professionals explicitly say it isn't a mental illness, it tells us that she is uninformed, ignorant, incompetent, and literally argue against human rights.

“Women are baby makers”

Or do you like your no true Scotsman fallacies?

Really all it comes down to is a respect for female people.

Respecting female people means respecting the experiences unique to female people as a coherent social class. Every person who is born was created by male sperm fertilizing female ova, carried to term and birthed by a human female. This makes females a distinct social class from males. Historically, women are and have been oppressed world wide because of this assumed ability of our bodies, you can’t produce heirs to your family without a woman.

Existing with the knowledge that you might or will or have the assumed capacity to become pregnant is a different form of existence than existing with the knowledge you could fertilize another person’s body.

Existing with the knowledge that you might or will or have the assumed capacity to become pregnant is the experience of existing as female. The word for this form of existence is womanhood. This is what distinguishes and informs our perspective on the world and impacts how we navigate it. Each month our bodies hormones fluctuate to facilitate this ability. This ability is a life altering and dangerous experience to undergo. It deserves to be recognized and respected for how important it is.

Respecting the lived reality of existing as female means respecting the language women use to talk about our bodies.

Women deserve the word womanhood to refer to our relationship to our female bodies and existing in them.

Womanhood is not about anything other than existing as female, because our bodies are the only thing women have in common with each other. Women can have any personality, any hobbies, any aesthetic, any job, any skills, and still be women. Womanhood is not performing femininity, womanhood is not sexist stereotypes, womanhood is existing as female, and that’s it.

What does this mean for trans women? Mentally ill people deserve human rights, respect, and the treatment necessary to live their lives in peace. There is no shame in being mentally ill–such a belief is rooted in ableism. Trans women with dysphoria who decide to transition deserve human rights, but their rights do not override the rights of female people. This means even if validating their identity helps them to cope, it has to be weighed against the damage done to women by doing so.

Women’s groups should be able to decide if they want to accept trans women or not. Some groups may be inappropriate for trans women to attend, and female people are entitled to the right to assemble collectively as a social class.

Women born female have the right to define womanhood as our distinct experience.

Women born female have the right to assemble without male presence as we are a social class oppressed for our unique abilities.

Women born female have a right to say no to male people and set boundaries.

Women born female have the right to deny male people our labor, time, and effort, women born female have the right to focus on ourselves.

That is not one serious pile of patriarchal misogyny, biological essentialism, outright lying, anti-lgbt sentiment, ignorance of trans people and their goals, and a few dozen other things.

Mostly, though, it demonstrates aversion, anxiety, and intense dislike for a class of persons that it actively engaged in a hostile, violent act of using a falsehood to attack and therefore, as a whole, amounts to ad hominem.

Collected for the fall session and will use it in some of my train the trainer sessions to show how badly some transphobes understand their own ideology, and how they use existing social oppression to maintain the status quo.

One quick question for you:

You do realize that Ted Cruz, Phyllis Schafly, and anti-abortion advocates all use the exact same arguments, and that all the bathroom break bills from conservative republicans and sponsored by the alliance defending freedom use exactly the same arguments, right?

Not just to say that trans people are bad, but to say that women belong in the kitchen and pregnant, and that abortion should be illegal.

You just argued against feminism as a whole, and against radical feminism, especially.

I pity you.

Because according to you, above, the thing that makes a woman a woman is the chance of getting pregnant, the act of being pregnant, and the existential ideas of pregnancy.

All of which is what patriarchy says, and all of which is why women who do not have children, cannot have children, do not engage in heterosexual sex willingly and joyfully, do not submit to their husbands, are deemed as not being worthy of being mothers (for a vast number of reasons), are subjected to such horrors and denied rights as a whole.

But you don’t see that. You don’t even know enough about feminism to realize that the fight of over 150 years has been to say “stop fucking doing this”.

Saying women CAN get pregnant isn’t saying women SHOULD get pregnant.

And yes, that’s what defines womanhood, because everything else about me–my personality, my hobbies, my interests, my aesthetic–those things are NOT what womanhood is about.

A woman can have any personality, so it isn’t personality that defines womanhood.

A woman can have any aesthetic, so it isn’t aesthetic that defines womanhood.

A woman can have any behavior, so behavior doesn’t define womanhood.

Our bodies make us distinctly women, give us unique experiences which males want to down play the importance of. Feminism is about respecting female bodies, loving female bodies.

Quit mansplaining feminism to actual female people. Misogyny is the hatred of and subjugation of female bodies, misogyny is the idea that because we are able to bear children that we are inferior. The solution isn’t to pretend womanhood is some abstract concept that can’t be defined.

You are still using the same arguments to get out of being a misogynists all the folks I mentioned have used.

Your entire post reads like a tract from the women haters of the 80’s. I mean, everything that radical feminism fights against, you use as the basis of everything here.

They never said a woman has to get pregnant either, they simply used it as cover for themselves when women who couldn’t have children were brought up, saying exactly what you said.

Like I said, you do not know enough about radical feminism, do not known enough about the way that women have been and are being oppressed at the root, to understand just how bad you did here.

I get that. You are still learning and trying to figure it out.

Too bad your anxiety, aversion, and intense dislike of trans people is fucking up your ability to think, learn, and grow.

I have experienced sex based oppression since the day I was born, I have survived an abusive relationship, I have had two abortions. Since I was a child my father and my brothers and the whole world has shouted at me that my female body is inferior, that my female brain is inferior.

Feminism is the only thing telling me to love and accept my female body.

Feminism is about centering female existence, patriarchy is about centering male existence. You are a misogynist who seeks to diminish the importance of existing in a female body. You claim female biological experiences are meaningless just because you don’t have them! Really you are just erasing the unique experiences of female people from our own word, womanhood, so you and males like you can colonize and appropriate our movement, labor, spaces, and even who we are.

I have not struggled for so long to come to terms with existing in this female body to have some male tell me what womanhood is about.

So you are lying.

Another aspect of your male behavior is your projection. I have clearly demonstrated that I do, in fact, know what I’m talking about. You’re the one who just keeps shouting that I don’t know what I’m saying, even though you haven’t made any real arguments. Anyone paying attention can see you’re a phony.

Everything you’ve written is a logical fallacy. Either ad hominem, false equivalence, or otherwise.

One of the things you know nothing about? Period shaming, because you have never felt it and never will. You’ll never know what it is like to have to decide to have an abortion, and no trans woman ever will, because abortion is not a trans woman’s issue.

You don’t have any right to speak for female people, you don’t have our body, and you don’t have the experiences that come with it.

Trans women could be allies to feminism, if you would be honest and own up to your male socialization and privilege, and not flex your male entitlement and demand women perform free labor for you and center you in our movement.

Here, you project your own anxieties and aversion onto others.

Like calling factual statements ad hominem.

I do know about period shaming.

Child, you can say I am wrong all you want, it doesn't make it true.

Feminism -- radical and otherwise -- has striven for over 150 years to rid the basis of being a woman as being able to get pregnant.

Aside from the logical fallacy of that being the case, and her desperate, anxiety and aversion based arguments that have long since been abandoned by anyone with a decent knowledge of science and feminism in general, she is defensive in the extreme.

That is what made you react the way you have, as well. Which means she is not calm, and her personal feelings are very much involved here.

As are yours.

When you learn enough to have an adult conversation about these topics, among the first things you will realize is that I was right, and the immediate thing you will do afterwards is deny it.

But, like her lie about trans people, you will choose to believe the falsehood.

Because transphobia works that way. It makes you do things like you two have done.

Really all it comes down to is a respect for female people.

Respecting female people means respecting the experiences unique to female people as a coherent social class. Every person who is born was created by male sperm fertilizing female ova, carried to term and birthed by a human female. This makes females a distinct social class from males. Historically, women are and have been oppressed world wide because of this assumed ability of our bodies, you can’t produce heirs to your family without a woman.

Existing with the knowledge that you might or will or have the assumed capacity to become pregnant is a different form of existence than existing with the knowledge you could fertilize another person’s body.

Existing with the knowledge that you might or will or have the assumed capacity to become pregnant is the experience of existing as female. The word for this form of existence is womanhood. This is what distinguishes and informs our perspective on the world and impacts how we navigate it. Each month our bodies hormones fluctuate to facilitate this ability. This ability is a life altering and dangerous experience to undergo. It deserves to be recognized and respected for how important it is.

Respecting the lived reality of existing as female means respecting the language women use to talk about our bodies.

Women deserve the word womanhood to refer to our relationship to our female bodies and existing in them.

Womanhood is not about anything other than existing as female, because our bodies are the only thing women have in common with each other. Women can have any personality, any hobbies, any aesthetic, any job, any skills, and still be women. Womanhood is not performing femininity, womanhood is not sexist stereotypes, womanhood is existing as female, and that’s it.

What does this mean for trans women? Mentally ill people deserve human rights, respect, and the treatment necessary to live their lives in peace. There is no shame in being mentally ill–such a belief is rooted in ableism. Trans women with dysphoria who decide to transition deserve human rights, but their rights do not override the rights of female people. This means even if validating their identity helps them to cope, it has to be weighed against the damage done to women by doing so.

Women’s groups should be able to decide if they want to accept trans women or not. Some groups may be inappropriate for trans women to attend, and female people are entitled to the right to assemble collectively as a social class.

Women born female have the right to define womanhood as our distinct experience.

Women born female have the right to assemble without male presence as we are a social class oppressed for our unique abilities.

Women born female have a right to say no to male people and set boundaries.

Women born female have the right to deny male people our labor, time, and effort, women born female have the right to focus on ourselves.

That is not one serious pile of patriarchal misogyny, biological essentialism, outright lying, anti-lgbt sentiment, ignorance of trans people and their goals, and a few dozen other things.

Mostly, though, it demonstrates aversion, anxiety, and intense dislike for a class of persons that it actively engaged in a hostile, violent act of using a falsehood to attack and therefore, as a whole, amounts to ad hominem.

Collected for the fall session and will use it in some of my train the trainer sessions to show how badly some transphobes understand their own ideology, and how they use existing social oppression to maintain the status quo.

One quick question for you:

You do realize that Ted Cruz, Phyllis Schafly, and anti-abortion advocates all use the exact same arguments, and that all the bathroom break bills from conservative republicans and sponsored by the alliance defending freedom use exactly the same arguments, right?

Not just to say that trans people are bad, but to say that women belong in the kitchen and pregnant, and that abortion should be illegal.

You just argued against feminism as a whole, and against radical feminism, especially.

I pity you.

Because according to you, above, the thing that makes a woman a woman is the chance of getting pregnant, the act of being pregnant, and the existential ideas of pregnancy.

All of which is what patriarchy says, and all of which is why women who do not have children, cannot have children, do not engage in heterosexual sex willingly and joyfully, do not submit to their husbands, are deemed as not being worthy of being mothers (for a vast number of reasons), are subjected to such horrors and denied rights as a whole.

But you don’t see that. You don’t even know enough about feminism to realize that the fight of over 150 years has been to say “stop fucking doing this”.

Saying women CAN get pregnant isn’t saying women SHOULD get pregnant.

And yes, that’s what defines womanhood, because everything else about me–my personality, my hobbies, my interests, my aesthetic–those things are NOT what womanhood is about.

A woman can have any personality, so it isn’t personality that defines womanhood.

A woman can have any aesthetic, so it isn’t aesthetic that defines womanhood.

A woman can have any behavior, so behavior doesn’t define womanhood.

Our bodies make us distinctly women, give us unique experiences which males want to down play the importance of. Feminism is about respecting female bodies, loving female bodies.

Quit mansplaining feminism to actual female people. Misogyny is the hatred of and subjugation of female bodies, misogyny is the idea that because we are able to bear children that we are inferior. The solution isn’t to pretend womanhood is some abstract concept that can’t be defined.

You are still using the same arguments to get out of being a misogynists all the folks I mentioned have used.

Your entire post reads like a tract from the women haters of the 80’s. I mean, everything that radical feminism fights against, you use as the basis of everything here.

They never said a woman has to get pregnant either, they simply used it as cover for themselves when women who couldn’t have children were brought up, saying exactly what you said.

Like I said, you do not know enough about radical feminism, do not known enough about the way that women have been and are being oppressed at the root, to understand just how bad you did here.

I get that. You are still learning and trying to figure it out.

Too bad your anxiety, aversion, and intense dislike of trans people is fucking up your ability to think, learn, and grow.

I have experienced sex based oppression since the day I was born, I have survived an abusive relationship, I have had two abortions. Since I was a child my father and my brothers and the whole world has shouted at me that my female body is inferior, that my female brain is inferior.

Feminism is the only thing telling me to love and accept my female body.

Feminism is about centering female existence, patriarchy is about centering male existence. You are a misogynist who seeks to diminish the importance of existing in a female body. You claim female biological experiences are meaningless just because you don’t have them! Really you are just erasing the unique experiences of female people from our own word, womanhood, so you and males like you can colonize and appropriate our movement, labor, spaces, and even who we are.

I have not struggled for so long to come to terms with existing in this female body to have some male tell me what womanhood is about.

So you are lying.

Another aspect of your male behavior is your projection. I have clearly demonstrated that I do, in fact, know what I’m talking about. You’re the one who just keeps shouting that I don’t know what I’m saying, even though you haven’t made any real arguments. Anyone paying attention can see you’re a phony.

Everything you’ve written is a logical fallacy. Either ad hominem, false equivalence, or otherwise.

One of the things you know nothing about? Period shaming, because you have never felt it and never will. You’ll never know what it is like to have to decide to have an abortion, and no trans woman ever will, because abortion is not a trans woman’s issue.

You don’t have any right to speak for female people, you don’t have our body, and you don’t have the experiences that come with it.

Trans women could be allies to feminism, if you would be honest and own up to your male socialization and privilege, and not flex your male entitlement and demand women perform free labor for you and center you in our movement.

Here, you project your own anxieties and aversion onto others.

Like calling factual statements ad hominem.

I do know about period shaming.

Really all it comes down to is a respect for female people.

Respecting female people means respecting the experiences unique to female people as a coherent social class. Every person who is born was created by male sperm fertilizing female ova, carried to term and birthed by a human female. This makes females a distinct social class from males. Historically, women are and have been oppressed world wide because of this assumed ability of our bodies, you can’t produce heirs to your family without a woman.

Existing with the knowledge that you might or will or have the assumed capacity to become pregnant is a different form of existence than existing with the knowledge you could fertilize another person’s body.

Existing with the knowledge that you might or will or have the assumed capacity to become pregnant is the experience of existing as female. The word for this form of existence is womanhood. This is what distinguishes and informs our perspective on the world and impacts how we navigate it. Each month our bodies hormones fluctuate to facilitate this ability. This ability is a life altering and dangerous experience to undergo. It deserves to be recognized and respected for how important it is.

Respecting the lived reality of existing as female means respecting the language women use to talk about our bodies.

Women deserve the word womanhood to refer to our relationship to our female bodies and existing in them.

Womanhood is not about anything other than existing as female, because our bodies are the only thing women have in common with each other. Women can have any personality, any hobbies, any aesthetic, any job, any skills, and still be women. Womanhood is not performing femininity, womanhood is not sexist stereotypes, womanhood is existing as female, and that’s it.

What does this mean for trans women? Mentally ill people deserve human rights, respect, and the treatment necessary to live their lives in peace. There is no shame in being mentally ill–such a belief is rooted in ableism. Trans women with dysphoria who decide to transition deserve human rights, but their rights do not override the rights of female people. This means even if validating their identity helps them to cope, it has to be weighed against the damage done to women by doing so.

Women’s groups should be able to decide if they want to accept trans women or not. Some groups may be inappropriate for trans women to attend, and female people are entitled to the right to assemble collectively as a social class.

Women born female have the right to define womanhood as our distinct experience.

Women born female have the right to assemble without male presence as we are a social class oppressed for our unique abilities.

Women born female have a right to say no to male people and set boundaries.

Women born female have the right to deny male people our labor, time, and effort, women born female have the right to focus on ourselves.

That is not one serious pile of patriarchal misogyny, biological essentialism, outright lying, anti-lgbt sentiment, ignorance of trans people and their goals, and a few dozen other things.

Mostly, though, it demonstrates aversion, anxiety, and intense dislike for a class of persons that it actively engaged in a hostile, violent act of using a falsehood to attack and therefore, as a whole, amounts to ad hominem.

Collected for the fall session and will use it in some of my train the trainer sessions to show how badly some transphobes understand their own ideology, and how they use existing social oppression to maintain the status quo.

One quick question for you:

You do realize that Ted Cruz, Phyllis Schafly, and anti-abortion advocates all use the exact same arguments, and that all the bathroom break bills from conservative republicans and sponsored by the alliance defending freedom use exactly the same arguments, right?

Not just to say that trans people are bad, but to say that women belong in the kitchen and pregnant, and that abortion should be illegal.

You just argued against feminism as a whole, and against radical feminism, especially.

I pity you.

Because according to you, above, the thing that makes a woman a woman is the chance of getting pregnant, the act of being pregnant, and the existential ideas of pregnancy.

All of which is what patriarchy says, and all of which is why women who do not have children, cannot have children, do not engage in heterosexual sex willingly and joyfully, do not submit to their husbands, are deemed as not being worthy of being mothers (for a vast number of reasons), are subjected to such horrors and denied rights as a whole.

But you don’t see that. You don’t even know enough about feminism to realize that the fight of over 150 years has been to say “stop fucking doing this”.

Saying women CAN get pregnant isn’t saying women SHOULD get pregnant.

And yes, that’s what defines womanhood, because everything else about me–my personality, my hobbies, my interests, my aesthetic–those things are NOT what womanhood is about.

A woman can have any personality, so it isn’t personality that defines womanhood.

A woman can have any aesthetic, so it isn’t aesthetic that defines womanhood.

A woman can have any behavior, so behavior doesn’t define womanhood.

Our bodies make us distinctly women, give us unique experiences which males want to down play the importance of. Feminism is about respecting female bodies, loving female bodies.

Quit mansplaining feminism to actual female people. Misogyny is the hatred of and subjugation of female bodies, misogyny is the idea that because we are able to bear children that we are inferior. The solution isn’t to pretend womanhood is some abstract concept that can’t be defined.

You are still using the same arguments to get out of being a misogynists all the folks I mentioned have used.

Your entire post reads like a tract from the women haters of the 80’s. I mean, everything that radical feminism fights against, you use as the basis of everything here.

They never said a woman has to get pregnant either, they simply used it as cover for themselves when women who couldn’t have children were brought up, saying exactly what you said.

Like I said, you do not know enough about radical feminism, do not known enough about the way that women have been and are being oppressed at the root, to understand just how bad you did here.

I get that. You are still learning and trying to figure it out.

Too bad your anxiety, aversion, and intense dislike of trans people is fucking up your ability to think, learn, and grow.

I have experienced sex based oppression since the day I was born, I have survived an abusive relationship, I have had two abortions. Since I was a child my father and my brothers and the whole world has shouted at me that my female body is inferior, that my female brain is inferior.

Feminism is the only thing telling me to love and accept my female body.

Feminism is about centering female existence, patriarchy is about centering male existence. You are a misogynist who seeks to diminish the importance of existing in a female body. You claim female biological experiences are meaningless just because you don’t have them! Really you are just erasing the unique experiences of female people from our own word, womanhood, so you and males like you can colonize and appropriate our movement, labor, spaces, and even who we are.

I have not struggled for so long to come to terms with existing in this female body to have some male tell me what womanhood is about.

So you are lying.

Another aspect of your male behavior is your projection. I have clearly demonstrated that I do, in fact, know what I’m talking about. You’re the one who just keeps shouting that I don’t know what I’m saying, even though you haven’t made any real arguments. Anyone paying attention can see you’re a phony.

Everything you’ve written is a logical fallacy. Either ad hominem, false equivalence, or otherwise.

One of the things you know nothing about? Period shaming, because you have never felt it and never will. You’ll never know what it is like to have to decide to have an abortion, and no trans woman ever will, because abortion is not a trans woman’s issue.

You don’t have any right to speak for female people, you don’t have our body, and you don’t have the experiences that come with it.

Trans women could be allies to feminism, if you would be honest and own up to your male socialization and privilege, and not flex your male entitlement and demand women perform free labor for you and center you in our movement.

Here, you project your own anxieties and aversion onto others.

Like calling factual statements ad hominem.

I do know about period shaming.